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[7x]dizzy
Russian Federation37 Posts
I was able to win all starcraft levels (terran zerg toss), but after i started broodwar i stuck at level 8 terran "To Chain the Beast". Currently i've spended 50 tries and my best result is 8:54. Is it possible to beat this map? Maybe i should consider it impossible and quit trying... For those who are interested in trying here is map dropmefiles.com | ||
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Eden Project
1 Post
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Jealous
10358 Posts
On January 24 2021 01:59 Eden Project wrote: Just load your dropships up with a lot of medics and fly on in there. You don't technically need to kill the cerebrate. I don't remember the details exactly, but you can either do it right away or mass dropships/medics and d-matrix the dropships Have you actually loaded up this specific Co-op version of the game? You start with 2 Medics, no Dropships, no Vessels, etc. Maybe you were talking about the original campaign? | ||
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radley
Poland582 Posts
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Jealous
10358 Posts
On January 24 2021 04:07 radley wrote: Ive beaten whole terran campaign without mining any single gas, including this map. So coop shouldnt be a problem too. I tried launching this to beat it myself and man, it's tough. I suggest you give it a try and then come back. First 3 waves come shortly after your first bunkers are finished and it's like 3x24+ 2-2 Zerglings. Then about 20 Hydras. Somehow I don't think you'll beat it on your first try or without gas. | ||
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Freakling
Germany1534 Posts
On January 24 2021 04:07 radley wrote: Ive beaten whole terran campaign without mining any single gas, including this map. So coop shouldnt be a problem too. Only the expansion campaign, I presume? You definitely cannot beat all of the original Terran campaign without ever mining gas. | ||
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[7x]dizzy
Russian Federation37 Posts
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Jealous
10358 Posts
On January 24 2021 17:18 [7x]dizzy wrote: This is modified version, a.i. script changed to insane (it is campaign in original). You need resources to defend your base, i dont think you will have extra resources for starport and dropship. Are you playing this solo or with a teammate? I tried a few runs of solo, and even when I survive the first 3 groups of Zerglings, the Hydras come right after and it's really tough. The AI also attacks at your weakest angle, and it's difficult to wall properly on both sides of the starting base  So far, haven't been able to make it past the first wave of Hydras alone. | ||
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[7x]dizzy
Russian Federation37 Posts
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Jealous
10358 Posts
On January 25 2021 22:33 [7x]dizzy wrote: I am playing with |BlackMamba|. Why play solo, its twice harder I thought that this was why you were asking if it's possible hahaha. I'll ask my friend to help out and we'll see if we can beat it. | ||
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arbiter_md
Moldova1219 Posts
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Jealous
10358 Posts
1. ~24+ Zerglings per Zerg (3x) 2. ~12+ Hydralisk per Z, with the occasional Dark Swarm 3. ~12+ Mutalisks per Z - hits around 4:30 4. Devourer + Guardian - hits around 7:30 -- Random Queens, Infested Terrans, Defiler + Plague etc. start appearing now -- 5. Ultralisk + Devourer + Guardian + Hydralisk - hits around 11:30 6. ??? For those thinking that this sounds manageable, keep in mind that you start with 0-0 upgrades on everything while the AI has 2-2 on everything, as well as all the techs (Cracklings, fully upgraded Hydra, Broodling + Ensnare, Plague etc.) I am getting the impression that it is impossible to hold everything at 12 minutes. There is just simply too much. I think that the goal should be to make a Dropship, have 2+ Vessels, then use D-matrix on the Medics and Dropship, and just fly that shit to the beacons. At this point I am not sure how we can hold that 11:30 wave. Some other particularly annoying things are that sometimes the first Zergling wave comes before we can even fill Bunkers with the Marines retreating from the "expansion" (what a laughable concept). Mutalisks sometimes hit just Player 2, sometimes both Players. Same with the Hydralisks, though it seems now that we learned how to fortify Player 2 properly, they started splitting up to both players more often. The fact that they sometimes come through the backdoor of Player 2 is also some bullshit. I wish that the AI waves were more consistent in direction and target, but alas, that seems to