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United States7488 Posts
Fantasy Proleague ContestShinhan 08/09 - Round 2
Contest is Now Closed. Good Luck!
For those of you who were aware or participated in the Fantasy MSL Contest, this will be similar (and expect the next Fantasy MSL Contest to be posted in a few days). The Fantasy Proleague will have a few differences from the MSL version to make it more conducive to the proleague format. There will be Team Captains and there will be a form of player Trading between weeks as well as an entirely different scoring system.
This contest will last for the duration of the next seven weeks of Proleague (starting on November 29th), which is the second of five rounds in the Shinhan 08-09 Proleague Season. I did not get this up in time for the first season because I was not prepared due to the change in format. Here is how this is going to work...
Contest Rules:
1. Each team will consist of six different players and one proteam.
2. Each team must include at least one player from each race. (Terran, Zerg & Protoss)
3. You must designate one of the players on your team to be the Team Captain (can't be traded and will determine tiebreakers).
4. You can spend no more than 30 points creating your team. (explained below)
5. PM me with a list of your team before November 29, 14:00 TL Time. You can post it here as well, but it won't be counted unless I get it via PM
6. Each person only gets one entry.
7. Failure to correctly follow these rules may result in disqualification from the contest.
If you do not clearly designate your captain, the first player on your roster will be chosen as your Team Captain. It is your responsibility to make sure you follow these rules as I may not have time to check everyone's team before the contest begins.
Team Creation:
Below is a list of all players who appeared in any team lineup throughout the first round of Proleague. There are 108 players in total. Each listed player has a point value. You must spend that many points to place that player on your team. You may not exceed 30 points or your team will be disqualified (you can spend less if you wish). Point values are based upon their performance in the previous Proleague round based on the same scoring system that will be used for this contest.
Any player who is not on the list may be added to your team for zero points, as based on the previous season, they did not play. (There may be a few good zero-point deals to be found). Please be sure that they are not on the list before you assume they will cost zero points. Check out the Proleague Results and Standings thread for complete team rosters.
edit: A more current list of rosters and roster changes can be found in this thread on page 12.
Both players and proteams cost points to be added to your team.
+ Show Spoiler [Player List] +
+ Show Spoiler [Proteam List] +
Sample Team:
 JangBi (Captain)
Stork
Much
 sAviOr
 BoxeR
Mind
WeMade FOX
(30 Points Total)
Trading:
During the few days with no Proleague matches between each week there will be a "Trading Period." I will offer one or more available trades as a Trade of the Week. The trades offered will appear a such:
If you have one of either player and you want to make the trade you may PM me at anytime during the Trading Period and I will switch out the player you have for the one you don't. The trading feature does not allow you to have multiples of the same player. Trading may allow you to exceed the 30 point limit, that is okay. However, you may not make a trade if it would result in you not having a player of each race. You may not trade your Team Captain.
During the week you may PM me trade suggestions/proposals. I will review all proposed trades and may choose from them when posting the Trade of the Week. For the trade to be considered it must appear as a fair and interesting trade.
Scoring:
Players:
Lineup Appearance: 1 Point
Game Win: 2 Points
Game Loss: -1 Points
Ace Match Appearance: 2 Points
3-Game Win Streak: 1 Point
6-Game Win Streak: 2 Points
9-Game Win Streak: 3 Points
Break Another's Streak: 1 Point
Team Win: 1 Point
DQ/Forfeit: -4 Points
Proteams:
3-0 Victory: 5 Points
3-1 Victory: 3 Points
3-2 Victory: 2 Points
2-3 Defeat: 1 Point
1-3 Defeat: 0 Points
0-3 Defeat: -2 Points
Best Record for Round 2: 4 Points
Example: Lecaf and KTF are going into the Ace Match. KTF sends out Flash, Lecaf sends Jaedong. Both players are currently on 5-Game win streaks. Jaedong beats Flash. Flash earns 2 points for being selected as Ace, but then loses one point for losing the game, netting him a total of only one point. Jaedong earns 2 points for being selected as Ace, he gets another 2 points for winning. Since it's his sixth win in a row, he gets 2 more points for being on a six-game win streak. He also broke Flash's win streak, so he earns 1 point for that as well. And finally, since his team won the match, he gets one more point, earning Jaedong a total of 8 points.
A win basically earns you 3 points and a loss 0 points. I didn't do the scoring that way though, because if a player did well enough on his team to warrant a spot in the lineup and was scheduled to play game four, but didn't get to because the match ended in three games, then both players that would have played game four each get a point.
I will do my best to get top Standing posted each week. At the end of Week Seven, a winner will be determined and a prize will be given. Any ties will be settled first by Team Captain.
My Team:
Hwasin - Team Captain
Luxury
Thezerg
Stork
Movie
Pure
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/teams/icons/11.png) Lecaf Oz
-semioldguy
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United States7488 Posts
If you have questions.. feel free to post them in the thread and I'll answer them when I can.
Please don't PM me questions though.. because I'll have too many other PM's and I probably won't get to it as quickly as I would if you just posted in this thread.
There is an image of all the compiled stats/points for the first round for all the players HERE. Be warned though, it's a large file, which is why I didn't just post the image here.
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Whats the point of the team captain? Is it only becuase you cannot trade him?
Thanks for doing this btw,
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United States7488 Posts
On November 27 2008 12:31 Tensai176 wrote:
Whats the point of the team captain? Is it only becuase you cannot trade him?
Thanks for doing this btw,
You're welcome.
Also Team Captain is the first thing to determine any tiebreakers. And for not being able to trade (sort of how you can't drop your first round pick in many fantasy sports). You have to have confidence in your captain! You can't just get rid of him, how would the rest of your team feel about that instability?.
On November 27 2008 12:32 ClouD.BreaK wrote:
No KTF?
Sorry... fixed.
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is awesome32269 Posts
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six players and the team choice costs points too
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you still have too many players, Tensai
it's 6 players plus one team
even if you pick players worth little points, you still can't have more than 6
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Thanks everybody, I fail T_T
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On November 27 2008 12:29 nemY wrote:
SOG is my hero.
QFT
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i like how the majority of the teams are SKT1 and have Bisu
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I nominate myself for having the best 0 point pick - sKyHigh ftw!
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I'll pick SKT1 too
3 SKT1
5 (P)Bisu (capt)
6 (P)Jangbi
6 (Z)Luxury
5 (Z)Savior
3 (P)By. Movie
2 (T)Boxer
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Bisu 5
GGPlay 4
ForGG 5
Luxury 6 (captain)
Tempest 3
Boxer 2
Team: Lecaf Oz 5
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United States8068 Posts
lol thezerg is the luxury of fantasy PL (fucking everyone had him in the fantasy MSL)
IT SUCKS becuase i really love the guy but I MUST be a nonconformist!
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^ You not non conforming, your conforming to my non conforming.
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Melbourne5338 Posts
Players:
Lineup Appearance: 1 Point
Game Win: 2 Points
Game Loss: -1 Points
Ace Match Appearance: 2 Points
3-Game Win Streak: 1 Point
6-Game Win Streak: 2 Points
9-Game Win Streak: 3 Points
Break Another's Streak: 1 Point
Team Win: 1 Point
DQ/Forfeit: -4 Points
does that include players that aren't in the line up?
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United States7488 Posts
On November 27 2008 14:05 pachi wrote:
Players:
Lineup Appearance: 1 Point
Game Win: 2 Points
Game Loss: -1 Points
Ace Match Appearance: 2 Points
3-Game Win Streak: 1 Point
6-Game Win Streak: 2 Points
9-Game Win Streak: 3 Points
Break Another's Streak: 1 Point
Team Win: 1 Point
DQ/Forfeit: -4 Points
does that include players that aren't in the line up?
Yes.
My reasoning it that they help with practice all week (and come to the matches for support/cheerleader purposes). So if the team is doing well, they are probably contributing in some way back at the training house.
Preparing Monologue...
But Ultimately if they aren't playing games... they won't be scoring you a whole lot of points. Players who have previously played are more likely to play again. If they haven't been getting televised matches, it's likely they won't be getting many any time soon.
So I think someone who went 0-4, but costs 1 or 2 points is still of greater value than some 0 point player on the same team because in many the 0-4 player is likely to get some more games. The zero point player may never get games. You need to play games to win games and that's where the most of a player's potential points would be coming from.
It could be argued that the player is not actually out there in the game doing anything, and in other fantasy sports the benched players don't get you points. just depends on how you want to look at it.
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51374 Posts
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Sounds fun, but I'm not up to the headache of calculating points. :/
It's cool that STX is finally getting some respect though. xD
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United States7488 Posts
On November 27 2008 14:43 3clipse wrote:
Sounds fun, but I'm not up to the headache of calculating points. :/
It's cool that STX is finally getting some respect though. xD
There's going to be some sort of prize (don't know what yet)... but it can't be that difficult to count to 30. :p
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Does captain count for anything? What is the point of picking one other than that he cant be traded?
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is awesome32269 Posts
I won't post my team because its super secretly secret. But I will tell you this guys: I will win this.
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Valhalla18444 Posts
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motbob
United States12546 Posts
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United States8068 Posts
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On November 27 2008 14:50 IntoTheWow wrote:
I won't post my team because its super secretly secret. But I will tell you this guys: I will win this.
50 magic nonexistent TL points says I beat you.
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loool, how much is the TL team worth?
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United States7488 Posts
On November 27 2008 14:45 PH wrote:
Does captain count for anything? What is the point of picking one other than that he cant be traded?
Determines tiebreakers before anything else.
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is awesome32269 Posts
On November 27 2008 15:02 SonuvBob wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2008 14:50 IntoTheWow wrote:
I won't post my team because its super secretly secret. But I will tell you this guys: I will win this. 50 magic nonexistent TL points says I beat you.
How about we bet posts?
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Melbourne5338 Posts
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No fair, your bankroll's too big.
MNTLPs or bust.
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is awesome32269 Posts
On November 27 2008 15:13 SonuvBob wrote:
No fair, your bankroll's too big.
MNTLPs or bust.
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We can't bet posts, it angers the database. 
Look what happened to Haji when he tried to collect too many!
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Im stuck at 25... help me please.
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is awesome32269 Posts
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On November 27 2008 14:50 IntoTheWow wrote:
I won't post my team because its super secretly secret. But I will tell you this guys: I will win this.
