EPThow would you recover from manner pylon?
| Forum Index > Brood War Strategy |
|
Jon166
Vietnam121 Posts
| ||
|
JeeJee
Canada5652 Posts
| ||
|
NeverTheEndlessWiz
Singapore827 Posts
On August 07 2004 08:11 JeeJee wrote: Sure there is, keep playing the game, he'll have a small eco advantage for now, but your ramp should make up for your slightly lower numbes of zeals or goons so wat if u are playing a map with no ramp? lol i'm serious about that question =P | ||
|
Jim
Sweden1965 Posts
| ||
|
SoMuchBetter
Australia10606 Posts
| ||
|
Ack1027
United States7873 Posts
| ||
|
JeeJee
Canada5652 Posts
it's all luck at that point, depends when he attacks, the worst possible time for you is when your reaver is half-bulding and he attacks because then you will have considerably less goons/zealots, and you will lose | ||
|
MiniRoman
Canada3953 Posts
| ||
|
GoSexierPerli
United States85 Posts
| ||
|
Beast_Bg
Bulgaria1623 Posts
By the way is it so good ?If he traps 2-3 probes and cancels the pylon then you've lost like 2-3x8 minerals and he lost 25.If he doesn't cancel it it has taken some damage already from the trapped probes and you attack it with 4-5 more and shouldn't lose more than 12x8=96 minerals.It's the panic it creates that is worse I think. Combined with a zeal attacking your mineral line it's too bad of course... | ||
|
tuig
Netherlands46 Posts
| ||
|
GeNoCiDe
United States22 Posts
| ||
|
STIMEY d okgm fish
Canada6140 Posts
| ||
|
RuGbUg
United States2347 Posts
On August 07 2004 09:38 MiniRoman wrote: or, he can just cancel the minerals and thus lose far less then you spent attacking itIt doesn't set you back that far behind. IF probes are trapped inside, use them to just kill it asap, you wont lose that much minerals. Remember, he is losing 100 by doing that. | ||
|
koehli
Germany350 Posts
On August 07 2004 16:03 RuGbUg wrote: or, he can just cancel the minerals and thus lose far less then you spent attacking it Rugbug is right, only let the pylon warp when there's at least 2 probes trapped. As the one being mannerpyloned I'd do a probe drill to make sure to not have more then one trapped. You should do some probe harvest micro to not harvest the long way around and wait till trapped probe and first zealot kill the pylon. Almost cost efficient for the defender. What I really fear is not the fully warped pylon, but the last second cancellation, it's plain and simple an advantage without regret for the party doing the mannerpylon. | ||
|
dashboard
United Kingdom40 Posts
| ||
Liquid`Drone
Norway28682 Posts
the problem is that the pylon isn't really a waste of 100 minerals. because you get supply from it until it's dead thus the mannerpyloner can keep producing zealots at a normal rate while you're losing money from the mannerpylon, and you can't really use zealots to kill it because then you're giving him free entrance to your base, and if you kill it with probes then you've spent more money on denying the pylon than he spent building it. no matter what you are at a disadvantage so the only solution is don't play maps where mannerpylon is possible and if someone mannerpylons you, don't bother playing him again! :-) | ||
|
MaGnIfIcA
Norway2312 Posts
 | ||
|
JoeUser
United States684 Posts
On August 09 2004 09:23 Liquid`Drone wrote: meh the problem is that the pylon isn't really a waste of 100 minerals. because you get supply from it until it's dead thus the mannerpyloner can keep producing zealots at a normal rate while you're losing money from the mannerpylon, and you can't really use zealots to kill it because then you're giving him free entrance to your base, and if you kill it with probes then you've spent more money on denying the pylon than he spent building it. no matter what you are at a disadvantage so the only solution is don't play maps where mannerpylon is possible and if someone mannerpylons you, don't bother playing him again! :-) Yea, I think this guy is right. But I think it's only a slight disadvantage. Once you have 3 zeals just send one to kill while the others hold position at ramp. Or, put a probe outside of his base, and send all the zeals you make to kill the manner pylon, but keep an eye on your probe, and if he sends his zeals, immediately send your zeals to your choke, and use probes to finish it off. The 2nd way is probably the best. | ||
IntoTheWow
is awesome32275 Posts
| ||
|
Casper...