be part of the challenge. I suspect that expanding to the bottom right island is out of the question as these AI maphack and have a fuckton of air Anyway, our approach right now is Player 1 walls the North side of their base Zergling-tight with 2 Medics, Factory, Machine Shop, Refinery, 2 Medics, Depot, Barracks on top of minerals. Player 1 also brings the first 4 Marines from the "expansion" to Player 2 and puts them in a Bunker. Player 1 rushes to Siege Tanks and sends 2 to Player 2, then 2 for themselves. Player 2 uses Depots, Barracks, and Engineering Bay to try to funnel the army to come from 2 sides in the North, and makes 3 Bunkers (1 Bunker from Player 1, so total of 4) in a pattern that allows for optimal repair surface area. Player 2 goes for Vultures + Spider Mines for the first few waves of Zergling/Hydralisk, going into Valkyries for the Mutalisks. We're not quite sure what is the best approach for Player 1 after the Siege Tanks; Bio seems to be sensible since they already have to produce it to fill the Bunkers and because they already have Medics/Marine Range. Vessels seems to be a good way to spend the extra gas but Irradiate is never done in time for the Mutalisk timing and I am not sure how useful it will be against the later waves, as there is just way too much. We decided to call it a night after the 12 minute game, will get back to it in the coming days to see if it is possible for us, at least TT__TT | ||
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[7x]dizzy
Russian Federation37 Posts
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Jealous
10358 Posts
On January 29 2021 01:21 [7x]dizzy wrote: Done playing broodwar campaign. 2 more "impossible" levels : Zerg 3 (The Kel-Morian Combine) and Zerg 7 (The Drawing of the Web). You get outnumbered before you can even make army for defence. How can you say you are truly "done" then?  Any thoughts on my post above concerning Terran 8? Have you tried rushing the objective as I described above, with Dropship + Medics + D-Matrix? Any pointers from your gameplay experience? What does your Player 2 base look like? Etc. Link these Co-op levels that you listed as impossible. Once my partner and I beat Terran 8, we will take those out too  | ||
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EmptyHands
14 Posts
But my main trick was just saving every minute. This way you know were the waves will come from, when they will come, how many will come and you can prepare beforehand and try it several times till you succeed. The rest is just slow grinding till you win. | ||
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[7x]dizzy
Russian Federation37 Posts
https://dropmefiles.com/A3rsc | ||
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Leonix
161 Posts
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EmptyHands
14 Posts
Maybe I made it sound too easy that wasn´t my intention and I know these missions are hard to beat. Every mission has it´s own challenge, but the waves are repetitive as it´s the same AI on all the maps and after playing several dozen hours of these missions you kinda know how to handle them. I also played these Missions alone and restarting a whole mission (that worked in my favor so far) only because the mutas didn´t come in the right angle, became quite stupid after a while. I also like your DS reference as I never played that game, but you seem to suffer some heavy ptsd from it. | ||
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Jealous
10358 Posts
On January 29 2021 20:20 EmptyHands wrote: I meant the mineral patches of the missions not my own resources(lol), so the problems at the beginning are still the same. But yes after i stabilized the 50k mineral stacks work too much in my favor, that´s why I said that I don´t know if that counts. I also had a rerun with normal patches but never played till that certain Mission. Just like Jealous said the attack patterns change quite often and it´s already really hard to fend of the enemy forces as you often start with 3-4 SCVs and need a good balance between defense and economy to survive the hordes. The thing with the saves makes it more like a puzzle and saves you a lot of time, as you only have to solve several sections to beat the mission. I mainly wanted to see if it´s possible to beat them if the scenarios would work perfectly in your hands, as the creator of these maps wrote that "some maps could be impossible to beat". Maybe I made it sound too easy that wasn´t my intention and I know these missions are hard to beat. Every mission has it´s own challenge, but the waves are repetitive as it´s the same AI on all the maps and after playing several dozen hours of these missions you kinda know how to handle them. I also played these Missions alone and restarting a whole mission (that worked in my favor so far) only because the mutas didn´t come