So you're using my team?
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although I'm sure none of you know me, what are the possibilities of getting access to the TLPD database if I was interested in coding a website for this
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Team Lecaf (5)
Flash (9) Captain
Savior (5)
Bisu (5)
Canata (2)
Anytime (1)
Piano (3)
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Melbourne5338 Posts
On November 27 2008 16:28 ehcg wrote:
although I'm sure none of you know me, what are the possibilities of getting access to the TLPD database if I was interested in coding a website for this
Very little. PoP is protective of TLPD. You'll probably have to make a very nice impression on him.
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I have a feeling I should have thought through my team a bit more after seeing how crazy ITW and SOG are about this. Actually... fuck it, ima own you noobs neway.
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is awesome32269 Posts
LOL sog, Stork is the worst pick ever
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is awesome32269 Posts
btw im making some changes to my team tomorow, ill pm you about it :3
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United States7488 Posts
On November 27 2008 16:54 IntoTheWow wrote:
LOL sog, Stork is the worst pick ever
I'd make fun of some of your picks... but you're so afraid you have to keep them secret from everyone so I won't spoil it for you :p
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SK Telecom T1 (3)
BeSt (Captain)
Bisu
Fantasy
By. Movie
EffOrt
Light
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is awesome32269 Posts
On November 27 2008 17:00 semioldguy wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2008 16:54 IntoTheWow wrote:
LOL sog, Stork is the worst pick ever I'd make fun of some of your picks... but you're so afraid you have to keep them secret from everyone so I won't spoil it for you :p
I'm changing some of them, but my picks are very well though and I have a reason for them.
But Strork for 7 points =
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Melbourne5338 Posts
On November 27 2008 17:04 IntoTheWow wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2008 17:00 semioldguy wrote:On November 27 2008 16:54 IntoTheWow wrote:
LOL sog, Stork is the worst pick ever I'd make fun of some of your picks... but you're so afraid you have to keep them secret from everyone so I won't spoil it for you :p I'm changing some of them, but my picks are very well though and I have a reason for them. But Strork for 7 points =
LOL TOSSGIRL WELL THOUGHTOUT. WHAT A TROLL ITW
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is awesome32269 Posts
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On November 27 2008 17:04 IntoTheWow wrote:
my picks are very well though and I have a reason for them.
Crap.
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8 (Z)ZerO
7 (P)Stork Captain
5 (Z)EffOrt
5 (T)fantasy
1 (Z)Hyuk
1 (Z)s2
3 SK Telecom T1
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is awesome32269 Posts
On November 27 2008 17:12 SonuvBob wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2008 17:04 IntoTheWow wrote:
my picks are very well though and I have a reason for them. Crap.
YE THAT'S RITE
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=\ I don't get the whole "Team" part. Does that mean, by buying a team, you're judged based on how well the team as a whole does in PL, or does that mean you buy every player on the team and a) don't have to buy Flash once you get the KTF team, while b) are rewarded points per player on the whole team per match?
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is awesome32269 Posts
On November 27 2008 17:23 xxsaznpride wrote:
=\ I don't get the whole "Team" part. Does that mean, by buying a team, you're judged based on how well the team as a whole does in PL, or does that mean you buy every player on the team and a) don't have to buy Flash once you get the KTF team, while b) are rewarded points per player on the whole team per match?
You pick a team, and you are rewarded/punished in points according to how the team does each week (3-1, 3-2, 3-0, 1-3, 2-3, etc give different points each)
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Aotearoa39261 Posts
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is awesome32269 Posts
haha I saw that coming :p
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10387 Posts
Team
SKT T1 (3)
Captain
Boxer (2)
Players
Bisu (5)
Thezerg (2)
Best (8)
Jaedong (9)
Midas (1)
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semioldguy tell me how you keep track of all these please! it seems like so much fucking work.. I had a had time just posting my team LOL
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United States7488 Posts
Excel takes care of a lot of the work.
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6 STX Soul
9 Zero (Team Captain)
7 Saint
4 July
2 Thezerg
1 Anytime
1 iloveoov
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my team is such hot shit
i can't believe how much more ballin' it is than every other team posted
it's so good i'm going to have to wait until after the deadline to post it (though to be honest, i wouldn't be surprised if someone figured out a very similar lineup)
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Samsung KHAN 5
firebathero 8 (captain)
Bisu 5
NaDa 2
Luxury 5
Much 3
BoxeR 2
i think im only the second person to choose FBH. He's expensive at 8 points, but i will gain 3 of those magical non existant TL points that ITW was talking about every time he does a ceremony :D
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9070 Posts
hmm the most balanced team imo... I should think some more about composing mine, because I'm planning to win the contest, but I will most likely pick up FBH for team captain as well
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Germany / USA16648 Posts
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I think this could be Really strong. Good picks.
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Question:
Does player win streak include all KeSPA games the player has played in, just Proleague games, or just Proleague Round 2 games?
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Watch TheZerg ends up getting injured and we all fail.
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On November 28 2008 01:14 miseiler wrote:
Watch TheZerg ends up getting injured and we all fail.
Thank god for trade week
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hmm i have a question if i choose TT for 2 points and he doesn't play but his team wins will i still get 1 point for his team winning ?
I need this question anwered because if a player gets points by not playing but his team winning it would be more advantages to make a team with diffrent teams players  .
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Another question about streaks: Does a player's 4th, 5th, 7th, and 8th win in a row get him streak points, or only the 3rd, 6th, and 9th? So if a player wins 9 in a row, has he accumulated 6 streak points (1+2+3) or 12 streak points (1+1+1+2+2+2+3) from those 9 games? If it's the sooner, you should probably word it "3-5 game win streak: 1 point."
Also, for "breaking another player's streak," does this mean beating a player who won a streak point in his last match (someone currently on a 3 game streak), or just stopping him from getting a streak point (someone currently on a 2 game streak)?
I know streak points aren't that important, as they probably only accounted for less than 20 points total across all players last round, I just want to be sure for my calculations.
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My team is fucking stellar.
- 8 (P) free (Captain)
- 8 (P) Pusan
- 2 (P) Violet
- 3 (P) By.Movie
- 1 (T) Midas
- 2 (Z) by.hero
24 points used.
Team:
- 5 Lecaf Oz
29!!
fuck, I should buy hoon for 0 and get someone like light for 3-4. TT.
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United States7488 Posts
On November 27 2008 23:41 LonelyMargarita wrote:
Question:
Does player win streak include all KeSPA games the player has played in, just Proleague games, or just Proleague Round 2 games?
Proleaugue Round 2 Games. So if they lose MSL/OSL/GOM games in between that's fine. And streaks are not going to carry over from Round 1, every player starts from the same clean slate.
On November 28 2008 01:46 raga4ka wrote:
hmm i have a question if i choose TT for 2 points and he doesn't play but his team wins will i still get 1 point for his team winning ?
Yes, you would still get 1 point for the team winning, even if the player was not in the lineup or didn't play.
On November 28 2008 01:55 LonelyMargarita wrote:
Another question about streaks: Does a player's 4th, 5th, 7th, and 8th win in a row get him streak points, or only the 3rd, 6th, and 9th? So if a player wins 9 in a row, has he accumulated 6 streak points (1+2+3) or 12 streak points (1+1+1+2+2+2+3) from those 9 games? If it's the sooner, you should probably word it "3-5 game win streak: 1 point."
the 4th, 5th, 7th, 8th wins do not net any extra points. The player only gets those points when he reaches those benchmarks of 3, 6 or 9 games. So if a player has gotten a 9-Game win streak he will have gotten 1+2+3 for a total of six extra points.
Also, for "breaking another player's streak," does this mean beating a player who won a streak point in his last match (someone currently on a 3 game streak), or just stopping him from getting a streak point (someone currently on a 2 game streak)?
They get it for beating a player who is currently on a win streak of 3 or more games. The first player to take down any player who has earned points from any win streak.
I know streak points aren't that important, as they probably only accounted for less than 20 points total across all players last round, I just want to be sure for my calculations.
From Last Round:
Total Streak Points - 44
Total Streak Break Points - 29
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Teh dark manners
(0) Grrrr... P
(0) Maynard T or Z (captain)
(0) Elky T
(0) Smuft P
(0) Supercondomuser T
(0) Oh well, let's go with me P ( i'm 0-7 on Kespa site I reckon)
Okay team doesn't exist but ... >.>
I'm pretty sure Elky or Smuft could actually score a few wins against yellow. Oh wait, was he picked at all by anybody?
However this team's secret weapon could be something like : Can turn a casual ramen pro league competitor into a poker addict, forcing him to cancel his pro gaming career to dive into an infinite bad beat blackhole.
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I hope we change streak points for round 3 then. An 8-game streak only gets you as many points as three 3 game streaks, and because of the pressure involved when you're on a streak, I'd wager an 8 game streak would be much harder to get. As it is, it's pretty much just a bonus for winning so many games. That's just my opinion though.
Also, http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/leagues/157_Shinhan_Proleague_08-09/player_stats is not showing any entries anymore for me. Was it just reset for round 2?
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9 Jaedong (Team Captain)
2 Nada
5 Bisu
5 forGG
3 Much
1 Anytime
3 SK Telecom T1
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I don't get why you select a group of players AND a proteam.
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United States13143 Posts
On November 28 2008 02:25 semioldguy wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2008 01:46 raga4ka wrote:
hmm i have a question if i choose TT for 2 points and he doesn't play but his team wins will i still get 1 point for his team winning ?
Yes, you would still get 1 point for the team winning, even if the player was not in the lineup or didn't play.
So if I chose multiple players from, for example, STX SouL, and STX won their match, would I get 1 point per STX player that I have or just 1 point?
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On November 28 2008 03:18 Elyvilon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2008 02:25 semioldguy wrote:On November 28 2008 01:46 raga4ka wrote:
hmm i have a question if i choose TT for 2 points and he doesn't play but his team wins will i still get 1 point for his team winning ?
Yes, you would still get 1 point for the team winning, even if the player was not in the lineup or didn't play. So if I chose multiple players from, for example, STX SouL, and STX won their match, would I get 1 point per STX player that I have or just 1 point?
Lol i didn't thought about that .
