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On November 18 2017 13:07 SCC-Faust wrote:Unfortunately I am probably moving on from the game and community after this weekend. I truly hope to come back when things are smoothed over, but currently this remains to be one of my worst video game experiences ever. I've learned quite a bit from this topic: I've gained a lot more respect for the development team, have better insight into the bugs that plague SC:R, and learned about how other people in the community feel regarding the same issues as I do- whether they agree or disagree. As much as StarCraft has been an integral part of my life, I'm just not happy with StarCraft: Remastered and after a lot of thinking the past two days, I've decided that instead of being upset, I should find other games that make me happy. To give a brief summary of my decision: I am a long time StarCraft player since 2006 (or maybe even before, I can't remember) and recently came back when I was told about Shieldbattery from a longtime friend. This was in September 2016 that I resumed playing from a long break. From September 2016 to January 2017 I played a ton - thousands of games. Between Shieldbattery, ICCup, and Fish, I estimate I played close to over 2,000 games at least in that three month period. According to the auto save folder from Shieldbattery (which came out in an update a month after I started playing in my most active month, so this doesn't even hold all my games on the server) I have 1,182 replay files. I can't even remember all my smurfs I played on ICCup, and Fish no longer exists, so you'll just have to believe me that I played a ton on those servers too. + Show Spoiler +Now to my current experience - according to my StarCraft: Remastered profiles, I have 1069 ladder games combined between them all. That is an average of 11 ladder games a day since release, and this is not counting the hundreds (or maybe even thousands) of UMS I have played. Basically, I have played a fucking ton of StarCraft before and after Remastered release, is the point I'm trying to make here. I don't know how, I don't know why, but Remastered has been a completely worse experience for me than 1.16.1 when it comes to latency, and this is coming from someone who played easily a 1,000+ games on a Korean server, and a server with a large South American/Eastern European population pre 1.18. And here is the kicker - nothing changed on my part. Same computer, same router, same internet. I do constant ping checks during my games and my ping is always very good. I do not lag on any other online games, and have no troubles with my internet connection minus rare moments when I stream. Hours before the most recent patch (1.20.10) I played on what felt like two turn rate 4 games in a row, but have no way to actually confirm it. I thought whatever, I'll call it a night and try again tomorrow. Well, after playing 4 games literally hours ago, I had two games convert themselves to turn rate 6 and it was all in all a miserable experience. It also doesn't help that it seems to downgrade the turn rate, but never increase it. ![[image loading]](https://i.gyazo.com/a76cdd43c97680a1dd9b5c4c689fe302.png) ![[image loading]](https://i.gyazo.com/7677d362874f97917eb02eba9a6c1f80.png) ![[image loading]](https://i.gyazo.com/702dbb1cdba6ba2588df30478a41427b.png) I checked my ping during the games (this is how I always do it, I just make a large number of pings to google to see if I'm spiking or having any packet loss) and it was as good as it always is, which made the situation even more frustrating. ![[image loading]](https://i.gyazo.com/2ef9ca70d34a9ecfe424fa399f05c83f.png) Unfortunately enough is enough for me. This post is not meant to make any claims for anyone other than my own experience. Despite saying I am trying to steer negativity away from this thread, I really can't help but post with my feelings on my sleeve because I've been passionate about this community and game since I was a young kid. So this is not a post to really convince anyone or sway opinions, nor do I think most people actually care if I quit (I was not a notable foreigner by any means). I just want to share my experience as some others have in this thread. As much as I want to help and continue thoughtful discussion as was my original intention of this thread, I really can't dig up any motivation whatsoever when the game is in an unplayable state for me that is completely out of my hands.
Sorry to see you go  But, if SC:R is causing you that much stress I'd definitely say it's for the best to give it a break for some time. I hope to see you back in the future though!
Just for clarity, pinging Google isn't actually a good test for something like this. The connection being p2p means that you're going to be connecting to people all over the world, so you'd need to find out where they are from and at the very least ping somewhere in that country. (Packet loss is often something that happens on one of the hops along the way from one location to another, so you'd need to emulate the route your connection would take. And, have your opponent do the same)
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On November 18 2017 10:01 LaStScan wrote:
didn't read all comments, but I want 2v2, 3v3 and 4v4 ladder. Also, Grade rank system.
it has been more than 3 months, and blizzard should reset the season asap because no one really plays ladder games above 2800++.
