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GTR
51432 Posts
Short Summary For the first time in Proleague history, the traditional grand final venue of Gwangahli Beach in Busan has been retired in favor of moving this seasons Proleague Grand Final to Shanghai, China. The finals will be held on August the 6th. The finals will be broadcast on a record number of cable channels, including OGN, XTM (owned by CJ), MBCgame, and local Shanghai cable channels. Some other stuff I don't see that's relevant... I'll let someone else handle it. | ||
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Troxior
United States168 Posts
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Crunchums
United States11143 Posts
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Megaliskuu
United States5123 Posts
On June 09 2011 11:53 Troxior wrote: Lets hope its larger than the last shanghai finals held there. While that was cool it was too small. This should be fun this change of venuE! Seriously that 300 spectators only crap was stupid. Is BW still big in china? | ||
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Loser777
1931 Posts
I do wonder what made them decide to hold another finals in China though. | ||
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ZeroChrome
Canada1001 Posts
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Xiphos
Canada7507 Posts
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darklordjac
Canada2231 Posts
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yeti
United States258 Posts
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bearbuddy
3442 Posts
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Kaolla
China2999 Posts
guess i'll go check it out if its not too hard to get in  | ||
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abomb007
China7 Posts
If it's ture I'm really happy because I'm a Chinese! And I want to say there are a lot of BW fans in China , don't doubt it. | ||
Carnivorous Sheep
Baa?21242 Posts
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sjtuqmy
China5 Posts
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supernovamaniac
United States3046 Posts
*bangs his head on the wall continuously* | ||
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naneri
Kyrgyzstan165 Posts
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Elefanto
Switzerland3584 Posts
On June 09 2011 12:19 supernovamaniac wrote: Aha, I'll be in Korea during that time. *bangs his head on the wall continuously* Must suck big time, i'm sorry :/. On the bright side, you won't be able to witness Cjs crushing defeat against SKT  | ||
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Troxior
United States168 Posts
On June 09 2011 11:54 Megaliskuu wrote: Seriously that 300 spectators only crap was stupid. Is BW still big in china? Yeah it was like omfg cool place cool pla-ohwait theres like legit no-one there and theres like at least double the people inside standing outside the place.... oh well I'm pretty sure they realized that, I am optimistic about it. Yeah I do believe its still fairly decent in china because of star wars and the like. China's scene has always been one of fluctuation I feel like. | ||
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supernovamaniac
United States3046 Posts
On June 09 2011 12:21 Elefanto wrote: Must suck big time, i'm sorry :/. On the bright side, you won't be able to witness Cjs crushing defeat against SKT I actually wouldn't mind that. Though I hope CJ doesn't get a ticket directly to finals; I want to see their staff at the stadium. | ||
swanized
Canada2480 Posts
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Hyde
Australia14568 Posts
Wonder how the Koreans feel about this. | ||
Empyrean
16977 Posts
Fuck everything. | ||
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MoonBear
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
I wonder if the Finals will have more people this time? Last time they hosted the OSL there it seemed like there weren't that many people because it was badly advertised and the like. | ||
white_horse
1019 Posts
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Zona
40426 Posts
On June 09 2011 12:42 swanized wrote: I'd be pretty fucking mad if I was a korean fan that they keep hosting finals of my national league in a foreign country Exactly what I logged in to post, except you posted it when I was logging in. Especially for fans of the team seeded into first (cough T1), who never get to see a playoff match in person. For all the investment the sponsor companies put into the teams, sometimes they make decisions that really endanger its future. | ||
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d_so
Korea (South)3262 Posts
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Redunzl
862 Posts
On June 09 2011 12:06 darklordjac wrote: Why do they keep holding finals in China? Because China is the hottest country in the world, Koreans are flocking to China for tourism in droves, and more specifically because China has the most gamers per capita of any other nation. | ||
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J1.au
Australia3596 Posts
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moopie
12605 Posts
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white_horse
1019 Posts
On June 09 2011 12:48 Redunzl wrote: Because China is the hottest country in the world, Koreans are flocking to China for tourism in droves, and more specifically because China has the most gamers per capita of any other nation. its actually the other way around | ||
BisuDagger
Bisutopia19229 Posts
On June 09 2011 12:21 Elefanto wrote: Must suck big time, i'm sorry :/. On the bright side, you won't be able to witness Cjs crushing defeat against SKT This ^ Is awesome and true. | ||
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Zona
40426 Posts
On June 09 2011 12:45 white_horse wrote: its for the money obviously I don't know if you know more than me due to understanding Korean, but what kind of money could be worth hurting fan enthusiasm for the entire scene? The entire scene provides a relatively low cost channel to promote all sorts of consumer goods and services to the Korean fanbase: phone service, gadgets, online games, airlines, clothing, beverages, and more - and many of the ads are linked to the team sponsors themselves. Making moves to damage the fans' enthusiasm could kill off their golden goose. I can understand them trying to develop an audience elsewhere...but with the damn PL finals? The culmination of an entire year's worth of games? You've got professional leagues all over the world holding exhibition games abroad, but not their damn finals. I'd be insulted if I was a Korean fan. I'm practically angry, sitting here and reading this news. | ||
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X10A
Canada9837 Posts
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Zyferous
United States270 Posts
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white_horse
1019 Posts
On June 09 2011 12:51 Zona wrote: I don't know if you know more than me due to understanding Korean, but what kind of money could be worth hurting fan enthusiasm for the entire scene? The entire scene provides a relatively low cost channel to promote all sorts of consumer goods and services to the Korean fanbase: phone service, gadgets, online games, airlines, clothing, beverages, and more - and many of the ads are linked to the team sponsors themselves. Making moves to damage the fans' enthusiasm could kill off their golden goose. I can understand them trying to develop an audience elsewhere...but with the damn PL finals? The culmination of an entire year's worth of games? You've got professional leagues all over the world holding exhibition games abroad, but not their damn finals. I'd be insulted if I was a Korean fan. I'm practically angry, sitting here and reading this news. umm I'm not happy either | ||
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Misanthrope
United States924 Posts
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES50110 Posts
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d_so
Korea (South)3262 Posts
On June 09 2011 12:51 Zona wrote: I don't know if you know more than me due to understanding Korean, but what kind of money could be worth hurting fan enthusiasm for the entire scene? The entire scene provides a relatively low cost channel to promote all sorts of consumer goods and services to the Korean fanbase: phone service, gadgets, online games, airlines, clothing, beverages, and more - and many of the ads are linked to the team sponsors themselves. Making moves to damage the fans' enthusiasm could kill off their golden goose. I can understand them trying to develop an audience elsewhere...but with the damn PL finals? The culmination of an entire year's worth of games? You've got professional leagues all over the world holding exhibition games abroad, but not their damn finals. I'd be insulted if I was a Korean fan. I'm practically angry, sitting here and reading this news. there are definitely a lot of Korean comments echoing your point of view. | ||