Edit:Reach is the Best 0 point deal if someone wants a more greedy lineup you can add him for the sixth player or if you want Casy but i would bet on Reach .
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3 Lions
United States3705 Posts
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United States7488 Posts
On November 28 2008 03:09 il0seonpurpose wrote:
I don't get why you select a group of players AND a proteam.
The Proteam you select is like Defense/Special teams in fantasy football. It's like picking the coaching staff for one of the teams, you have confidence that they will be sending out the right lineups to ensure that their team gets the best overall results.
On November 28 2008 03:18 Elyvilon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2008 02:25 semioldguy wrote:On November 28 2008 01:46 raga4ka wrote:
hmm i have a question if i choose TT for 2 points and he doesn't play but his team wins will i still get 1 point for his team winning ?
Yes, you would still get 1 point for the team winning, even if the player was not in the lineup or didn't play. So if I chose multiple players from, for example, STX SouL, and STX won their match, would I get 1 point per STX player that I have or just 1 point?
1 point per STX player. So if all six of your players were from STX and they won, you'd get 6 points, but if they lost you would get 0.
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Lol CHEATER ! too bad there is a post above you saying bisu - 5
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1 (P)Anytime (what a steal)
9 (T)Flash Captain(when you reward 2 points for an ACE match appearance...I can't think of a better choice).
9 (Z)Jaedong
2 (Z)Thezerg (at least skt1 will play him)
4 (T)Mind
0 (P)Reach (should be able to eek out some wins. Even if he doesn't, he'll at least appear in the lineup often.)
5 Samsung KHAN
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I have a question concerning team win.
If i have 2 players in my list that are in the same team and this team happens to win.
Would i get 2 points for "team wins" ?
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(5) Team: KHAN
(9) Jaedong (Team Captain)
(9) Flash
(7) Really
(0) Casy
(0) Zeus
(0) inter.young
(30) Total
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United States7488 Posts
On November 28 2008 03:56 trollbone wrote:
I have a question concerning team win.
If i have 2 players in my list that are in the same team and this team happens to win.
Would i get 2 points for "team wins" ?
Yes, each player gets a point.
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On November 27 2008 17:15 IntoTheWow wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2008 17:12 SonuvBob wrote:On November 27 2008 17:04 IntoTheWow wrote:
my picks are very well though and I have a reason for them. Crap. YE THAT'S RITE
¡TE APLASTARÉ!
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s.a.y. that is a very nice team.
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skyhigh and han shouldn't be worth 0 semi.
That's ridiculous!
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United States7488 Posts
On November 28 2008 04:39 Showtime! wrote:
skyhigh and han shouldn't be worth 0 semi.
That's ridiculous!
Neither of them got even a single game the first 7 weeks (though they are scheduled to play in the first week of the this round). I have to base the points on stats, I don't want any bias to be used in determining point values.
If it turns out to be a problem for some reason I have a couple ideas for solutions to that for next round.
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Understood. I might decide to make some changes to my roster before the deadline then.
It would be really silly to pass up those two to upgrade any roster.
i.e.
Team Showtime!
8 Free ©
5 Fantasy
5 Bisu
7 Saint
0 Han
0 SkyHigh
Team: 5 Lecaf OZ
***
Your trade options would be extremely limited with a team like this.
Someone should just pickup the entire Soul team if they think they'll really win PL this year.
They usually always play:
9 Clam
.. JulyZerg
.. Hwasin
etc.
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Do you do all the adding up of scores and whatnot for everyone on your own semioldguy? it really must be a hellova lot of work.
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United States7488 Posts
It's not so bad. It hardly takes more than one second for me to check the addition. I'm one of the crazy people who can do weird math really fast in his head.
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LoL FakeSteve ain't takeing any chances here . His team is pure brute force ...
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You know what, fuck it.
I'm going out on a limb on this one and choosing almost all STX Soul players lmao.
It is one hell of an absurd team though and if they run the floor this round, well fuck me. Huge points.
Here's my new team. I'm going to try and keep track of both though, because my other team was fricking spectacular too, but very Protoss heavy. X_X
Here is my final submission.
Showtime!'s Dream Team (STX SOUL WIN please, lol)
9 Calmby
8 Kal
5 Hwasin - I hate the red sniper, but hoping for the best t.t
0 SkyHigH
2 by.hero
TEAM: STX SOUL!!
0 free points. All 30 used now (I thought Midas was worth 2, but I guess you changed him to one, good discount for those who want him though!)
-_-
changing again lol... I do not trust Kal or Hwasin.
bleh.
FINAL EDIT:
8 free (C)
9 Calm
5 Bisu
2 by.hero
0 SkyHigH
0 by.han -- forgot to add him.
Team: 6 STX Soul.
With this team I get a few more options as Bisu and Free are normally used in regular PL games and ace matches. I'll PM you when I'm done thinking out loud semi t.t
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SOG, out of curiosity, do you have a list of who got the 24 points for Lineup Appearance that didn't play their games (I believe there were 12 3-0 victories)?
And the 29 streak break points? Just if you have these things in a list already, it would save me the time of figuring them out. If not, don't worry about it. Thanks. nm I got them
EDIT: APPEARANCE POINTS (the real source of points for Ace's players):
+ Show Spoiler +
APPEARANCE POINTS
cj GGPlay
ace Oversky
ogn yellow[arnc]
fox baby
stars free
cj iris
ktf luxury
ace daezang
stars darling
ace daezang (2)
estro tester
ace fOru
fox HerO
cj EffOrt
ktf Flash
ogn Shine
lecaf HiyA
ace OversKy (2)
mbc Pusan
fox BaBy (2)
estro SangHo
cj By.Movie
stx Hwasin
ace Anytime
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7 (P)Stork (captain)
8 (P)free
8 (Z)ZerO
1 (T)Midas
1 (T)iloveoov
5 Samsung KHAN
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Funny that Sea isn't in FS's team
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Hey, I'm a big Sea fan too, but it's kind of hard to afford him when:
a) you only have 30 points to spend
b) you can only have 6 players
c) he's playing mediocre
TT
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On November 27 2008 16:54 IntoTheWow wrote:
LOL sog, Stork is the worst pick ever
Stork has the most efficient points/cost ratio (tied with 3 other players, I believe) if you calculate his points from round 1. Except for free (unless I made a miscalculation), they are in order based on how many points they would have received for round 1, so the top player for each cost is the best value.
Obviously any player that performed well last round could be considered a bad pick, as their point cost is based on that performance. They have to do at least as well as last round to be worth their cost, so picking someone like Calm or Jaedong (considering they're removing Raid Assoult) is about as bad a pick as you can get, unless you honestly think they'll get 11+ wins next round.
EDIT: NM, Stork isn't the most efficient, but he's in the top 10. I miss-typed an entry in my stat sheet.
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9070 Posts
The best pick is oversky imo, he is almost always in the line up, wins from time to time and is relatively cheap. Putting bisu as capt is insane
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On November 27 2008 14:44 semioldguy wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2008 14:43 3clipse wrote:
Sounds fun, but I'm not up to the headache of calculating points. :/
It's cool that STX is finally getting some respect though. xD There's going to be some sort of prize (don't know what yet)... but it can't be that difficult to count to 30. :p
lol
I man constantly checking every player's games and checking their opponents to see if they're on streaks and making sure I don't miss anything.... it's just too much work. xD
I like the idea though.
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8 Best (Captain)
8 FBH
5 fantasy
4 July
1 Anytime
1 Midas
3 SKT1
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On November 28 2008 07:43 disciple wrote:
The best pick is oversky imo, he is almost always in the line up, wins from time to time and is
relatively cheap. Putting bisu as capt is insane
How so? If Bisu keeps his play up, he's going to be on every starting line-up on SKT along with best, and more often than not, be picked as an ACE for a long time to come. Very reasonable that you dont want to trade this point-getter.
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9070 Posts
On November 28 2008 08:08 Tensai176 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2008 07:43 disciple wrote:
The best pick is oversky imo, he is almost always in the line up, wins from time to time and is
relatively cheap. Putting bisu as capt is insane How so? If Bisu keeps his play up, he's going to be on every starting line-up on SKT along with best, and more often than not, be picked as an ACE for a long time to come. Very reasonable that you dont want to trade this point-getter.
I do have bisu in my team, mostly because of my fanboysm,but his history and traditions in PL are not promising. JD is the safest pick because his is in every line up, plays every ACE match but its a bit all-in move for me because he is so damn expansive. It will be even more interesting to follow the PL now 
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Valhalla18444 Posts
On November 28 2008 06:07 o3.power91 wrote:Funny that Sea isn't in FS's team
he's a great choice for 5 points, but i have a plan for this
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United States7488 Posts
On November 28 2008 07:49 3clipse wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2008 14:44 semioldguy wrote:On November 27 2008 14:43 3clipse wrote:
Sounds fun, but I'm not up to the headache of calculating points. :/
It's cool that STX is finally getting some respect though. xD There's going to be some sort of prize (don't know what yet)... but it can't be that difficult to count to 30. :p lol I man constantly checking every player's games and checking their opponents to see if they're on streaks and making sure I don't miss anything.... it's just too much work. xD I like the idea though.
Well... LOL I'm keeping track of everyone's points and streaks and stats and everything. So it wouldn't be a headache for you.
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what happens when to of your players meet in a game or ace match?
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Kind of a dumb question, but we can only have 1 Team, right?
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See I KNEW someone would have the exact same lineup as me. Except instead of KTF I have SKT and instead of Anytime i have Thezerg. I'm pretty sure this is the optimal lineup, unless you rank Best/Anytime above Stork/Thezerg
(my team)
Team
SK Telecom T1 (3)
Captain
Flash (9)
Players
Jaedong (9)
Stork (7)
Thezerg (2)
sKyHigh (0)
han (0)
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On November 28 2008 04:27 Showtime! wrote:
s.a.y. that is a very nice team.
tnx m8
it's all luck in the end.
after i have chosen my team, i noticed that i didn't interpret the rules good enough...
can't wait to see first points :D
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It sucks that 0-3 is negative two points for a proleague team instead of negative 1, otherwise I could have upgraded Thezerg to Bisu.
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United States7488 Posts
On November 28 2008 09:30 gk_ender wrote:
what happens when to of your players meet in a game or ace match?
One will win and one will lose, you'll get points for both sides.
