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On June 29 2011 03:29 Ryusei-R1 wrote:
Every time Jaedong plays like a motherfucking badass, the rest of Oz loses.
Why is it when Jaedong played bad for a few games the rest of Oz picked it up, but then when he comes back into form the rest of Oz slumps again?
I have this theory that Killer and Hiya are really clutch, so if Killer needs to win a game 6 in a 2-3 scenario, he will win. Similarly, Hiya can take ace matches or do well in WL when JD is slumping. But when those two are the first to play and they know JD will win, they think them losing doesn't matter, as there are plenty of other games to be played.
On the other hand, maybe Hiya just sucks at TvT right now, Killer isn't better than Kal, Anytime was outclassed by Bogus and Hyo is a rookie in the worst possible situation he could have faced.
It's one or the other, really 
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On June 29 2011 04:11 kuroshiroi wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2011 03:29 Ryusei-R1 wrote:
Every time Jaedong plays like a motherfucking badass, the rest of Oz loses.
Why is it when Jaedong played bad for a few games the rest of Oz picked it up, but then when he comes back into form the rest of Oz slumps again? I have this theory that Killer and Hiya are really clutch, so if Killer needs to win a game 6 in a 2-3 scenario, he will win. Similarly, Hiya can take ace matches or do well in WL when JD is slumping. But when those two are the first to play and they know JD will win, they think them losing doesn't matter, as there are plenty of other games to be played. On the other hand, maybe Hiya just sucks at TvT right now, Killer isn't better than Kal, Anytime was outclassed by Bogus and Hyo is a rookie in the worst possible situation he could have faced. It's one or the other, really
I think Oz is one decent player away from being a playoff team. Right now Princess, Perfectman, and Hiya just aren't the answer... Hiya should have been that decent player but has been god frickin awful this season with a few redeeming moments. I feel Killer has developed alot this year and I hope his continues to progress, but Oz really needs a decent consistent player to truly get out of this mediocre JD Oz image.
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I really wish we got to see more of Shy. He's played some pretty nice games and in general, I can't recall any facepalm-worthy games from him.
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On June 29 2011 04:46 DarkMatter_ wrote:
I really wish we got to see more of Shy. He's played some pretty nice games and in general, I can't recall any facepalm-worthy games from him.
How about his cybernetics core placement vs action? (LR facepalm moment)
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The problem with OZ is fairly obvious: after Jaedong, their best players are Killer (who has improved dramatically over his two years as an A-teamer, and should keep getting better) and Anytime (savvy old veteran).
HiyA ought to be/used to be a second ace threat but he's fallen off horribly over the last year or so (almost as bad as Jangbi before the recent resurrection).
After those four, OZ has Lomo, and a slew of young promising Protoss (Dear, sHy (probably the best of them), sky, Perfectman (may have lost the "promising" title by now), hyo who is actually sky, lol, etc.).
Basically, if we were still doing Bo5 I guarantee OZ makes the playoffs.
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On June 29 2011 05:17 VGhost wrote:
The problem with OZ is fairly obvious: after Jaedong, their best players are Killer (who has improved dramatically over his two years as an A-teamer, and should keep getting better) and Anytime (savvy old veteran).
HiyA ought to be/used to be a second ace threat but he's fallen off horribly over the last year or so (almost as bad as Jangbi before the recent resurrection).
After those four, OZ has Lomo, and a slew of young promising Protoss (Dear, sHy (probably the best of them), sky, Perfectman (may have lost the "promising" title by now), hyo, etc.).
Basically, if we were still doing Bo5 I guarantee OZ makes the playoffs.
I dunno about "guarantee" because Bo5 means STX, MBC and Fox would be getting more wins as well.
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I completely agree that Oz is 1 A-class player away from being a solid playoff contender. JD is pretty much autowin for two games so they just need two fuckin wins from everyone else. Its just sad to see them continue to be Jaedong Oz. I almost wish one of the other teams would disband so Oz can pickup a solid player in the draft...
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Well JD has lost some important Ace matches as well vs Bogus and Zero and some other important game. Yes it is maybe to much for JD to carry his team but his ace match appearance was not good this season.
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On June 29 2011 05:17 VGhost wrote:
The problem with OZ is fairly obvious: after Jaedong, their best players are Killer (who has improved dramatically over his two years as an A-teamer, and should keep getting better) and Anytime (savvy old veteran).
HiyA ought to be/used to be a second ace threat but he's fallen off horribly over the last year or so (almost as bad as Jangbi before the recent resurrection).
