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On March 10 2009 05:10 DrTJEckleberg wrote:Show nested quote +On March 10 2009 03:53 freelander wrote:
I watched the TvP help vod, and I don't think that shift+attack with sieged tanks works. If you're using "A" hotkey for attack it might not, I don't know. I use shift + right click and it's faster and it works.
well, I've just tested it in single player with A hotkey, I attacked my own units. The siege tank always attacked the last unit I clicked on, it's like shift not working with sieged tanks.
I guess from this, it shouldn't work with right click either, because right clicking on enemy or A + left click on enemy is the same.
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hm... edit: nvm XD
actually, i want to say it... i hope im not only speaking for myself but, i'd really appreciate a TvZ VOD of late game play, like 3-4 base Terran vs 4-5 base zerg... Dunno how often that happens in TvZ, but on andromeda it shouldn't be too uncommon.
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I have a question about your hotkeys, I have been using 1-3=units/scout 4-5=cc 6-7=fac 8-0=scan
You have your hotkeys for factories as 4-9, I like this idea, but This takes up so much room on my hotkeys. How do you fit the units micro and cc( for scv prodcution) and scaners?
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In the late game, pumping out SCVs is still important but it's not as crucial to pump out SCVs while in the middle of a battle. that's the point of having your facts on normal hotkeys so that you can quickly macro an army but still stay on the same screen of where your army is fighting. In the late game, you should probably use F2-F4 for your mining bases and manually click on the CC for SCV production.
EDIT: Stylish does it 0 for scanner and 1-4 is your army and then 5-9 are facts.
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On March 10 2009 07:17 AtlaS wrote:
In the late game, pumping out SCVs is still important but it's not as crucial to pump out SCVs while in the middle of a battle. that's the point of having your facts on normal hotkeys so that you can quickly macro an army but still stay on the same screen of where your army is fighting. In the late game, you should probably use F2-F4 for your mining bases and manually click on the CC for SCV production.
EDIT: Stylish does it 0 for scanner and 1-4 is your army and then 5-9 are facts.
Yah but having 5-9 facs is only going to be a 5 fac build, Typically in TvP requires a 6 fac push and then thats 1 more fac you need. If you put the 6th on 0 you lose ur scanners, and if you put the fac at 4, then you only have 3 ctrl groups. So how would u fix this.
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Im going to answer all this tomorrow.
Just fast answer though.
fact 4 5 6 7 8 9. thats 6 fact total if you have that many.
i dont have ctrl on CC in midgame/lategame.
1-2-3 units is enough for the first push.
1vult 2tank 3gol/scv/marine.
scan=0
Cya tomorrow
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On March 10 2009 08:19 StylishVODs wrote:
Im going to answer all this tomorrow.
Just fast answer though.
fact 4 5 6 7 8 9. thats 6 fact total if you have that many.
i dont have ctrl on CC in midgame/lategame.
1-2-3 units is enough for the first push.
1vult 2tank 3gol/scv/marine.
scan=0
Cya tomorrow
ok, when you get back let me know how ur late game hot keys looks like.
Start of game for me is now
1-2 cc(coverts to units) 3 scout 4-9 facs 0 scan
How would I switch to late game style of hotkeys? Becuase more facs would be in place, and I would need the 3 scaners.
So like 1-5 units 6-7 fac 890 scans??? Would be my ideal set up, how dose urs look like?
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Wow another update today... I heart stylish.. lol..
Thanks Stylish & freelander for responding to my question about hotkeys and 'fingering'.. They were helpful! Woot!