On November 28 2008 09:35 Avidkeystamper wrote:
Kind of a dumb question, but we can only have 1 Team, right?
Correct, only one team. That's Rule #6
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Go with the second one. It is much stronger.
July is honestly a bad choice for this. He doesn't fair so well in PL when he's focusing on winning a personal title.
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4 (Z)GGPlay
9 (T)Flash (Captain)
4 (Z)July
6 (Z)Luxury
1 (P)Anytime
2 (Z)Thezerg
4 Woongjin Stars
That is the team I went with in the end. I tried to get as many points in the first week as possible and after that its a crap shoot. I'm a KTF fan anyways so I couldn't pass Lux and Flash up.
-super theory craft-
GGPlay should net 8 points.
Flash should net 8 points minimum, but KTF's matches look like they'll go to ACE and Flash should be sent out and he should win ending up with 6 more points. 3 match win streak would give him a total of 15.
July is up against s2 and herb this week so he should also go 2-0 for 6 and he'll net 2 more for beating SKT and OGN. 8 points.
Lux is up against Nal_keke and UpMagiC, should go 2-0 with two team wins for 8.
Anytime: If what Anytime says about no dropping a single pvp in the Lecaf house then there is no way he'll lose to HakSoo... I hope. That should be 3 points, and he'll net another for being on the roster against SKT and he won't lose a point for me if SKT 3-0's them.
Thezerg should net 4 points for the SKT vs. ACE match and if SKT wins their other match he'll net 5.
The Woogjin Stars should win both matches 3-1 or better, so they should net 6 points.
Player that play twice a night, like Flash and other common ace players, seem to be the key to winning. But its all a crap shoot and I love my players, woot 4 zergs.
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On November 28 2008 10:18 Showtime! wrote:
Go with the second one. It is much stronger.
July is honestly a bad choice for this. He doesn't fair so well in PL when he's focusing on winning a personal title.
agreed that choice was more of "hes my fav player eva eva" now that i think about it, thanks for the advice i think il go wiht second one
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United States7488 Posts
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Wait, so each person individually calculates his/her points? Or is there some supercomputer that does it for us?
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United States7488 Posts
On November 28 2008 13:07 Tensai176 wrote:
Wait, so each person individually calculates his/her points? Or is there some supercomputer that does it for us?
I take care of it.
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man why is stx 6 and lecaf and khan 5
thats bs
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coz they are ranked #1 in the 1st round? duh.
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United States7488 Posts
STX was the only team with 8 wins, so they earned the most points last round.
OGN actually scored the second most amount of points in the first round because they overall had better wins and closer losses.
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Stork 7
Jangbi 6 Captain
Bisu 5
Much 3
Frozean 2
Thezerg 2
Samsung Kahn 5
= 30
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(T) Flash[C] || 9
(T) Tossgirl || 0
(T) NaDa || 2
(Z) Luxury || 6
(P) Tempest || 3
(P) JangBi || 6
KTF Magic Ns @ 4
30 points.
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http://rosedelta.com/fantasy/select_team.php
I was wondering if people would be willing to look at the general idea of the interface and let me know what they think. I haven't exactly made too much progress on anything because I just hacked away at this in between working on my memo for law school.
And yes, you will all start with juni on your team because I was testing modifying an existing user's roster.
also i haven't had time to test it out in any setup except mine so it will most likely have problems, let me know your specs (resolution, browser, etc.) and i'll fix it
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For me it only allows 29 points
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hrm it's working for me. what combination of players/team did you attempt
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Perhaps the problem was you trying to change teams as your last move? It wasn't properly adding back the old points from the previously selected team before checking the points.
i do seem to have broken it so juni won't show up checked by default anymore though. hrm.
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Btw, is this week officially the start of SPL Round 2?
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Bisu [Capt'n]
Leta
Savior
Hwasin
TheZerg
Anytime
Samsung
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5 Lecaf
---------
9 Flash (Captain)
6 Jangbi
5 Bisu
3 Movie
2 TheZerg
0 SkyHigh
=30 points
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United States7488 Posts
On November 28 2008 18:27 o3.power91 wrote:
Btw, is this week officially the start of SPL Round 2?
Yes
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Aotearoa39261 Posts
psst Darkelf was just removed from the CJ roster
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Kau
Canada3500 Posts
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South Africa4316 Posts
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Russian Federation4333 Posts
This team is so fucking awesome but it costs 31 pts, aaaaaaaargh!
5 Samsung KHAN
9 Jaedong (capitan)
8 Free
6 Jangbi
1 Anytime
0 Casy
2 Thezerg
T_T
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Russian Federation4333 Posts
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Breaking News! Tossgirl removed from STX A-team. Calm to go into major slump!?
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9070 Posts
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it may interest you to know that according to a post in the PL lineups thread, Tazza is being taken off the active roster
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They just use him to wipe out Bisu and now they remove him from the roster so the best from Tazza you will get 1 point if OGN wins
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United States7488 Posts
Rosters and changes:+ Show Spoiler +On November 29 2008 02:32 KizZBG wrote:▶ Air Force ACEDirector - Yoo Seong Yeol Playing Coach - Lee Jae Hoon (P) Captain - DaezanG (P) MuMyung (Z) Rage (P) Sunny (T) BoxeR (T) OversKy (Z) Reach (P) Anytime (P) Casy (T) ◆ Changes Team Captain - BoxeR -> DaezanG▶ Lecaf OzDirector - Cho Jeong Woong Coach - han Sang Young Captain - Dongrae (T) HiyA (T) fOrGG (T) Lomo (T) Jaedong (Z) ToSky (Z) ggaemo (Z) ZergBOy (Z) Ever)Z(Killer (Z) BackHo (P) inter.young (P) PerfectMan (P) ◆ Changes In: Killer, PerfectManOut: ZergJoaa ▶ Samsung KHANDirector - Kim Ga Eul Coach - Yoo Ji Gang Coach - Choi Woo Beon Captain - TT (P) JiHyun (Z) oDin (Z) Juni (Z) by.great (Z) RorO (T) firebathero (T) FrOzean (T) Brave (P) Stork (P) JangBi (P) Yoon (P) ◆ Changes In: Brave, roroOut: Chavi, Purpose ▶ OGN Sparkyz Director - Lee Myung Keun Coach - Ju Jin Chul Coach - Cha Ji Hoon Captain - Zeus (P) Chalrenge (P) Spear (P) HakSoo (P) herb (P) YellOw[ArnC] (Z) type-b (Z) Clay (Z) go.go (T) Leta (T) Shine (T) Justin (T) ◆ Changes In: Chalrenge, herb, ClayOut: Tazza, Flower, HoGiL▶ Woongjin StarsDirector - Lee Jae Kyun Coach: Kim Sang Hoon aka S.E.S_486 (Z) Coach: Son Seung Wan aka SONJJANG (P) Captain - GanZi (T) Child (Z) GGPlay (Z) ZerO (Z) by.eagle (Z) DarLinG (T) PianO (T) Special[S.G] (T) MVP (T) FanTastic_NamoO (P) free (P) GuemChi (P) ◆ Changes In: by.eagleOut: by.mingu▶ WeMade FOXDirector - Kim Yang Joong Coach - Won Jong Wook Coach - Kim Kwang Bok Captain - HoOny (P) NaDa (T) pepe (T) Mind (T) BaBy (T) Nal_keke (Z) RorO (Z) Shine (Z) HerO (P) Pure (P) ◆ Changes Out: Rock (P) ▶ CJ EntusDirector - Elliot Cho Coach - Kim Dong Woo aka KIMDONGWOO (Z) Coach - Na Jae WoongCaptain - Iris (T) XellOs (T) AzAng (T) sKyHigh (T) Much (P) Nbs (P) By.Movie (P) jjonga (P) sAviOr (Z) Kwanro (Z) Orion (Z) EffOrt (Z) ◆ Changes In: AzAng (T), jjonga (P) Out: DarkElf (T), Memory (T) ▶ eSTRODirector - Kim HyuN Jin aka kOs (T) Coach - Oh Sang Taek aka Xian[3.33] (Z) Captain - Tester (P) maGma (Z) Sea.Really (T) NsP_Action (Z) UpMagiC (T) hyvaa (Z) PuMa (T) SangHo (P) Neo.G_Flying (P) Suny (T) ◆ Changes In: Neo.G_Flying (P) ▶ KTF MagicNsDirector - Lee Ji Hoon Coach - Jo Byung Ho aka EJi (P) Coach - Kang Doh Gyung aka H.O.T-Forever (Z) Coach - Lee Gil Man Captain - ZergBOy (Z) Luxury (Z) 815 (Z) Haran (Z) FireFist (Z) Flash (T) SaiR (T) Hery (T) Stats (P) LuCifer (P) Tempest (P) Violet (P) ▶ MBC HerODirector - Kim Hyuk Seom Coach - Lee Woon Jae aka [Oops]Lee (T) Coach - Do Jin Kwang aka JoyO (T) Captain - Shark (Z) Saint (Z) HyuN (Z) Pusan (P) Jaehoon (P) han (P) 910 (T) koala_V_ (T) Sea (T) Light (T) RuBy (T) kkong (T) ◆ Changes In: HyuN (Z), koala_V_ (T) Out: Thezerg (Z), Miz.Peace (Z) ▶ SK Telecom T1Director - Park Young Woon aka Beat Artosis 2-0 Coach - Park Yong Wook aka Kingdom (P) Assistant Coach - Choi Byeong Hun Playing Coach - (T) iloveoov (T) Captain - Bul_T (P) AnomiA (Z) n.die_soo (Z) Hyuk (Z) s2 (Z) Thezerg (Z) Midas (T) Canata (T) Fantasy (T) BeSt (P) Bisu (P) ◆ Changes In: AnomiA (Z), n.die_soo (Z), Thezerg (Z) Out: GoRush (Z), Rumble (Z), MuJuK (P) Captain Change - GoRush (Z) > Bul_T (P) ▶ STX SouLDirector - Kim Eun Dong Coach - Jo Gyu Baek Coach - Park Jae Seok Captain - Hwasin (T) Notice (T) Last[fOu] (T) Bogus (T) July (Z) Calm (Z) by.hero (Z) Modesty[GsP] (Z) Kal (P) SoO (P) BestGod (P) YoonJoong (P) ◆ Changes In: Bogus (T) Out: ToSsGirL source
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Is it possible to edit team before deadline?