Liberia4948 Posts
then rapes you | ||
|
A3iL3r0n
United States2196 Posts
| ||
|
Liquid`Drone
Norway28682 Posts
 | ||
|
kP_cHoBo
United States439 Posts
| ||
|
SoMuchBetter
Australia10606 Posts
ie. building a pylon between their nexus and mineral field in such a way that their miners get stuck behind it | ||
|
IntoTheWow
is awesome32275 Posts
[] [] [] [] [] []..[].[].[] .<> . . ________ |Nexus | |_______| [] = Mineral . = probe <>= Pylon so basically 2 porbes there get walled between 3 minerals and a pylon due to bad mineral line placing :O | ||
|
PuertoRican
United States5709 Posts
| ||
|
SpuniasauR
Australia1500 Posts
 | ||
|
aseq
Netherlands3981 Posts
you could mine the same patch then stop, and get 1 out. but the other? | ||
|
RiSE
United States3182 Posts
| ||
|
Dave[9]
United States2365 Posts
| ||
|
hasuwar
7365 Posts
| ||
mrmin123
Korea (South)2971 Posts
| ||
|
RuGbUg
United States2347 Posts
On August 11 2004 01:14 PuertoRican wrote: if you're lucky you might get all of them out, but almost always you'll lose at least 1 in thereyou can get all of your peons out once they trap them, but then you still gotta kill it, slows you down a lil but just defend ramp and you're fine. | ||
|
NeverTheEndlessWiz
Singapore827 Posts
1-u lose access to at least 2-3 mineral blocks and have a harder time mining them; workers have to go around to the back of the minerals being blocked just to mine them 2-1 to 3 workers for sometime till they are freed both of these will cause problems for the other player for just a mere 100 minerals.... therefore the player got manner plyoned is at an ecomonical loss | ||
|
IntoTheWow
is awesome32275 Posts
 try to play maps that are well designed | ||
|
Elvin_vn
Vietnam2038 Posts
a) No manner pylon vs Zerg, thx. b) Zerg > Toss c) Do offensive hatch on ramp | ||
|
Manit0u
Poland17339 Posts
Another type of manner pylon... When I was making my wall-in on LT my friend got there with his probe and placed a pylon so that his zets could go through it (even more, he microed his probe so I couldn't kill it fast and place another building to fill enlarging gap ) then he rushed with zeals...Is there any way to stop this with terran? Also what should I do when he builds an assimilator on my gas spot early in the game (rax just started building and no raf yet) thx | ||
|
fuqin-suck
United States142 Posts
| ||
|
Day[9]
United States7366 Posts
build pylons in your own mineral patches that prevent manner pylons but which also don't slow ur workers down O_o o_O | ||
|
SoL.Origin
Argentina2400 Posts
On August 16 2004 10:22 Manit0u wrote: Sorry, but could you explain to a noob that's playing only with his friends (started too late to become any good against even lames) one thingie? Another type of manner pylon... When I was making my wall-in on LT my friend got there with his probe and placed a pylon so that his zets could go through it (even more, he microed his probe so I couldn't kill it fast and place another building to fill enlarging gap ) then he rushed with zeals...Is there any way to stop this with terran? Also what should I do when he builds an assimilator on my gas spot early in the game (rax just started building and no raf yet) thx build 2-3 marines and use 2-3 scvs to help kill the pylon and the zealot if you have good micro, use just 1 marine and 3-4 scvs. You can surround the zealot with the scvs while attacking and running away with the marine, and if he attacks an scv you select it and right click your minerals to save that one. You can also block your ramp with 2 scvs and put the marine on hold behind them. Regarding the pvp situation, you can select all trapped scvs and right click a mineral that is next to the pylon but that those probes can reach, and when they are all stacked up you right click somewhere farther away, on the ground, several times until they are all out. As a prevention measure, you can make your probes gather minerals in a way in which he cant place the pylon. Use the move command to place the probe in diagonal between mineral and nexus but next to the mineral, and then right click the mineral. You can also leave a probe where the pylon would go but that isnt such a good option. | ||
|
PuertoRican
United States5709 Posts
