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[WCG] Korean Qualifiers - Round of 8 - Day 2 - Page 38

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
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IMlemon
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
Lithuania296 Posts
August 27 2009 11:17 GMT
#741
On August 27 2009 20:16 Sinedd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 27 2009 20:15 Itachii wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:14 Sinedd wrote:
dude ... what a hardcore fail

hahahahahaha

??

failed ramp block by Kwanro that was pretty ... sloppy



You're joking, I hope? He had like 2 zerglings vs 10.
My future's so bright, I gotta wear shades.
darktreb
Profile Joined May 2007
United States3019 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-08-27 11:19:53
August 27 2009 11:17 GMT
#742
On August 27 2009 20:13 Ver wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 27 2009 20:06 darktreb wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:01 MrHoon wrote:
and yes like Ret said, Flash failing to predict a Double Nex is just a really wtf moment

Oh well atleast Flash took a game


I mean it's kind of a 50/50 isn't it? Bisu knows that Flash knows that 12 Nex is really strong Heartbreak. But if you BBS and a Protoss as good as Bisu doesn't 12/14 Nex you are DONE - especially on a two player map means there's no scouting luck involved whatsoever.

Flash apparently didn't want to take that chance so he went for an 8 Rax push strat but just executed it terribly (losing that first Marine was pretty inexcusable). Bisu's Pylon blocking Flash's choke was also big because a Vulture could have gotten to that fight while it was still happening - as it turned out Vultures only got out after the initial skirmish.

Had Flash done a better job with his push it would have been a very different game. I don't think it's ever "obviously correct" to BBS because it's only impossible to stop if you 12/14 Nex.


I didn't see but if Flash really 8 raxed he made a really dumb move. I mean micro blah blah Bisu did nothing special that game. You simply can't rush the 12 nexus on that map because of a) distance and b) they can pylon block your vulture and you can't win with the rush at this distance without the vulture (not like you usually can anyway). It's really unbelievable Flash didn't know that.

So either he has to do some type of normal expansion build and attempt to get ahead by other means or proxy bbs. HBR is tough for T but it doesn't excuse Flash being really dumb about it.


Yes, the blocked Vulture really seals it, and that he didn't anticipate it surprised me too.

And as for Bisu's micro - it was perfect, but perfect in the sense that he took pairs of Goons, moved them away and hit hold position....
Toolshed
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
337 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-08-27 11:18:53
August 27 2009 11:18 GMT
#743
well, the chances for 3 good games are now officially down to zero. Jaedong completely destroyed kwanro. I don't think he will come back in the next game, he seems to be really pissed.
dl2agon
Profile Joined June 2009
United States473 Posts
August 27 2009 11:18 GMT
#744
On August 27 2009 20:16 Sinedd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 27 2009 20:15 Itachii wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:14 Sinedd wrote:
dude ... what a hardcore fail

hahahahahaha

??

failed ramp block by Kwanro that was pretty ... sloppy


more like pretty impossible -_-
ATLAS-3.04
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States190 Posts
August 27 2009 11:18 GMT
#745
Lol, Jaedong. Could've ended it earlier by focusing on the spawning pool, but killing all of his drones is much more humiliating.

GO JD!
"I wheel destoryed, ehh, everywon... okay? In two-souzand-nine! Tank you!" ~Savior, Blizzcon 2008
rinoh
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States335 Posts
August 27 2009 11:18 GMT
#746
On August 27 2009 20:18 ATLAS-3.04 wrote:
Lol, Jaedong. Could've ended it earlier by focusing on the spawning pool, but killing all of his drones is much more humiliating.

