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[VNSL] Finals: Bisu vs EffOrt

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
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amazingxkcd
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
GRAND OLD AMERICA16375 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-23 00:25:27
January 22 2016 17:58 GMT
#1
<link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/FOnTTaX/liquipedia/liquipediaintegration_test/lp.css"></link><script type="text/javascript" src="http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/FOnTTaX/liquipedia/liquipediaintegration_test/lp.js"></script><!--

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HEADER IMAGE

--><div><a href="http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/VANT36.5_National_Starleague"><img src="http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/v1/vant_finals/logo1.jpg"></a></div><div class="article-content foicons"><!--

CONTENT (stuff inside <h2></h2> are headings)

-->
<h2>Intro</h2>

[image loading] ALL ABOARD THE HYPE TRAIN!

(Wiki)VANT36.5 National Starleague

Saturday, Jan 23 8:00am GMT (GMT+00:00)

<h2>Streams</h2>

[image loading] AfreecaTV Korea(Main) | [image loading] AfreecaTV Korea(Terror&Britney) | gb Twitch Korean Restream |
[image loading] AfreecaTV English(BisuDagger&AmazingXKCD)
| [image loading] AfreecaTV English (Tastosis)

Casters:
Tasteless | Artosis | Amazingxkcd | BisuDagger

<h2>Format and Maps</h2>
Best of five

<center>
<span class="putLPElement_test" data-page="VANT36%2E5_National_Starleague" data-no="1" data-eclass="mapstable" data-wiki="starcraft"></span></center>
<h2>Matchup</h2>

[image loading]      [image loading]
(P)Bisu              (Z)EffOrt


<h2>Results</h2>
<center>+ Show Spoiler [Bracket] +
<span class="putLPElement_test" data-page="VANT36%2E5_National_Starleague" data-no="1" data-eclass="bracket-wrapper" data-wiki="starcraft">
</center>
<h2>Recommended Games</h2>


+ Show Spoiler [Game 1] +
Poll: Recommend Game 1?

Yes (49)
 
91%

No (3)
 
6%

If you have time (2)
 
4%

54 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Game 1?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
(Vote): If you have time


+ Show Spoiler [Game 2] +
Poll: Recommend Game 2?

No (20)
 
67%

Yes (9)
 
30%

If you have time (1)
 
3%

30 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Game 2?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
(Vote): If you have time


+ Show Spoiler [Game 3] +
Poll: Recommend Game 3?

Yes (21)
 
91%

No (2)
 
9%

If you have time (0)
 
0%

23 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Game 3?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
(Vote): If you have time


+ Show Spoiler [Game 4] +
Poll: Recommend Game 4?

Yes (15)
 
88%

No (2)
 
12%

If you have time (0)
 
0%

17 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Game 4?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
(Vote): If you have time


+ Show Spoiler [Game 5] +
Poll: Recommend Game 5?

No (4)
 
44%

If you have time (3)
 
33%

Yes (2)
 
22%

9 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Game 5?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
(Vote): If you have time




<h2>Polls</h2>
+ Show Spoiler +

Poll: Head?

Bisu (11)
 
65%

EffOrt (6)
 
35%

17 total votes

Your vote: Head?

(Vote): Bisu
(Vote): EffOrt


Poll: Heart?

Bisu (10)
 
53%

EffOrt (9)
 
47%

19 total votes

Your vote: Heart?

(Vote): Bisu
(Vote): EffOrt



<hr>
Writer: Amazingxkcd
Graphics: v1
CSS: Swampflare, FO-nTTaX

</div>
The world is burning and you rather be on this terrible website discussing video games and your shallow feelings
amazingxkcd
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
GRAND OLD AMERICA16375 Posts
January 22 2016 18:01 GMT
#2
LETS GET HYPEEEE
The world is burning and you rather be on this terrible website discussing video games and your shallow feelings
outscar
Profile Joined September 2014
2832 Posts
January 22 2016 18:06 GMT
#3
I'm waiting for another stomp just like SSL11 because I think EffOrt is even more challenging opponent than herO for Bisu. He is who grabbed 4th OSL from Flash's hand. Time for him to show that he can win it even if organizers change his machine to Linux or Mac.
sunbeams are never made like me...
BisuDagger
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Bisutopia19224 Posts
January 22 2016 18:28 GMT
#4
On January 23 2016 03:06 outscar wrote:
I'm waiting for another stomp just like SSL11 because I think EffOrt is even more challenging opponent than herO for Bisu. He is who grabbed 4th OSL from Flash's hand. Time for him to show that he can win it even if organizers change his machine to Linux or Mac.

