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United States33128 Posts
News from sportschosun and progamer.net
*update* looks like they're not going to appear on the starleague either ;p
It's 7 PM on Tuesday, which means it's time for the KPGA Team League. There was supposed to be an exibition match between Orion and Soul, but neither of the teams showed up.
A few weeks ago, there was an article in the news, about a formal request by the progamers to MBCGame about the Team League. The pro teams threatened the would not show up, or send out their 2nd rate players if their demands were not met. Their requests included:
Around $60,000 in total prize money for a 3 month league.
A stop in pay/free VOD services (since they are not paid for them)
A $400 appearance fee for the Team League (around $160 during the 1st league), and over 30% of that for reruns.
To confer and agree with the KPGA on tournament rules
It is true that it is very hard for a progamer who is not in the top 10 to make money, and that many progamers don't even make $300 a month.
The pro teams say that this is simply required for them to make a decent living. MBCGame says that the kind of money they want is just impossible at the time.
While this article showed up in mid june, it appears they have not been able to agree on anything. So what's going to happen in July? I guess we can look forward to a lot of reruns!
The gamers haven't taken their case to OGN yet, though the KTF Ever Pro League hardly meets the demands they have sent to MBCGame either. If they succeed with MBCGame, they'll be pressuring OGN in no time.
While a cool $60,000 in total prize money for a 3 month Team League would be very cool, I can't help but think that the Pro teams are being ridiculous. They're asking for the prize money to be multiplied by 5, which is not something that easily happens at once.
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Belgium8305 Posts
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HnR)hT
United States3468 Posts
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i cant believe mbc doesnt manage to pay that. most other sports produce multimillionaires even if there are way less people interested in it. are korean gaming channels just ripping off the players or do they really not make enough money? a grand final with thousands of live visitors should be easily enough to pay 60,000 8[
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30 000 showed up to watch Boxer vs Reach, I think
$$
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United States33128 Posts
that number keeps growing each time it's told again
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Australia4514 Posts
i heard it was 35'009 at least!!
$$$
i think the 60k is unreasonable, the rest seems sorta okay
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United States33128 Posts
please, some ppl can't read between lines T_T
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4492 Posts
I heard from Legionnaire it was 39005?
-Mynock
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must have been 45000++ at least
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wow, x 5? That's a little stiff..that is a poor country, too
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I sympathize for the progamers, but I have to admit i laughed at first hearing someone refuse to play their favorite computer game...
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Canada5062 Posts
5X does sound a bit stiff, but a couple of things to keep in mind:
1) Most such demands have some basis in reality. In other words, the $60,000 is most likely a figure arrived at by the KPGA based not only on their NEED, but also on what people in the industry assume MBC is capable of actually paying. No serious organziation capable of driving its members to strike would ask for an amount they know the other side is not remotely capable of paying.
2) The KPGA is probably assuming that, one way or another, MBC will come to bargain with them somehow because, let's face it, their demands are based on a very real need: like Wax said, unless you're a Top 10 player, the "Pro" tag is a kind of sad joke because you just cannot make a worthwhile living off of playing. So, as in many negotiations involving a $ figure, the opposing sides start at opposite extremes and meet somewhere towards the middle - or at least that's probably what the KPGA is hoping. In other words, it's doubtful the KPGA seriously expects MBC to cave in to ALL their demands - just SOME of them and/or to a reasonably similar level (perhaps 3X? 4X? 2X? Dunno...).
Hope this gets resolved soon.
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These demands don't seem unreasonable at all.
From what I can tell, the $60,000 figure is a total for all of the prizes in the tournament, not just the big winner. Split 6 ways and divided by 3 months, that's roughly $3,333 per person (assuming six people, I might be way off there) per month.
That's comfortable -- but not exorbitant; you can make cash like that managing a grocery store, as a carpenter or a member of some other trade union (-- at least in the US. I don't know how the economy works in South Korea). Considering that there probably isn't a purse like that awarded every three months (probably more like every five or six), and that some of the money is almost certainly taxed, I'd knock the figure down to around $2,250/month or so.