GO JD!


haha I guess that's why Kwanro looked so pissed
베르사유의 장미
disciple
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
9071 Posts
August 27 2009 11:18 GMT
#747
On August 27 2009 20:17 darktreb wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 27 2009 20:13 Ver wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:06 darktreb wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:01 MrHoon wrote:
and yes like Ret said, Flash failing to predict a Double Nex is just a really wtf moment

Oh well atleast Flash took a game


I mean it's kind of a 50/50 isn't it? Bisu knows that Flash knows that 12 Nex is really strong Heartbreak. But if you BBS and a Protoss as good as Bisu doesn't 12/14 Nex you are DONE - especially on a two player map means there's no scouting luck involved whatsoever.

Flash apparently didn't want to take that chance so he went for an 8 Rax push strat but just executed it terribly (losing that first Marine was pretty inexcusable). Bisu's Pylon blocking Flash's choke was also big because a Vulture could have gotten to that fight while it was still happening - as it turned out Vultures only got out after the initial skirmish.

Had Flash done a better job with his push it would have been a very different game. I don't think it's ever "obviously correct" to BBS because it's only impossible to stop if you 12/14 Nex.


I didn't see but if Flash really 8 raxed he made a really dumb move. I mean micro blah blah Bisu did nothing special that game. You simply can't rush the 12 nexus on that map because of a) distance and b) they can pylon block your vulture and you can't win with the rush at this distance without the vulture (not like you usually can anyway). It's really unbelievable Flash didn't know that.

So either he has to do some type of normal expansion build and attempt to get ahead by other means or proxy bbs. HBR is tough for T but it doesn't excuse Flash being really dumb about it.


Yes, the blocked Vulture really seals it, and that he didn't anticipate it surprised me too.

And as for Bisu's micro - it was perfect, but perfect in the sense that he took pairs of Vultures, moved them away and hit hold position....

are you sure thats the sense ?
Administrator"I'm a big deal." - ixmike88
integral
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
United States3161 Posts
August 27 2009 11:18 GMT
#748
On August 27 2009 20:17 samachking wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 27 2009 20:15 integral wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:13 rinoh wrote:
wow jaedong hides 6 of his lings from kwanro's ovie so kwanro doesnt put up a sunken

calm has started a zvz revolution!


???
This is used all of the time in 2 player maps. Lux used it last season vs Zero too.

first time I saw it was when calm did it a while ago, I forget which game that was

sorry I'm a newb
darktreb
Profile Joined May 2007
United States3019 Posts
August 27 2009 11:19 GMT
#749
Jaedong's just playing out the string - qualifying for WCG so he can retire and play one last event even if he's semi-pro.
Keniji
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Netherlands2569 Posts
August 27 2009 11:19 GMT
#750
at first i thought: oh, a replay of luxury vs yarnc first, but then, kwanro didn't noticed :[
Sinedd
Profile Joined July 2008
Poland7052 Posts
August 27 2009 11:19 GMT
#751
On August 27 2009 20:16 Itachii wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 27 2009 20:16 Sinedd wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:15 Itachii wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:14 Sinedd wrote:
dude ... what a hardcore fail

hahahahahaha

??

failed ramp block by Kwanro that was pretty ... sloppy

you know, its hard to block ramp with 2 lings vs 6

well yes of course but that wasnt even a good try by kwanro so ...
T H C makes ppl happy
Pads
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
England3228 Posts
August 27 2009 11:19 GMT
#752
[image loading]
#1 Kwanro[saM] fan!
Itachii
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Poland12466 Posts
August 27 2009 11:20 GMT
#753
On August 27 2009 20:19 darktreb wrote:
Jaedong's just playing out the string - qualifying for WCG so he can retire and play one last event even if he's semi-pro.

nothing's decided yet, dont spread BS arround
unless i missed some news post explaining what will happen with JD
La parole nous a été donnée pour déguiser notre pensée
johanes
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
Czech Republic2246 Posts
August 27 2009 11:20 GMT
#754
On August 27 2009 20:19 Sinedd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 27 2009 20:16 Itachii wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:16 Sinedd wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:15 Itachii wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:14 Sinedd wrote:
dude ... what a hardcore fail

hahahahahaha

??