On August 13 2004 22:51 RuGbUg wrote: if you're lucky you might get all of them out, but almost always you'll lose at least 1 in there obviously i know what im talking about or i wouldnt have posted it, the rare occasions i get manner pyloned, i end up only getting one stuck in there once pylon is first layed down, but i still get it out w/o destroying the pylon. if you're a toss user, you'd know about floating units, like how u can move a goon behind 6 nat minerals on LT, but then its stuck | ||
RaGe
Belgium9947 Posts
On August 16 2004 19:39 fuqin-suck wrote: im curious. has anyone ever done a manner depot? Don't think so,they could just kill the scv and depot is bit big to fit but they do sometime block exps early games vs zerg...like if you see a zerg expanding you always follow with scv and attack it so it cant spawn hatch then most of the times the drone runs a little end then goes back and manages to hatch.. instead of running after it when it goes for a walk to lose the scv,just start building a depot where the hatch should go and stop right after 150 hp or so and go on and harass a little more,he'll probably get cliff hatch then maybe,when you're in a very cheesy mood,start building a bunker there (by then you can cancel the depot and get the 100 mins back)so he has to attack with drones... P.S.: keep it mannered ^^ | ||
|
Pacifist
Israel1683 Posts
However, the pilon still lives, and u will have to mine 2 of ur minerals from the back, which isn't good, so u need to kill the pilon ASAP. | ||
|
PuertoRican
United States5709 Posts
On August 17 2004 08:18 Pacifist wrote: I didnt read the entire thread so i dont know if its been mentioned before but theres a way to get your probes which are trapped by mannerpilon out. You tell the probes to gather on the side minearls (the pilon and 3 or 4 minearls form a box around ur trapped probes, the side minerals are the two on either side next to the pilon), and then suddenly tell them to move to an area outside the mannerpilon. They will slip between the minerals and the mannerpilon and get out. However, the pilon still lives, and u will have to mine 2 of ur minerals from the back, which isn't good, so u need to kill the pilon ASAP. finally a good answer  | ||
|
SoL.Origin
Argentina2400 Posts
| ||
|
fuqin-suck
United States142 Posts
On August 17 2004 07:20 RaGe-xG- wrote: Don't think so,they could just kill the scv and depot is bit big to fit but they do sometime block exps early games vs zerg...like if you see a zerg expanding you always follow with scv and attack it so it cant spawn hatch then most of the times the drone runs a little end then goes back and manages to hatch.. instead of running after it when it goes for a walk to lose the scv,just start building a depot where the hatch should go and stop right after 150 hp or so and go on and harass a little more,he'll probably get cliff hatch then maybe,when you're in a very cheesy mood,start building a bunker there (by then you can cancel the depot and get the 100 mins back)so he has to attack with drones... P.S.: keep it mannered ^^ Actually, I tried to before. Manner Depot does work! Of course my scv had to run away when they started to attack, but it was just as successful as a pylon. i canceled it before it died. Does this sound like a good manner-depot strat? Bring 2 scvs to scout on TvP.. works best 12v3 on LT. When you enter 12oclock base, you bring one of your scvs around the bottom of the base to the back (near the gas). The other SCV goes somewhere near the mineral line but not too close and build a bunker. Seeing a building bunker, P will attack your scv building the bunker with at least 3-4 probes (hopefully more). As soon as he does this, there will be a smaller number of probes mining and it will be easier to manner depot him. Twice if possible. If you dont have enough $, then cancel bunker, or you can try and keep building the bunker with your 2 scvs. Your marines should be rallied to his base. I just thought of this right now, so I dont know how well it would work, but it sounds like it would disrupt and frustrate P enough to give you a strong upper hand. Plus, when you cancel your depots before they die, you will have gained most that money back so its not an entire waste like manner pylons. | ||
|
hasuwar
7365 Posts
On August 16 2004 19:39 fuqin-suck wrote: im curious. has anyone ever done a manner depot? many times. People think they're safe with those spread out mineral LTs, well suckers, a depot still works! Gotta have some luck t hough, because a 3 block building is hard as hell to get in there without being obstructed it | ||
| ||