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Comet702
China236 Posts
On June 09 2011 11:54 Megaliskuu wrote: Seriously that 300 spectators only crap was stupid. Is BW still big in china? definitely yes! we have 5 famous Chinese BW websites, professoinal Chinese commatators and millions of BW fans here in China. to tell you the truth I am from one of the 5 BW websites, wfbrood.com. | ||
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Holgerius
Sweden16951 Posts
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Zona
40426 Posts
Damn Dogspa. | ||
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d_so
Korea (South)3262 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:03 Zona wrote: I wonder what Korean netizen reactions are like. Damn Dogspa. from what I see on Fomos they are herra pissed. there's been 3 articles on it, the latter two seemingly intent on assuaging the hate on the boards... it's not working tho | ||
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Comet702
China236 Posts
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Zona
40426 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:02 Comet702 wrote: definitely yes! we have 5 famous Chinese BW websites, professoinal Chinese commatators and millions of BW fans here in China. to tell you the truth I am from one of the 5 BW websites, wfbrood.com. the question is how many of the fans will be allowed to show up? "Security concerns" or whatever? I'm sure the fanbase was comparable during those OSL finals. There's no doubt there's plenty of BW fans in China. | ||
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Chimpalimp
United States1135 Posts
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d_so
Korea (South)3262 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:09 Comet702 wrote: ok, Can anyone comfirm this news? if it is true i will post it on my website. www.wfbrood.com fomos has 3 articles discussing it. First one announcing the news, the second one intimating that the fans already knew about it (which is bs), and the last one wondering what effect it will have on the pro teams. So if you're looking for another source, then yeah, fomos confirms too. | ||
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white_horse
1019 Posts
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Zyferous
United States270 Posts
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Zona
40426 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:13 d_so wrote: fomos has 3 articles discussing it. First one announcing the news, the second one intimating that the fans already knew about it (which is bs), and the last one wondering what effect it will have on the pro teams. So if you're looking for another source, then yeah, fomos confirms too. Considering even the players always talked about Gwangahli in interviews it's obvious they didn't know, either. Well, front line workers are always the last to be told important info. Bah. And it's got to be Kespa that made the final call - AFAICT, Kespa runs everything regarding PL and OGN wouldn't be able to unilaterally make that sort of decision. | ||
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d_so
Korea (South)3262 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:14 white_horse wrote: the fomos article seems to suggest that kespa or OGN (whoever is running this) is trying to spread brood war e-sports to the international level, which in itself imo isn't bad but considering how professional BW outside korea is dead, its a pretty idiotic decision. people are so stupid these days i think korea's definition of international and the western definition is different. Korea's "international" probably means just China. Western definition of "international" is all the players who have met limited success at BW and have moved over to SC2. Nor do I think Korea is too interested in getting Chinese players, though a few wouldnt hurt to boost appeal (think: Nikoon in 2pm, that chinese guy in super junior, that chinese girl in FX). They're more interested in the masses and masses of fans. | ||
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Comet702
China236 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:13 d_so wrote: fomos has 3 articles discussing it. First one announcing the news, the second one intimating that the fans already knew about it (which is bs), and the last one wondering what effect it will have on the pro teams. So if you're looking for another source, then yeah, fomos confirms too. thanks a lot ~ | ||
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zobz
Canada2175 Posts
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vectorix108
United States4633 Posts
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d_so
Korea (South)3262 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:23 zobz wrote: Yeah seems quite a strange decision. Of course they want to encourage growth of BW appretiation in China, which is so close by and already into e-sports and probably has cultural similarities, but it seems irrational to make investments that are so disporportionate to the demand. Really you think the potential for long-term growth of e-sports in China outweighs the potential for short-term damage to your foundational home fanbase, in a time when it's just stabalizing after multiple recent contraversies? Stupid KESpA. well, one thing to note is that demand for starcraft seems pretty strong regardless of what happens. Or at least, one could easily be led to think that way after how easily Korean BW fended off SC2. Maybe KesPA is betting its fans will bear with this like they persevered through all the sc2/weird time changes/delays/lawsuits bullshit. I don't know if I agree or disagree with them though. Whether it's in game or out of game, when you expand you expose yourself to vulnerabilities, but you eventually have to expand or you'll mine yourself out. right? And your spelling is fucked up again. just helping you out. | ||
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Zona
40426 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:28 d_so wrote: well, one thing to note is that demand for starcraft seems pretty strong regardless of what happens. Or at least, one could easily be led to think that way after how easily Korean BW fended off SC2. Maybe KesPA is betting its fans will bear with this like they persevered through all the sc2/weird time changes/delays/lawsuits bullshit. I don't know if I agree or disagree with them though. Whether it's in game or out of game, when you expand you expose yourself to vulnerabilities, but you eventually have to expand or you'll mine yourself out. right? And your spelling is fucked up again. just helping you out. I think you might be right about Kespa taking its Korean fanbase for granted. But fans aren't minerals at an expansion that mine out after a certain amount of time. Fans are plants that grow or shrivel with the nourishment they receive. | ||
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whamm
67 Posts
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ArvickHero
10387 Posts
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Antoine
United States7481 Posts
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Cambium
United States16368 Posts
You also have to look at the sponsors, the Shanghai OSL sponsor was Korean Airlines, and the current SPL is sponsored by Shinhan Bank. Maybe Shinhan Bank is planning on expanding its consumer banking business to China (Shanghai in particular), who knows. ...or that I'm just excited because I'm in China, and I might actually go if the tickets are cheap enough. | ||
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white_horse
1019 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:38 whamm wrote: go china keep this game alive pls its really a definition of what you mean by "keeping it alive". having a lot of fans means more ads and more sponsorships - and therefore money. So that keeps the industry alive in a very important way. If you want to make professional brood war actually grow (or even just to maintain it), then you need new players and fresh players continually coming in, making bigger teams, making more teams, making more talent - the only country on this planet that supports and encourages this is south korea. so its very meaningless to try to encourage brood war growth elsewhere; the skill gap is so high and the fact that SC2 came out pretty much ended professional foreign BW. so if kespa thinks that their industry is actually going to grow in terms of people playing the game and more professional players by going to china, they are being incredibly stupid. the only benefit that is coming out of this is more money from the market in china and more chinese viewers in the future due to exposure and awareness | ||
