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Eywa-
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Canada4876 Posts
February 04 2014 13:51 GMT
#41
On February 04 2014 15:29 chrisolo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 04 2014 10:32 BigFan wrote:
On February 04 2014 10:07 Eywa- wrote:
On February 04 2014 09:45 BigFan wrote:
Maybe someone can explain to me why Eywa seems to have some haters. I wasn't as involved in the scene back then although I do recall a blog from Nina challenging him and such way back. From what I understand, he made promises and couldn't keep them. That's all I'm getting from the posts above at least.

As I said in the OP, I have no intention of hiding or pretending I didn't do what happened before. The division of haters was created before most of the things which I knock myself for. Not that I can say I didn't play a part in that, the division of haters is as much a feat of mine as it is of theirs, I did not come back to make war with them. For a very brief and summarized history:

First event was a king of the hill which probably no one remembers hosted on iCCup with the help of the iCCup staff

I offered my services to LRM)Game in ISL1 for write ups and interviews at the semi-final level. - This is the point where Nina, Gecko and I became opposed... Just getting more severe over the ages because there was ultimatum offered from both sides, and I chose one over the other. There was unnecessary bm on both sides, worsening over the years.

I was interested in organizing and so, I partnered with Game to benefit from his skill set making the justin.tv king of the hill

Following the good reception of that, I created twitch.tv king of the hill

After that, joe kim was going to make a clan league, but didn't think it had enough steam to take off, so he abandoned the project. This was a project that I took on, beginning the first season of Gambit's Cup... 2 Other seasons would follow, increasing in prize pool, however, in terms of season, the order of quality was probably 3, 1, 2... The second season was a disaster due to length, there is no denying that. in terms of playoffs, the best season was 2, 3, 1 in my opinion however... which is unfortunate that I believe the best potential was lost.

In between Gambit's Cup 2 and 3 I also played a major organization role in Altitude Nation Wars.

Despite popular belief, I have done the majority of my work on my own, the development in skill of organization would be credited majorly to game, which in of itself is a huge time saver. Unfortunately, due to this association, I would also gain a lot of enemies because generally, teams thought that I favored LRM in clan events, which to be fair... I wanted them to win, which made me have to moderate them extra hard in most cases. This ended up creating a lot of enemies, including some on LRM itself because they were generally the ones feeling the stress.

Past this point, things get really rocky...

I started up several leagues simultaneously, which didn't work because I had no time to run them (Ladder league) and (European LAN). I met a ton of controversy and eventually (becoming my biggest mistake to the BW community) essentially told them to screw themselves.

After this, I went ahead and started the Liquid Pasture Community League which is a community Dota 2 league which was taken over by leloup (much thanks to him) at season 2 due to my inability to remain active. This is the only league which I built the foundation for remaining it is currently in season 4.

On July 17th, 2013... I requested to Heyoka to terminate my account.


I am a strong believer in that for my case, 80% of success is just showing up applies... Coming into the scene, I was a nobody with no experience in running anything, I learned what I could and when things worked out, people cheer, when they don't, people boo. The problem I had before was that there was no detachment, as you can see by what I have above + the fact that I used to play Brood War, Brood War was a lifestyle for me... My temperament got progressively worse to the point where I convinced people to do stuff for the sole sake of mocking them for it, one more famous than any others involving iCCup.

thanks for the summary. Explains things a lot better so I have an idea of what's going on. All I can really say is don't let the hate get to you and keep working at what tourneys you have in mind to the best of your abilities. Best of luck!


You should not only listen to one side of the story, there is MUCH more than that to it. Ask yourself why people like DraW dislikes him? Do you think the post of Eywa tells the whole truth? Not even close.

I, for myself, think he should be given one more chance, but he has to prove that ALL of the prizemoney he is promising is transferred to a 3rd party (TL admin or whatever). Then we could talk about it.

Also I do not see why an invitational should be any more legitimate than a open to all series? If you only invite your friends to play, then go ahead, but do not make a topic about it (I do not question Invitationals in general, but in Eywa's case, you never can be sure).

I fully agree with the first two parts.

The third, I will answer because it is a legitimate question, it is not more credible for those participating, the major point was that a sign up would wind up with roughly the same group of people as an invite-only would. In that respect, from an outside perspective, it is no more credible... It's just the only thing that's possible. I hope that clarifies the point I was trying to make.
Being mannered is almost as important as winning. Almost...
Eywa-
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Canada4876 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-04 14:02:11
February 04 2014 14:01 GMT
#42
On February 04 2014 11:28 dRaW wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 04 2014 07:29 2Pacalypse- wrote:
On February 04 2014 07:07 dRaW wrote:
On February 03 2014 14:38 thezanursic wrote:
You got a lot of hate in the past for way over promising, but nobody can deny that if it weren't for you the scene would be way more inactive if it weren't for you.

So if you manage to actually run something with realistic expectations...

Very curious who would accept an "invite-only" tour unless the money was upfront to a third party, not handled by Eywa or there was some actual credibility to this claim, once again by another party.

He offered TL to hold the prize pool to increase the legitimacy of the tournament.

