[OSL] Ever OSL - Ro8 Week 2 - Page 137

On December 26 2009 05:31 Avidkeystamper wrote:

He was known for making Starleagues but never really going far at all. Kinda like go.go but slightly better without great macro and nonexistant micro.

On December 25 2009 21:46 StorkHwaiting wrote:


LoL. This is why Shine does not have my respect and why Stork utterly destroyed him in Game 2.

In game 2, he tried for mass hydra spamming on 3 base with a fast doom drop to avoid the cannons. It was an all-in because he knew Stork was taking his third and did not a single thing to stop it. He tried to go for the timing window when the nexus/cannons are just warping in so basically Stork's got a non-operational third rather than 10 more zealots. It got raped. For the rest of the game, Shine played so utterly generic because he had no other choice.

The reason JD is respected is because he does things that are outside the realm of what's normal. He doesn't win on basic racial or map advantages. He wins AGAINST odds. JD will be down by a lot and then he'll claw his way back in with amazing scourge micro, really efficient ling usage, really smart drops, etc.

Shine on the other hand, found the need to spend minerals making sunkens AND spores at all of his expos because he didn't have enough trust in his own multitask to use OLs and scourges to defend his shit. This is why he can't ever come back from a disadvantage.

Shine got burrow and OL speed + drop, yet never had a single smart burrow ambush vs shuttles nor did he ever have an intelligent drop.

He even managed to lose 9 drones to a DT, when he could have burrowed them. And when he saw them dying, instead of burrowing, he tried to run and lost 2 more.

Shine could not even rely on scourge micro to snipe obs while using his muta to snipe templars. Instead, Shine stood at the bridge and used his mutas and a ton of OLs to snipe obs. His mutas got drilled by goons, he lost a bunch of OL's every time he brought them to detect, and all he did was delay the inevitable. Not one of these moves are a "skill" move that use superior control/judgment to secure an advantage.

This is why Shine sucks.

The only time Shine wins is when he secures the basic early game advantages that ALL zergs have vs protoss until storm is done and there are enough dragoons/corsair to babysit the templars. If Shine doesn't win or secure a tremendous advantage before this point in time, he will never ever win a game. It's really a simple concept and it's what many others have consistently said. Shine is not a player that stands out in any way. He relies on the basic advantages of his race, nothing more.



The moment ZvP's inherent advantage got taken away, Shine was helpless.

On December 26 2009 06:02 FireGuyX wrote:



Are you kidding me? ForGG during his MSL run looked like what Flash is right now. ForGG's macro at one point was insane.

On December 26 2009 06:11 samachking wrote:
Okay

results

T___T

My favorite player of all time gets cheesed in the most gay and tragic way as a repeat of the PL Grand Finals, Fuck you Flash and Fantasy for not having the balls to go for 2 straight up games back to back even when you had the lead. JD is sustaining the Yellow vs Boxer curse of Terran cheese faggotory that prevails. But it doesnt matter, JD IS going to ass rape Flash so bad that hell quit BW in the MSL finals with a tragic man tearjerking suicidal way 3-0 in the MSL Finals, Flash wont want to pick up a mouse again after that series and fall into an eternal slump and retire from BW. T_________T, fucking flash and fantasy make me rage so hard :/

Then I hope for the best, and guess what happens? my 2nd and 3rd favorite progamers also get knocked out , Stork and Zero T_____T, they blew their first game and paid the price, but thats not the worst part, Movie the cheesy toss proceeds to win over my 2nd favorite Zerg with his creative 10-12 minute all in BOs and proceeds to the ro4, good fucking luck with finding 5 all in builds in a bo5. Pure the toss I actually liked and loved his style also proceeds to fail and drop out after a failure game 1. And the 2 zergs that qualify, one I dislike for being a semiallinsh player with weak mechanics but sick ZvZ id give him that, and another I felt apathetic towards.

Oh well, the OSL became T__T for me. Who to root for?
Calm 3-0 Flash( I HATE YOU SO MUCH FLASH RIGHT NOW T___T But if you reach the finals and get raped 0-3 by JD id love it if you do that okay?)
Shine >>> Movie- This will probably be a great series despite how cheesy Movie's style is, its entertaining to watch and fun to see how Zergs play against it, and shine is one of the smartest Zergs around with really good decision making all game long with not so perfect mechanics

So lets go ZvZ finals with Shine winning lets go...

Oh Im 0/4 too yay

Mods sorry if this is offensive but im just venting my rage here



ForGG back then was a retarded macro terran bot with godlike macro that just a-moved and had 70% winrate TvP and TvZ, but terrible TvT (30%) because he just a-moved. During that MSL he learnt something called a timing push and learnt some TvT and learnt micro, he just raped everyone straight up with some really funky TvP games vs Kal( one of the best series ever), Flash played like a retarded monkey in that series and just mass 14cc'd and died, his TvZ vs JD was the real deal though, the maps didnt matter, it just felt like he was just on another level of TvZ at the time, the macro was simply unreal. Haji coined it best, by saying this guy can macro better than anyone ever, if he only learnt to micro his units he will destroy everyone