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Caladbolg
2855 Posts
I find it similar to what Commissioner David Stern of the NBA did. Since he wanted to expand the NBA market, he had games hosted in London, China, etc, and those games were well received. The ultimate plan would be to have foreign (non-US) NBA teams. While structurally and logistically it would be hard to have non-US NBA teams, eventually it could be a possibility (proper scheduling, reduction of total regular season games, etc.) The Korean fanbase will always be the most important crowd because that's where the companies get their moolah, but I also think the bigger sponsors are now multinationals and would benefit tremendously from the giant consumer market that is China. Esp since they're now the world economic super power. | ||
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Legatus Lanius
2135 Posts
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a176
Canada6688 Posts
![[image loading]](http://static.arstechnica.com/2011/03/28/2006ProleagueFinals.jpg) | ||
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Chewii101
Canada23 Posts
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d_so
Korea (South)3262 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:51 Caladbolg wrote: China is THE next e-sports capital (sorry Sweden). . they certainly rock at dota. | ||
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Antoine
United States7481 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:51 Caladbolg wrote: I find it similar to what Commissioner David Stern of the NBA did. Since he wanted to expand the NBA market, he had games hosted in London, China, etc, and those games were well received. The ultimate plan would be to have foreign (non-US) NBA teams. While structurally and logistically it would be hard to have non-US NBA teams, eventually it could be a possibility (proper scheduling, reduction of total regular season games, etc.) there is a big difference between having a preseason game of a random game early in the regular season overseas, and having the final which has been in the same place for almost a decade overseas | ||
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Vasoline73
United States7801 Posts
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pyrogenetix
China5094 Posts
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Carnivorous Sheep
Baa?21242 Posts
What? No it's not? | ||
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dtz
5834 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:51 Caladbolg wrote: While I initially agreed with the notion that this spits on the face of the Korean fanbase, I think this would be a good thing for the BW scene overall. China is THE next e-sports capital (sorry Sweden). Imagine how fast they were able to air the SC2 league on TV? So logically, if KeSPA didn't want its talent pool and fanbase to dry up, doing this would be the first step. I find it similar to what Commissioner David Stern of the NBA did. Since he wanted to expand the NBA market, he had games hosted in London, China, etc, and those games were well received. The ultimate plan would be to have foreign (non-US) NBA teams. While structurally and logistically it would be hard to have non-US NBA teams, eventually it could be a possibility (proper scheduling, reduction of total regular season games, etc.) The Korean fanbase will always be the most important crowd because that's where the companies get their moolah, but I also think the bigger sponsors are now multinationals and would benefit tremendously from the giant consumer market that is China. Esp since they're now the world economic super power. Sure having one or two exhibition games is fine especially if its Pre-season. But the idea of holding even regular season games overseas is not going to be well received at all by fans inside the US. The EPL also tinkered with the idea of having a regular season game overseas and it was very quickly shot down. Imagine if NBA finals ( Heat vs Dallas) is played in China. Can you imagine how angry the US NBA fans would be. This is what is happening with this PL. Koreans fans have every right to be outraged. | ||
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Caladbolg
2855 Posts
On June 09 2011 14:27 Antoine wrote: there is a big difference between having a preseason game of a random game early in the regular season overseas, and having the final which has been in the same place for almost a decade overseas Of course, and that's where the similarity ends. But the concept is the same. I suppose since esports is still a niche thing overall, few people would watch a normal game, as opposed to the PL finals. Same thing with the OSL last year. EDIT: And to address the post above me, it was only an analogy. They're similar, but obviously the NBA would have bigger potential losses than KeSPA. I think it's a necessary evil to inject new blood in the scene. Again, I agreed initially with the reaction but deep down I now believe this is what's best for BW. I'm sure a lot of thought went into this within KeSPA as well. I hope the Korean fans can forgive. | ||
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Spica
United States5582 Posts
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LunarDestiny
United States4177 Posts
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InTheFade
United States1721 Posts
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Fionn
United States23455 Posts
Also playing on the beach has been an iconic image. It's also been great with the ceremonies, the presentation and crowd reactions. I would be okay if it was another MSL/OSL Final because there are usually six single titles a year, but there is only ONE PROLEAGUE FINAL every year. Will the final even take place outside? It has to. Come on. | ||
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Slow Motion
United States6960 Posts
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
I'm at office right now, but can't stop smiling, this is so PERFECT. I feel so lucky and didn't even do anything special to deserve such a treat. I know exactly how one must feel when winning the lottery jackpot. Damn I can't even believe it, this is wonderful. The irony is that next month I'll start a new project for a Korean customer and may be sent on-site lol. I'll make sure to be home on week end ! | ||
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BlackMesa
Kenya338 Posts
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ehalf
408 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:20 d_so wrote: i think korea's definition of international and the western definition is different. Korea's "international" probably means just China. Western definition of "international" is all the players who have met limited success at BW and have moved over to SC2. Nor do I think Korea is too interested in getting Chinese players, though a few wouldnt hurt to boost appeal (think: Nikoon in 2pm, that chinese guy in super junior, that chinese girl in FX). They're more interested in the masses and masses of fans. Unfortunately, currently there are no Chinese BW players. There are maybe some fans playing BW, but there is no profession BW gamers anymore and of course no BW team. Only few fan clans exist. It's literally impossible for Kespa to attract Chinese players to play BW since all the Chinese young RTS ppl are playing WC3, DOTA, SC2. | ||
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Iplaythings
Denmark9110 Posts
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Sinensis
United States2513 Posts
If it's -big- however, I will be happy and satisfied as a fan. Numbers should be the most important deciding factor. The BW scene needs numbers. Hope it's not another invite only small China finals. | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