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United States7488 Posts
On November 29 2008 04:48 Initial_H.C, wrote:
Is it possible to edit team before deadline?
Yes, just PM me what you would like to change before the deadline.
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9070 Posts
meh I dont give a damn,my team will own the PL even with a handicap
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United States7488 Posts
The only discrepancy I see on the above list is that RorO is being added to the Samsung roster but wasn't removed from the WeMade roster.
nevermind.... the Roro being added to Samsung is a Terran player. So there are two different Roro's now... which is ridiculous.
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Stork 7
Sangho 6
Savior 5
Backho 5
Boxer 2
Gorush 1
TEAM: KAY TEE F
The Captain? This is an easy one BoxeR !!!
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Rock got pulled from the A-Team, there is a god.
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On November 29 2008 06:09 SingletonWilliam wrote:
Rock got pulled from the A-Team, there is a god.
He will be the first B - team to win the OSL next season .
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free[gm] (8) (Captain)
Jaedong (9)
Bisu (5)
By.Movie (3)
Anytime (1)
Casy (0)
Woongjin Stars (4)
Im updating my team to this i realized stork not been as hot in pl lately so switched him for bisu and took those 2 extra points to change midas into By.Movie, i did midas instead of anytime since because of skts terran depth and aces lack of options i think anytime will get more proleague playtime.
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On November 29 2008 06:09 SingletonWilliam wrote:
Rock got pulled from the A-Team, there is a god.
has to hurt to be a vet and be pulled from the A team
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Under 6 hours left to sign up!
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Wow, I'm really interested to see how far my 15 point team gets me, hehe
Lots of really well thought out lineups here, whereas mine is mostly ACE fanboyism.
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Team
5 Lecaf Oz
Captan
9 (T)Flash
Players
9 (Z)Jaedong
3 (P)Much
3 (P)By.Movie
1 (T)iloveoov
0 (T)Casy
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uh bisu is only 5 pnts u sure you dont mean Best or maby Free for your captain seat?
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3+8+5+5+7+4+4 = 30 now? I mean you could try to sneak by with 31, but I don't think SOG is gonna fall for a 36 point team. Although since Bisu is 5 points, that team is actually only 33 points. Still, try harder next time, and use a calculator if you need to. 
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On November 29 2008 10:26 LonelyMargarita wrote:3+8+5+5+7+4+4 = 30 now? I mean you could try to sneak by with 31, but I don't think SOG is gonna fall for a 36 point team. Although since Bisu is 5 points, that team is actually only 33 points. Still, try harder next time, and use a calculator if you need to.
lmao
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Team - Woongjin Stars
Stork (Captain)
Leta
Jangbi
Much
TheZerg
Anytime
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Samsung Khan 5
TheZerg 2
Tazza 2
Bisu 5
Light 4 (Captain)
Effort 5
Stork 7
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Heck, if others are gonna do it, I'll try too:
STX Soul (7)
Calm (4)
Flash (5)
Jaedong (7)
ZerO (0)
free (0)
Kal (3)
Total: 26
I just assumed their point values were the number of letters in their names, except that free was free and zero cost zero.
+ Show Spoiler [rant] +
Actually, my highest point pick was 5. I really think people picking 8 and 9 pointers don't understand how a fantasy league works. To do well, your players have to do BETTER than last season. Do you really think any of those players are gonna get 12 wins? There's only 11 matches in the round. On the other hand, someone like Anytime has to get 2 wins to be a good pick, and 3+ to be among the best. You want solid players that slumped last season or up-and-comers that are just now getting big. Unless of course you just want to pick your favorite players to be silly. Oh well....that's my rant.
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Team = KTF MagicNs
Stork - Team Captain (7)
JangBi (6)
Fantasy (5)
OversKy (4)
Boxer (2)
Kwanro (2)
Total = 30 points
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Braavos36372 Posts
On November 29 2008 10:51 LonelyMargarita wrote:Heck, if others are gonna do it, I'll try too: STX Soul (7) Calm (4) Flash (5) Jaedong (7) ZerO (0) free (0) Kal (3) Total: 26 I just assumed their point values were the number of letters in their names, except that free was free and zero cost zero. + Show Spoiler [rant] +
Actually, my highest point pick was 5. I really think people picking 8 and 9 pointers don't understand how a fantasy league works. To do well, your players have to do BETTER than last season. Do you really think any of those players are gonna get 12 wins? There's only 11 matches in the round. On the other hand, someone like Anytime has to get 2 wins to be a good pick, and 3+ to be among the best. You want solid players that slumped last season or up-and-comers that are just now getting big. Unless of course you just want to pick your favorite players to be silly. Oh well....that's my rant.
lol you are like completely opposite of what is going to work this season for fantasy
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United States7488 Posts
On November 29 2008 10:26 LonelyMargarita wrote:3+8+5+5+7+4+4 = 30 now? I mean you could try to sneak by with 31, but I don't think SOG is gonna fall for a 36 point team. Although since Bisu is 5 points, that team is actually only 33 points. Still, try harder next time, and use a calculator if you need to.
Heh... a 31 point team won't be able to get by me even. Already found a couple.
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
remember the epic fail'ness of my MSL team? lol I hardly followed any rules hahahah
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(6) jangbi (Captain)
(4) by.great
(7) stork
(5) bisu
(1) anytime
(4) light
(3) SK Telecom T1
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3 Lions
United States3705 Posts
my original PM had a team that was 31 pts. cuz I mistakened Flash for 8 instead of 9. Will my new corrected team that I PM'd to you still count Semi?
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United States7488 Posts
On November 29 2008 12:45 3 Lions wrote:
my original PM had a team that was 31 pts. cuz I mistakened Flash for 8 instead of 9. Will my new corrected team that I PM'd to you still count Semi?
Yes. Any corrections sent to me before deadline will be made.
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On November 29 2008 10:51 LonelyMargarita wrote:+ Show Spoiler [rant] +
Actually, my highest point pick was 5. I really think people picking 8 and 9 pointers don't understand how a fantasy league works. To do well, your players have to do BETTER than last season. Do you really think any of those players are gonna get 12 wins? There's only 11 matches in the round. On the other hand, someone like Anytime has to get 2 wins to be a good pick, and 3+ to be among the best. You want solid players that slumped last season or up-and-comers that are just now getting big. Unless of course you just want to pick your favorite players to be silly. Oh well....that's my rant.
No offense, but you haven't done the math.
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SK Telecom T1-3
1.(Z)Thezerg-2pts- Capt.
2.(Z)OversKy-4pts
3.(P)Bisu-5pts
4.(Z)Kwanro-2pts
5.(Z)Saint-7pts
6.(P)Stork-7pts
Team TheZerg- Plz go nuts in proleague.
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United States7488 Posts
Only about 30 minutes left to get your submissions in
Currently at 197 Total Entries.
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How do I get you to recongize my team, if posting here okay. Sorry but I wasn't clear from the instructions, any response is appriciated
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United States7488 Posts
On November 29 2008 13:30 n.DieJokes wrote:
How do I get you to recongize my team, if posting here okay. Sorry but I wasn't clear from the instructions, any response is appriciated
PM me you team. (Rule #5)
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On November 29 2008 13:27 n.DieJokes wrote:
SK Telecom T1-3
1.(Z)Thezerg-2pts- Capt.
2.(Z)OversKy-4pts
3.(P)Bisu-5pts
4.(Z)Kwanro-2pts
5.(Z)Saint-7pts
6.(P)Stork-7pts
Team TheZerg- Plz go nuts in proleague.
you don't have a terran.
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Good catch, my bad thank you
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Samsung Khan
stork
Frozean
Luxury
Nada
Fantasy
Boxer
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United States7488 Posts
CONTEST IS NOW CLOSED
Any team submission received beyond this point will not be accepted. There were 207 Teams entered. Good Luck to you all!
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United States7166 Posts
ah so my submission @ 14:23 is invalid then? doh..
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Well I got 3 points for 815 showing up and winning, so that's a good start.
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Melbourne5338 Posts
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Braavos36372 Posts
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5 (P)Bisu (Captain)
8 (P)Best
8 (P)free[gm]
1 (P)Anytime
2 (Z)Thezerg
2 (T)RuBy
3 SK Telecom T1
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PLEASE ZERO KICK STORKS ASS.
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CAPTAIN
8 firebathero
5 EffOrt
5 Bisu
5 Sea
4 July
3 Much
0 ToSsGirL
lol I made this team with no real knowledge of stats or anything. Oh, and Tossgirl is my ace snipe for the likes of Flash and Luxury (who lose their ace matches whenever I check...).
and i wonder if this is on time or not...
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On November 29 2008 17:46 xxsaznpride wrote:CAPTAIN8 firebathero5 EffOrt5 Bisu5 Sea4 July3 Much0 ToSsGirLlol I made this team with no real knowledge of stats or anything. Oh, and Tossgirl is my ace snipe for the likes of Flash and Luxury (who lose their ace matches whenever I check...). and i wonder if this is on time or not...
u picked no team and too many players
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God dammit... I missed the part Where teams were mandatory.
CAPTAIN
8 firebathero
5 EffOrt
5 Bisu
4 July
3 Much
0 ToSsGirL
0 sKyHigh
TEAM
5 Lecaf Oz
edit: Where is a player...?
- 3 PMs to SOG
one with my mistaken lineup, one with no text whatsoever because only pros use "enter" as their "tab", and the third with the correct stuff.
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On November 29 2008 14:01 semioldguy wrote:CONTEST IS NOW CLOSED Any team submission received beyond this point will not be accepted. There were 207 Teams entered. Good Luck to you all!
Sorry bro read the full thread before posting.
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On November 29 2008 17:35 GGQ wrote:
my team's got 8 points!
Hehe mine got 9 yet :D
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3 Lions
United States3705 Posts
lol i just got 13 pts. from the KTF vs Wemade game alone ^^
+ Show Spoiler +Mind: in lineup, won, ace match appearance, lost -> 4 points
Luxury: in lineup, lost, ace match appearance, won -> 4 points
Flash: In lineup, won -> 3 points
KTF win, KTF win -> 2 points
4+4+3+2=13 points
right?