Bisu's level of play is far above what it was 6 months ago. There's now way it goes the same way. It will be very close and challenging for both imo.
ModeratorFormer Afreeca Starleague Caster: http://afreeca.tv/ASL2ENG2
Nikon
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Bulgaria5710 Posts
January 22 2016 18:36 GMT
#5
I hope I catch this. Fight fight!
[sc1f]eonzerg
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Belgium6540 Posts
January 22 2016 18:46 GMT
#6
smelling 3-2 bisu 2 gates in the last game -_-
Foxxan
Profile Joined October 2004
Sweden3427 Posts
January 22 2016 18:48 GMT
#7
Bisu better play alot better than the last tourament, the one whicvh he lost against a zerg in the final.
His pay was very lacking. He made bad cheeses and stuff and still won cuz zerg opponent fucked up.
prech
Profile Joined March 2014
United States2948 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-22 23:52:44
January 22 2016 20:28 GMT
#8
On January 23 2016 03:28 BisuDagger wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2016 03:06 outscar wrote:
I'm waiting for another stomp just like SSL11 because I think EffOrt is even more challenging opponent than herO for Bisu. He is who grabbed 4th OSL from Flash's hand. Time for him to show that he can win it even if organizers change his machine to Linux or Mac.

Bisu's level of play is far above what it was 6 months ago. There's now way it goes the same way. It will be very close and challenging for both imo.

Hmm, I watch all of Bisu's streams and don't really sense significant change one way or the other over the past year... His PvZ is dominant as always and that hero series still feels like an aberration.

I'd guess Bisu has played hero and EffOrt in best-of series (usually Bo3) ~5 times every week over the past many months and won a good 90% of them. That SSL11 loss was by far the worst, unfortunately, it also happened to be on the biggest of stages.

It seems EffOrt's had the most success when expanding conservatively to the nearby third and preventing Bisu from taking his third, with big hydra/ling pushes, followed by muta HT sniping. Conversely, when EffOrt expands cross map to take a main/natural, Bisu just takes his third and macros his way through EffOrt's split forces/defenses.

Basically, fully expecting EffOrt to be conservative in these finals with his third, but Circuit Breaker spells big trouble... CB could potentially be played twice, and that awkward third expansion for Zerg, be it the mineral only or the more distant mid-map spot, make it really tempting to expand cross map instead. As we saw against GuemChi in the quarters, EffOrt's forced to turtle and Protoss out macros him.

Hoping it'll be an exciting finals, either way!
Liquipedia
Chef
Profile Blog Joined August 2005
10810 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-22 20:34:49
January 22 2016 20:34 GMT
#9
That graphic makes the players look like they have unfortunate skin conditions / the photos are really old.

Still super excited about this. Can't wait to listen to my old SC heroes cast an great final.
LEGEND!! LEGEND!!
prech
Profile Joined March 2014
United States2948 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-22 20:40:44
January 22 2016 20:40 GMT
#10
Checking out the Korean fan predictions/bets over at Ygosu, with about 100 entries:

[image loading]

[image loading]
Source

Was expecting a much more Bisu-favored audience, but only ~60:40
Liquipedia
HyralGambit
Profile Joined February 2014
2439 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-22 22:01:34
January 22 2016 21:43 GMT
#11
Why is ZerO's face at the top?

Get out ZerO :^)

My hype video is better than yours btw:


Reddit post: https://redd.it/427ua7
Passion overcomes corporate stupidity: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jX9hbbA-WP4#t=4h2m
tanngard
Profile Joined April 2011
Norway1325 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-22 22:07:33
January 22 2016 22:06 GMT
#12
Hmm i did not know Bisu was that favoured Prech. I thought effort was for sure on level with him. Are you sure bisu wins 90 %? I guess im shocked to hear this considering efforts got a 18-3 winning record against protoss.

Actually after digging around i found that you also wrote this in the afreeca thread in early december after effort won 2 BO3 and bisu won 1 against eachother

On December 06 2015 12:59 prech wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 06 2015 11:50 c3rberUs wrote:
Was this played yesterday Korean time? I saw 2 or 3 games and EffOrt was just so aggressive with hydras and lurkers. Bisu won one after beating back EffOrt's everything with his everything (zeal/goon/ht/archon/corsair/dt/reavers.)

Yup, exactly, they played 3 Bo3's, all on FS and La Mancha, if I recall

First time I can remember that EffOrt won so many times again Bisu, having watched all of their games since EffOrt joined the scene.

It almost seems like EffOrt has realized the winning formula. 1) Expand to the nearby third instead of cross-map, give up economy for aggressive early play instead of blowing resources on defense 2) Going hydra den first instead of lair + spire and 3) Doing everything possible to prevent Bisu from taking his third. Basically the hero playbook, and it's been paying off...