On June 09 2011 16:08 ehalf wrote: Unfortunately, currently there are no Chinese BW players. There are maybe some fans playing BW, but there is no profession BW gamers anymore and of course no BW team. Only few fan clans exist. It's literally impossible for Kespa to attract Chinese players to play BW since all the Chinese young RTS ppl are playing WC3, DOTA, SC2. It's not about making Chinese players to play BW at all... They just want to put out feelers. Like to see how to arrange broadcasting with local channels, making good contacts with local e-sports representatives etc. MBC and OGN, who are probably the ones responsible for having grand finals in Shanghai do not only broadcast SCBW and may consider enlarging e-sports audience to China, for games other than BW. On June 09 2011 16:10 Iplaythings wrote: I feel sorry for the koreans. And happy for the chineese. And neutral cus I am gonna be in Denmark at that time, I hope the flight wont have a negative effect on the games Flight didn't seem to impact the quality of the KA S2 OSL at all, so I'm pretty confident ! Hope you're not too disappointed to be in Denmark this summer :p | ||
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raga4ka
Bulgaria5679 Posts
On June 09 2011 16:08 ehalf wrote: Unfortunately, currently there are no Chinese BW players. There are maybe some fans playing BW, but there is no profession BW gamers anymore and of course no BW team. Only few fan clans exist. It's literally impossible for Kespa to attract Chinese players to play BW since all the Chinese young RTS ppl are playing WC3, DOTA, SC2. You don't have to be a professional BW player to enjoy watching BW . If you ever played BW or like watching games for entertainment as a whole you will surely enjoy watching the most professional gamers ever with commentary in your language . Even the korean commentators make the games really exciting even thought i don't understand them . And BW is way more entertaining to watch them other games including SC 2 . | ||
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Ryo
8787 Posts
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ArvickHero
10387 Posts
On June 09 2011 15:38 endy wrote: HOLY FUCKING SHIT THIS IS AWESOME MY WILDEST DREAMS OF SEEING PROLEAGUE GRAND FINALS BECOMES TRUE AND I DONT EVEN NEED TO GO TO KOREA ?! I'm at office right now, but can't stop smiling, this is so PERFECT. I feel so lucky and didn't even do anything special to deserve such a treat. I know exactly how one must feel when winning the lottery jackpot. Damn I can't even believe it, this is wonderful. The irony is that next month I'll start a new project for a Korean customer and may be sent on-site lol. I'll make sure to be home on week end ! at least someone is happy haha.. | ||
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Baarn
United States2702 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:02 Comet702 wrote: definitely yes! we have 5 famous Chinese BW websites, professoinal Chinese commatators and millions of BW fans here in China. to tell you the truth I am from one of the 5 BW websites, wfbrood.com. If you have millions of fans then break record at Busan at least. | ||
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EchoZ
Japan5041 Posts
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
Oh sure I am :D By the way, I wanted to open a blog on TL to share my last night dream, but I'll do it here : I dreamed that I participated an online amateur singing contest, with a mystery grand prize, I sang and recorded "DTs on Top" an put it online, and I won the whole contest. In my dream I was so pumped, like "haha when I'm gonna tell that on TL, its gonna be so sick!" then still in my dream, the website that organized the contest sent someone to interview me and announce me what the grand prize was as, my alarm clock rang and I woke up T_T I guess I got my grand prize anyway ! I just hope SKT doesn't fail to be in the Grand Finals. Just like Nada and Boxer failed to reach semis of that SC2 tournament which had semis and finals played in Shanghai T_T I could have seen two more bonjwas on the same day (already saw Flash and JD last September). Last word : Seeing Bisu would be even better than seeing all the bonjwas together. | ||
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ZoW
United States3983 Posts
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Rhaegar99
Australia1190 Posts
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:51 Caladbolg wrote: China is THE next e-sports capital (sorry Sweden). . Likely what KesPA is thinking, as well, but... I think they're miscalculating. Professional BW is dead outside of Korea. They'll get the diehards in China, but the diehards would've watched the PL finals wherever it is, and I doubt the admission fee is going to cover the costs especially after accounting for currency differences. On June 09 2011 14:19 d_so wrote: they certainly rock at dota. And wisdom suggests if you want to expand eSports in China, you should play the games they're playing. Of course, KesPA being a BW organization doesn't have much of a choice in the matter. As someone who's been observing the Chinese scene in various games, I think the interest is there, but there is a lack of money and official support. Outside of Dota, which has good (though not great) sponsorship, all the other games have limited funding, few pro teams, and mediocre tournaments. Moreover, both the government and the society seem to have relatively conservative attitudes - ie games are a waste of time. That's not too different from most other places, but might be compounded by Chinese parents being allowed to have only one child and consequently placing all their expectations on that child. It's not an environment that I'd think would be supportive of an old game like BW. If eSports is to become huge in China, it'd probably have to do so with the newer generations, and the newer generations tend to play games that aren't BW. SC 2 had a chance, but its official release being delayed a year did not help the scene. On the other hand, there's something about Dota and Dota-like games that is really liked there. Maybe they just have a different kind of gaming culture. | ||
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Spica
United States5582 Posts
On June 09 2011 19:26 Rhaegar99 wrote: Are there any korean netizen response to this? Im fairly disappointed in this decision. I can understand OSL or MSL finals in China since its happens like once every 4 months, but a proleague finals happens once every 1.5 year or so. The Korean netizens are outraged and disgusted at the decision. Sure, there are very few fans who are like, "Well, this might be good for the BW/eSports scene as a whole...", but they are far outnumbered by the pissed off fans. There is cursing at the news everywhere and lots of ㅠㅠㅠㅠ emoticons as well. Some netizens are even saying, "Augh, the finals are gonna end up in epic failure now...." | ||
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bITt.mAN
Switzerland3693 Posts
HOLY SHIT my older brother works in Shanghai. Nevermind, he is TOTALLY going to this q;/contacts sibling | ||
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Ryo
8787 Posts
On June 09 2011 19:38 Spica wrote: The Korean netizens are outraged and disgusted at the decision. Sure, there are very few fans who are like, "Well, this might be good for the BW/eSports scene as a whole...", but they are far outnumbered by the pissed off fans. There is cursing at the news everywhere and lots of ㅠㅠㅠㅠ emoticons as well. Some netizens are even saying, "Augh, the finals are gonna end up in epic failure now...." Yeah a lot of Korean fans work very hard to support their players, going to matches and organising events etc even though they have school to attend. Now they can't even go to watch their team live at the most important event of the year. Edit: But I suppose this keeps their sponsors happy and PL does need major sponsors to keep it going. | ||
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kidleader
Korea (South)233 Posts
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Arceus
Vietnam8333 Posts
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everstarleague
China89 Posts
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hacklebeast
United States5090 Posts
I think this is a bad business decision, but those guys know a lot more about the state of the scene and about business that I do, so I'll give them the benefit of the doubt. I hope that they get a much better stadium than the OSL one though. | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8637 Posts
why the fuck are the finals being held in china when theyve done shit all to support pro bw this is fkin retarded | ||
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CobaltBlu
United States919 Posts
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trance-
United States46 Posts
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pyrogenetix
China5094 Posts
On June 09 2011 17:58 EchoZ wrote: Why not beijing beijing is too old and too political. shanghai is wehre it's at now dude, it's hot shit here. | ||
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KameZerg
Sweden1761 Posts