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On November 29 2008 13:01 traced wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2008 10:51 LonelyMargarita wrote:+ Show Spoiler [rant] +
Actually, my highest point pick was 5. I really think people picking 8 and 9 pointers don't understand how a fantasy league works. To do well, your players have to do BETTER than last season. Do you really think any of those players are gonna get 12 wins? There's only 11 matches in the round. On the other hand, someone like Anytime has to get 2 wins to be a good pick, and 3+ to be among the best. You want solid players that slumped last season or up-and-comers that are just now getting big. Unless of course you just want to pick your favorite players to be silly. Oh well....that's my rant.
No offense, but you haven't done the math.
No offense, but I have. I computed every player's stats and score for round one. You CANNOT make large gains if you are an expensive player. They are the most expensive because they performed the best last round. Take 9 points for flash: He went 10-4, including a SEVEN game streak, FOUR ace matches, and 2 broken streaks. Sure, he averages the best at 5 earned points/cost, but the average player is still like 4.5 earned points/cost. With 11 matches in the round, it's actually quite unlikely he'll even get 14 games next round, and in the best case scenario he might win 12 and get the same streak and ace matches - and then he's earned 5.67 points/cost...AT BEST. Then take Anytime. Like Flash, he also should play in almost every match, since he's notably better than anyone else of his race on his team. So say he gets 9 appearances...I'm betting he'll win at least 3. His team gets him another 1-2 points, and he's earned 11 points per cost. I also used 5 point players that should also play in basically every match. Say Bisu goes out ten times plus an ace match. If he plays even close to his MSL play, he's getting 8 -9 wins, plus his team will earn at least 2-3 points more than last season for him, plus he'll more than likely play an ace, get a streak, and break a streak. Oh look, 37/5 = 7.4 points earned per cost. With the 6 player limit you obviously can't solely go based on that ratio though. Expected point differential also makes the 8-9 pointers unlikely to perform though, especially considering you need a 0-1 point player for each big player you have (and besides anytime and midas, the 0-1s would have to come out of nowhere to earn anything - midas majorly slumped and anytime was in basic training, so didn't get any games). Even without dividing by cost, the 9 pointers realistically can't earn more than 7 points more than last season, and to do that they'd need about a 90% win rate with a 6+ game streak....unlikely since no one did it this season. Taking my slumping players: if they come out of their proleague slumps, they're easily getting 2+ more wins, an additional streak, and then they get more ace matches and more chances to improve by 3-4 wins over last season. Looking at it the opposite way, if an 8 pointer like ZerO suddenly realizes he's like 100th in KeSPA and plays a bit better than the average player with 5 wins, he's earning 15 points less than last season. A 5 point player would have to get 1 win on the season to do that much worse than last season. The only way I see someone with big hitters winning is if they choose the only 2 really solid ones (Jaedong and Flash) in hopes they will do the exact same as last round, but also choose guys like Anytime, sKyHigh, TheZerg, and maybe a couple like pepe and movie, and then ALL their 4 low-pointers pull off 5 win rounds (and SKT gets 10 more than last season).
This isn't like the MSL Fantasy league, where the guy who earned the most last season is a great deal if he repeats, since the best player earns double the points of the second best, yet only costs 1 point more. Here every player that played has been given a cost to be as close to 5 earned points per cost point without going over. There are no "great deals" (besides the Anytime anomaly), just up-and-comers and slumping legends. Because of the luck involved, the winner is going to have every person on his team do the same or better. Obviously I'm not saying someone following my choosing theory will win. If a zero pointer other than sKyHigh pulls off a 6 win season, even a mediocre team with him on it could easily win. I bet teams like mine will be more consistently near the top ranked teams though, because I believe it is statistically the better strategy. Instead of 3-4 players who can make large gains, I have 6.
Oh yeah, and my strategy was to choose mid-costing players (a mix of slumping legends and up-and-comers) that should all play in at least 9 games next round due to the balance of their teams. So they not only have room for notable improvement (e.g. winning 3-4 more games than last season), but they also are pretty much guaranteed the opportunity based on the other players of their race on their teams. Their potential gains are improved even more with the fact that if they start improving, they could go up to 11-14 game appearances, adding a couple more wins, and a couple ace match points too.
+ Show Spoiler +And I can pretty much guarantee my team won't win, because I purposely chose 3 of my 5 favorite players...the ones that were closest to fitting in with my strategy.
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Braavos36372 Posts
what's your team margarita?
also, in your calculations are you factoring in that a lot of the big hitters point per cost are lower but their risk is also lower? it's pretty safe to assume flash and jaedong will earn lots of appearances, ace matches, and win points, and other more "speculative" players could kill your team if they underperform badly. the higher point value players like jaedong, stork, free, kal etc have a lesser chance of disappointing given their frequency and consistency in PL.
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is awesome32269 Posts
It's ok, onl thing Margarita needs to win is ACE not to lose 3-0 every round and Anytime to get aces (how many times did ACE get to ace?).
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I got 18 pts from yesterday's games, if i counted correctly
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Braavos36372 Posts
On November 30 2008 02:19 (paladin)roMAD wrote:
I got 18 pts from yesterday's games, if i counted correctly
lol fuck
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Braavos36372 Posts
18 is nuts
Woongjin +5 (3-0)
Luxury +5 (+1 lineup, +1 team win, +2 ace, +2 ace win, -1 loss)
Mind +4 (+1 lineup, +2 regular win, +2 ace, -1 loss)
GGplay +4 (+1 lineup, +2 regular win, +1 team win)
Bisu (pending)
Jangbi (pending)
Anytime (pending)
averaged 4.5 pp/appearance which is NUTS considering getting a win and team win is only +4, which is about the best you can expect out of anyone in any given week and you're averaging higher than that hahhahaha
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United States7488 Posts
On November 30 2008 02:19 (paladin)roMAD wrote:
I got 18 pts from yesterday's games, if i counted correctly
Yes, you counted correctly and you're in the lead after day 1 :p
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I wonder how teams with more small point players will do against teams that have maybe 2-3 bigger point players. I was thinking about going with this team but I opted out of it:
3 (P)By.Movie
4 (Z)July
4 (Z)GGPlay
4 (T)Mind
5 (P)Bisu
6 (P)JangBi
4 Woongjin Stars
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Kennigit
Canada19447 Posts
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16952 Posts
On November 29 2008 18:03 xxsaznpride wrote:God dammit... I missed the part Where teams were mandatory. CAPTAIN8 firebathero5 EffOrt5 Bisu4 July3 Much0 ToSsGirL0 sKyHighTEAM 5 Lecaf Ozedit: Where is a player...? - 3 PMs to SOG one with my mistaken lineup, one with no text whatsoever because only pros use "enter" as their "tab", and the third with the correct stuff.
Haha, you still have too many players and the signups were already closed, regardless.
Anyway, I'm hoping next round I do better, but then again, what else can you do when you didn't pick your players based on stats
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I can't believe I missed this. Oh well, I guess I will post a team just for fun to see how I would have done. Also, I'm glad the captain idea was adopted for the fantasy league.
9 Jaedong (Captain)
5 Bisu
4 by.great
3 Modesty
2 Kwanro
2 FrOzean
5 Lecaf OZ
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On November 29 2008 12:53 traced wrote:lol now you're at 29
Yeah so? =) 1 spare point. big deal?
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#semioldguy
Did you get my final team update? I think i sent you 2 that were a bit off ^^;;
Sorry about that.
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United States7488 Posts
On November 30 2008 04:48 WindOw wrote:
#semioldguy
Did you get my final team update? I think i sent you 2 that were a bit off ^^;;
Sorry about that.
If it came in before the deadline, then yes, I've got the final version you sent.
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8 points for me last night thanks to free and woongjin, not a bad start
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So is semioldguy scoring this? Or do we keep track individually or what?
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United States7488 Posts
On November 30 2008 05:25 Kuja900 wrote:
So is semioldguy scoring this? Or do we keep track individually or what?
yes, I am keeping track along with Hot_Bid. There is actually a R&S thread that Hot_Bid posted that will be kept frequently up to date.
I will be coming out with weekly comprehensive results in addition to the work done in that thread.
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On November 30 2008 00:58 LonelyMargarita wrote:post post
Okay so you did some math.
You overlooked important things, though.
1- Projecting the high end. We both had Flash at greater than 5 points per dollar. The thing is, Flash, Jaedong, Stork, and Best are more likely to keep a > 5ppd, whereas guys like Calm and Pusan are not. Flash, Jaedong, and Best, though I didn't do the math for the previous season, have similar stats last season. They're consistently elite, and their point output is likely to be similar. Calm and Pusan may perform just as well, but they are less likely to.
2- Predicted points per dollar is greatest at the highest end and lowest end. $1 players may not necessarily be worth it. I had Anytime anywhere from a 3-9 point value. $0 players are. Because...
3- $0 players give you 5-10+ points for free. Each one essentially make your other players worth more points per dollar. The important factor here is team wins. SkyHigh and Han benefit from 1 lineup appearance already, which projects for 1-2 points, in addition to their 5 points from team wins. Also, simply appearing in the lineup once makes it more likely for them to appear in the lineup again. Shuttle is also a decent pick because STX will likely win 6 or more games, and he is a candidate to make an appearance or two. I'm sure there are others.
4- $3-4 players all have lower ppd than the highest and lowest end. I had them consistently anywhere from 3-4.5 ppd. Then they share a synthesis flaw:
5- Though a few (Bisu) $5 players are worth more ppd than the highest end, all of them force you to take a $3 or $4 player. There are even more good $6 values, but they force you to take a $2 or $3 player. Flash or Jaedong plus Han or SkyHigh is simply more valuable than any combo you can create. Remember, you're buying consistency - Flash and Jaedong are very likely to repeat performances - some $3 or $4 WILL outvalue them this season, but at this point you cannot project any individual to, if you understand what I mean.
6- Most people overlooked this one. Teams just score less points per dollar than players. It is actually more efficient to choose a $3 team that wins 4 games over a $4 that wins 6 games, because the extra dollar in players makes up the difference and then some. That SKT will probably go at least .500 this season makes them the obvious choice.
My lineup is Jaedong, Flash, Stork, Thezerg, Han, and Skyhigh. I'm projecting my players for a combined >5 ppd (without factoring in SKT).
