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micronesia
United States24810 Posts
On September 11 2007 14:05 crescendo wrote: If a unit is building and the building dies before the unit comes out, you don't get your money back for that unit. Uh I'm pretty certain that you are entirely wrong. Why don't you try it and double check ... | ||
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crescendo
United States140 Posts
On September 11 2007 14:08 micronesia wrote: Uh I'm pretty certain that you are entirely wrong. Why don't you try it and double check ... Yeah I just tried, my mistake. >_>;; | ||
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Superiorwolf
United States5509 Posts
On September 11 2007 14:08 micronesia wrote: Uh I'm pretty certain that you are entirely wrong. Why don't you try it and double check ... Me? Well I'm almost positive on the extractor being 17 minerals lost for cancel, but for the unit thing I'm tentative to say that since I've read it before but I haven't personally tested it... edit: nvm ninja'd | ||
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SonuvBob
Aiur21552 Posts
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fanatacist
10319 Posts
On September 11 2007 13:57 Superiorwolf wrote: Yeah it's about 33%, I remember doing a extractor cancel test and it was 17 minerals, so extractor probably 33 or 34. Unit cancel is free though, and buildings with units and they die you get money back I think. EDIT: Not so sure about my post anymore. | ||
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Myrmidon
United States9452 Posts
How did I do this? -I created a pylon when I had 100 minerals -I sent 2 probes mining from the minerals that were blocked, while two others would destroy the pylon -When the pylon was destroyed, I checked how much minerals the 2 probes had collected in total. -I did it 10 times, 5 times in 2 LT patches, 5 times on 2 other LT patches. Results: The probes mined 120-128 minerals each time So the probes that mined from the blocked minerals took in 120-128 minerals by the time the pylon was destroyed by the 2 trapped probes attacking it. Only those 2 probes attacked the pylon? But anyway, how does that demonstrate a 120-128 mineral loss from the manner pylon? I'm confused at your reasoning--take it through again please. | ||
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Kau
Canada3502 Posts
On September 11 2007 13:57 Superiorwolf wrote: Yeah it's about 33%, I remember doing a extractor cancel test and it was 17 minerals, so extractor probably 33 or 34. Unit cancel is free though, and buildings with units and they die you get money back I think. I lose 25 mins when I cancel a pylon. | ||
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SonuvBob
Aiur21552 Posts
Building cancel: 75% Unit cancel: 100% Upgrade cancel: 100% Scarab/interceptor cancel: 100% Queued units when building is destroyed: 100% Queued upgrade when building is destroyed: 75% Queued scarabs/interceptors when reaver/carrier dies: 0% | ||
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LonelyMargarita
1845 Posts
Canceling buildings refunds 75% (you lose 25%) Losing a building with units queued cancels the units being made and in queue (100% returned). You lose 25 by canceling a pylon. You lose 13 for extractor trick. And on a related note, from all my extractor trick testing, it was never profitable: you lose the 13, you take the extractor drone off mining for a bit, and you delay your overlord to get a 10 drone early, which usually is one of the most inefficient drones (especially on 9 patch maps). Does anyone have any conclusive tests that show when extractor trick is useful? Maybe I'm just too slow to do it right, cause I've seen sAviOr do it. | ||
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ArC_man
United States2798 Posts
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useLess
United States4781 Posts
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Piste
6184 Posts
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micronesia
United States24810 Posts
On September 11 2007 14:23 SonuvBob wrote: Handy refund list: Upgrade cancel: 100% Why do tosses fake air weapons instead of singularity in pvt then? | ||
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Sr18
Netherlands1141 Posts
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SonuvBob
Aiur21552 Posts
On September 11 2007 18:56 Piste wrote: Anyone still has that video which was posted by "Commentator" on the "Nal_Ra's anti manner pylon thread"? It wasn't available there anymore. Mass Mirror Links: http://rapidshare.com/files/54953973/probejumphorizontal.avi.html http://www.zshare.net/video/3592266ef9660b/ http://www.badongo.com/vid/470577 [url blocked] | ||
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born-to-porn
Denmark400 Posts
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Mortality
United States4790 Posts
As Kwark said, it's a pylon; it gives supply. It's not as though it has no use at all. And since you're probably following it up with aggressive play (the only scenario I can think of where I wouldn't would be if I've already commited to tech and I happen to be able to seal off like 3 probes or something ridiculous like that), he'll be far too busy dealing your zealots to get rid of the pylon quickly. If you're forced to cancel, he's probably commited several probes to destroying the pylon (or you fucked it up and his mining isn't suffering as badly as it should, but we'll ignore that for discussion purposes), in which case he's still losing more money than you. It can be very worth it, just good players won't often let you get away with making them and getting 2 or more probes. | ||
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Leath
Canada1724 Posts
On September 11 2007 14:25 LonelyMargarita wrote: I'm really tired of people posting things that are absolutely incorrect, despite being trivial to check. If you're not sure about something, DON'T CORRECT SOMEONE. Either check for yourself, google it, or ask politely. Canceling buildings refunds 75% (you lose 25%) Losing a building with units queued cancels the units being made and in queue (100% returned). You lose 25 by canceling a pylon. You lose 13 for extractor trick. And on a related note, from all my extractor trick testing, it was never profitable: you lose the 13, you take the extractor drone off mining for a bit, and you delay your overlord to get a 10 drone early, which usually is one of the most inefficient drones (especially on 9 patch maps). Does anyone have any conclusive tests that show when extractor trick is useful? Maybe I'm just too slow to do it right, cause I've seen sAviOr do it. This is easy to test. First you need to calculate the amount the earlier drone will mine. To do this is easy on an average game. You just need to check how many mineral chunks he brought back before the regular drones (the drone that will come after the ol, which normally comes together with the early drone) could bring one chunk. I think the early drone can bring back around 2 chunks before the regular drone brings its first one. so 16 minerals. and lost 13. But that is not all. The drone who went building a geyser probably lost a full mining turn, and therefore 8 minerals. Thus, I dont think gas trick is effective. But if thats the case, you lost 5 minerals lol not much =p | ||
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pooper-scooper
United States3108 Posts
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Superiorwolf
United States5509 Posts
On September 12 2007 02:56 pooper-scooper wrote: Don't forget, he ALSO blocks the direct route to mineral patches. You didn't take this into account. Uhh... no, he blocks the outside so the probes can't get to nexus, so the probes are stuck between pylon and mineral patches... | ||
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