On June 09 2011 22:29 pyrogenetix wrote: beijing is too old and too political. shanghai is wehre it's at now dude, it's hot shit here. I say Hong Kong | ||
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jpak
United States5045 Posts
Holding the finals there is just dumb, I think. | ||
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GTR
51432 Posts
i don't want to beat a dead horse with the analogies... but i just have to... what if the super bowl was held in europe? what if the champions league final was in asia? makes no sense, right? | ||
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XsebT
Denmark2980 Posts
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Ryo
8787 Posts
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trexbqs
Malaysia1731 Posts
Those who in Shanghai lucky get to watch final live. | ||
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SkelA
Macedonia13032 Posts
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naneri
Kyrgyzstan165 Posts
Hong Kong doesn't suit very well because it is like some special zone of china and not to comfortable for people to get there. And also a question - why didn't they come up with holding up one of the semis in China. I think that would already be something special for chinese fans. And even more - how about one semis in China and another one in Japan/USA and the epic finals in Korea so it would really be something special and at the same time not crashing their plans on expanding outside of Korea. | ||
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ggggbabybabybaby
Canada304 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/2HZnV.png) | ||
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konadora
Singapore66156 Posts
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oBlade
United States5524 Posts
On June 09 2011 22:52 GTR wrote: to add my opinion, such a slap in the face to the koreans. i don't want to beat a dead horse with the analogies... but i just have to... what if the super bowl was held in europe? what if the champions league final was in asia? makes no sense, right? I don't know. How many people actually go to Busan from Seoul to watch as opposed to people who already live in Busan just showing up at the beach? To those people from the rest of the country who wouldn't make a special trip anyway, it's probably no matter whether the final is held in Busan or Shanghai. | ||
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reincremate
China2213 Posts
On June 10 2011 02:08 oBlade wrote: I don't know. How many people actually go to Busan from Seoul to watch as opposed to people who already live in Busan just showing up at the beach? To those people from the rest of the country who wouldn't make a special trip anyway, it's probably no matter whether the final is held in Busan or Shanghai. Don't you need a passport to go to China though? edit: also plane tickets are probably going to be more expensive/inconvenient than train/bus fare. | ||
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kamikami
France1057 Posts
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mmdmmd
722 Posts
On June 09 2011 13:14 white_horse wrote: the fomos article seems to suggest that kespa or OGN (whoever is running this) is trying to spread brood war e-sports to the international level, which in itself imo isn't bad but considering how professional BW outside korea is dead, its a pretty idiotic decision. people are so stupid these days boardcast fees. I am sure there are TV channels that are interested. | ||
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white_horse
1019 Posts
its not "droves of koreans". I've read articles on korean newspaper websites about newly rich chinese people (from their economic growth) going to korea for kpop concerts, visit korean drama shooting locations, plastic surgery, etc etc | ||
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Caos2
United States1728 Posts
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
On June 10 2011 07:38 white_horse wrote: its not "droves of koreans". I've read articles on korean newspaper websites about newly rich chinese people (from their economic growth) going to korea for kpop concerts, visit korean drama shooting locations, plastic surgery, etc etc The term Hallyu wave came to be because some chinese newspaper reported it I believe I could be wrong tho. | ||
Xxio
Canada5565 Posts
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8637 Posts
definitely more japanese and chinese tourists coming to korea cause of our entertainment industry, and the countrys overall development in the last decade or so | ||
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k.taeyang
Peru145 Posts
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Carnivorous Sheep
Baa?21242 Posts
On June 10 2011 07:38 white_horse wrote: its not "droves of koreans". I've read articles on korean newspaper websites about newly rich chinese people (from their economic growth) going to korea for kpop concerts, visit korean drama shooting locations, plastic surgery, etc etc It goes both ways, it's not some unilateral movement from one country to another. | ||
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MangoTango
United States3670 Posts
On June 09 2011 12:19 supernovamaniac wrote: Aha, I'll be in Korea during that time. *bangs his head on the wall continuously* lol well that's kinda ironic. | ||
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ArvickHero
10387 Posts
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swanized
Canada2480 Posts
On June 10 2011 09:19 ArvickHero wrote: You know what would be the solution to this? Have the PL finals in a Bo3 series format like the rest of the playoffs instead of just a lameass Bo1 series. That way first match could be held at Shanghai, and the rest held in the Holy Land of Gwangahnri Beach. I was always kinda annoyed at how last year's PL final was only Bo1 series anyways. That's a good idea but preparing two venue is probably impossible | ||
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Assymptotic
United States552 Posts
On June 10 2011 09:19 ArvickHero wrote: I was always kinda annoyed at how last year's PL final was only Bo1 series anyways. Me too...what's the rationale behind this format? Too expensive to host for 3 days? | ||
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hellbound
United Kingdom2242 Posts
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d_so
Korea (South)3262 Posts
On June 10 2011 09:23 swanized wrote: That's a good idea but preparing two venue is probably impossible if they hold it one week apart it might be more feasible. not to mention more EPIC | ||
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ZeroChrome
Canada1001 Posts
On June 10 2011 09:56 hellbound wrote: Wasn't that OSL final in a TV tower? If so I don't get all the moaning about venue capacity. The OSL final had 300 people in the audience, the PL final usually has like 30,000 or more. There will be a serious problem if the biggest event in all of esports has an attendance lower than some PL matches. | ||
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prototype.
Canada4200 Posts
Hopefully this turns out good for broodwar in the end. | ||
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seRapH
United States9756 Posts
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Caphe
Vietnam10817 Posts
On June 09 2011 11:54 Megaliskuu wrote: Seriously that 300 spectators only crap was stupid. Is BW still big in china? No worries here. Even without any Chinese fan, if the venue of the final is below 1000 people. Korean people in Shanghai will fill that up easily. I am leaving Shanghai in July, fuk damn, no PL final for me T_T. | ||
Emlary
China3334 Posts
Did they say which venue will this be held? Jinshan beach maybe? | ||
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synapse
China13814 Posts
On June 09 2011 12:01 Xiphos wrote: Does China even have BW fans anymore? From what my cousin tells me, most of the old BW fans are still BW fans. Mostly WC3 players have moved to SCII. | ||
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iloahz
United States964 Posts
so gamefy is saying that OGN is planning a new esports league in China, details of which remain secretive for now. Some are speculating a kespa sc2 league since BW in China is pretty much dead. But Kespa doesn't have the right to hold sc2 league so I don't know. | ||
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GTR
51432 Posts
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dtz
5834 Posts
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Release
United States4397 Posts
BRING BACK THE BO3 FORMAT FFS. MAKE IT BO5. JUST HAVE AT LEAST A GAME AT THE BEACH. | ||
