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[OSL] Ro16 Day 4 - Page 54

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 52 53 54 55 56 Next
hitthat
Profile Joined January 2010
Poland2294 Posts
July 22 2011 13:09 GMT
#1061
On July 22 2011 22:03 Gescom wrote:
Everyone make sure to let Bisu know how you feel about PvZ on your way. Don't be mad Jangbi played like a butt.


i am mad for Jangbi playing bad, that's not resist anyone to find alternative answers. Thats why terrans and Zergs are evolving and protoss stay in their conservative world like it was still protoss dragons era.
Likely they still believe that corsairs and storms are the only possible option to beat Zerg.


But hell, its pros problem, not mine
Shameless BroodWar separatistic, elitist, fanaticaly devoted puritan fanboy.
setzer
Profile Joined March 2010
United States3284 Posts
July 22 2011 13:10 GMT
#1062
Sad to see no protoss in the ro8. Here is to hoping some terran can save us from another horrible ZvZ finals.
Dandy4
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States493 Posts
July 22 2011 13:11 GMT
#1063
How does it look in Group D now that Modesty won?
Who let the dogs out?
Sinedd
Profile Joined July 2008
Poland7052 Posts
July 22 2011 13:11 GMT
#1064
On July 22 2011 22:09 hitthat wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 22:03 Gescom wrote:
Everyone make sure to let Bisu know how you feel about PvZ on your way. Don't be mad Jangbi played like a butt.


i am mad for Jangbi playing bad, that's not resist anyone to find alternative answers. Thats why terrans and Zergs are evolving and protoss stay in their conservative world like it was still protoss dragons era.
Likely they still believe that corsairs and storms are the only possible option to beat Zerg.


But hell, its pros problem, not mine

exactly my thoughts

Protoss WAY too conservative.

tt
T H C makes ppl happy
DarkMatter_
Profile Joined January 2010
Canada1774 Posts
July 22 2011 13:15 GMT
#1065
On July 22 2011 22:11 Dandy4 wrote:
How does it look in Group D now that Modesty won?

Modesty winning was ideal for Jaedong. If Jaedong loses to hyvaa, there's still a chance for tiebreakers if Hyuk beats Modesty. Tiebreaker will be between Hyuk, Modesty, JD.

If Jaedong wins against hyvaa and Modesty beats Hyuk, there's going to be a three way tiebreak between Hyuk, Modesty, JD.

If JD loses and Hyuk loses against Modesty, it's over for JD.
swanized
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
Canada2480 Posts
July 22 2011 13:17 GMT
#1066
KILLLLAAAAARRR
Writer
Evs
Profile Joined December 2008
Philippines330 Posts
July 22 2011 13:17 GMT
#1067
On July 22 2011 22:11 Sinedd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 22:09 hitthat wrote:
On July 22 2011 22:03 Gescom wrote:
Everyone make sure to let Bisu know how you feel about PvZ on your way. Don't be mad Jangbi played like a butt.


i am mad for Jangbi playing bad, that's not resist anyone to find alternative answers. Thats why terrans and Zergs are evolving and protoss stay in their conservative world like it was still protoss dragons era.
Likely they still believe that corsairs and storms are the only possible option to beat Zerg.


But hell, its pros problem, not mine

exactly my thoughts

Protoss WAY too conservative.

tt


It fits with the lore.

Terrans are adaptive by nature and Zergs evolve every cycle.

Blame the conclave for favoring tradition instead of experimentation.

PS
still waiting for protoss to find a good strategy that involves hallucination...
hitthat
Profile Joined January 2010
Poland2294 Posts
July 22 2011 13:19 GMT
#1068
On July 22 2011 22:17 Evs wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 22:11 Sinedd wrote:
On July 22 2011 22:09 hitthat wrote:
On July 22 2011 22:03 Gescom wrote:
Everyone make sure to let Bisu know how you feel about PvZ on your way. Don't be mad Jangbi played like a butt.


i am mad for Jangbi playing bad, that's not resist anyone to find alternative answers. Thats why terrans and Zergs are evolving and protoss stay in their conservative world like it was still protoss dragons era.
Likely they still believe that corsairs and storms are the only possible option to beat Zerg.


But hell, its pros problem, not mine

exactly my thoughts

Protoss WAY too conservative.

tt


It fits with the lore.

Terrans are adaptive by nature and Zergs evolve every cycle.

Blame the conclave for favoring tradition instead of experimentation.