in the right angle, became quite stupid after a while. I also like your DS reference as I never played that game, but you seem to suffer some heavy ptsd from it. I can't fathom trying to beat this mission as a solo player, the map linked by OP specifically. I get to about 4 minutes and then die when trying to play single player on this co-op mission, so mineral amounts never even factor in. For the record, my recent peak was low A rank Protoss 2 years ago on RM ladder and since then I've mostly been playing TvP casually, I'd estimate my T is around high C low B, while my friend hit B on ICCup with T and regularly pumps out 200+ APM in this mission. I find it hard to believe that not only are we not good enough to beat this (yet), but that anyone could beat it solo at all, regardless of mineral patches or whatnot. | ||
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[7x]dizzy
Russian Federation37 Posts
-I start at left and rush to siege. I make a wall with engeneering, refinery, barrack and academy. It has 3 holes, so i use 2 medics, 1 scv 1 marine and 1 scv 1 marine to make them lingtight. I send all my tanks to my ally at right side. -Ally starts at right side and make 6 bunkers. He repair them each attack. We save/load until get into situation when all hydra goes to right base and dies due to siege (since i have no bunkers) Before muta comes i make 2 bunkers and 4 turrets, my ally comes to me with his m&m army. Then we die to guards and ultralisks. | ||
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EmptyHands
14 Posts
edit: I played the solo insane edition (50k) and died at around 7-9 minutes, I went into the editor and added 1 CC and 4 SCVs next to my main CC and needed 3 tries to come into the stable zone and win it from there. But that made it way to easy compared to the past where I had some really clutch moments to become stable back then. I know I had to add 1-4 SCVs on some maps to gain enough momentum to kill of the waves and become stable when I played 2 years ago, so I probably had added them there too. So Leonix is right, I bragged about beating it but I never really beat it. So I´m sorry :<! Nonetheless some pics. ![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/A38e5Kn.jpg) ![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/oWC9lmX.jpg) | ||
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MarlieChurphy
United States2065 Posts
TL;DW rush gas, 2 ports, 8 medics, and 2 drops. Send ebay up to tank spore fire. Load 2 dropships 8 scv and 8 medics. Drop on the overmind base, run scv in to draw fire, send medics to the beacons. Win . Takes 6.5 minutes | ||
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Jealous
10358 Posts
On January 30 2021 08:00 MarlieChurphy wrote: i dont know what the coop is but there are speedruns on YT and AGDQ that show strategies to beat these fast. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QydafSS3leU TL;DW rush gas, 2 ports, 8 medics, and 2 drops. Send ebay up to tank spore fire. Load 2 dropships 8 scv and 8 medics. Drop on the overmind base, run scv in to draw fire, send medics to the beacons. Win . Takes 6.5 minutes Bro it's not even remotely the same. Try the map linked in OP. | ||
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EmptyHands
14 Posts
I will roughly explain what I did: - SCV build/ Factory build/ Gas build/ research infantry attack in ebay/ start marine production/ build bunkers (place it in a location that covers most of your entrance area) - Move your marines form your expo back and kill your two turrets (I don´t know I you have to but they could trigger a back attack) - Keep producing bunkers/SCVs/Marines, place 2-3 SCVs in your gas so your able to build your tanks and research the siege mode at the same time. You need to build a block of around 6 bunkers in total, but that takes some time. - Try to block most of the Zerglings from attacking your bunkers with your 2 medics, SCVs and buildings. If some back attack happens lure the Zerglings into your bunkers if they ignore you reload and try to aggro them if nothing works restart. Try to build a second barracks in front of your bunkers when you can afford it. - I think you have 1-3 tanks when the Hydras start to attack, a bunch of bunkers and your buildings blocking the Hydras and tanking some extra damage. Try not to lose any bunkers there, if you can afford it prepare some SCVs to mass repair it and spam the bunkers. Keep building Tanks/SCVs etc. If you lose a Tank reload it/ if you lose a bunker try to play it out/ if you lose your marines or 2 bunkers => reload. - After the Hydra waves shortly the mutas will come. Use the time between the waves to build turrets around the bunkers and if you see some mutas flying to your back add a thin line of turrets to lure them into your bunkers. Again keep your bunkers alive the turrets can die. Usually