Also, we desperately need more foreign BW events and yet most people are still being bitter and negative all the time. I don't get it.


If someone else hosted the tournament and said "sponsored by Eywa" I think it would be better than him opening a thread and saying he will organize events. TBH the negativity isn't unreasonable considering his attendance and updating of event information wasn't anywhere near punctual. For someone who needs a lot of help but is very concerned on doing everything himself, he should work harder rather than come back and bark his big talk again. Further, saying you are sorry with half ass threads like these don't admit any sort of guilt, if he REALLY wanted to redeem himself, he would've just had someone else open up a thread and everything ALREADY TO GO, then have somewhere noted that he was overshadowing/sponsoring/organized everything. I do however appreciate your confirmation.

Show nested quote +
On February 04 2014 08:59 L_Master wrote:
On February 04 2014 07:07 dRaW wrote:
Very curious who would accept an "invite-only" tour unless the money was upfront to a third party, not handled by Eywa or there was some actual credibility to this claim, once again by another party.


I'm not sure I understand. The tournament is, afaik, online; in other words there are no expenses involved. What reason would there to be not to participate? Worst possible case is there was no prize pool and you got to play some decent series against good players much like any other day on icc/fish.


The last organized tour, he didn't show up and expected all the players to organize themselves into groups, play the games, report the games, etc. There was no update, no cast, no forum posts, nothing so it was time wasted. Sure you can say, "Oh I practiced vs good players and did this and that" but most players in the BW community actually want some injected competitive spirit and we get a bit demoralized when these situations arise.

Switching shifts, I think we need to change the approach a bit. Consider we try to recruit/market/volunteer to behind the scenes efforts. Example: Thread work, casters, statistic updates, video hype, interviews etc. We have many great people who already do this and I couldn't possibly name them all but they could use the help. I find that when the event has well timed updates and run smoothly, more people participate and it makes the players want to actually try harder to perform well.

Conclusion, I'll wait to see how it unfolds but improvement in infrastructure should be taken into consideration before always throwing tournaments at players/viewers. (it really killed us in STL, but was fantastic in TLS)

I don't disagree with a lot that was said, the only thing is, there is misinterpretation going on (on both sides perhaps).

I do not intend on making any comprehensive tournaments for all Brood War players at this point, nor is there an announcement for that. When I first presented the tournament, I actually suggested that it could be played offline (as in - no stream or public view - Not LAN), it was decided that it would be best otherwise. Also, to say that I am working alone on this would be inaccurate as well and it remains unclear how much of a role I will play in the organization itself.
Being mannered is almost as important as winning. Almost...
Boonbag
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
France3318 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-04 14:03:07
February 04 2014 14:02 GMT
#43
i say give the tournament money directly to the best current foreigner so he can move korea and play in afreeca events o_O

that's the only way to prove your sincerity and you won't have to deal with any shortcoming
Fazers
Profile Joined August 2013
736 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-04 21:19:59
February 04 2014 14:37 GMT
#44
edit: sorry, i won't do that again.

User was warned for this post
skzlime
Profile Joined July 2005
Hungary462 Posts
February 04 2014 14:40 GMT
#45
my post was the most meaningful yet and i got warned for it i am sad pusheen
life is balanced, L2P
Boonbag
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
France3318 Posts
February 04 2014 14:56 GMT
#46
On February 04 2014 23:40 skzlime wrote:
my post was the most meaningful yet and i got warned for it i am sad pusheen


getting warned is part of cycle of life
dRaW
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Canada5744 Posts
February 04 2014 16:06 GMT
#47
You guys are just neglecting many important aspects. I am not hating on anything. For one, eywa was never upfront with any information - everything was always hidden so he can 'make it up on the fly' or appear so. I am saying if you make a thread like this, you know fully well before you've made the thread what your intentions are.

Rather than this I would like to see:
Name of Tournament, legitimate sponsors, which admins are in charge, who is making announcements/casting/etc, list of players, times and dates.

The fact that you are always dancing around facts and legitimacy is more troubling than these posts about making something happen, anyone can say they will do something, so if you have plans to do it just do it, don't announce plans about it. (esp with the reputation, and I didn't expect any large scale tournaments anyway. @ 2pacalypse I agree that it's good to get help from whoever but I just see a post so far and no action, given the person who has presented this idea there's no reason to give a chance until proven otherwise. This is like Telecom getting players into korean clans and stating he's a gosu player, except worse)
I don't need luck, luck is for noobs, good luck to you though
Eywa-
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Canada4876 Posts
February 04 2014 16:55 GMT
#48
On February 04 2014 16:48 Golgotha wrote:
you shouldn't just dismiss people as haters. they aren't hating on you, but what you did. they are calling you out fair and square. that said, if we can keep the drama out of this then all should be fine.