PS
still waiting for protoss to find a good strategy that involves hallucination...


this is a good spell, but storm is just awsome cheap spell. So its just a little shame to put energy for something like this, when you can have your little nuke to mass murder drones/probes/scvs
Shameless BroodWar separatistic, elitist, fanaticaly devoted puritan fanboy.
Hittegods
Profile Joined April 2007
Stockholm4641 Posts
July 22 2011 13:26 GMT
#1069
On July 22 2011 22:05 kuroshiroi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 21:59 Elyvilon wrote:
On July 22 2011 21:55 Winechu wrote:
On July 22 2011 21:51 hitthat wrote:
Actually most of this is not about balance complain but about theorycrafting to find an answer in actual state of balance. Why are you think it's all whinig?


-scout the hydra den and yet still skimp on cannons

I agree with a lot of your post, but this part is tough. If you build like 10 cannons or whatever, you're not going to lose immediately, but you're going to lose in 10 minutes since you can't pressure. It can be tricky to figure out whether a zerg is really hydrabusting or just wants you to think he is.

Make a corsair, scout. Probe scout till you get a corsair. PvZ early game is mostly scouting.

More like lack of scouting. Probe scouting vs speedlings is near impossible at best, and the corsair is usually able to see the hydras as they march to your nat, which is a little bit too late.
This neo violence, pure self defiance
TwoToneTerran
Profile Joined March 2009
United States8841 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-22 13:27:32
July 22 2011 13:26 GMT
#1070
Mmhm.

Welcome to ShinHan Bank OSL Season 1 everyone!
Remember Violet.
Sinedd
Profile Joined July 2008
Poland7052 Posts
July 22 2011 13:27 GMT
#1071
On July 22 2011 22:19 hitthat wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 22:17 Evs wrote:
On July 22 2011 22:11 Sinedd wrote:
On July 22 2011 22:09 hitthat wrote:
On July 22 2011 22:03 Gescom wrote:
Everyone make sure to let Bisu know how you feel about PvZ on your way. Don't be mad Jangbi played like a butt.


i am mad for Jangbi playing bad, that's not resist anyone to find alternative answers. Thats why terrans and Zergs are evolving and protoss stay in their conservative world like it was still protoss dragons era.
Likely they still believe that corsairs and storms are the only possible option to beat Zerg.


But hell, its pros problem, not mine

exactly my thoughts

Protoss WAY too conservative.

tt


It fits with the lore.

Terrans are adaptive by nature and Zergs evolve every cycle.

Blame the conclave for favoring tradition instead of experimentation.

PS
still waiting for protoss to find a good strategy that involves hallucination...


this is a good spell, but storm is just awsome cheap spell. So its just a little shame to put energy for something like this, when you can have your little nuke to mass murder drones/probes/scvs

im just waiting for protoss to start using they damned skills/spells not only storm and stasis ;(
T H C makes ppl happy
TheGlassface
Profile Joined November 2010
United States612 Posts
July 22 2011 13:37 GMT
#1072
ffs. I hate this.

Being a toss fan sucks hard.

But, it IS flash and I guessss Killer's been on a roll...

dammit Khandudes
The mystery of life is not a problem to solve, but a reality to experience. **Hang in there STX fans!! Kal Hwaiting!**
Sawamura
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Malaysia7602 Posts
July 22 2011 13:41 GMT
#1073
who is going to save the toss race ???? Let's see Stork ? nope 0-2 in osl hmm how about jangbi 0-2 errr no . So where's bisu well he didn't even make it into osl . So protoss dreams to enter osl has already been crushed T_T".
BW/KT Forever R.I.P KT.Violet dearly missed ..
Fenrax
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States5018 Posts
July 22 2011 13:44 GMT
#1074
On July 22 2011 22:17 Evs wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 22:11 Sinedd wrote:
On July 22 2011 22:09 hitthat wrote:
On July 22 2011 22:03 Gescom wrote:
Everyone make sure to let Bisu know how you feel about PvZ on your way. Don't be mad Jangbi played like a butt.


i am mad for Jangbi playing bad, that's not resist anyone to find alternative answers. Thats why terrans and Zergs are evolving and protoss stay in their conservative world like it was still protoss dragons era.
Likely they still believe that corsairs and storms are the only possible option to beat Zerg.


But hell, its pros problem, not mine

exactly my thoughts

Protoss WAY too conservative.

tt


It fits with the lore.

Terrans are adaptive by nature and Zergs evolve every cycle.

Blame the conclave for favoring tradition instead of experimentation.

PS
still waiting for protoss to find a good strategy that involves hallucination...


idra is sc2 now, so who would fall for it...

anyway, jangbi didnt play bad, it was extremely bad luck imo

soos timing was lucky. you can call it perfect timing but it involved a ton of luck imo. his attack came right before the one reaver came back from harass and the other had built his first scarab. if that attack came two seconds later jangbi would have held easily. he got a bit greedy with his harass, but imo that was okay. the result was not foreseeable from his position. shit happens and your opponent usually wont hit his 2 second window.

unlike stork whose game against flash was just horrible jangbi is still playing well. he just had extremely hard competion (top tier zergs) and tough luck in the last 4 games, thats all. unless he himself starts thinking that he slumps he is a contender for the individual leagues.
TheGlassface
Profile Joined November 2010
United States612 Posts
July 22 2011 13:48 GMT
#1075
AND it was a hydra bust?!
AND it was Failierrs?