failed ramp block by Kwanro that was pretty ... sloppy

you know, its hard to block ramp with 2 lings vs 6

well yes of course but that wasnt even a good try by kwanro so ...

lol man, stop trying
StRyKeR
Profile Blog Joined January 2006
United States1756 Posts
August 27 2009 11:20 GMT
#755
On August 27 2009 20:17 darktreb wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 27 2009 20:13 Ver wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:06 darktreb wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:01 MrHoon wrote:
and yes like Ret said, Flash failing to predict a Double Nex is just a really wtf moment

Oh well atleast Flash took a game


I mean it's kind of a 50/50 isn't it? Bisu knows that Flash knows that 12 Nex is really strong Heartbreak. But if you BBS and a Protoss as good as Bisu doesn't 12/14 Nex you are DONE - especially on a two player map means there's no scouting luck involved whatsoever.

Flash apparently didn't want to take that chance so he went for an 8 Rax push strat but just executed it terribly (losing that first Marine was pretty inexcusable). Bisu's Pylon blocking Flash's choke was also big because a Vulture could have gotten to that fight while it was still happening - as it turned out Vultures only got out after the initial skirmish.

Had Flash done a better job with his push it would have been a very different game. I don't think it's ever "obviously correct" to BBS because it's only impossible to stop if you 12/14 Nex.


I didn't see but if Flash really 8 raxed he made a really dumb move. I mean micro blah blah Bisu did nothing special that game. You simply can't rush the 12 nexus on that map because of a) distance and b) they can pylon block your vulture and you can't win with the rush at this distance without the vulture (not like you usually can anyway). It's really unbelievable Flash didn't know that.

So either he has to do some type of normal expansion build and attempt to get ahead by other means or proxy bbs. HBR is tough for T but it doesn't excuse Flash being really dumb about it.


Yes, the blocked Vulture really seals it, and that he didn't anticipate it surprised me too.

And as for Bisu's micro - it was perfect, but perfect in the sense that he took pairs of Goons, moved them away and hit hold position....


fixed

haha man, hold position works if there's only one mine. Otherwise goons end up targeting different mines. There was some definite right-mouse click control by Bisu.
Ars longa, vita brevis, principia aeturna.
Pads
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
England3228 Posts
August 27 2009 11:21 GMT
#756
On August 27 2009 20:19 Sinedd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 27 2009 20:16 Itachii wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:16 Sinedd wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:15 Itachii wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:14 Sinedd wrote:
dude ... what a hardcore fail

hahahahahaha

??

failed ramp block by Kwanro that was pretty ... sloppy

you know, its hard to block ramp with 2 lings vs 6

well yes of course but that wasnt even a good try by kwanro so ...


you know that jaedong hid 6 of his zerglings from kwanro's ovie, and kwanro saw 4 moving out so couldn't react properly. It was really clever play by the dong, literally nothing kwanro could do in that situation, tbh.
#1 Kwanro[saM] fan!
Shikyo
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Finland33997 Posts
August 27 2009 11:21 GMT
#757
On August 27 2009 20:17 darktreb wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 27 2009 20:13 Ver wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:06 darktreb wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:01 MrHoon wrote:
and yes like Ret said, Flash failing to predict a Double Nex is just a really wtf moment

Oh well atleast Flash took a game


I mean it's kind of a 50/50 isn't it? Bisu knows that Flash knows that 12 Nex is really strong Heartbreak. But if you BBS and a Protoss as good as Bisu doesn't 12/14 Nex you are DONE - especially on a two player map means there's no scouting luck involved whatsoever.

Flash apparently didn't want to take that chance so he went for an 8 Rax push strat but just executed it terribly (losing that first Marine was pretty inexcusable). Bisu's Pylon blocking Flash's choke was also big because a Vulture could have gotten to that fight while it was still happening - as it turned out Vultures only got out after the initial skirmish.