3 months of data should be totally enough to make a grade rank system by now.
since this ladder system keeps going on, expro on afreeca platform pretty much play games with their other streamers(spon-matches), and that shit pretty much separate the community.
I, as a top level amateur player, feel like too isolated, and i don't get much of practice(korean twitch viewers hate afreeca btw). Ladder games are really meaningless since those expros don't play ladder games.
this current sc:r system pretty much made me to somewhat move to PUBG and enjoy my life.
What do you think a ladder reset is gonna do for the pros who are already rank 1-15? They are going to be 1-15 again
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On November 18 2017 13:37 Heyjoray wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2017 10:01 LaStScan wrote:
didn't read all comments, but I want 2v2, 3v3 and 4v4 ladder. Also, Grade rank system.
it has been more than 3 months, and blizzard should reset the season asap because no one really plays ladder games above 2800++.
3 months of data should be totally enough to make a grade rank system by now.
since this ladder system keeps going on, expro on afreeca platform pretty much play games with their other streamers(spon-matches), and that shit pretty much separate the community.
I, as a top level amateur player, feel like too isolated, and i don't get much of practice(korean twitch viewers hate afreeca btw). Ladder games are really meaningless since those expros don't play ladder games.
this current sc:r system pretty much made me to somewhat move to PUBG and enjoy my life. What do you think a ladder reset is gonna do for the pros who are already rank 1-15? They are going to be 1-15 again
They'll have to play games to get there though. So he'll have some time to play against them
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wait a minute, the game now changes turnrate by itself? so the worst nightmare of having a random observer in an old obs map changing the latency, because he feels like making himself get hated by everybody is a good idea, is now an unavoidable feature?
this is for ladder games only or all games?.
this has to be reverted immediately.
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On November 18 2017 14:11 Bakuryu wrote:
wait a minute, the game now changes turnrate by itself? so the worst nightmare of having a random observer in an old obs map changing the latency, because he feels like making himself get hated by everybody is a good idea, is now an unavoidable feature?
this is for ladder games only or all games?.
this has to be reverted immediately.
It's for ladder games only.
Edit: It's also been in place for a few weeks now, They just made a change that it announces when it makes a change.
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well im in china for a few weeks, so its hard to get good information everywhere.
but when i get back and want to practice, i will not ladder at all.
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After reading this entire thread, and as coming from my perspective as a software developer, I can say this.
The community is really healthy right now. We have true fans of the game complaining because they are passionate about it. The fact that they complain shows that they care.
We have developers of the game chiming in to explain things in a detailed manner (software development is hard boys). The fact that they come here means they care.
The saddest thing for a game is when no one says anything. Silence. Posts from a year ago with no response. No one cares to play and no one cares to fix.
Look at the game from a 10000 ft perspective and appreciate that this game is still alive after 20+ years and appreciate that.
SC for Life.
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I have the same gut feeling as SCC-Faust regarding the lag. During 1.16 I was able to play vs most Koreans on high latency and #L2. Now I have to play the majority of ladder games with what feels like 0.5s delay.
The release of SC:R basically screwed the long-time foreign players the hardest. For most of them, everything was working fine when Blizzard didn't give a shit. But now because they have enough skill they only get matched against Koreans after 10-15 games on ladder and then will never play a lag free game on low latency again. Custom games are not an option either because barely anyone will see it with the multiple servers. Basically, I don't play much ladder anymore aside from the occasional 1-2 games to see if something changed. And even though I don't care about it much, not having a 2v2 ladder anymore compared to all those years before is also a negative point.
Regarding the ladder they really should check the connection before game and not just increase the latency until there is no lag and the turn rate should at maximum be reduced to 8 in ladder games. Turn rates below that don't even allow for basic micro anymore plus whatever Blizzard screwed up with the input registering like a control group getting overwritten if you select it to fast after assigning another one gets worse.