After those four, OZ has Lomo, and a slew of young promising Protoss (Dear, sHy (probably the best of them), sky, Perfectman (may have lost the "promising" title by now), hyo, etc.).
Basically, if we were still doing Bo5 I guarantee OZ makes the playoffs.
Heh, sky and hyo are the same person.
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Oz may have gotten destroyed, but I'm still happy that Jaedong won. Am I a terrbile fan?
On June 29 2011 05:37 jyLee wrote:
I completely agree that Oz is 1 A-class player away from being a solid playoff contender. JD is pretty much autowin for two games so they just need two fuckin wins from everyone else. Its just sad to see them continue to be Jaedong Oz. I almost wish one of the other teams would disband so Oz can pickup a solid player in the draft...
To be fair, Jaedong hasn't really preformed up to the standard of an Ace player this season. He's dropped quite a few games and his Ace record this year wasn't exactly "jaedong-esque" if I can remember correctly. I do agree Oz needs another very good player who can deliver results on a consistent basis and be almost guarenteed to win games against weaker players (like KT has stats). Oz isn't as bad in paper but Lomo's fallen, Killer still has consistency issues, and Hiya is prone to going on slumps for long periods of time. Oh and the lack of a half-decent Protoss really hurts too; there are some up and comers but they still need time to develop.
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Whenever OZ loses, it's a consolation prize to see Jaedong win, so it's not all bad, but Khan and Stars are definitely the contenders now.
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On June 29 2011 06:49 Release wrote:
Whenever OZ loses, it's a consolation prize to see Jaedong win, so it's not all bad, but Khan and Stars are definitely the contenders now.
Lol thats exactly how I feel, except I'd happier seeing Jd win than i am seeing oz win D:
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On June 29 2011 06:33 TheSubtleArt wrote:Oz may have gotten destroyed, but I'm still happy that Jaedong won. Am I a terrbile fan? Show nested quote +On June 29 2011 05:37 jyLee wrote:
I completely agree that Oz is 1 A-class player away from being a solid playoff contender. JD is pretty much autowin for two games so they just need two fuckin wins from everyone else. Its just sad to see them continue to be Jaedong Oz. I almost wish one of the other teams would disband so Oz can pickup a solid player in the draft... To be fair, Jaedong hasn't really preformed up to the standard of an Ace player this season. He's dropped quite a few games and his Ace record this year wasn't exactly "jaedong-esque" if I can remember correctly. I do agree Oz needs another very good player who can deliver results on a consistent basis and be almost guarenteed to win games against weaker players (like KT has stats). Oz isn't as bad in paper but Lomo's fallen, Killer still has consistency issues, and Hiya is prone to going on slumps for long periods of time. Oh and the lack of a half-decent Protoss really hurts too; there are some up and comers but they still need time to develop.
Even if JD is not playing up to his usual standards in ace games what other players not named Flash/JD would anyone put actual money down on in ace matches. Bisu? Stork? Zero? lol no thanks. JD/Flash in massive slump mode > anyone else. JD loses a couple matches in a row and thats considered a huge slump but when players like Bisu go on slumps they are done for entire seasons. This really isnt fanboyism and just shows how scarily consistent those two players are. Give JD one REAL A-class player with Hiya as the 3rd option and Oz would easily be a top 3 contender. Hiya just isnt consistent enough to be playing the second best players on other teams regularily but would crush your regular A-teamer.
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Even as a Jaedong fan, you should enjoy it when Oz wins despite JD losing. It means he can feel less burdened knowing that his teammates can actually hold their own once in a while. As a Jaedong fan, it's painful watching Jaedong being consistently let down by his teammates.
Although, I still think last season was worse. I'm actually surprised that Oz managed to do as well as they did with the Bo7 format. Some of the players (Killer, Perfectman) definitely stepped up their game and several of the losses were partially due to JD under performing as the team's ace and losing a bunch of ace matches in the earlier rounds.