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I said it before in here, but if you're trying to calculate player's worth like this you should take into account how often they will be sent into an ace matchup and their chance to win it. This is why I think Flash is one of, if not the best, pick up. KTF takes nearly every match to ace and Flash plays once, wins, and gives you three points. Then he is selected for the ace match, wins again, and you get team win points. So while Stork might be a ballerific player, he is on an incredibly stacked team where he isn't going to get 2 matches a day. I think Jaedong is more likely to get 2 matches a day than stork, but his team is decent enough to where they don't take everything to ace. Just my two cents anyways, this is the first fantasy league I've ever done.
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9070 Posts
I'm all-in with SKT. I think they will make a comeback
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Braavos36372 Posts
On November 30 2008 06:33 SingletonWilliam wrote:
I said it before in here, but if you're trying to calculate player's worth like this you should take into account how often they will be sent into an ace matchup and their chance to win it. This is why I think Flash is one of, if not the best, pick up. KTF takes nearly every match to ace and Flash plays once, wins, and gives you three points. Then he is selected for the ace match, wins again, and you get team win points. So while Stork might be a ballerific player, he is on an incredibly stacked team where he isn't going to get 2 matches a day. I think Jaedong is more likely to get 2 matches a day than stork, but his team is decent enough to where they don't take everything to ace. Just my two cents anyways, this is the first fantasy league I've ever done.
this is already factored into the player point values though, that's why jaedong is 9, flash is 9, and stork is 7, its already taking into account their ace values from last season
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Braavos36372 Posts
On November 30 2008 06:01 traced wrote:
6- Most people overlooked this one. Teams just score less points per dollar than players. It is actually more efficient to choose a $3 team that wins 4 games over a $4 that wins 6 games, because the extra dollar in players makes up the difference and then some. That SKT will probably go at least .500 this season makes them the obvious choice.
I agree with you on the High/Low combination of players being best, but not on the "SKT is obvious choice." For just one more point, you get Woongjin or CJ, who are far, far more likely to win 3-1 or 3-0 than SKT, who loses often and almost never sweeps due to their lineup being loaded at the Best/Bisu end and shitty at the Zerg end. They almost always drop one game or two.
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All stats are reset for the second round of play correct? What I want to know is if a streak would continue through from round one, especially since GGPlay is doing very well for himself right now. I am sure this has been asked before, but forgive my stoned ass and help a brother out :D
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Braavos36372 Posts
On November 30 2008 08:51 SpiralArchitect wrote:
All stats are reset for the second round of play correct? What I want to know is if a streak would continue through from round one, especially since GGPlay is doing very well for himself right now. I am sure this has been asked before, but forgive my stoned ass and help a brother out :D
while we could've pro-rated the current streaks players were on into the player costs, i don't think semi accounted for already existing streak value, so i would assume all streak statistics are now reset, but wait for semi to make the official call
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On November 30 2008 08:05 Hot_Bid wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2008 06:33 SingletonWilliam wrote:
I said it before in here, but if you're trying to calculate player's worth like this you should take into account how often they will be sent into an ace matchup and their chance to win it. This is why I think Flash is one of, if not the best, pick up. KTF takes nearly every match to ace and Flash plays once, wins, and gives you three points. Then he is selected for the ace match, wins again, and you get team win points. So while Stork might be a ballerific player, he is on an incredibly stacked team where he isn't going to get 2 matches a day. I think Jaedong is more likely to get 2 matches a day than stork, but his team is decent enough to where they don't take everything to ace. Just my two cents anyways, this is the first fantasy league I've ever done. this is already factored into the player point values though, that's why jaedong is 9, flash is 9, and stork is 7, its already taking into account their ace values from last season
That was directed at LonelyMargarita and traced, sorry for any confusion. It was just a general statement about picking players to be on your team.
I can't wait to see how trading works out in this league too.
Edit: Can anyone repost the link to those excel sheets that were posted earlier? I looked through the thread but I didn't see them.
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wtf i just noticed this thread and contest is already over
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I may have undervalued Anytime, but consider:
Anytime has not played since the beginning of June.
He has not played well since February.
Players get worse when they play for ACE.
I dunno, maybe with Reach and Casy and Oversky he'll have proper practice partners and be okay this season. Tough to say.
Hot_Bid - that's a valid point, but the problem is there isn't much point separation amongst the teams. 3-0, 3-1, 3-2 is deceptive - not many teams win or lose 3-0 except ACE, and games go to ace 4/7 times. Even though SKT were only 4-7 and ALL of their wins came from aces, they were only something like 6 or 7 points behind the teams you mentioned, I believe. Because you can fill the extra point with a 5-6 point per dollar player, if you project SKT for even one more win, or even two more non-ace wins, they become just as cost effective or more than the teams you mentioned. Of course maybe you just think they really are a 4-7 team.
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Braavos36372 Posts
anytime is going to pay for his value in one week haha
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United States10774 Posts
if bisu beat calm and calm was on a 3 game winning streak, does it count as 1 point?
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On November 30 2008 16:07 OneOther wrote:
if bisu beat calm and calm was on a 3 game winning streak, does it count as 1 point?
No, all streaks started when the deadline ended.
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United States7488 Posts
On November 30 2008 08:53 Hot_Bid wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2008 08:51 SpiralArchitect wrote:
All stats are reset for the second round of play correct? What I want to know is if a streak would continue through from round one, especially since GGPlay is doing very well for himself right now. I am sure this has been asked before, but forgive my stoned ass and help a brother out :D while we could've pro-rated the current streaks players were on into the player costs, i don't think semi accounted for already existing streak value, so i would assume all streak statistics are now reset, but wait for semi to make the official call
All streak values are reset. The reason is to put all players on equal footing at the start of the game.
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Hungary11261 Posts
I have a question, sorry if it has been answered, and maybe it is a bit late to question the rules.
What is the logic behind giving points for appearance in the lineup?
The point is this. If a player is fielded and loses, he loses his LU point again and gives you 0 points in total.
If a player wins, he gains 3 points, 2 for win, 1 for lineup.
So why even value lineup and not give "3 points per win" and "0 if they are not on the lineup or lose their game"?
Normally I would think you want to reward players even making the lineup, but currently it only happens if they win, else they are +-0.
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Braavos36372 Posts
I think that's exactly the logic, you get rewarded for making the lineup, it means your player is good.
Your alternate classification is just a different way to show the scoring, which really is +3 per win and 0 for a loss. You can do this for a lot o fthings, for example Ace appearance can be reclassified as +1 appearance and +1 ace bonus, which is the same as just +2 ace appearance.
Also, they don't have to win to get rewarded, if your player is the 4th game and the match doesn't progress that far (3-0 win or 0-3 loss) he still gets +1 for being scheduled to play.
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Hungary11261 Posts
On December 01 2008 07:31 Hot_Bid wrote:
I think that's exactly the logic, you get rewarded for making the lineup, it means your player is good.
Your alternate classification is just a different way to show the scoring, which really is +3 per win and 0 for a loss. You can do this for a lot o fthings, for example Ace appearance can be reclassified as +1 appearance and +1 ace bonus, which is the same as just +2 ace appearance.
Also, they don't have to win to get rewarded, if your player is the 4th game and the match doesn't progress that far (3-0 win or 0-3 loss) he still gets +1 for being scheduled to play.
The case of "being scheduled game 4 but not getting to play" is interesting, but right now it's the only (and comparably rare) case where making the lineup is rewarded. Apart from that, players who are not played at all and players who make the lineup and lose are not treated differently.
Of course it's too late to change the rules now (people picked based on rules), but removing the -1 for losing appears like the most logical to me to introduce proper differentiation.
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Braavos36372 Posts
why should the -1 be removed? i don't understand
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Hungary11261 Posts
On December 01 2008 08:02 Hot_Bid wrote:
why should the -1 be removed? i don't understand
Right now: No differentiation between {making the lineup and losing} and {not making the lineup}.
a) 0 if not in lineup
b) 0 if in lineup and lose
c) 3 if in lineup and win
As you stated, you want to reward players if they are being put into the lineup, compared to not being considered at all.
So the logical step would be to remove the -1, so players are worth in points:
a) 0 if not in lineup
b) 1 if in lineup and lose
c) 3 if in lineup and win
Thus creating a difference between the cases a) and b).
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Braavos36372 Posts
On December 01 2008 08:12 Aesop wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2008 08:02 Hot_Bid wrote:
why should the -1 be removed? i don't understand Right now: No differentiation between { making the lineup and losing} and { not making the lineup}. a) 0 if not in lineup b) 0 if in lineup and lose c) 3 if in lineup and win As you stated, you want to reward players if they are being put into the lineup, compared to not being considered at all. So the logical step would be to remove the -1, so players are worth in points: a) 0 if not in lineup b) 1 if in lineup and lose c) 3 if in lineup and win Thus creating a difference between the cases a) and b).
a) and b) are not the same, in a) you have no chance for win points and b) you have an opportunity to get a win. that's real value even if it doesn't necessarily show up on the score sheet, and a significant difference than not being in the lineup at all, which is guaranteed no points (save for team wins).
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On December 01 2008 04:23 semioldguy wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2008 08:53 Hot_Bid wrote:On November 30 2008 08:51 SpiralArchitect wrote:
All stats are reset for the second round of play correct? What I want to know is if a streak would continue through from round one, especially since GGPlay is doing very well for himself right now. I am sure this has been asked before, but forgive my stoned ass and help a brother out :D while we could've pro-rated the current streaks players were on into the player costs, i don't think semi accounted for already existing streak value, so i would assume all streak statistics are now reset, but wait for semi to make the official call All streak values are reset. The reason is to put all players on equal footing at the start of the game.
KK thank you.
