EPT[MSL] Ro4 Day 1 - Page 26
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Release
United States4397 Posts
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Doughboy
United States721 Posts
On February 11 2011 14:42 Ideas wrote: ive got to be honest. great making it to the finals is way more underwhelming than when calm/kwanro/movie made it to a final. calm destroyed the other top 2 zergs on his way to the final. kwanro had been moderately successful in individual leagues for a while before he reached the finals (several Ro8s, and i THINK he made a semifinals before that?), not to mention he also beat flash on his way to the finals (ironically he ALSO beat zero on his way to the finals lol). movie (who ALSO ALSO beat zero on way to finals rofl) had some of the best PvZ at the time and well at least his final wasnt a mirror lol. the hardest person great had to play was kal (highest vs Z ELO of any of his opponents thus far, and by a longshot). while that was impressive i guess, that series was way more kal giving it away than great taking it, at least in my most likely biased opinion. hydra/JD is going to fucking CRUSH great :\. man how many times has it been now that zero lost to someone he shouldnt of and then we get a totally mediocre starleague? rofl. damnit zero, WE ALL WANT YOU TO MAKE A FINAL. FUCKING DO IT ALREADY Couldn't agree with this post more :/ | ||
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Ideas
United States8030 Posts
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ShadeR
Australia7535 Posts
On February 11 2011 14:42 Ideas wrote: ive got to be honest. great making it to the finals is way more underwhelming than when calm/kwanro/movie made it to a final. calm destroyed the other top 2 zergs on his way to the final. kwanro had been moderately successful in individual leagues for a while before he reached the finals (several Ro8s, and i THINK he made a semifinals before that?), not to mention he also beat flash on his way to the finals (ironically he ALSO beat zero on his way to the finals lol). movie (who ALSO ALSO beat zero on way to finals rofl) had some of the best PvZ at the time and well at least his final wasnt a mirror lol. the hardest person great had to play was kal (highest vs Z ELO of any of his opponents thus far, and by a longshot). while that was impressive i guess, that series was way more kal giving it away than great taking it, at least in my most likely biased opinion. hydra/JD is going to fucking CRUSH great :\. man how many times has it been now that zero lost to someone he shouldnt of and then we get a totally mediocre starleague? rofl. damnit zero, WE ALL WANT YOU TO MAKE A FINAL. FUCKING DO IT ALREADY Nah we all knew he was gonna lose this one =/ | ||
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Ideas
United States8030 Posts
On February 11 2011 15:53 ShadeR wrote: Nah we all knew he was gonna lose this one =/ what i mean by that is that zero has consistently been a top 10 players since 2009, but he's constantly losing to random people who go on a streak (like movie during EVER09) or just not playing as well as he should (korean air S2 vs free). it's so sad that this is actually the only time he's made a semifinal since lost saga MSL :\ I guess he really is the zerg version of sea (but with slightly better results) | ||
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Ryo
8787 Posts
On February 11 2011 16:25 Ideas wrote: what i mean by that is that zero has consistently been a top 10 players since 2009, but he's constantly losing to random people who go on a streak (like movie during EVER09) or just not playing as well as he should (korean air S2 vs free). it's so sad that this is actually the only time he's made a semifinal since lost saga MSL :\ I guess he really is the zerg version of sea (but with slightly better results) Nah, he's not the zerg version of Sea. Sea is very clutch in proleague. Zero can choke in any given league. But actually Zero didn't really choke this MSL, his ZvZ is just plainly not good enough. Maybe if he had met Kal instead of Great he could have won. Tough luck meeting Great who's best matchup is ZvZ. | ||
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j2choe
Canada243 Posts
Not that I necessarily blame the MSL staff for pushing for hive play--ZvZ semis must be a serious damper on ratings, and hyping hive play might be the only thing that can make it appealing. | ||
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kuroshiroi
3149 Posts
On February 11 2011 19:13 j2choe wrote: Did anyone else think the huge lull in Game 2 where neither player did anything but macro/tech seem kind of bullshitty? I wouldn't be surprised if the MSL people told both players to incorporate hive play into at least one game in order to make the matches more interesting. Not sure why, but while I watched Game 2 I had the feeling I was watching something planned, like a no-rush agreement. Not that I necessarily blame the MSL staff for pushing for hive play--ZvZ semis must be a serious damper on ratings, and hyping hive play might be the only thing that can make it appealing. Conspiracy theories? Really? When you've got the two most willing and capable Hive tech players in a BO5 series who have frequently gone to Hive without any "need" for it and claimed they wanted to go Hive in every interview before the match? Long ZvZs just play out differently from other matchups where there's a lot of dull moments in the beginning and everything explodes at the end. In long ZvZ there's a lot of action in the beginning, dull moments in the middle and chaotic überaction at the end. Great wanted to go Hive tech, Zero obliged. One of the best Hive tech ZvZs ever ensued after about 10 minutes of buildup. Everybody was happy. | ||