What I am really angry about is the guy who apparently thought it was okay to release this bug of art prematurely. Granted, the lag issues would have come up even with a later release, because you need a larger player pool for that, but all the problems regarding the bnet interface are really inexcusable. Releasing a game without a working chat or basic commands like /friend or /where and having to wait 20s to get your match results?
I guess Blizzards strategy nowadays is to make the beta testers pay for beta testing.
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imo the higher ups at blizzard likely want us to stop playing SC:R and buy hearthstone/overwatch etc and go into microtransactions, also for the players of these other games to just quickly buy SC:R and then go back to microtransaction super overpriced games
they don't care about starcraft
they also don't care about making great games that you play for a long time at the top quality from the start etc
they also want to shut down public chat spaces as much as they can so that we have less space and opportunity to criticize them, thats why they say no to lobbys when asked at blizzcon and present their new social schematics that don't really offer anything compared to proper chat, and why they avoided as much as possible including proper chat into each of their games since they merged with activision
that is the reason for the dumbed down social features and mandatory blizzard adware and everything else
the company was screwed by deals made between mike morhaime and robert kotick for their profit and the shareholders. These two guys are probably 100% selfish, and liars.
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Omg I don't know what came over me. I love this game too much to leave.
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Just yesterday I played a ladder game vs a guy from Estonia. During the course of the game The Turn rate was first adjusted to 14 and then reduced in a couple of minutes to 8,then 6 and even 4. I live in Germany, so it's not that far. I never had the kind of problem on ICC, shieldbattery or fish.
But what annoys me the most is how bad the game runs on low end Computers. My PC is Pretty old, but still good bit better than the minimum requirements. I can't play the game in HD. And the SD graphics are appalling. It's very upsetting to play the game with graphics that are officially worse than the original one. When I switch to HD interface gets laggy. So for me I paid €15, which is not a lot granted, and effectively its a downgrade.
Honestly I don't believe that Blizzard was unable to emulate the SD graphics one to one. Certainly there were some problems, but I imagine the sd graphics where a 0 priority.
I hope the Blizzard fixes it, so I can at least play the game in the proper SD graphics.
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Netherlands4651 Posts
Only reason I'd ever buy Remastered is if it supported 16-9 with old graphics. Playing 16-9 with Michael Bay explosions and neon light buildings - no thank you.
To me 16-9 only in HD seems like strategical decision to get more serious streamers and casters play HD for the benefit of having 16-9. A feature to help promote their new product, because flashy graphics is obviously much more appealing to younger players than old, SD graphics. Which is super ironic to me considering how bad the neon light pre-order skins look. Total marketing fail right there imo. The neon lights still affect tournaments nowadays, so bad impressions that don't help sells of the product continue. You just cannot tell me with a straight face that the majority will see that and think: "Omg, those graphics are so good, I need to have that game!".
TL;DR: The HD graphics honestly don't look bad, but the skins are a huge fail. From a business point of view I cannot even begin to understand it.
Something relatively important that I haven't seen mentioned is that the HD makes it impossible to target units at the edge of the map (perhaps that's only an obs-mode issue though.)
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On November 18 2017 21:25 Cele wrote:
I hope the Blizzard fixes it, so I can at least play the game in the proper SD graphics.
This is what I would like too.
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adjusting tr during the game is nice, but i would not like to see it to go down more than tr8. :/
i want blizzard to maximum lowest tr in ladder game should be 8.
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On November 19 2017 05:12 LaStScan wrote:
adjusting tr during the game is nice, but i would not like to see it to go down more than tr8. :/
i want blizzard to maximum lowest tr in ladder game should be 8.
Agree with this. Games below tr8 are not even worth playing. Also something that I thought existed (or this may be from a dream) is during 1.18 beta you could actually put a latency restriction on games you hosted. Why is this not a thing for ranked? I know that developers have to choose between queue times and an acceptable form of latency and that players will be on either side of the fence here on which is more important to them - so why not add a feature that allows people to compromise on what they want more? Also, I feel like this issue is kind of misrepresented... I really do not believe for a moment that the majority of the community cares more about queue times than getting in games that are actually playable.