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eviltomahawk
United States11135 Posts
On June 10 2011 12:41 dtz wrote: if kespa/ogn truly cant hold an sc2 league in china, then its pretty likely that it's a Dota league because dota in china is huge and they have wage structures and fans who support it kinda like BW is in Korea. It is also huge in the region ( southeast asia, russia) and they might anticipate the release of dota 2. But does Blizzard have some control over DotA rights since it's technically a mod of WC3? I'm not very familiar with these legal technicalities. Although GOM has the rights to SC2 in Korea, do those rights extend to Korean organizations trying to arrange for SC2 leagues and broadcasts outside of Korea? Anyways, this news is great for Chinese fans but quite disappointing for Korean fans. I'm sure the event will draw hordes of Chinese spectators and some hardcore Korean fans, but I dislike the notion of holding such a high-profile event outside of Korea. | ||
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Ryo
8787 Posts
On June 10 2011 10:05 ZeroChrome wrote: The OSL final had 300 people in the audience, the PL final usually has like 30,000 or more. There will be a serious problem if the biggest event in all of esports has an attendance lower than some PL matches. It was 300 people because OGN insisted on holding it at the Oriental Pearl Tower. The date was 9/11 so they had to limit the number of spectators. If it was another venue, it would have drawn more than 300 people. Still, I wish the PL final was held in Korea. | ||
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Fionn
United States23455 Posts
If it isn't on a beach, I riot. | ||
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GTR
51432 Posts
![[image loading]](http://www.fivb.ch/EN/beachvolleyball/Competitions/WorldTour/2008/venue%20view1.jpg) i can see it on the beach. | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
On June 10 2011 14:41 Ryo wrote: It was 300 people because OGN insisted on holding it at the Oriental Pearl Tower. The date was 9/11 so they had to limit the number of spectators. If it was another venue, it would have drawn more than 300 people. Still, I wish the PL final was held in Korea. You guys are clearly exaggerating. 300 was the amount of "vip tickets", i.e central bleachers, complimentary OSL usb stick and thunder sticks the color of the player you're cheering for. Anyone could see really well by just sitting on lateral bleachers. All you had to do was getting the tower park ticket which cost 5$. I'd say that we were between 2000 and 3500 people to attend the finals. The thing they were criticized for, and why you all think there were only 300 seats, is that in every official announcement of the OSL finals they said there would be only 300 tickets, but they forgot to mention it was free to sit outside of the "vip bleachers". In the end many people didn't even come to the venue because they thought they had no chance to get tickets... while they could have watched OSL finals for 5$... edit : ^^ GTR, isn't that Jinshan beach, the venue Emlary mentioned ? | ||
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GTR
51432 Posts
i can just see tens of thousands of people piling up on the beach to watch. | ||
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J1.au
Australia3596 Posts
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Ryo
8787 Posts
On June 10 2011 15:11 J1.au wrote: I'm so disappointed, I thought they cared about the fans in Korea. Turns out the incompetence isn't just confined to KeSPA and Blizzard, they are all bad. I remember the commentators pleading with the fans to stick with Brood War following the scandal and this is how they repay them? It could turn out to be a good move to please the sponsors, I dunno. It's this time of the year when there are a lot of rumors floating around. Sigh. | ||
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doothegee
Korea (South)3011 Posts
Translation of a post on Starcraft Gallery: Some guy called KeSPA and asked why the finals were being held in China, and they answered it was what the sponsors wanted. Believe it if you want. | ||
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PH
United States6173 Posts
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hacklebeast
United States5090 Posts
On an unrelated note. I didn't realize how early they set these up. So once a year they just close a large part of a major beach in summer for starcraft? That's pretty cool | ||
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bITt.mAN
Switzerland3693 Posts
SK T1 recently did a seminar on humour, in the hopes of improving ![[image loading]](http://img.dailygame.co.kr/news/20110604/20110604_9363e5916520f0e8971e0ae363f69dd8.jpg) "This is a good idea, we approve!" Also dear babel fish can only do so much to translate Korean sites, I can't find the venue details/address/date information to bombard my older brother with so that he can go :S Plox | ||
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Zona
40426 Posts
On June 10 2011 15:11 J1.au wrote: I'm so disappointed, I thought they cared about the fans in Korea. Turns out the incompetence isn't just confined to KeSPA and Blizzard, they are all bad. I remember the commentators pleading with the fans to stick with Brood War following the scandal and this is how they repay them? Yeah, that part makes it worse. | ||
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writer22816
United States5775 Posts
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white_horse
1019 Posts
On June 12 2011 11:22 writer22816 wrote: So basically this is a thread mostly filled with people who live neither in China nor Korea and are complaining about the finals venue. And also can someone please explain to me how hosting the finals in China could possibly be bad for professional BW? the idea of having the finals in china isn't inherently bad, they have good venues and lots of BW fans there; whats bad is the utter betrayal of thousands of fans in the biggest BW scene in the world. You have the culmination of season's worth of games in korea only to have the final end up somewhere else. I guarentee you there are very passionate and diehard korean fans who have spent a lot of time watching proleague. You spend all this time cheering for a player or team and then the finals, which you have been excited about, is suddenly not going to be in gwang-anri, which you were planning to go to? Do you think every fan in korea has the time and money to travel to shanghai to see a proleague final? Those korean fans got totally robbed. Someone in the thread said that kespa is taking korean fans for granted and I think thats true. The more disgusted people feel, the less they will watch. It's really meaningless to spread BW abroad if support at home falls. Now this probably isn't going to happen just because one proleague final happened to take place elsewhere but given how much korean people are pissed with kespa and others who are running the show, I don't get why they think it's a good idea. | ||
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pyrogenetix
China5094 Posts
On June 10 2011 16:46 doothegee wrote: http://gall.dcinside.com/list.php?id=starcraft_new&no=48478 Translation of a post on Starcraft Gallery: Some guy called KeSPA and asked why the finals were being held in China, and they answered it was what the sponsors wanted. Believe it if you want. Well duh. The spending power of chinese people in Shanghai is huge. | ||
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aimaimaim
Philippines2167 Posts
On June 10 2011 23:12 bITt.mAN wrote: It's not a Fomos so it's fine. SK T1 recently did a seminar on humour, in the hopes of improving "This is a good idea, we approve!" Also dear babel fish can only do so much to translate Korean sites, I can't find the venue details/address/date information to bombard my older brother with so that he can go :S Plox Those shoes really hurts my eyes .. damn | ||
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phosphorylation
United States2935 Posts
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ArvickHero
10387 Posts
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a176
Canada6688 Posts