People project images of themselves, especially on the Internet, thus, it is important to understand what you did wrong in as many situations as possible, however, I disagree that you shouldn't dismiss people who hate you so long as you don't dismiss the message. A human being by default is incapable of taking massive amounts of hate without any kind of emotional throwback whatsoever and generally, due to this biological factor, you tend to have situations where people get ignored if their message doesn't get presented in the right manner... It happens everywhere, in fact, I would argue that this is least prominent on the internet because people are accustomed to more of a rough environment. Consider the internet to be a caricature of the person, with everything amplified for better and for worse.
Being mannered is almost as important as winning. Almost...
HaFnium
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United Kingdom1074 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-04 20:23:03
February 04 2014 20:20 GMT
#49
On February 04 2014 10:07 Eywa- wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 04 2014 09:45 BigFan wrote:
Maybe someone can explain to me why Eywa seems to have some haters. I wasn't as involved in the scene back then although I do recall a blog from Nina challenging him and such way back. From what I understand, he made promises and couldn't keep them. That's all I'm getting from the posts above at least.


Unfortunately, due to this association, I would also gain a lot of enemies because generally, teams thought that I favored LRM in clan events, which to be fair... I wanted them to win, which made me have to moderate them extra hard in most cases. This ended up creating a lot of enemies, including some on LRM itself because they were generally the ones feeling the stress.



Wow you are admitting it now.. (Not that we couldn't guess it though we aren't idiots.)

Anyway you know I am not your biggest fan but hope that the new tournaments will be run smoothly. At the end of the day it's your money/sponsor but still I believe most of us would like the tournament to be handled more fairly/transparently. I.e. you do do the admin work and maybe delegate tasks to other less biased people...


On February 04 2014 23:02 Boonbag wrote:
i say give the tournament money directly to the best current foreigner so he can move korea and play in afreeca events o_O

that's the only way to prove your sincerity and you won't have to deal with any shortcoming



Omg you're still around. Can you write more Pro-gaming (or korea) tales please TT
BW forever!
dsaqwe.
Profile Joined February 2011
Croatia274 Posts
February 04 2014 20:37 GMT
#50
[image loading]

User was warned for this post
Eywa-
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Canada4876 Posts
February 04 2014 20:54 GMT
#51
On February 05 2014 05:20 HaFnium wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 04 2014 10:07 Eywa- wrote:
On February 04 2014 09:45 BigFan wrote:
Maybe someone can explain to me why Eywa seems to have some haters. I wasn't as involved in the scene back then although I do recall a blog from Nina challenging him and such way back. From what I understand, he made promises and couldn't keep them. That's all I'm getting from the posts above at least.


Unfortunately, due to this association, I would also gain a lot of enemies because generally, teams thought that I favored LRM in clan events, which to be fair... I wanted them to win, which made me have to moderate them extra hard in most cases. This ended up creating a lot of enemies, including some on LRM itself because they were generally the ones feeling the stress.



Wow you are admitting it now.. (Not that we couldn't guess it though we aren't idiots.)

Anyway you know I am not your biggest fan but hope that the new tournaments will be run smoothly. At the end of the day it's your money/sponsor but still I believe most of us would like the tournament to be handled more fairly/transparently. I.e. you do do the admin work and maybe delegate tasks to other less biased people...


Show nested quote +
On February 04 2014 23:02 Boonbag wrote:
i say give the tournament money directly to the best current foreigner so he can move korea and play in afreeca events o_O

that's the only way to prove your sincerity and you won't have to deal with any shortcoming



Omg you're still around. Can you write more Pro-gaming (or korea) tales please TT

You misread, I was biased against LRM because I knew if I didn't do that, there would be problems.
Being mannered is almost as important as winning. Almost...
HaFnium
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United Kingdom1074 Posts
February 04 2014 21:27 GMT
#52
On February 05 2014 05:54 Eywa- wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 05 2014 05:20 HaFnium wrote:
On February 04 2014 10:07 Eywa- wrote:
On February 04 2014 09:45 BigFan wrote:
Maybe someone can explain to me why Eywa seems to have some haters. I wasn't as involved in the scene back then although I do recall a blog from Nina challenging him and such way back. From what I understand, he made promises and couldn't keep them. That's all I'm getting from the posts above at least.


Unfortunately, due to this association, I would also gain a lot of enemies because generally, teams thought that I favored LRM in clan events, which to be fair... I wanted them to win, which made me have to moderate them extra hard in most cases. This ended up creating a lot of enemies, including some on LRM itself because they were generally the ones feeling the stress.



Wow you are admitting it now.. (Not that we couldn't guess it though we aren't idiots.)

Anyway you know I am not your biggest fan but hope that the new tournaments will be run smoothly. At the end of the day it's your money/sponsor but still I believe most of us would like the tournament to be handled more fairly/transparently. I.e. you do do the admin work and maybe delegate tasks to other less biased people...


On February 04 2014 23:02 Boonbag wrote:
i say give the tournament money directly to the best current foreigner so he can move korea and play in afreeca events o_O

that's the only way to prove your sincerity and you won't have to deal with any shortcoming



Omg you're still around. Can you write more Pro-gaming (or korea) tales please TT

You misread, I was biased against LRM because I knew if I didn't do that, there would be problems.


Sorry that I have misread it. Wanting LRM) to win while moderating them extra hard does seem a bit contradictory though, does it not? Anyway no point arguing it doesn't change my initial message in that we'd want a transparent tournament.
BW forever!
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