when you have your 6 bunkers + turrets you only need 5 SCVs to mass repair the bunker which the Mutas are attacking to kill these waves. - Now comes the tricky part you need to produce units to counter the next wave which has Guardians in it. Overall the AI isn´t that smart and with enough spam of barracks, turrets, gols and marines like my picture above, it will lure them in and kill them. But I lacked the the economy to spam them enough and I had to reload some saves till I was able to push trough it. I also stopped my tank production to produce enough gols. I tried to add another CC to be able to gain enough resources to become stable and prepared for the next wave. - A horde of Ultras + Hydras will appear, maybe some dark swarm, plague etc. You NEED to spam these shitty barracks, turrets + Marines to create a puffer. They also bug the Ultras (don´t let any paths open for the Ultras to reach your inner base), Hydras get aggro from the marines and the turrets handle the Mutas + kill some Guardians. Also Defilers are using their spells on your spam buildings. Keep your bunkers alive and don´t let anything touch your Tanks. The biggest problem are the air-waves with their Guardians if you reach a point where you can handle all that you basically won. You need to setup a good enough economy till then, to be able to kill them with Air units or mass gols. I lacked that and all my Gols died at 14 mins to the next air-wave. If a back attack happens try to have at least 1 Tank in range for most of your buildings to trigger the enemy units. If a air-wave comes and you don´t have enough to handle the Guardians => reload and try different things to change their pathing if nothing works restart. - After the 12 min mark the AI kinda repeats the Ultra + Hydra + Zergling wave, the air-wave and the spellcaster spam. Keep your puffer alive to make them unable to reach/kill your core units. You should be able to add more and more of your core units, start to research your attack upgrades etc. and hold the waves with enough building spam. I think my main problem was that I added my CC too late, but it´s really hard to be able to get up enough defense to handle the waves. I also have no real plan how to expand or survive the long run with these 2k patches, so I think a suicide squad with dropships and medics are the only real solution. | ||
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BaggyT
6 Posts
We're not the best StarCraft players, but we can make it to about 18-20 mins. Here's our strategy: Person starting on right focuses on Tanks for when the Torrasque comes. Person on left (usually me) builds up to nukes. A few well-places nukes gets access to the high ground just south of the Red Zerg and the Cerebrate can be nuked... just have to be careful of roaming Overlords. Because the ghosts can cloak, the invulnerable Sunken Colonies can just be walked past. A small group of wraiths are essential for killing off those Guardians. It should go without saying that upgrades are essential... but we try not to double up with upgrades: if my friend goes for tanks, he'll get vehicle upgrades; I get air unit upgrades. That way we save some precious resources. Mining the expansion to the right is difficult because defending it against the Torrasque is incredibly tough. I tried to expand to the top left corner after taking out Red, but it always gets overrun. Battlecruisers seem to always get taken out by plague and scourge, so I don't like them on this map. We almost managed to get the Brown Zerg, again by landing on the high ground and using nukes. Never managed to finally land the last nuke to take out the Cerebrate. That's as far as we ever got. All other missions were possible for us, although some were quite tough. Here's a link to someone completing the coop version of To Chain the Beast: They didn't do it first time, but got there eventually. My friend and I can't get this tactic to work though. | ||
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Jealous
10358 Posts
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BaggyT
6 Posts
Well, I can't even do normal coop, so I'm not even going to attempt the insane version!! Thanks for the clarification. | ||
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[7x]dizzy
Russian Federation37 Posts
:-( | ||
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Jealous
10358 Posts
On February 15 2021 23:20 [7x]dizzy wrote: looks like its time to call it "impossible" :-) :-( My friend are still trying but we give it an hour a week, tops. | ||
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kogeT
Poland2042 Posts
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Jealous
10358 Posts
On February 16 2021 03:14 kogeT wrote: Didnt read in detail, is it expected to play solo or as a team? As a team. | ||
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