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tr8+high already feels like original bnet latency. That`s ridicoulus. They promised some patches, they delivered, now the UI is complete garbage, laggy, shitty, when I hit a button it registers like I`m pressing alt, when I`m not, and so on. I completely agree with Cryoc.
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7 Posts
Thanks for the support guys, we really appreciate it.
Some answers to a couple of other questions I've noticed:
Why not merge gateways (specifically USE, USW)? This was another thing we considered right at the start of designing out the integration with modern Battle.net. Here are a couple of things to consider immediately:
1. What if my name is on USE but not USW? What if someone else has my name on USW? The obvious answer is to internally prefix/suffix my name, but remember, whatever the final name is needs to fit within the restrictions of names in the old chat server. So if my name has already used the maximum bytes available, what then? And yes, we could rewrite or augment the chat server to remove such old restrictions, but that is quite the undertaking and it also hits on point #2 below. Another option would be to force me to rename my profile on next login, but that's not a great user experience (who gets to keep their name, and who has to rename?).
2. It's easy to forget that the original chat server is shared between 4 other games. Whatever solution we come up would very likely require every game to be patched. A couple of those we've patched in the last couple of years, so it's not unreasonable that we could patch them, but there are other cases where we really haven't looked at the source code in a very long time. Even getting to the point of releasing any kind of patch on each of those is a serious time investment with substantial risk.
TLDR - although we agreed there were compelling reasons to merge USE & USW, the additional risk and time investment was pushing us well above what was already a very complicated and intricate subproject. So we decided to table the idea and circle back to it when we felt we could tackle it.
"After a match it takes a solid 2 minutes or more for my rating change to be displayed. I don't even bother waiting for it anymore, but it's definitely something I'd like to know."
I think you're referring to the toast post-game screen here. This is part of the Battle.net UI responsiveness that we're working on optimizing right now. We'll have a small improvement coming soon (which should impact on this screen), but a larger change is in the works too.
Finally, Faust, I am surprised to hear that you're experiencing more latency than you ever used to, assuming you're playing the same custom games. Once you're in game, assuming the host does not require a proxy server, there is no server involved and it's a direct connection between you and your opponent (for 1v1). None of that code has changed in any material way, so it really should be the same experience as ever. Our network diag tool will show you if you need proxy server assistance when hosting games (coming soon). Since your setup hasn't changed, I wouldn't expect that to be the case. Once that's released, I'll be interested to hear the results and see if we can get to a better place with your latency woes.
As AManHasNoName mentioned, pinging google.com isn't a conclusive test. It does show that the network at your end is in good shape - you're not slowing it down by software/hardware/config like running over wifi, etc. - and also that your ISP is good. What really matters is your connection to the host player (or if you're the host, all the other players and observers), which comes down to the state of their network plus the physical routing between you (which unfortunately can be non-obvious, particularly in regions with many different countries).
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On November 19 2017 06:26 GrantTheAnt wrote:
Why not merge gateways (specifically USE, USW)? This was another thing we considered right at the start of designing out the integration with modern Battle.net. Here are a couple of things to consider immediately:
1. What if my name is on USE but not USW? What if someone else has my name on USW? The obvious answer is to internally prefix/suffix my name, but remember, whatever the final name is needs to fit within the restrictions of names in the old chat server. So if my name has already used the maximum bytes available, what then? And yes, we could rewrite or augment the chat server to remove such old restrictions, but that is quite the undertaking and it also hits on point #2 below. Another option would be to force me to rename my profile on next login, but that's not a great user experience (who gets to keep their name, and who has to rename?).
TLDR - although we agreed there were compelling reasons to merge USE & USW, the additional risk and time investment was pushing us well above what was already a very complicated and intricate subproject. So we decided to table the idea and circle back to it when we felt we could tackle it.
Re-name US West "South America" and US east "North America"
Bing bang boom problem solved.
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Netherlands4651 Posts
On November 19 2017 06:45 NerO wrote:
Re-name US West "South America" and US east "North America"
Bing bang boom problem solved.
I reckon it would solve loads of lag issues if Latin America got it's own gateway.
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EPT![[image loading]](https://i.gyazo.com/a11bd5b499e232577cfa91ca2f7fc60a.png)
