EPTIf you are looking to get into masters, watch *your own* replays, and try to push your win rate to max. But i think top ten diamond players can easily fit into the bottom half of a masters league in terms of skill.
Difference between Diamond and masters? - Page 6
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MinimalistSC2
United States121 Posts
If you are looking to get into masters, watch *your own* replays, and try to push your win rate to max. But i think top ten diamond players can easily fit into the bottom half of a masters league in terms of skill. | ||
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b_unnies
3579 Posts
diamond = learning micro masters= actually start thinking and understanding the game eg. interpreting scouting, why you do the things you do, how to do transitions. KR master league is another step up though, they can maintain constant aggression while doing macro at the same time | ||
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Nyast
Belgium554 Posts
- timings - anticipation | ||
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Deadlyfish
Denmark1980 Posts
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Ksyper
Bulgaria665 Posts
My experience with diamond players is that they don't know what they are doing, but they do it well. Master players don't risk as much, we want to get better, a win from an all in doesn't really feel that great, but diamond players do stupid wierdly timed all ins all the time, that's why I had trouble with them. I was used to playing master players and I was greedy, but when I realised that against diamond players I don't have to be greedy I quickly got back into master. The difference in my opinion is that master players have an idea of what's optimal and they try to do it, while diamond players have pretty good execution of their own little risky, wierd timing attacks. | ||
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apalemorning
Canada509 Posts
i have the mechanics from being a C level zerg player in broodwar, but when it comes to everything else, i'm not very good due to lack of playing. i really only got to C in broodwar from pure mechanics+builds. sc2 has a low mechanical skill ceiling, so the strategy part is way more integral to actually being good. after watching my own replays, i'm slowly playing more masters players, and will soon be promoted. so, to summarize my 6:20 am rambling, basically its solid macro (that alone takes you to diamond), with good decision making, micro, actually being able to interpret scouting information. so if you're stuck at high diamond, its most likely one of those things i listed. watch yo reps son! | ||
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hybridsc
United States63 Posts
Of course there are the players who are better at like everything, and they're in grandmasters or at least high masters. EDIT and it's not grinding, cause plenty of players have played many times more games than me and are stuck in plat let alone diamond/masters. if you check plenty of masters players don't have hundreds or thousands of games played. | ||
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HudsonK
China172 Posts
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Ichobicho
Norway79 Posts
Diamonds does not. At least that's the only really notable difference to me without the obvious a little better micro/macro | ||
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BigJoe
United States210 Posts
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Jandos
Czech Republic928 Posts
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clusen
Germany8702 Posts
On April 26 2011 21:40 BigJoe wrote: I am diamond and I think the only thing holding me back is good decision making. I can micro/macro pretty well and hold off cheese... but I dont have a really good idea of what my opponent is doing and how to counter. That is something where analyzing your own replays helps very much, just to compare you to your opponent at certain points. It is so much easier to see your flaws in decision making when you have an image of both sides. Stuff like "oh, I should've counter attacked at that point" becomes sooo obvious all of a sudden. | ||
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CrankyBears
United States1 Post
1) more harassing (scv/probe/drone harass, etc in the early game) - if they can delay a building for a few seconds they are ahead by a few seconds 2) lots of drops / multi-tasking - the other day I was fending off a stalker/colissi ball and there was a DT in my mineral line killing me that was warped in from who knows where. distraction attacks. 3) positioning - sending 3-4 scouts out to see where the army is - hit and run against buildings, plyons, fungals on stray groups of units, etc. 4) I would say the APM is way higher in Masters too; better unit splits, micro, etc. | ||
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Dalavita
Sweden1113 Posts
On April 26 2011 09:04 fishjie wrote: Wrong, if you are better than 98% of the total players, you are by definition, above average. His point was that you're still crap compared to the competitive scene, the scene that "matters", in which case he's right, but his point is still shitty and badly worded. | ||
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rauk
United States2228 Posts
i've found that decision making and reaction to build orders is generally equally terrible between masters and diamond. maybe a masters player would defend a 4gate better one out of every five games, but i don't feel like it's the determining factor. | ||
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Dalavita
Sweden1113 Posts
On April 27 2011 07:49 rauk wrote: i play games for shits and giggles on my friends diamond account. the biggest difference has always been macro and APM. in masters i generally face people with around 180-200 apm, with some sub 100 apm outliers, but in diamond it's pretty rare for me to find someone with over 130 apm. also in 9/10 games i play by the 15 minute mark i've got double their supply because they just can't macro and keep their money down. i've found that decision making and reaction to build orders is generally equally terrible between masters and diamond. maybe a masters player would defend a 4gate better one out of every five games, but i don't feel like it's the determining factor. APM-wise, do you mean ingame APM or sc2gears proper calculated APM? I've yet to see/play against someone with 180 APM even through sc2gears and I've seen/played some masters. | ||
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rauk
United States2228 Posts
On April 27 2011 09:00 Dalavita wrote: APM-wise, do you mean ingame APM or sc2gears proper calculated APM? I've yet to see/play against someone with 180 APM even through sc2gears and I've seen/played some masters. both. i average 202 apm over 1053 games. however, i set sc2gears to ignore the first 4 minutes of apm because i spam a lot. that actually probably causes other players' apm to go up a bit because they don't spam in the start, though i don't think that'll make a huge difference. but yeah i've found diamond players just do everything slower. | ||
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HaeHei
United Kingdom162 Posts
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Monasou
United States218 Posts
The difference between diamond and masters players is a fine line, considering the new grandmaster league, the difference will likely become more like the difference in Platinum and diamond when there was a master league. There isn't really a difference, and there is at the same time. I would like to say that the more able a person is to multi-task the higher they would be a on a ladder system, but that is also true as there are some progammers that have low APM and still make VERY good game decisions and do wonderfully. All in all, I think the differences are so minute that it doesn't make a world of difference. If you're not playing this game professionally, it shouldn't really matter. | ||
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xrayEU
Sweden571 Posts
On April 26 2011 21:40 BigJoe wrote: I am diamond and I think the only thing holding me back is good decision making. I can micro/macro pretty well and hold off cheese... but I dont have a really good idea of what my opponent is doing and how to counter. Im also in Diamond and have pretty much the same problem as you, i have my builds set and doing it right but its the decisions and how to counter what i see that is the problem, and sometimes scouting in general for tech and so on. I pretty much think its the decision making that is the difference between a diamond and a masters player. You should have your build set for each matchup and having good macro and decent micro if you are in Diamond. | ||
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