EPT[Q] What exactly is a Bonjwa
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gk_ender
United States717 Posts
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Jyvblamo
Canada13788 Posts
This thread should give you some idea... Basically, Bonjwa has to win a bunch of leagues within a short period of time (Happens to be 3 MSLs then OSL in the case of Nada, Oov, and Savior) and 'dominate' everyone for an extended duration. | ||
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gk_ender
United States717 Posts
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gk_ender
United States717 Posts
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Avidkeystamper
United States8556 Posts
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Xenocide_Knight
Korea (South)2625 Posts
like... somebody who dominates so much, its not even fair there's no certain requirements or anything it's just a status thing when all other gamers realize that not one single person has a chance at beating this "bonjwa" Like, imagine Bisu, then take out the other 5 dragons, Jaedong, and Flash Bisu would be basically unstoppable then he'd be a bonjwa | ||
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Jyvblamo
Canada13788 Posts
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traced
1739 Posts
*sigh | ||
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gk_ender
United States717 Posts
im sry i wasn't around for savior, i caught the end of it, so i don't know a bonjwa when i see one. I can only look at stats and not the mental game. Bc i go back and look and july was #1 for awhile, and xellos was very close to oov and oov didnt take the top for awhile. So when do we call it bonjwa, bisu beat flash, bisu beat stork, does he have to beat jaedong to get it? And why is flash considered the closest (they say it in recent interviews) | ||
Manifesto7
Osaka27180 Posts
Boxer, Iloveoov, NaDa, and Savior are three that I consider a bonjwa. edit - can you please stop posting 3 times in a row? Post your thoughts in one post, and wait for the response. | ||
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Crunchums
United States11144 Posts
Flash was the closest because at his peak his dominance was bonjwa level, but he could not keep it up for long enough to be considered a bonjwa. Bisu may be the best player right now but he is not unbeatable; he loses about as many games as the other current top players. This is reflective of the overall trend of greater parity among progamers, ironically brought about by Bisu unseating Savior as the last bonjwa. | ||
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Letmelose
Korea (South)3227 Posts
July for example cannot be considered as bonjwa despite his long term reign as the first placed player in the Kespa ranking and his three OSL titles because there are too many "flaws" for him to be a bonjwa. 1) He never did anything of note in the MSL even during his prime 2) His winning rate rapidly became mediocre after 2004, and his accomplishments during 2004 alone aren't enough 3) He consistently had trouble overcoming Nada Boxer is an exception because he reigned supreme at started at a time where MBCGame leagues hadn't even been created yet. Yet his accomplishments are no less spectacular than the other bonjwas. Bisu is currently on a winning streak. But remember how Flash was on a winning streak coming off his first OSL win? Yet he failed to win any of the tournaments he competed in afterwards. Before that, Jaedong actually managed to win back to back individual leagues and triumphed in the proleague, but failed to continue his domination (thanks, crappy maps) which makes his reign too short for him to be considered as a bonjwa despite his trophies and high winning percentage. Bisu is on a roll after his MSL victory. Hell, what with him actually doing well in the proleague for once, with the protoss in general doing well in all competitions, I think Bisu has a pretty good chance of making a serious claim as the next bonjwa in line. Don't think that one MSL victory (the other two were from completely different time frames so they don't into discussion when we're talking about his current performance) and a pretty winning streak afterwards is enough to get him there. If that was all it took, we'd be seeing a hell of a lot more bonjwas around. My two cents. | ||
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CapO
United States1615 Posts
when nada, iloveoov, and savior were bonjwas, no matter who they faced, we had absolute confidence that their games would be instant win. now a days, everyone is fucking good, as the progamers would say it all the time in their interviews and whatnot. EVERYONE IS SO DAMN GOOOOOD NOW. | ||
Atrioc
United States1866 Posts