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On November 30 2008 06:01 traced wrote:Okay so you did some math. You overlooked important things, though. 1- Projecting the high end. We both had Flash at greater than 5 points per dollar. The thing is, Flash, Jaedong, Stork, and Best are more likely to keep a > 5ppd, whereas guys like Calm and Pusan are not. Flash, Jaedong, and Best, though I didn't do the math for the previous season, have similar stats last season. They're consistently elite, and their point output is likely to be similar. Calm and Pusan may perform just as well, but they are less likely to. 2- Predicted points per dollar is greatest at the highest end and lowest end. $1 players may not necessarily be worth it. I had Anytime anywhere from a 3-9 point value. $0 players are. Because... 3- $0 players give you 5-10+ points for free. Each one essentially make your other players worth more points per dollar. The important factor here is team wins. SkyHigh and Han benefit from 1 lineup appearance already, which projects for 1-2 points, in addition to their 5 points from team wins. Also, simply appearing in the lineup once makes it more likely for them to appear in the lineup again. Shuttle is also a decent pick because STX will likely win 6 or more games, and he is a candidate to make an appearance or two. I'm sure there are others. 4- $3-4 players all have lower ppd than the highest and lowest end. I had them consistently anywhere from 3-4.5 ppd. Then they share a synthesis flaw: 5- Though a few (Bisu) $5 players are worth more ppd than the highest end, all of them force you to take a $3 or $4 player. There are even more good $6 values, but they force you to take a $2 or $3 player. Flash or Jaedong plus Han or SkyHigh is simply more valuable than any combo you can create. Remember, you're buying consistency - Flash and Jaedong are very likely to repeat performances - some $3 or $4 WILL outvalue them this season, but at this point you cannot project any individual to, if you understand what I mean. 6- Most people overlooked this one. Teams just score less points per dollar than players. It is actually more efficient to choose a $3 team that wins 4 games over a $4 that wins 6 games, because the extra dollar in players makes up the difference and then some. That SKT will probably go at least .500 this season makes them the obvious choice. My lineup is Jaedong, Flash, Stork, Thezerg, Han, and Skyhigh. I'm projecting my players for a combined >5 ppd (without factoring in SKT).
1) Flash was exactly 5 pt/dollar. He also had the most wins of any player, the most ace appearances, and the longest streak. He was the absolute best performing player in round 1, and among the best for any player of any season since proleague has been around. And you're trying to argue he's not only going to improve, but by enough to end up at a greater points/cost than 5 point players that improve. Combine the fact that 8-9 pointers have the greatest potential to underperform last season with the fact that they have the least room for improvement, and I don't see anyone winning with them. It's much more likely a 6-7 pointer will perform as well as last season's 9 pointers, and that strategy could win. Stork and Jangbi I think are the best bets, but I didn't like that strategy quite as much, so I didn't spend much time on it.
2-3) Anytime is a MUCH better choice than any zero point player. Why? a) He's a better, more experienced player overall and more importantly (pending something really weird), b) He will play in AT LEAST 9 games. I'm guessing he'll play in 11 because of an ace match or two. He's ace's best player of any race, multiple maps already favor his race, and he's the new star of the team (fandom wise). He will not get as many team points as any zero pointer on any team besides ace or estro. But why are zero pointers zero points? Because they played zero games last round. Coach wouldn't even try them on TV once. The best performing zero pointer will likely win 3 games in 5 appearances, and that's one guy out of the whole pool of 0s. sKyhigh is the best bet, especially if Iris slumps. But if he loses his 1st game, there's a decent chance he won't get more than 1 or 2 more tries. CJ will likely play 2 zerg in 9+ matches, and Iris will get most the terran slots, meaning a likely 5 appearance best possible situation for sKyHigh (bear in mind CJ just moved azang onto the roster as well). I'll take Anytime's 11 over sKyhigh's possible 5 anytime for 1 more point.
4) I don't have any 3-4 pointers, nor do I have any 2 pointers or 6+ pointers. I have anytime and five 5 pointers. This was the basis of my strategy, as I briefly outlined. And I think your math may be off: I got that 3 pointers were about 4.33 pt/dollar, and 4 pointers were about 4.56 pt/dollar (beating or tying 5-, 6-, and 7-pointers). Besides Anytime, Midas, Thezerg, by.hero, Firefist, Movie, and Much, I feel all 1-3 pointers were bad. There were a few possibly good 4 pointers, including GGPlay, Oversky, and Mind. I thought anytime was a better pick than midas, didn't have room for a 2 pointer in the team I chose, and found there was always a 5 pointer better than a 4 pointer of the same race. As for much and movie, it's too much of a risk that they'll split the games (especially with jjonga joining the roster); compound it with the fact that toss is CJ's weakest race, and that's likely a maximum 4-6 appearances each.
5) Like I said, I have Anytime and then all 5-pointers. No 3s, no 2s, not even any 4s, 6s, 7s, 8s, or 9s. I don't know why you'd mathematically think 5 pointers then require 2-3 pointers, unless you assumed everyone chose STX for their team. STX was a very bad team choice. CJ, Stars, and SKT were the good choices. And your next point is the exact opposite of how fantasy leagues work. You are absolutely not buying consistency if you want even a remote chance at winning. Buying consistency will get you an average-below average team in the final standings (since the average person's team will probably beat the average points/team using last rounds stats just based on making decent picks). If you want to win, you are betting on not only improvement, but noted improvement. You want a team where EVERY SINGLE PLAYER can get 3 more wins than last season. As soon as you buy a 8-9 point player, it's absolutely impossible that will happen. No one's going to win 13 games in round 2. It would be the greatest proleague performance by any player in any proleague ever. The winning team will probably have an average improvement of more than 2.5 wins/player. Although there's a small chance someone could win with Flash or Jaedong on their roster, it will likely be because of a dark horse 0 pointer getting 5+ wins. Not sKyHigh, han, or young, but someone on only a couple people's teams.
And not projecting a low-value player to improve? This is a gambling game. You have to gamble to win. Like I said, mathematically you have no room to improve with high-pointers. If every player can move up or down a maximum of 4 points from last season with a maximum of 10 (the best season any player has ever had), the most potential comes from a team with all players of 6 or fewer points. They also have the most potential to get last (since 6 5 point players could all be 1 point players next season), but you need the potential to win or you'll just finish average.
6) On average, yes: Average team is 4.21 pt/dollar and average player listed was about 4.41 pt/dollar. Average also includes Ace though, and going by the average is pointless, since you can pick out the winners and losers. CJ Entus outscored any player last round with 5.25 pt/dollar, and with their lineup as the most well-rounded team they could easily be the best team in round 2. If their 0-3 loss had gone 1-3, they'd have actually scored the most before factoring in the +4 for overall round winner. SKT has the most potential for improvement, but are so lopsided with 2 powerhouse Protoss players and not much else. Since 3-0s and 3-1s are worth so much, they won't be the best team next round, but could be a decent value. Woongjin could also be great if a Terran steps up on the team and balances them out.
***
Basically, your strategy could be described by words like "average," "consistency," and "risk-free." And that's just what I expect will happen. Your team will do about as well as last season, but gain a few points over the mathematical average because of the 0 pointers. The only chance you have at winning is a 10 win season by stork, and a huge season by thezerg, along with flash and jaedong continuing their unlikely 10 win seasons. You can't gain on skyhigh and han because too many people have them on their roster. You'll probably finish between 50 and 100 out of the 200+ entries. The guy who wins will likely have a similar strategy to quite a few people near the bottom, because he'll have lots of room for improvement on all players, but also lots of room for them to do worse. You can't win without risk.
My strategy combined maximizing potential gain stat-wise with maximizing appearances. All my players will play in at least 7 games, and they should all play in 9+ games. I don't see how anyone can argue that this is a bad strategy, unless you think the object of the game is to do average. There's nothing lost for coming in last place, but there is reward for coming in 1st, so all that matters is winning. You don't get points for being above average. My team should have a decent chance at finishing in the top 20, but also a decent chance at being in the bottom 50. The risk balances out, and most people following my strat will finish around average, but I think more than likely the winner will have followed it. We'll see in about 6 weeks.
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United States7488 Posts
On December 01 2008 08:12 Aesop wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2008 08:02 Hot_Bid wrote:
why should the -1 be removed? i don't understand Right now: No differentiation between { making the lineup and losing} and { not making the lineup}. a) 0 if not in lineup b) 0 if in lineup and lose c) 3 if in lineup and win As you stated, you want to reward players if they are being put into the lineup, compared to not being considered at all. So the logical step would be to remove the -1, so players are worth in points: a) 0 if not in lineup b) 1 if in lineup and lose c) 3 if in lineup and win Thus creating a difference between the cases a) and b).
As Hot_Bid mentioned... the difference is the player got the opportunity to get more points. It then is the player's responsibility to win to earn points. The point for appearance is there not to benefit players that lose, but so that a player who didn't get a chance to play and win could still be worth something.
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On December 01 2008 12:53 LonelyMargarita wrote:---
First issue - you're confusing risk with variance. You described your strategy as "gambling," which is appropriate; your build buys variance at a loss of value, ie. typical gambling. You can still have a variant team without sacrificing value. You say you're more likely to finish in the top 20 or bottom 50 than me, most likely to finish 50-100. It's more realistic to project my likely range anywhere from 20-100 with a 60 mean, while yours 20-150 with an 85 mean. Though honestly both of us are just guessing.
Second issue - you based a lot of your entire argument on my use of the word "consistency," which was my mistake in phrasing. Regression-resistant is a more appropriate term. My point was, basically, Jaedong and Flash are both consistently the highest scoring players in proleague per dollar, and least likely to regress back to the mean.
Third issue - mainly because I used "consistency" to describe Flash and Jaedong, you conclude my entire team is "consistent" and "average" and "risk-free." SkyHigh, Han, and TheZerg are all players with a high degree of positive variance. Stork is relatively variant, especially considering he's a high value player. And we agree SKT is probably the most variant team, other than ACE.
It doesn't matter that quite a few people have the $high/$high/$high/$1$2/$0/$0 build. Player choice and lineup synthesis will be more than enough to distinguish teams and create a significant spread.
Fourth issue - You say "We'll see in 6 weeks," as if the final standing will prove everything... Come on. We're arguing over statistical theory, we both know result-oriented analysis is useless. The hypothetical 14 point team in the results thread is a perfect example. The final standings will prove very little - only the art of our debate can determine a clear winner
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United States7488 Posts
On November 30 2008 06:01 traced wrote:
6- Most people overlooked this one. Teams just score less points per dollar than players. It is actually more efficient to choose a $3 team that wins 4 games over a $4 that wins 6 games, because the extra dollar in players makes up the difference and then some. That SKT will probably go at least .500 this season makes them the obvious choice.
Actually teams were priced based on the same point output ratio as players. So any player worth 5 points scored more total points in round one than any team worth 4 or less points
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