On June 12 2011 13:55 white_horse wrote: the idea of having the finals in china isn't inherently bad, they have good venues and lots of BW fans there; whats bad is the utter betrayal of thousands of fans in the biggest BW scene in the world. You have the culmination of season's worth of games in korea only to have the final end up somewhere else. I guarentee you there are very passionate and diehard korean fans who have spent a lot of time watching proleague. You spend all this time cheering for a player or team and then the finals, which you have been excited about, is suddenly not going to be in gwang-anri, which you were planning to go to? Do you think every fan in korea has the time and money to travel to shanghai to see a proleague final? Those korean fans got totally robbed. Someone in the thread said that kespa is taking korean fans for granted and I think thats true. The more disgusted people feel, the less they will watch. It's really meaningless to spread BW abroad if support at home falls. Now this probably isn't going to happen just because one proleague final happened to take place elsewhere but given how much korean people are pissed with kespa and others who are running the show, I don't get why they think it's a good idea. imagine if nba/nhl finals took place ... in europe ?! like that | ||
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Chef
10810 Posts
I don't like that they are screwing up tradition, but they might have thought about it at least a little. PS: Chef is bad at geography. | ||
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Hirmu
Finland850 Posts
the red ones are pretty cool tho | ||
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Ryo
8787 Posts
On June 12 2011 17:10 phosphorylation wrote: I'm hearing that the PL sponsor Shinhan Bank had an influence on this, since they are trying to expand to chinese market. Well whatever it takes to get Shinhan to renew their sponsorship of PL I guess. It expires at the end of this season. It would be disastrous if PL did not have a major sponsor. | ||
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[Azn]Nada
United States275 Posts
red ones are aiight, but the barf green and orange shirt/shoe sandwich are visual nightmares | ||
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allen_ami
China1392 Posts
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bITt.mAN
Switzerland3693 Posts
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GolemMadness
Canada11044 Posts
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bITt.mAN
Switzerland3693 Posts
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xarthaz
1704 Posts
On June 16 2011 00:15 Ryo wrote: Well whatever it takes to get Shinhan to renew their sponsorship of PL I guess. It expires at the end of this season. It would be disastrous if PL did not have a major sponsor. | ||
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Enderbantoo
United States465 Posts
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Zyferous
United States270 Posts
Can anybody enlighten me on whether or not you have to pay for tickets or sign up for seats? | ||
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d_so
Korea (South)3262 Posts
On June 26 2011 06:03 xarthaz wrote: Well ProLeague and MBC have been running at a loss for quite a while now so even with sponsorship renewed, it seems dubious as to how they could continue in bad business situation. It may be that the leagues are overexpanded for the current market interest. While 3 big leagues mightve been optimal at the height of BW in mid 2000s, with the current decreased interest it is time to wrap up some of the activities, liquidate, and continue the ones that can still turn a profit. Not good change for a fan- but to remain active it may be necessary in next season or so. do u have a source for "running at a loss"? | ||
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xarthaz
1704 Posts
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Antisocialmunky
United States5912 Posts
On June 26 2011 10:25 xarthaz wrote: One of the Koreans here said it here i believe. Im sure they wouldnt lie on a matter as serious as this. I'll wait for Rekrul's drunken fire-side chat on the matter :\ | ||
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Zona
40426 Posts
As long as the cost of running PL is comparable or cheaper than other shows that attract a similar audience (in demographic and size) then PL will remain. I have a feeling though that when pro BW dies - it will be killed from within. Someone will have killed the goose that lays the golden eyes. | ||
flamewheel
FREEAGLELAND26781 Posts
Except for I need to leave from Beijing... ;_; | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
On July 01 2011 17:32 flamewheel wrote: Oh whoa I just realized that I'm going to be in China till the morning of the 7th... Except for I need to leave from Beijing... ;_; You have 10 hours to go back to Beijing, it's not like PL Grand Finals isn't worth a sleepless night. EZPZ | ||
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laLAlA[uC]
Canada963 Posts
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xXFireandIceXx
Canada4296 Posts
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xXFireandIceXx
Canada4296 Posts
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JohannesH
Finland1364 Posts
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Zyferous
United States270 Posts
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Ryo
8787 Posts
On July 11 2011 22:15 Zyferous wrote: Does anybody know the exactly location of the venue, or what time of the day it is going to be held, or is this all of this information still pending? From the Kespa website, it says Shanghai Se Ki Gwang Jang, which I think refers to Century Square in Shanghai. Date: August 6th 2011, 6pm. 6pm could refer to KST instead of local Shanghai time, since this info is from the Kespa site. http://www.e-sports.or.kr/ | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
On July 11 2011 22:45 Ryo wrote: From the Kespa website, it says Shanghai Se Ki Gwang Jang, which I think refers to Century Square in Shanghai. Date: August 6th 2011, 6pm. 6pm could refer to KST instead of local Shanghai time, since this info is from the Kespa site. http://www.e-sports.or.kr/ oh wow, it's in Century park :'( damn that sucks, I thought they would organize this on the beach... I guess there won't be over 3000 seats again... well more chances to touch Bisu's hair. | ||
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Empyrean
16977 Posts
AOEIFJAOIEWFJOAIEJFOAEJIF Ugh. So incredibly disappointed. | ||
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Kaolla
China2999 Posts
midi festival this summer had way more ppl i'd say? (just a feeling tho) | ||
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mmdmmd
722 Posts
source plu ![[image loading]](http://www.plu.cn/d/file/sc/note/2011-07-11/37f373fc0c9068154278756c74b64272.jpg) | ||
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Torenhire
United States11681 Posts
Doesn't look like a bad location, in any case. | ||
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Kiett
United States7639 Posts
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Ryo
8787 Posts
Some day time pictures of Century Square, Nanjing Road: panoramio.com ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/uU9t7.jpg) ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/VWk2u.jpg) | ||
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SoKHo
Korea (South)1081 Posts
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
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funnybananaman
United States830 Posts
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Soap
Brazil1546 Posts
[Proleague] The venue of the final has released. 'Segi Square' in Shanghai. Is it the same thing? | ||
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Empyrean
16977 Posts
That place is going to be unnavigable XD | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
On July 13 2011 11:43 Empyrean wrote: Oh God, placing it on Nanjing Road? That place is going to be unnavigable XD Yeah, seriously wtf, you know how Chinese bystanders behave... Nanjing road is not that wide there, starcraft fans will be outnumbered by bystanders in a 1:10 ratio at least... We need a backup plan. Lemme find a Korean interpret and make a TL press card, and we get VIP seats. | ||
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moopie
12605 Posts
I wonder how many people they can fit in that area. | ||
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DirtYLOu
575 Posts
On July 13 2011 12:17 moopie wrote: yeah, doesn't look too big :x I wonder how many people they can fit in that area. Doesn't look too big? ITS AN OPEN AREA. So i would say it's enuff . | ||
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J.Dong
United States102 Posts
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
On July 13 2011 12:37 DirtYLOu wrote: Doesn't look too big? ITS AN OPEN AREA. So i would say it's enuff . It's not an open area at all. It's the most crowded street of Shanghai. There is just a portion that is a little wider (70 meters instead of 30). | ||
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Empyrean