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Turbovolver
Australia2334 Posts
On February 11 2011 14:42 Ideas wrote: ive got to be honest. great making it to the finals is way more underwhelming than when calm/kwanro/movie made it to a final. calm destroyed the other top 2 zergs on his way to the final. kwanro had been moderately successful in individual leagues for a while before he reached the finals (several Ro8s, and i THINK he made a semifinals before that?), not to mention he also beat flash on his way to the finals (ironically he ALSO beat zero on his way to the finals lol). movie (who ALSO ALSO beat zero on way to finals rofl) had some of the best PvZ at the time and well at least his final wasnt a mirror lol. the hardest person great had to play was kal (highest vs Z ELO of any of his opponents thus far, and by a longshot). while that was impressive i guess, that series was way more kal giving it away than great taking it, at least in my most likely biased opinion. hydra/JD is going to fucking CRUSH great :\. man how many times has it been now that zero lost to someone he shouldnt of and then we get a totally mediocre starleague? rofl. damnit zero, WE ALL WANT YOU TO MAKE A FINAL. FUCKING DO IT ALREADY Great played awesome ZvZ here, at least when it didn't go to hive tech. That alone shows he's changed (from being the guy that wins hive tech and is nothing special otherwise). You watch this series and go "Oh Zero choked again *yawn*" but Great did some very cool stuff in this series, and JD or Hydra better check themselves. Think about the games and not just the results. | ||
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Renkaoru
390 Posts
On February 11 2011 12:35 Turbovolver wrote: :O One's mentioned in your sig! :O And why don't they bring any star value to BW? Because they haven't won any titles yet. Which would change if they won a title. Basically if we follow your logic there should have never been a Flash/JD/Bisu/Stork because "Bisu is just a random, he doesn't bring star value like Savior". Repeat ad infinitum right up the complete BW history tree. PS: JD is not going to win this MSL. This post speaks of truth. It's not like every TBLS member was TBLS from the start. Not all the star players tear shit up from the moment they enter the scene, they got to start somewhere. I'm personally confident this is going to be Great's breakout performance. Unfortunately for his fans, JD is burning out, anyone who doesn't see this is just looking at him with fanboy-colored glasses. Time for new blood, Hydra and Great to step up now.  | ||
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SubtleArt
2710 Posts
On February 11 2011 14:42 Ideas wrote: ive got to be honest. great making it to the finals is way more underwhelming than when calm/kwanro/movie made it to a final. calm destroyed the other top 2 zergs on his way to the final. kwanro had been moderately successful in individual leagues for a while before he reached the finals (several Ro8s, and i THINK he made a semifinals before that?), not to mention he also beat flash on his way to the finals (ironically he ALSO beat zero on his way to the finals lol). movie (who ALSO ALSO beat zero on way to finals rofl) had some of the best PvZ at the time and well at least his final wasnt a mirror lol. the hardest person great had to play was kal (highest vs Z ELO of any of his opponents thus far, and by a longshot). while that was impressive i guess, that series was way more kal giving it away than great taking it, at least in my most likely biased opinion. hydra/JD is going to fucking CRUSH great :\. man how many times has it been now that zero lost to someone he shouldnt of and then we get a totally mediocre starleague? rofl. damnit zero, WE ALL WANT YOU TO MAKE A FINAL. FUCKING DO IT ALREADY Yea great is like the most average of the average Zergs. It's pretty underwhelming having him as a finalist. If Hydra reaches the finals he has a shot (like...20% maybe?) considering Hydra's inexperience but if Jaedong makes the finals theres absolutely no hope. | ||
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TheShimmy
United States1808 Posts
http://www.youtube.com/user/TheShimmySC?feature=mhum | ||
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Prototype
Sweden56 Posts
Makes you wonder why Chill hasn't won the MSL... | ||
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MuffinDude
United States3837 Posts
On February 11 2011 14:42 Ideas wrote: ive got to be honest. great making it to the finals is way more underwhelming than when calm/kwanro/movie made it to a final. calm destroyed the other top 2 zergs on his way to the final. kwanro had been moderately successful in individual leagues for a while before he reached the finals (several Ro8s, and i THINK he made a semifinals before that?), not to mention he also beat flash on his way to the finals (ironically he ALSO beat zero on his way to the finals lol). movie (who ALSO ALSO beat zero on way to finals rofl) had some of the best PvZ at the time and well at least his final wasnt a mirror lol. the hardest person great had to play was kal (highest vs Z ELO of any of his opponents thus far, and by a longshot). while that was impressive i guess, that series was way more kal giving it away than great taking it, at least in my most likely biased opinion. hydra/JD is going to fucking CRUSH great :\. man how many times has it been now that zero lost to someone he shouldnt of and then we get a totally mediocre starleague? rofl. damnit zero, WE ALL WANT YOU TO MAKE A FINAL. FUCKING DO IT ALREADY Maybe think of it as great's coming out party? | ||
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Mortality
United States4790 Posts