The Bonjwa - Born in November - Wins 3 MSL in rapid succession, - Wins 1 OSL, and then loses form as the next Bonjwa comes along. (They may have a resurgence later and win another trophy, but its always over a year later, and its always another OSL, never another MSL) - Has a dominant record against the previous Bonjwa and beats them in any BO3/5 series, and often gains their throne by defeating the previous Bonjwa in a final by this definition, the only Bonjwas are Nada ---> Oov ---> sAviOr ---> should be Bisu, but Mind fucked it up. Notice that until the GOM TV MSL S3 where Bisu totally fucked up against Mind and ruined the story, he had followed the rules exactly (Born in November, beat sAviOr in a final to take his throne immediately after sAviOr's first OSL, and has a dominant record against sAviOr) | ||
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rredtooth
5464 Posts
On January 09 2009 12:25 Manifesto7 wrote: A Bonjwa is a player that dominates an era. In addition, it is someone that affects the way the game evolves. It is much harder to find one now because players play 10x more games than they used to. There are plenty more chances to lose, and to be examined. Boxer, Iloveoov, NaDa, and Savior are three that I consider a bonjwa. edit - can you please stop posting 3 times in a row? Post your thoughts in one post, and wait for the response. =D Monitoring the TL forums must be tiring yes? | ||
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Jyvblamo
Canada13788 Posts
On January 09 2009 12:45 Atrioc wrote: I agree with Manifesto's definiton as something realistic, but I also like the more "mystical" one that highlights all the weird connections between the three Bonjwas. The Bonjwa - Born in November - Wins 3 MSL in rapid succession, - Wins 1 OSL, and then loses form as the next Bonjwa comes along. (They may have a resurgence later and win another trophy, but its always over a year later, and its always another OSL, never another MSL) - Has a dominant record against the previous Bonjwa and beats them in any BO3/5 series, and often gains their throne by defeating the previous Bonjwa in a final by this definition, the only Bonjwas are Nada ---> Oov ---> sAviOr ---> should be Bisu, but Mind fucked it up. Notice that until the GOM TV MSL S3 where Bisu totally fucked up against Mind and ruined the story, he had followed the rules exactly (Born in November, beat sAviOr in a final to take his throne immediately after sAviOr's first OSL, and has a dominant record against sAviOr) I think if Bisu wins anothe MSL and an OSL, he can make amends for his c-c-c-combo breaker vs Mind. I don't want to wait another 3 MSL seasons (at least) to crown a new bonjwa. | ||
Plexa
Aotearoa39261 Posts
All the other bonjwas only really started dominating in their third MSL through to the end of the next OSL (by that i mean being noticed by everyone). It's like, MSL1 "Oh shit its this cool newcomer guy" MSL2 its like "Oh cool this guy is pretty good yea?" and by MSL3 "holy shit this guy has force" and just rapes every living thing. Bisu is in bonjwa mode atm and he will win this OSL | ||
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Manifesto7
Osaka27180 Posts
On January 09 2009 12:48 redtooth wrote: =D Monitoring the TL forums must be tiring yes? :p I actually wrote that sentence without Boxer, but then changed my mind. He wasn't quite as dominant in terms of titles but had some of the strongest influence on the development of the game/esports. | ||
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Manifesto7
Osaka27180 Posts
On January 09 2009 13:05 Plexa wrote: If Bisu takes this OSL imo he'll be bonjwa status All the other bonjwas only really started dominating in their third MSL through to the end of the next OSL (by that i mean being noticed by everyone). It's like, MSL1 "Oh shit its this cool newcomer guy" MSL2 its like "Oh cool this guy is pretty good yea?" and by MSL3 "holy shit this guy has force" and just rapes every living thing. Bisu is in bonjwa mode atm and he will win this OSL I disagree with you. While Bisu winning would make him the number one player on the scene (if he isn't already) the rest of the competition is too close to him. Can you honestly say that Bisu is far ahead of Stork, Jaedong, or Flash? I give those three even odds to win the MSL. I honestly believe there are too many games and too many leagues to be a banjwa in the classic sense. It would take someone winning 5-6 leagues in a year for me to feel that. (I'm including GOM and proleague here). | ||
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deathgod6
United States5064 Posts
Bisu is in top condition, but if he is worthy of the bonjwa status, then how about Stork or Jaedong? They have both played consistent, dominated at their peaks, and .have been on the scene for a while. As much as I like SKT and Bisu, I think the classic title of bonjwa isn't ready to be handed down to a new player any time soon. | ||
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