EPTThere's no guarantee that the skills found in one master level player will be present in another master level, and as such you can't write a list of things that you must accomplish in order to rank up.
Difference between Diamond and masters? - Page 5
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Blurb
Denmark55 Posts
There's no guarantee that the skills found in one master level player will be present in another master level, and as such you can't write a list of things that you must accomplish in order to rank up. | ||
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Narcind
Sweden2489 Posts
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ChaseR
Norway1004 Posts
Diamond are people who are 'decent' at the game, they got all the basics down, normally below 100 APM and play to the best of their ability from the early to mid-game. However often their decision making and game sense is poor, I lose all the time with Dia allies against Masters because they 'think' they know better, always makes up some flawed plan WITHOUT even scouting or feeling how the game evolves depending on what the enemy players does. Master's are normally people who will play to the best of their ability from early to late game, they rarely make mistakes, normally will have a game sense and understanding of timings. They make good decisions but they suffer from an arrogance that their 'plan' will always work (There's no fail safe if it doesn't work.) You can quickly tell the difference between a Dia and a Master, one will make more mistakes than the other and be much harder to take advantage of. As for rankings having something to say with different tiers of skill within a league, honestly only if their Top 8 material, I've completely outplayed top ranked Masters last season that are now mediocrely ranked. Just because someone has grinded tons of games doesn't mean they're 'better', I would be more afraid of those that have less games but more points/win ratio. IN THE END, trying to discuss the leagues is useless, it's just a gimmick like GM, the only true indicator of skill difference is the complex MMR system and that is hidden from us all... | ||
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ALPINA
3791 Posts
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carbon_based
United States46 Posts
its as simple as: rarely getting supply blocked, ALWAYS (srsly, always) building probes, and spending your money on not horrible army composition. harder than it sounds but thats all it really takes. to play well in masters, scouting, control, and tactics help. or u can be really, really good at cheese. | ||
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MockHamill
Sweden1798 Posts
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BGrael
Germany229 Posts
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lolsixtynine
United States600 Posts
On April 26 2011 08:27 Pwnographics wrote: Masters is done by MMR and not timing laddering. It's small things like fending off all-ins or better scouting. If masters players played diamond players the win rate would be like 60:40. But if masters players played gold it'd be like 95:5 whereas diamond would be around 75:25. In other words, they're just more solid. Yeah but unless your MMR is insanely high it will take a while for your uncertainty value to be low enough for you to be promoted into masters. Read the thread explaining the ladder and MMR system for more details. | ||
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graxx
Netherlands13 Posts
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SOB_Maj_Brian
United States522 Posts
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Juke290
Egypt316 Posts
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Sigmur
Poland497 Posts
On April 26 2011 08:27 Pwnographics wrote: Masters is done by MMR and not timing laddering. It's small things like fending off all-ins or better scouting. If masters players played diamond players the win rate would be like 60:40. But if masters players played gold it'd be like 95:5 whereas diamond would be around 75:25. In other words, they're just more solid. I don't know from where you took your numbers. I'm in masters and have ~5 diamond league friends with whom I play couple a games per week. Ratio is not 60:40, more like 90:10, where I have to screw up really bad for them to win. If master league player is behind in macro, he can micro his way back, and other way round. | ||
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RodYan
United States126 Posts
Really, the difference between being promoted to any division is whatever your weakest link is. Do you have constant probe production? Yes? Well what about expansion timing? For me, I can only comment on things as a Z player, but my weakest links, and what really pushed me from diamond to masters, were these things: 1) I stopped being surprised by things players were doing. Rather, I became familiar with most timing attacks and signs of cheese. Doyou know how to scout AND tell the difference between a 3 gate expand, a blink stalker rush and a DT rush? Not losing stupidly to these things really helps your MMR. 2) I really changed the way I thought about my economy. I'm constantly aware of my drone count and saturation levels now. I'm also better at not over or under-droning 3) I really improved my worst matchup. Which for me, was ZvZ. I was clueless about this matchup, so I started watching streams. Mr. Bitter's 12 weeks with the pros was really helpful for me. | ||
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sleepingdog
Austria6145 Posts
The OP has pointed out that he can take the occasional game of a master but can't beat them consistently. This is - in my opinion - already the crucial point of this matter. High diamond players, at least the ones I know, HAVE what it takes to get into masters already, they just happen to screw up a considerable number of games. With that I don't mean macro, supply-blocks etc. but faulty DECISIONMAKING. I don't think that low masters have that much better execution and macro than high diamonds. At least not that it would matter. What low masters have is, they play safer, they don't take risks that often and generally make less gamedeciding mistakes. Simple example: two PvZ games that look exactly the same. The high diamond does NOT scout for the broodlord tech-switch, misses the timing and just dies against 10 broodlords some minutes later when he could've killed the zerg comfortably before that. Such mistakes have nothing to do with macro/etc. Other example: two PvT games, the high diamond player doesn't protect his third against drops consistently. Every other game a 2-dropship-drop kills the expo. And that's game, doesn't matter if his macro was maybe even "slightly" better than that of his opponent up to that point. To cut the long story short (TL; DR): from observing and talking to friends I noticed that top diamond players usually have low master-league-ish macro but have a couple SERIOUS flaws in their overall game, flaws that in most cases are gamedeciding. Which is the reason why they lose more games than they should, the reason why they lose some games even when they are ahead. Which ultimately is the reason why they don't get promoted. | ||
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SuitGuy
United States186 Posts
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LoLAdriankat
United States4307 Posts
Build orders. Most diamond players follow a build for maybe the first 50 supply then they sort of wing it for the rest of the match, not trying to hit any build order timings etc. Others follow a build order but don't understand the reason why they work. Being able to think while executing play. Pretty sure this is the biggest reason. Most diamond players are able to watch a mid masters replay from one player's perspective and understand every decision that the player makes, but when they actually play, they can't think like they do watching replays because they're busy macroing. This is my biggest problem because I don't play very often. I could rival my high masters friend with mechanics but he can think while he plays so it becomes a roflstomp after 20 minutes. | ||
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MiningSchuhu
Germany53 Posts
People were always High diamond, even Rank #1 sometimes but their play was so ...well .. "bad" in some ways that it didnt fit into normal masters, for example their approach of my army so that i could easily forcefield them etc. | ||
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Drake
Germany6146 Posts
On April 26 2011 08:25 Mailing wrote: Time laddering. A lot of top masters/grandmasters simply ladder grind thousands of games over time, but they are not necessarily better than everyone else. Same applies to an extent in diamond masters. Some people just don't ladder enough to get the promotion to masters/points needed to advance. i would not say this. as i can see most of the gamers in my master league even season one have less then 100 games including me. i generelly think its decision making and execution of strategys also i think generelly a master player not even have to notice the strats of the other player, its just the kind of play make him often so save that u cant "allin" break him without perfect execution and this exectution is the difference | ||
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Kvz
United States463 Posts
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cocosoft
Sweden1068 Posts
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