And that's the KPGA shooting for the moon. As Mensrea mentioned, negotiations will push the $60,000 request down to something more like $40,000 or so. Maybe less. With figures like that, none of the KGPA members are exactly looking forward to an early retirement...
I'd like to see prize money thrown around a little more liberally anyway. Then the gamers can devote more time and energy to training, push for more innovation, raise the bar and continue to entertain us without having to sacrifice their well-being.
The payment balance issues (the top %1 of players getting 95% of the cash) remind me of the music business in the states: screwed up and messy. Especially that tiff with Nada and his manager. Let's get Courtney Love on the KPGA's team; her vs. MBC's lawyers. Fight of the century. I'd watch.
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no...about 45,000 showed up for Boxer/Reach
T.T
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guess they finally got tired of getting their shit pushed in by faggot ass poser fatcats.
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Greedy sons of bitches. They don't play for the fun, the joy in the game. They only play is for green dollar bills. It's discusting! If they don't wanne appear to next show fine. Who cares? There are 10 000 others who would die to replace them.
Shame on all of you! 60 000$ for 3months? My familie dont even make 200 000$ a year.
I piss on your demands! Go back to school! Get a life!
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On July 01 2003 22:48 UnderGroUndZerG wrote:
Greedy sons of bitches. They don't play for the fun, the joy in the game. They only play is for green dollar bills. It's discusting! If they don't wanne appear to next show fine. Who cares? There are 10 000 others who would die to replace them.
Shame on all of you! 60 000$ for 3months? My familie dont even make 200 000$ a year.
I piss on your demands! Go back to school! Get a life!
Dude, it's what they are doing for a living! They can't just say "blah, it's still fun, who cares." They need to make money! And the 60,000 USD prize for the Team League is for the whole group of players, not just one person.
This is what I posted on WGTour, slightly more indepth.
You people don't seem to get that not every pro-gamer makes a lot of money like Boxer or Nada. Most only get free food, lodging and practice. No real money to spend except meager apperance fees here and there. Since they didn't write the WGTour post like Wax did on TeamLiquid, here are the demands and how reasonable they are.
- 60,000 dollar prize for winning the Team League -
This is very reasonable, the Team League is damn hard to win! Also, this is for the whole Pro-Gaming team.
- VOD service shut down, since the gamers get no compensation for it. -
This is bullshit, there is nothing wrong with the VOD service and it's just greed by the gamers.
- Appearence fees increased from 150 USD to 400 USD. -
MBC Game supposedly can't pay appearence fees that high. I'm not sure though wether it's per player of for the whole team to show. Either way, if MBC can't pay the 400, then an amount like 250-300 USD might be more reasonable.
I agree that yes, MBC is jipping them, but some of this stuff is just crazy.
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MURICA15980 Posts
We'll be seeing the same type of stuff for Ongamenet too I bet pretty soon.
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Canada5062 Posts
For the record: the 60K is NOT for the Team League. It's the TOTAL prize money to be disbursed to ALL participants (altho, obviously, the higher placed finishers will get more) in a "3-month Starleague," NOT the Team League. 60K to the winner of the TEAM LEAGUE is a ridiculously high amount and cannot be justified under the current business environment: it would roughly work out to nearly 10K for EACH player on a Team! That's NOT what the KPGA wants.
Just setting the record straight because there seems to be some confusion about this.
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You can be a progamer and have a part time job. And the social service could help too. They don't need all that money.
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You see, even if there are 10,000 gamers to replace them, no way in hell will they make as much money with Ads and ticket sales unless they have the best of the best, and the progamers know this.
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Canada5062 Posts
On July 01 2003 22:48 UnderGroUndZerG wrote:
Greedy sons of bitches. They don't play for the fun, the joy in the game. They only play is for green dollar bills. It's discusting! If they don't wanne appear to next show fine. Who cares? There are 10 000 others who would die to replace them.