Hey do any of you guys know if the TvZ 9 minute Push BO vod and game vod are up yet? I'm dying waiting for that one..... ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH... :-p
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you when you play tvz and you have too many units at your natural build up from macroing 5 or more rax and you already have 3 groups of mnm/vessels and maybe left over tanks.What do you do when you have too many unused units,or how do you prevent that from happening.Ikno you might say reinforcements but if u have 3-4 groups of mnm idont think you can micro more than that.Can you send them few groups of mnm to zergs expo or just somewhere in middle of map to stop zergs reinforcwments and stop zerg from moving around,or what is the best solution?One of my friends on sc said if you cant macro good or you have too much mnm you can build 2factories (or more if you have eco) to make more tanks so you wont have that many marines.any suggestions?thnx :D
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On March 09 2009 16:36 StylishVODs wrote:
Thnx for the support guys! I'll try to answer your questions:
ZzZzang: I didn't read through that post that careful and now he has changed the OP so i cannot see the exact build, but if i remember correctly it included an earlier academy and 3 raxes for the tech rather than 2 raxes.
You can also look for a rather common build that artosis wrote in the difference between koreans and foreigners thread.
Assuming those builds were rather simular then the main difference isn't that huge, except that I really think that the 9minPush is easier to execute.
However there is a difference and its basically that earlier academy will allow you to get a faster medic/bat to be able to move out and set preassure on the zergs natural or his third expansion. This will cause him to add zerglings and mutalisks to be able to secure himself, thus wasting minerals on units rather than tech and drones.
However with the 9minPush you will actually have more marines in the early game without being able to pressure the opponent. This imo will make you safer vs zerglings if you use the ramp to your advantage and also the tech will be slightly faster. I tried the build of artosis a couple of times and the timing of the vessel will be about 15 seconds delayed and the unitcount will be the same as 9minPush, so in the midgame the 9minPush will grant you an earlier but equally strong push and your upgrades will hit 2-1 earlier aswell.
This plus the fact that its actually easier to execute because of the lone SCV building all important buildings is enough to make this my standard build for terran vs zerg, but in the end the difference is not that huge on a foreigner level of play.
Note though that "my" build I didn't invent myself, it has been used by alot of pro gamers including flash.
iloveroo: I dont know whats wrong with your codecs but I guess you have to wait a while until you can stream the VOD directly from filefront, you should be able to do that soon.
Beenizzle: This is just a matter of experience. Try to improve the scouting micro with your scv and use the early vulture to be able to scout his third or his natural. Sometimes when he moves out to preassure you early on you will be able to sneak in his main with the first vulture when his units are moving towards you.
Then its just a matter of execution. I suggest you practice the build in singleplayer until you have the timing correctly. Try the 5factpush its the most standard one.
LuisMI8:
Sure I can ask but i don't think it will happen. It takes alot of work and I'm not sure anyone is up for it, the avarage VOD takes me 3-4 hours to record write BO upload etc.
Azalea:
Usually I try to send yet another SCV after my first scv dies by clicking on his mineralpatch to be able to scout his tech. While I do this is send my initial marines to scout for proxies and float my barrack towards his main or third. If he cancel the range his dt will be a few seconds delayed and 1 vulture + turrets is out before the DTs hit your base. This is enough to kill the dt. Be sure to float the Ebay over the turret so he cannot run in and target it with the goons.
If you still arent able to scout his tech i suggest you open with 2 vultures rather than one and lay 6 mines to be sure his dts will die. Micro units to kill zealots or goons that are trying to trigger the mines also.
I_heart_nukes:
I will look into this and post the exact timing however if you see a forge and third nexus i suggest doing the faster push. If you cannot scout his gates/forge then practice the 5factpush and wait for scan then scan his gateways to see how many he has.
If you do the FD opening and his third is up before your second tank then its rather early but still you have to know if he makes cannons or not to decide for the 4fact or 5fact push and if you cant scout i suggest you try the 5factpush because its safer and your able to switch from the 5fact into lategame much better.
lovelycomplex8:
just keep practicing the way i told you and you will be comfortable with it. It takes some time i suggest you open a word document or something like that and then just repeat typing 1a2a3a4a5a6a7a8a until you're fast and can control it. Its the only way.
I don't know if most pros use it but i have watched some and they do, plus the fact that I can type it really fast indicates that this is a good and safe way to do it.
Yes I do it early game aswell.
freelander:
I would suggest that you practice doing it my way. Then you wont have to switch fingers in the middle of 1a2a3a4a5a6a7a8a'ing and you'll be able to do it faster.