Had Flash done a better job with his push it would have been a very different game. I don't think it's ever "obviously correct" to BBS because it's only impossible to stop if you 12/14 Nex.


I didn't see but if Flash really 8 raxed he made a really dumb move. I mean micro blah blah Bisu did nothing special that game. You simply can't rush the 12 nexus on that map because of a) distance and b) they can pylon block your vulture and you can't win with the rush at this distance without the vulture (not like you usually can anyway). It's really unbelievable Flash didn't know that.

So either he has to do some type of normal expansion build and attempt to get ahead by other means or proxy bbs. HBR is tough for T but it doesn't excuse Flash being really dumb about it.


Yes, the blocked Vulture really seals it, and that he didn't anticipate it surprised me too.

And as for Bisu's micro - it was perfect, but perfect in the sense that he took pairs of Goons, moved them away and hit hold position....

IMO If you go for that kind of a build you must build your first factory at your natural.

Also, Jaedong knew the overlord timings and such pretty well it seems. Kwanro really had no idea until 10 lings were running up his ramp.
League of Legends EU West, Platinum III | Yousei Teikoku is the best thing that has ever happened to music.
darktreb
Profile Joined May 2007
United States3019 Posts
August 27 2009 11:22 GMT
#758
On August 27 2009 20:18 disciple wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 27 2009 20:17 darktreb wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:13 Ver wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:06 darktreb wrote:
On August 27 2009 20:01 MrHoon wrote:
and yes like Ret said, Flash failing to predict a Double Nex is just a really wtf moment

Oh well atleast Flash took a game


I mean it's kind of a 50/50 isn't it? Bisu knows that Flash knows that 12 Nex is really strong Heartbreak. But if you BBS and a Protoss as good as Bisu doesn't 12/14 Nex you are DONE - especially on a two player map means there's no scouting luck involved whatsoever.

Flash apparently didn't want to take that chance so he went for an 8 Rax push strat but just executed it terribly (losing that first Marine was pretty inexcusable). Bisu's Pylon blocking Flash's choke was also big because a Vulture could have gotten to that fight while it was still happening - as it turned out Vultures only got out after the initial skirmish.

Had Flash done a better job with his push it would have been a very different game. I don't think it's ever "obviously correct" to BBS because it's only impossible to stop if you 12/14 Nex.


I didn't see but if Flash really 8 raxed he made a really dumb move. I mean micro blah blah Bisu did nothing special that game. You simply can't rush the 12 nexus on that map because of a) distance and b) they can pylon block your vulture and you can't win with the rush at this distance without the vulture (not like you usually can anyway). It's really unbelievable Flash didn't know that.

So either he has to do some type of normal expansion build and attempt to get ahead by other means or proxy bbs. HBR is tough for T but it doesn't excuse Flash being really dumb about it.


Yes, the blocked Vulture really seals it, and that he didn't anticipate it surprised me too.

And as for Bisu's micro - it was perfect, but perfect in the sense that he took pairs of Vultures, moved them away and hit hold position....

are you sure thats the sense ?


Yes, I mean that's the only way to do it. You can't individually target Mines at that scale so that's what players do. There might even be a little luck involved depending on the situation (though that game looked like Bisu just knew exactly how it was going to go). I'm not saying it's easy but that's what it is. Personally I am always more impressed by Probe/Zeal micro or any melee unit moving shot micro.
C[SCL]
Profile Joined April 2009
Philippines576 Posts
August 27 2009 11:22 GMT
#759
i thought my internet speed was the reason i couldn't watch the games.
turns out the number of viewers also affect that. lol
BISU FAN FOREVER|Really fan.. really.|Flash, please get all the golds. k thx
dnosrc
Profile Joined May 2009
Germany454 Posts
August 27 2009 11:23 GMT
#760
yeah cheesy hidden lings :D

i hope kwanro gets his revenge the next two games
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