But he's no superstar either. I expected Great to win over Zero, whose ZvZ track record is unbelievably shaky. But Great is not the better player. In ZvZ yes, but that's Great's best MU and Zero's worst. Zero would have been a much more deserving finalist. To be honest, Great really does rank among the worst of finalists in history. Mind was high A-class when he won MSL. He was beating some of the most solid players of that era and he was able to make it back to the Ro4 the next season, as well take down Jangbi in TvP at the heigh of Jangbi's career in WCG 08. Yarnc had S-class ZvT and was palying very, very solid ZvZ (but not solid enough to topple JvZ at its height). Movie was being haled as a diamond in the rough, one of the greatest developing talents. Kwnaro was on fire, high A-class. And Calm? Jesus, the man was butchering everyone. Just to give a figure, Calm went 68-32 (68%) in 2009 and his series against Kwanro was right at his height. Pushing S-class. Even July at his golden mouse win was the best ZvP player in the world at that time. I'd grant you that Great is probably more solid relative to his peers than July was back then, but July had the right specialty to carve his way through Protoss season, even if his ZvT was B-class and his ZvZ was C-class (by that I mean, almost a sure loss in a PL level match). And... it was mother fucking July who had proven himself time and time again over the years. The fact that he revolutionized ZvP in the process at least lets us forgive that July was no longer a stellar player when he won his third. Basically, Great will really need to show us something special in order to fit in. | ||
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Finale
249 Posts
Shit happens occasionally and I was left unable to continue for a couple of hours, but Nyovne was too quick for me and I had to a eat a ban. That's on me for making the thread and breaking the rules. Not much else to be said. On February 10 2011 22:27 Aesop wrote: I updated the results in the OP. But really, no matter how pretty your OP is, it should contain the results once the games are finished. Thanks for taking care of that. | ||
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KamMoye
United States721 Posts
And since Kal is a top 5 player per KeSPA, you can't say Great had an easy path, no matter how many scrubs he might have faced before getting to Kal. | ||
Sayle
United Kingdom3685 Posts
http://iccupbw.blip.tv/file/4755578/ | ||
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StorkHwaiting
United States3465 Posts
On February 11 2011 14:42 Ideas wrote: ive got to be honest. great making it to the finals is way more underwhelming than when calm/kwanro/movie made it to a final. calm destroyed the other top 2 zergs on his way to the final. kwanro had been moderately successful in individual leagues for a while before he reached the finals (several Ro8s, and i THINK he made a semifinals before that?), not to mention he also beat flash on his way to the finals (ironically he ALSO beat zero on his way to the finals lol). movie (who ALSO ALSO beat zero on way to finals rofl) had some of the best PvZ at the time and well at least his final wasnt a mirror lol. the hardest person great had to play was kal (highest vs Z ELO of any of his opponents thus far, and by a longshot). while that was impressive i guess, that series was way more kal giving it away than great taking it, at least in my most likely biased opinion. hydra/JD is going to fucking CRUSH great :\. man how many times has it been now that zero lost to someone he shouldnt of and then we get a totally mediocre starleague? rofl. damnit zero, WE ALL WANT YOU TO MAKE A FINAL. FUCKING DO IT ALREADY What? Great's been just as successful if not more so in indiv. leagues as fking Kwanro. I hate when people QQ that a player didn't deserve to get to the finals. He won so he deserves to be there. And Great didn't get to the finals by playing a whole bunch of cheesy all-ins or one-trick play. He played all different ranges of games and more than deserved to get there. He beat Zero and Kal, two very good players. And Zero/Kal eliminated some fantastic players to get there, so your argument really makes no sense. | ||
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Ideas
United States8030 Posts
On February 14 2011 05:14 StorkHwaiting wrote: What? Great's been just as successful if not more so in indiv. leagues as fking Kwanro. I hate when people QQ that a player didn't deserve to get to the finals. He won so he deserves to be there. And Great didn't get to the finals by playing a whole bunch of cheesy all-ins or one-trick play. He played all different ranges of games and more than deserved to get there. He beat Zero and Kal, two very good players. And Zero/Kal eliminated some fantastic players to get there, so your argument really makes no sense. great made the Ro8 in the Hana Deatoo MSL. before that he never passed the Ro32 in a league. kwanro made the Ro8 in GOMTV S3 MSL, Ro16 of bacchus 2009 OSL, Ro16 of lost saga MSL, and semifinals of NATE MSL (although this was after avalon MSL) besides reaching the finals of avalon. kwanro has a much better track record than great in individual leagues, even though he has slumped really bad since 2009 (on the other hand, great was always bad until this year). Im just saying, zero has way more credentials and it sucks that once again he met someone with better ZvZ and lost too early in an individual league. besides beating kal, great got really lucky with his path to the finals (, soulkey in a zvz, leta with a horrible cheese, zero in a zvz, action in a zvz). but im willing to forgive him if he doesnt embarrass himself in the finals. | ||
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