I hope this answered most of your questions, if you're still uncertain ask again.
/Thnx
as long as you put the videos on 'filefront'
but yeah i love all your strats, i mostly just use 9min_push against zerg and 5fac_push against toss, i don't use any other strats yet, but yet again, i still can't get pass d+ LOL, but then thats my fault cause i always forget things in the game that make me lose, like late supply
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Hey Stylish. I watched your VODs, loved every single one. I'd like to give some feedback though.
On filefront, I haven'y really been able to change the volume so it seems a bit soft to me when I just play it straight from filefront. It might just be me though, so maybe we should ask around.
Also, I'm having trouble with TvZ in general. I can do the midgame and early game fine, and sometimes I can even get an advantage by say killing all their mutalisks or sniping a couple of lurkers, etc. but ...
1) I always end up supply blocked at some point. How do you recommend microing and macroing (already difficult), while balancing supplies? Do you just build them as a reflex?
2) Late game, I move around to kill his expansion and I end up killing his third, but the zerg dark swarms my natural and pours in lurkers. How should prevent this, or in the worse case, defend against this?
3) Any tips or strategies on not getting vessels sniped?
4) When do you usually get a dropship and how do you use them? I know about the center of gravity techniques and etc, but I mean more strategical advice. Do you drop his main or third? Do you drop him as he moves out with his army? What do you target first and what do you move onto after that? When moving out with your dropship, do you scan the path you want to take to make sure no ovies or scorages are there?
5) I've noticed that Idra tends to get 2+ attack on tanks and get 3 fac tank going against hive play. How do you feel this stacks against the normal 2 port MM play?
Thanks a lot, you're a lifesaver.
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I will eat some food before answering questions.
- Update 10 March
New TvZ 9Min Push BO is uploaded(better version)!
TvP DropStrat BO is uploaded!
The 9Min Push is my standard build vs zerg.
I'm trying to be as instructional as possible
and therefor use my "robot voice" haha.
Enjoy!
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R u a robot? niceone keep it up very appreciated.
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where can i watch these FPVods?
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New format sounds great, thanks for slowing down and speaking more clearly.
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Tbh the new format is great and sometimes during the watch it brought me back to 6-9th grade when you had a presentation on something in school. LOL
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Korea (South)3086 Posts
Hey Stylish, what's the timing for when the first observer pops for the Toss player if he opts for fast obs? I'm just wondering because when you do the TVP drop play on Medusa and you mine the ramp after you drop behind the mineral line. If the Toss has obs, the goons can easily dispose of the mines that are placed on the ramp, and the damage that you dish out on the initial drop could be drastically minimized.
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Stylish,
When I do the Ayumi build, I get caught off guard a lot by 2 hatch mutalisk, or mutas come hen my army is out, at their natural.
How can I prevent muta harass/2 hatch with this build? Or respond to it without running my whole army back. thanks.
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On March 11 2009 04:14 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Stylish,
When I do the Ayumi build, I get caught off guard a lot by 2 hatch mutalisk, or mutas come hen my army is out, at their natural.
How can I prevent muta harass/2 hatch with this build? Or respond to it without running my whole army back. thanks.
Stylish already answered this question a couple of pages before (it's about halfway down):
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=86770¤tpage=7
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On March 11 2009 04:22 d1v wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2009 04:14 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Stylish,
When I do the Ayumi build, I get caught off guard a lot by 2 hatch mutalisk, or mutas come hen my army is out, at their natural.
How can I prevent muta harass/2 hatch with this build? Or respond to it without running my whole army back. thanks. Stylish already answered this question a couple of pages before (it's about halfway down): http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=86770¤tpage=7
Thanks.
I searched for Ayumi, not a-yu-mi.
Also, Stylish, have you seen FlaSh's mnm build against SangHo on Andromeda? I'm kind of interested in how to do that build, seems like a good follow-up to gas steal/dt drop/or low tech protoss.
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EPT