DAMMIT!!!

The mystery of life is not a problem to solve, but a reality to experience. **Hang in there STX fans!! Kal Hwaiting!**
Mirror0423
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States175 Posts
July 22 2011 14:32 GMT
#1076
On July 22 2011 21:55 Winechu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 21:51 hitthat wrote:
Actually most of this is not about balance complain but about theorycrafting to find an answer in actual state of balance. Why are you think it's all whinig?


Most Ps deserve to be hydra busted

-scout the hydra den and yet still skimp on cannons
-go for a tech build like double stargate + dt without a follow up plan
-don't make enough units and play greedy

It's not the fault of Zs hydra busting if Ps decide to play like this, it gets the job done and players have to do what they have to to win. It is not a balance issue. It can be rectified by simply playing better. Hydra busts have been around forever. Ps should know better.


Remember Zero V Stork game a while ago, where zero didn't even build a lair, stork saw it, made a ton of cannons, and zero just continued to make a TON of drones, and then stork got SMASHED? Now, imagine the zerg DIDN'T delay his tech, and you, with minimal scouting toss builds more cannons, turns out, zerg wasn't hydra busting, and... you still get smashed.

Toss sortof needs to "commit" to a tech path. If 2 stargate + DT didn't work, do you think 1 stargate DT would work? or just DT would work? Those plans have a "follow up plan" but if 2 stargate DT didn't work, plans that have a follow up would get even more hard-smashed. (don't say, if they weren't prepared it would work, that goes as well for 2 stargate DT, or any other committed build)

Toss units, without HT/Reaver, are NEVER cost efficient against mass hydras, or lurkers, or lings...IDK if you mean "greedy" as in greedy tech, or greedy econ, but zerg almost always has an army advantage untill we get to high tech. (even a 2 base V 2 base, without reavers or HT, zerg wins) so we have to either tech quickly fast, OR catch up on econ fast.

The point of toss is to try to cut corners and get to high tech ASAP, but the problem is the margin of corner you can cut is paper thin. If you cut too much you get hydra busted, if you don't cut enough, zerg gets too big too quickly. (doesn't apply for our measly "non-pro ppl" as much though.) anyways... I hope toss finds an answer soon.
Dandy4
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States493 Posts
July 22 2011 14:33 GMT
#1077
On July 22 2011 22:15 DarkMatter_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 22:11 Dandy4 wrote:
How does it look in Group D now that Modesty won?

Modesty winning was ideal for Jaedong. If Jaedong loses to hyvaa, there's still a chance for tiebreakers if Hyuk beats Modesty. Tiebreaker will be between Hyuk, Modesty, JD.

If Jaedong wins against hyvaa and Modesty beats Hyuk, there's going to be a three way tiebreak between Hyuk, Modesty, JD.

If JD loses and Hyuk loses against Modesty, it's over for JD.


Thanks hun, So I assume if JD wins againstHyvaa and Hyuk beats Modesty, then they both advance.
Who let the dogs out?
Gescom
Profile Joined February 2010
Canada3507 Posts
July 22 2011 14:35 GMT
#1078
On July 22 2011 23:33 Dandy4 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 22:15 DarkMatter_ wrote:
On July 22 2011 22:11 Dandy4 wrote:
How does it look in Group D now that Modesty won?

Modesty winning was ideal for Jaedong. If Jaedong loses to hyvaa, there's still a chance for tiebreakers if Hyuk beats Modesty. Tiebreaker will be between Hyuk, Modesty, JD.

If Jaedong wins against hyvaa and Modesty beats Hyuk, there's going to be a three way tiebreak between Hyuk, Modesty, JD.

If JD loses and Hyuk loses against Modesty, it's over for JD.


Thanks hun, So I assume if JD wins againstHyvaa and Hyuk beats Modesty, then they both advance.

That is correct.
Jaedong Hyuk || Bisu Jangbi || Fantasy Flash
Baddieko
Profile Joined October 2008
Singapore855 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-22 14:43:12
July 22 2011 14:40 GMT
#1079
The best thing for toss is to protect own units from getting snipe for nothing which bisu has done well. But that isn't enough strategy against all zergs. The best vZ protoss still lose because the zergs actually practice solely vP matchup in individual leagues, not like proleague when u don't know who they send out, needing to practice vP vT vZ for the zerg player.
virpi
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Germany3599 Posts
July 22 2011 15:45 GMT
#1080
yeah killer!!
first we make expand, then we defense it.
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