EPTBot on ladder - Page 5
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RowdierBob
Australia13498 Posts
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Dante08
Singapore4181 Posts
On September 19 2026 21:21 TMNT wrote: I saw a game between Pluto and Paralyze on Odyssey. This is like their 6th or 7th game already so Paralyze fully knew what kind of "player" he was dealing with. Once again the bot dismantled him with MM and Tanks on 2 bases. I think the map hack does play a role though. The MM Tanks army was CONSTANTLY moving around the map at a level I dont even think human team melee is possible. Protoss couldn't find any good angle to fight. Surely knowing the movement of your opposition's army all the time plays a role in the bot's army movement? Yeah it'll be interesting to see how it does without maphack, but this is still quite impressive in its current form. But it's not too surprising if it wrecks humans given it has an insane APM and multi-tasking advantage. Would be more interested to see how it fares if you limit its APM and multi-tasking ability (e.g. it can only action items it sees on the screen like humans). | ||
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vesicular
United States1311 Posts
Certainly if it's using some level of cheats that's lame, but watching some of these games it feels like it's basically just winning with micro. | ||
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StRyKeR
United States1743 Posts
For the purpose of human vs AI, I wrote a post on the other thread in this forum about formalizing the rules that we expect the AI to follow. Obviously, not map hacking is one of them. Indefinite worker stack, money hacks, mineral walking without vision of minerals, etc. are some other obvious ones. A subtle one is z-ordering, which I believe is a crucial game constraint. It's what allows Zerg to buy time versus Irradiate by stacking Lurkers, as you can only target one of them at a time. It's also what allows Tanks to be hidden under Engineering Bays against the Spawn Broodlings spell. I highly agree with the competition organizer's restrictions as well: "While there is no limit to how fast a bot can run, we do place limits on how slowly a bot can run, after all it is a real-time strategy game. The main rule for the competition is that a bot is not allowed to have too many individual frames that exceed a specific amount of computational time." In effect, this limitation forces the AI to prioritize the actions it takes instead of just "do it all". It probably also naturally limits their APM. Very reasonable to me. | ||
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TT1
Canada10072 Posts
it keeps the game organized/easier to manage by staying on 2 bases and bio + tank is a very strong comp to max out on, mainly cus bio is 1 supply and it's moving/attacking perfectly while locking down with ghosts (low cost utility vs tech which bio supposed to be weak on "paper" for humans if theyre microing that comp) but this was pretty easy to guess on our own too  , terran requires the fewest expos out of all the races so having them execute/iterate a bio tank ghost style as best as it can is the best bang for your buck in terms of basic/simple execution (for a bot moving and microing everything is simple) + ultimate cost efficient comp | ||
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quaristice
147 Posts
it's also part of why it's so effective with wraith and ghost in tvp and it's putting a lot of stress on the robo build timer meaning less reavers | ||
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Jealous
10374 Posts
On September 20 2026 01:59 quaristice wrote: it instantly seeing cloaked unit blurs mapwide and scanning them is very broken and feels like a form of cheating on its own it's also part of why it's so effective with wraith and ghost in tvp and it's putting a lot of stress on the robo build timer meaning less reavers Visual intelligence is a very complicated field. What would you suggest as an alternative? I'm struggling to think of anything reasonable or feasible. Feels like this could be abused, too. Move DT into vision, see scan, move it back, rinse repeat, waste all scans, then go kill. | ||
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quaristice
147 Posts
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