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On June 29 2011 07:24 jyLee wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2011 06:33 TheSubtleArt wrote:Oz may have gotten destroyed, but I'm still happy that Jaedong won. Am I a terrbile fan? On June 29 2011 05:37 jyLee wrote:
I completely agree that Oz is 1 A-class player away from being a solid playoff contender. JD is pretty much autowin for two games so they just need two fuckin wins from everyone else. Its just sad to see them continue to be Jaedong Oz. I almost wish one of the other teams would disband so Oz can pickup a solid player in the draft... To be fair, Jaedong hasn't really preformed up to the standard of an Ace player this season. He's dropped quite a few games and his Ace record this year wasn't exactly "jaedong-esque" if I can remember correctly. I do agree Oz needs another very good player who can deliver results on a consistent basis and be almost guarenteed to win games against weaker players (like KT has stats). Oz isn't as bad in paper but Lomo's fallen, Killer still has consistency issues, and Hiya is prone to going on slumps for long periods of time. Oh and the lack of a half-decent Protoss really hurts too; there are some up and comers but they still need time to develop. Even if JD is not playing up to his usual standards in ace games what other players not named Flash/JD would anyone put actual money down on in ace matches. Bisu? Stork? Zero? lol no thanks. JD/Flash in massive slump mode > anyone else. JD loses a couple matches in a row and thats considered a huge slump but when players like Bisu go on slumps they are done for entire seasons. This really isnt fanboyism and just shows how scarily consistent those two players are. Give JD one REAL A-class player with Hiya as the 3rd option and Oz would easily be a top 3 contender. Hiya just isnt consistent enough to be playing the second best players on other teams regularily but would crush your regular A-teamer.
I don't disagree, Jaedong is still frighteningly good even when he's slumping. Just saying, this season's preformance wasn't his best and there were some stretches where he was letting the team down and other players were carrying the burden. It's all relative, of course. Jaedong in his current form is still probably better than almost any player out there, but as a big Jaedong fan, and having watched what he did up to last year, this season was a little bit of a letdown.
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10387 Posts
On June 29 2011 07:24 jyLee wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2011 06:33 TheSubtleArt wrote:Oz may have gotten destroyed, but I'm still happy that Jaedong won. Am I a terrbile fan? On June 29 2011 05:37 jyLee wrote:
I completely agree that Oz is 1 A-class player away from being a solid playoff contender. JD is pretty much autowin for two games so they just need two fuckin wins from everyone else. Its just sad to see them continue to be Jaedong Oz. I almost wish one of the other teams would disband so Oz can pickup a solid player in the draft... To be fair, Jaedong hasn't really preformed up to the standard of an Ace player this season. He's dropped quite a few games and his Ace record this year wasn't exactly "jaedong-esque" if I can remember correctly. I do agree Oz needs another very good player who can deliver results on a consistent basis and be almost guarenteed to win games against weaker players (like KT has stats). Oz isn't as bad in paper but Lomo's fallen, Killer still has consistency issues, and Hiya is prone to going on slumps for long periods of time. Oh and the lack of a half-decent Protoss really hurts too; there are some up and comers but they still need time to develop. Even if JD is not playing up to his usual standards in ace games what other players not named Flash/JD would anyone put actual money down on in ace matches. Bisu? Stork? Zero? lol no thanks. JD/Flash in massive slump mode > anyone else. JD loses a couple matches in a row and thats considered a huge slump but when players like Bisu go on slumps they are done for entire seasons. This really isnt fanboyism and just shows how scarily consistent those two players are. Give JD one REAL A-class player with Hiya as the 3rd option and Oz would easily be a top 3 contender. Hiya just isnt consistent enough to be playing the second best players on other teams regularily but would crush your regular A-teamer.
I would put money down on Bisu in an ace match against anyone that's not Flash..
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If Dream league is any indication, then I'm sure Oz will have a solid toss lineup by next season.
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On June 29 2011 05:27 Ryo wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2011 05:17 VGhost wrote:
The problem with OZ is fairly obvious: after Jaedong, their best players are Killer (who has improved dramatically over his two years as an A-teamer, and should keep getting better) and Anytime (savvy old veteran).
HiyA ought to be/used to be a second ace threat but he's fallen off horribly over the last year or so (almost as bad as Jangbi before the recent resurrection).
After those four, OZ has Lomo, and a slew of young promising Protoss (Dear, sHy (probably the best of them), sky, Perfectman (may have lost the "promising" title by now), hyo, etc.).
Basically, if we were still doing Bo5 I guarantee OZ makes the playoffs. I dunno about "guarantee" because Bo5 means STX, MBC and Fox would be getting more wins as well.
I'll take Jaedong against Calm, Kal, Bogus, Mind, BaBy, RorO, Jaehoon, or Sea any day. ANY DAY.