Shame on all of you! 60 000$ for 3months? My familie dont even make 200 000$ a year.
I piss on your demands! Go back to school! Get a life!
On July 02 2003 03:02 UnderGroUndZerG wrote:
You can be a progamer and have a part time job. And the social service could help too. They don't need all that money.
Joy in the game?! Social service?! They don't need ALL that money?!
Geezus fuck sakes, kid. Just shut the fuck up. You have no idea just how ignorant you just sounded. I won't even waste my time explaining to you why your self-righteous idealism's misplaced by about 5 billion light-years.
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Ohh mensrea's explanation helps. Now it seems more reasonable.
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United States33128 Posts
rea, I thought you'd discover the sarcasm in the first post you replied too -.-;;
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ejai63
United States2101 Posts
no, 15000 showed up for boxer-reach
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ejai63
United States2101 Posts
On July 01 2003 19:22 hasuwar wrote:
wow, x 5? That's a little stiff..that is a poor country, too
people should get something straight about korea...yes, cost of living for an average korean is very low. i think $10,000 a year and you can support yourself. however, you ignorant retards, this doesnt mean that most koreans income very low and that korea is a poor country. low cost of living != poor country == "everyone is poor" i'm sure that in many european countries, the cost of living is not even close to the US, but nobody is calling those countries poor. besides, many of my korean friends are very well off by korean standards, meaning their parents making several hundreds of thousands a year. yes, in america, they are "only" well off, but in korea they're rich, but so what? honestly, it doesnt really matter what the cost of living in another country is, unless you make your money in one country and live in another. and if you want to get even pickier, some of my friends' parents make several million a year, which is rich by any standard.
and to people who say that the pro-gamers are idiots for striking, look at MLB and the NBA. They strike even though they make MILLIONS of dollars a year. richest pro gamers make less than $100,000. poorest pro bball, baseball players make what, $400,000? a million?
the lesson is, as exemplified in both points i made, is that its important to keep perspective.
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Well i look at it this way. No 'one' makes these people to be a progamer, and they know its not a $$$$ business unless you are the top players. I think asking x5 then the oringal amount is just bad manner( i think x2 the oringal is acceptable). If MBC give in, who knows when they will go on strike again and ask for MORE money.
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ejai63
United States2101 Posts
razor, if you had a job and your pay was not commensurate with your productivity and output, would you just sit there and continue to take it up the ass? Assuming that your co-workers felt the same way you did, i seriously doubt you would, and if you didnt do anything about it, you're a pussy.
With that being said, I'm not saying that the pro-gamers are completely geting shafted. however, i'm sure that they have very good reason for demanding more money. i believe that they honestly just want an improvement in their lifestyle. even if they make enough money to sustain their current lifestyle and just want more money, I can empathize with that too. hypothetically, if MBC Game makes millions of dollars a year, mostly through their sc shows, then the players are clearly getting screwed, even if they make enough money to live decently. I think at the most fundamental level, its not about greed or standard of living but getting what they deserve.
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Well seems a big change, maybe they will be ok with a 45K, but i think that the real problem is the concetration of bedget that the top 10 get... they get it all, BoXeR rots in money wile Bejje gets almost nothing.
more money and less concentrated, thats my opinion...
and keep the VODs or ill kick every pro asses!!!!
 baal said.
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On July 02 2003 06:16 mensrea wrote: Show nested quote +
Joy in the game?! Social service?! They don't need ALL that money?!
Geezus fuck sakes, kid. Just shut the fuck up. You have no idea just how ignorant you just sounded. I won't even waste my time explaining to you why your self-righteous idealism's misplaced by about 5 billion light-years.
ouch.
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Canada5062 Posts
On July 02 2003 08:49 Waxangel wrote:
rea, I thought you'd discover the sarcasm in the first post you replied too -.-;;
If there was any sarcasm, it wasn't apparent to anyone. Except you, of course.
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EPT