On December 26 2009 06:11 samachking wrote:
Okay

results

T___T

My favorite player of all time gets cheesed in the most gay and tragic way as a repeat of the PL Grand Finals, Fuck you Flash and Fantasy for not having the balls to go for 2 straight up games back to back even when you had the lead. JD is sustaining the Yellow vs Boxer curse of Terran cheese faggotory that prevails. But it doesnt matter, JD IS going to ass rape Flash so bad that hell quit BW in the MSL finals with a tragic man tearjerking suicidal way 3-0 in the MSL Finals, Flash wont want to pick up a mouse again after that series and fall into an eternal slump and retire from BW. T_________T, fucking flash and fantasy make me rage so hard :/

Then I hope for the best, and guess what happens? my 2nd and 3rd favorite progamers also get knocked out , Stork and Zero T_____T, they blew their first game and paid the price, but thats not the worst part, Movie the cheesy toss proceeds to win over my 2nd favorite Zerg with his creative 10-12 minute all in BOs and proceeds to the ro4, good fucking luck with finding 5 all in builds in a bo5. Pure the toss I actually liked and loved his style also proceeds to fail and drop out after a failure game 1. And the 2 zergs that qualify, one I dislike for being a semiallinsh player with weak mechanics but sick ZvZ id give him that, and another I felt apathetic towards.

Oh well, the OSL became T__T for me. Who to root for?
Calm 3-0 Flash( I HATE YOU SO MUCH FLASH RIGHT NOW T___T But if you reach the finals and get raped 0-3 by JD id love it if you do that okay?)
Shine >>> Movie- This will probably be a great series despite how cheesy Movie's style is, its entertaining to watch and fun to see how Zergs play against it, and shine is one of the smartest Zergs around with really good decision making all game long with not so perfect mechanics

So lets go ZvZ finals with Shine winning lets go...

Oh Im 0/4 too yay

Mods sorry if this is offensive but im just venting my rage here



ForGG back then was a retarded macro terran bot with godlike macro that just a-moved and had 70% winrate TvP and TvZ, but terrible TvT (30%) because he just a-moved. During that MSL he learnt something called a timing push and learnt some TvT and learnt micro, he just raped everyone straight up with some really funky TvP games vs Kal( one of the best series ever), Flash played like a retarded monkey in that series and just mass 14cc'd and died, his TvZ vs JD was the real deal though, the maps didnt matter, it just felt like he was just on another level of TvZ at the time, the macro was simply unreal. Haji coined it best, by saying this guy can macro better than anyone ever, if he only learnt to micro his units he will destroy everyone

On December 26 2009 07:12 Tien wrote:
I'm a Shine fan now.


Also a Flash fan. I hope Flash takes this one down.

On December 26 2009 06:11 samachking wrote:
Okay

results

T___T

My favorite player of all time gets cheesed in the most gay and tragic way as a repeat of the PL Grand Finals, Fuck you Flash and Fantasy for not having the balls to go for 2 straight up games back to back even when you had the lead. JD is sustaining the Yellow vs Boxer curse of Terran cheese faggotory that prevails. But it doesnt matter, JD IS going to ass rape Flash so bad that hell quit BW in the MSL finals with a tragic man tearjerking suicidal way 3-0 in the MSL Finals, Flash wont want to pick up a mouse again after that series and fall into an eternal slump and retire from BW. T_________T, fucking flash and fantasy make me rage so hard :/

On December 26 2009 07:14 xDark.Carnivalx wrote:

flash has zero chance of losing in the finals. shine will somehow make it past movie and than get destroyed by flash

On December 26 2009 07:42 MapleLeafSirup wrote:
Here is the thing why many people complain about Flash cheesing Jaedong:
I do NOT want to discuss whether it is a cheese strategy or not.
but in many minds, especially in zerg's minds, 8rax bunkerrushing is an "unfair" strategy

what do I mean by unfair?

With this sort of bunkerrush, terrans have the chance to destroy zergs easily who are much better usually, I do not want to say that Jaedong is much better than Flash or Fantasy or whatever, but bunkerrushing is so frustrating because almost every terran with decent micro can take out a much better zerg who chose the wrong bo. like Flash said, it can work but it might not. If not he can still try to win in the 3rd game. But Jaedong had no chance of saving the overlord and the 12hatch BO was his death.

Practice timing and micro for bunkerrushing on ICC for like 20 tvzgames. Even if you never play terran you will be able to beat zergs then who are WAY ahead of you skillwise. Sure you will lose a lot of these games too, BUT you would lose horribly in straight games anyway. so why not try to 8proxy rax bunkerrush where you have a great chance to win??

Jaedong fans might admit that this strategy is not cheese, but they are just frustrated because they are sure that jaedong could have given flash a great fight if he did not have bad luck with his bo and the new HBR map design

On December 26 2009 07:42 MapleLeafSirup wrote:
With this sort of bunkerrush, terrans have the chance to destroy zergs easily who are much better usually, I do not want to say that Jaedong is much better than Flash or Fantasy or whatever, but bunkerrushing is so frustrating because almost every terran with decent micro can take out a much better zerg who chose the wrong bo. like Flash said, it can work but it might not. If not he can still try to win in the 3rd game. But Jaedong had no chance of saving the overlord and the 12hatch BO was his death.

On December 26 2009 07:55 TheYango wrote:

The way this is worded, you make it sound like BO choice is entirely random.

The fact of the matter is, Jaedong lost the mind game. He should have known that with a one-game lead, Flash could afford to try something cheesy. He banked on the fact that Flash usually plays safe, defensive, macro-games and tried to capitalize on it. He could have gone 9 pool, and he would have been perfectly fine. Instead, he went 12 hatch and paid the price.