EffOrt and Bisu must have played something like 50-100 times on CB over the past few months and EffOrt expands cross-map for his third 90%+ of the time, and he loses a good 75%+ of the time... Learn by trial and error



You have some key insights that will make me anticipate the games for tomorrow that much more. Thank you very much! I really did not know effort had so much problem with taking third at the other natural. But when you say he does not go directly into spire from three hatches, does that mean he goes for something like a fake hydra bust? Forcing bisu to invest in static defence, meanwhile saving drones from not building his own sunkens, saturating at his third and getting lair for lurkers...and then use lurkers to try and mantain bisu from moving out. What about a real hydra bust? Is he known for trying that or is bisu to good to scout and defend properly?
purakushi
Profile Joined August 2012
United States3300 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-22 22:21:41
January 22 2016 22:20 GMT
#13
Revenge of the eyebrows keke

Someone photoshop the header image.
T P Z sagi
c3rberUs
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Japan11286 Posts
January 22 2016 23:13 GMT
#14
I'll miss most if this live T_T.

GG
WriterMovie, 진영화 : "StarCraft will never die".
Qikz
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United Kingdom12022 Posts
January 22 2016 23:37 GMT
#15
Oh woops glad I checked. This is at 8AM my time. I thought it was 10.

Better get up early!
FanTaSy's #1 Fan | STPL Caster/Organiser | SKT BEST KT | https://twitch.tv/stpl
prech
Profile Joined March 2014
United States2948 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-22 23:50:02
January 22 2016 23:48 GMT
#16
On January 23 2016 07:06 tanngard wrote:
Hmm i did not know Bisu was that favoured Prech. I thought effort was for sure on level with him. Are you sure bisu wins 90 %? I guess im shocked to hear this considering efforts got a 18-3 winning record against protoss.

Actually after digging around i found that you also wrote this in the afreeca thread in early december after effort won 2 BO3 and bisu won 1 against eachother

Show nested quote +
On December 06 2015 12:59 prech wrote:
On December 06 2015 11:50 c3rberUs wrote:
Was this played yesterday Korean time? I saw 2 or 3 games and EffOrt was just so aggressive with hydras and lurkers. Bisu won one after beating back EffOrt's everything with his everything (zeal/goon/ht/archon/corsair/dt/reavers.)

Yup, exactly, they played 3 Bo3's, all on FS and La Mancha, if I recall

First time I can remember that EffOrt won so many times again Bisu, having watched all of their games since EffOrt joined the scene.

It almost seems like EffOrt has realized the winning formula. 1) Expand to the nearby third instead of cross-map, give up economy for aggressive early play instead of blowing resources on defense 2) Going hydra den first instead of lair + spire and 3) Doing everything possible to prevent Bisu from taking his third. Basically the hero playbook, and it's been paying off...

EffOrt and Bisu must have played something like 50-100 times on CB over the past few months and EffOrt expands cross-map for his third 90%+ of the time, and he loses a good 75%+ of the time... Learn by trial and error



You have some key insights that will make me anticipate the games for tomorrow that much more. Thank you very much! I really did not know effort had so much problem with taking third at the other natural. But when you say he does not go directly into spire from three hatches, does that mean he goes for something like a fake hydra bust? Forcing bisu to invest in static defence, meanwhile saving drones from not building his own sunkens, saturating at his third and getting lair for lurkers...and then use lurkers to try and mantain bisu from moving out. What about a real hydra bust? Is he known for trying that or is bisu to good to scout and defend properly?

It might be easier to watch some of those Bisu/EffOrt Bo3's than going into detail, thanks to Korhal:

(Bo3 starting at around 25mins)
(2x Bo3 starting at around 23mins then 57mins)

EffOrt mixes it up with the build orders, sometimes hydra den before lair, sometimes lair before den, but yea, when taking a nearby third rather than expanding cross map, EffOrt forces Bisu to make 4-6 cannons in most of these games.

On La Mancha, the thirds are similar to CB where they're more distant and difficult to defend for Zerg, so that makes for a few straight forward Bisu wins.

As for all-in hydra busts, I recall only a handful of attempts in recent months and Bisu's roaming corsairs usually pick that up -- it's easy to see EffOrt's rally point set up outside Bisu's natural so the cannons and psi storms are usually ready. EffOrt usually gg's after the failed attempt :/
Liquipedia
xccam
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
Great Britain1150 Posts
January 22 2016 23:58 GMT
#17
I'll miss it due to work, but can't wait to watch the vods!
Hoping for a 3-2!
HyralGambit
Profile Joined February 2014
2439 Posts
January 23 2016 00:00 GMT
#18
Second reddit post with 8 hours countdown:

https://redd.it/428cwf
Passion overcomes corporate stupidity: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jX9hbbA-WP4#t=4h2m
Cele
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Germany4016 Posts
January 23 2016 00:10 GMT
#19
HYPE-TRAIN, HYPE-TRAIN!
Broodwar for life!
cha0
Profile Joined March 2010
Canada504 Posts
January 23 2016 00:59 GMT
#20
The hype is real!!! We need the effort. Let's see the effort.
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