Jaedong's maybe not at his 2009 peak, relatively speaking, but the only players I'd worry about him facing are Bisu, Stork, and Flash - probably in that order. Whereas STX ace players are known for blinding inconsistency, MBC has replaced Sea-Light with Sea-Jaehoon (not as good), and FOX... I don't know what to make of FOX, honestly. If they had T1 or CJ coaching I think they'd rip up everybody, but as is they're maddening (I sympathize as a Stars fan, lol).
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On June 29 2011 08:07 ArvickHero wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2011 07:24 jyLee wrote:On June 29 2011 06:33 TheSubtleArt wrote:Oz may have gotten destroyed, but I'm still happy that Jaedong won. Am I a terrbile fan? On June 29 2011 05:37 jyLee wrote:
I completely agree that Oz is 1 A-class player away from being a solid playoff contender. JD is pretty much autowin for two games so they just need two fuckin wins from everyone else. Its just sad to see them continue to be Jaedong Oz. I almost wish one of the other teams would disband so Oz can pickup a solid player in the draft... To be fair, Jaedong hasn't really preformed up to the standard of an Ace player this season. He's dropped quite a few games and his Ace record this year wasn't exactly "jaedong-esque" if I can remember correctly. I do agree Oz needs another very good player who can deliver results on a consistent basis and be almost guarenteed to win games against weaker players (like KT has stats). Oz isn't as bad in paper but Lomo's fallen, Killer still has consistency issues, and Hiya is prone to going on slumps for long periods of time. Oh and the lack of a half-decent Protoss really hurts too; there are some up and comers but they still need time to develop. Even if JD is not playing up to his usual standards in ace games what other players not named Flash/JD would anyone put actual money down on in ace matches. Bisu? Stork? Zero? lol no thanks. JD/Flash in massive slump mode > anyone else. JD loses a couple matches in a row and thats considered a huge slump but when players like Bisu go on slumps they are done for entire seasons. This really isnt fanboyism and just shows how scarily consistent those two players are. Give JD one REAL A-class player with Hiya as the 3rd option and Oz would easily be a top 3 contender. Hiya just isnt consistent enough to be playing the second best players on other teams regularily but would crush your regular A-teamer. I would put money down on Bisu in an ace match against anyone that's not Flash..
I still remember during the last msl selection ceremony how hard Bisu cried about being stuck in the group of death but Flash/JD both said they didnt care. Good luck with bankruptcy.
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10387 Posts
On June 29 2011 12:27 jyLee wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2011 08:07 ArvickHero wrote:On June 29 2011 07:24 jyLee wrote:On June 29 2011 06:33 TheSubtleArt wrote:Oz may have gotten destroyed, but I'm still happy that Jaedong won. Am I a terrbile fan? On June 29 2011 05:37 jyLee wrote:
I completely agree that Oz is 1 A-class player away from being a solid playoff contender. JD is pretty much autowin for two games so they just need two fuckin wins from everyone else. Its just sad to see them continue to be Jaedong Oz. I almost wish one of the other teams would disband so Oz can pickup a solid player in the draft... To be fair, Jaedong hasn't really preformed up to the standard of an Ace player this season. He's dropped quite a few games and his Ace record this year wasn't exactly "jaedong-esque" if I can remember correctly. I do agree Oz needs another very good player who can deliver results on a consistent basis and be almost guarenteed to win games against weaker players (like KT has stats). Oz isn't as bad in paper but Lomo's fallen, Killer still has consistency issues, and Hiya is prone to going on slumps for long periods of time. Oh and the lack of a half-decent Protoss really hurts too; there are some up and comers but they still need time to develop. Even if JD is not playing up to his usual standards in ace games what other players not named Flash/JD would anyone put actual money down on in ace matches. Bisu? Stork? Zero? lol no thanks. JD/Flash in massive slump mode > anyone else. JD loses a couple matches in a row and thats considered a huge slump but when players like Bisu go on slumps they are done for entire seasons. This really isnt fanboyism and just shows how scarily consistent those two players are. Give JD one REAL A-class player with Hiya as the 3rd option and Oz would easily be a top 3 contender. Hiya just isnt consistent enough to be playing the second best players on other teams regularily but would crush your regular A-teamer. I would put money down on Bisu in an ace match against anyone that's not Flash.. I still remember during the last msl selection ceremony how hard Bisu cried about being stuck in the group of death but Flash/JD both said they didnt care. Good luck with bankruptcy.
and Bisu has the highest number of wins in Proleague. I think I'd make a pretty nice profit lol
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EPT