16977 Posts
On July 13 2011 12:02 endy wrote: Yeah, seriously wtf, you know how Chinese bystanders behave... Nanjing road is not that wide there, starcraft fans will be outnumbered by bystanders in a 1:10 ratio at least... We need a backup plan. Lemme find a Korean interpret and make a TL press card, and we get VIP seats. Bah, gonna be back in the states, remember? X_X But yes, get VIP seating and take lots of pictures! ....then send them to me so I can photoshop myself in ;D | ||
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moopie
12605 Posts
On July 13 2011 12:37 DirtYLOu wrote: Doesn't look too big? ITS AN OPEN AREA. So i would say it's enuff . no, THIS is an open area. ![[image loading]](http://www.fomos.kr/board/photo/1249734930_1.JPG) That square is relatively small. | ||
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Empyrean
16977 Posts
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
I guess it will be like OSL finals, anyone can watch for free, but people with tickets get a free Proleague gift or something. It's gonna be such a mess... Flash really needed his 20 bodyguards at the OSL finals, and I think Bisu is even more popular than Flash here. So if we have both Bisu and Flash... On July 13 2011 13:40 Empyrean wrote: Bah, gonna be back in the states, remember? X_X But yes, get VIP seating and take lots of pictures! ....then send them to me so I can photoshop myself in ;D If that's enough for you, well, you can say you already met Tossgirl. + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/mwEaK.jpg) On July 13 2011 14:28 Empyrean wrote: There are a lot of bigger outdoor venues in Shanghai, too. Even in the vicinity of Nanjing Road. I still don't know why they chose to have it there X_X Jiashan beach would have been really perfect. (see GTR's pic earlier in the thread). Beach like Gwang An Ri. No Bystanders, only fans. Lot of space. | ||
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el perro
United States12 Posts
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Ryo
8787 Posts
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naneri
Kyrgyzstan165 Posts
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Empyrean
16977 Posts
On July 13 2011 14:37 endy wrote: If that's enough for you, well, you can say you already met Tossgirl. + Show Spoiler + XD | ||
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iloahz
United States964 Posts
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Fionn
United States23455 Posts
On July 22 2011 14:01 iloahz wrote: kespa head was just interviewed by gamefy and he confirmed that kespa will get into sc2. Source? Link? This would be pretty huge news in the SC2 forum. | ||
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES50110 Posts
On July 22 2011 14:01 iloahz wrote: kespa head was just interviewed by gamefy and he confirmed that kespa will get into sc2. what?source? | ||
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Ryo
8787 Posts
It was part of an interview the secretary-general of Kespa did about the Shanghai finals published yesterday in the lead-up to the PL final. The relevant sentence about SC2 was "We think that SC2 is also one of the excellent games in the esports scene. Through close cooperation with Blizzard Entertainment, we will nurture more star players from SC2". From his answers, it seems to me that Kespa will continue to grow BW while eventually also entering SC2 at some point in the future, in some shape or form. Other notable points: -Kespa might start a Chinese website for PL -They want to spread the "culture" of SPL to China. http://www.gamefy.cn/topic/spl/view_10283.html | ||
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Power Overwhelming
46 Posts
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Ryo
8787 Posts
On July 22 2011 15:11 Power Overwhelming wrote: Anything to promote BW is fine, especially in its dying days (years?). Ouch. It's not dying. They wouldn't invest money in expanding an industry that has no potential for growth. | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
On July 22 2011 14:51 Ryo wrote: Other notable points: -Kespa might start a Chinese website for PL -They want to spread the "culture" of SPL to China. http://www.gamefy.cn/topic/spl/view_10283.html Incredible news, BW is timeless, SPL will go on forever. Amen. | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
TICKETS AVAILABLE TONIGHT ONLY INFO HERE : http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=247421 sorry for bumping this but this is an emergency for the TLers who are in Shanghai, in case they missed my thread in the community forum | ||
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Goldfish
2230 Posts
On July 22 2011 14:51 Ryo wrote: It was part of an interview the secretary-general of Kespa did about the Shanghai finals published yesterday in the lead-up to the PL final. The relevant sentence about SC2 was "We think that SC2 is also one of the excellent games in the esports scene. Through close cooperation with Blizzard Entertainment, we will nurture more star players from SC2". From his answers, it seems to me that Kespa will continue to grow BW while eventually also entering SC2 at some point in the future, in some shape or form. Other notable points: -Kespa might start a Chinese website for PL -They want to spread the "culture" of SPL to China. http://www.gamefy.cn/topic/spl/view_10283.html Wow huge. I do think Blizzard should cooperate with KeSPA and give them rights to cast SC2. One league in SC2 is just too little in South Korea (out of hundreds of players who compete in the GSL [either Code B, Code A, etc), only the top 32 Code S players really receive anything. Having another league in Korea would help (though a KeSPA SC2 league in China wouldn't be bad either). | ||
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Dakkas
2550 Posts
On July 25 2011 16:16 Goldfish wrote: Wow huge. I do think Blizzard should cooperate with KeSPA and give them rights to cast SC2. One league in SC2 is just too little in South Korea (out of hundreds of players who compete in the GSL [either Code B, Code A, etc), only the top 32 Code S players really receive anything. Having another league in Korea would help (though a KeSPA SC2 league in China wouldn't be bad either). You're spot on the money. As much disdain is thrown towards Kespa (lol ppp), they however have a good solid system with the PL/OSL/MSL that gives all aspiring players a decent chance to get exposure. Gom is doing a decent job with SC2 given the smaller market and them managing nearly everything though it is quite difficult for new players to get in because the Code-A qualifiers are insanely difficult and other chance is to get picked up by a team The extended exposure of BW into the rest of China is awesome. It does make sense given BW's popularity there and anything that makes BW bigger is good | ||
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Loanshark
China3094 Posts
And maybe China can start its own BW team to compete in the SPL!! | ||
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naneri
Kyrgyzstan165 Posts
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gueva RA
Ukraine19 Posts
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Sawamura
Malaysia7602 Posts
On July 22 2011 15:11 Power Overwhelming wrote: Anything to promote BW is fine, especially in its dying days (years?). Ouch. hmm post 46 nickname poweroverwhelming alright i am going to take this guy post seriously . yes bw is dying my ass... | ||
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ibreakurface
United States664 Posts
On July 25 2011 23:55 gueva RA wrote: Is it just me, or does it seem extremely upsetting especially among Koreans to follow the games all season long only not to be able to see it because it will be held in another country? Unless you can shell out the plane tickets. Share the love man. | ||
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white_horse
1019 Posts
On July 25 2011 23:55 gueva RA wrote: Is it just me, or does it seem extremely upsetting especially among Koreans to follow the games all season long only not to be able to see it because it will be held in another country? Unless you can shell out the plane tickets. ding ding ding correct answer! | ||
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gueva RA
Ukraine19 Posts
On July 26 2011 00:03 Sawamura wrote: hmm post 46 nickname poweroverwhelming alright i am going to take this guy post seriously . yes bw is dying my ass... kespa just got into sc2. they have been slowing moving away from bw, if you didnt notice | ||
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rasers
Sweden691 Posts
On July 26 2011 03:30 gueva RA wrote: kespa just got into sc2. they have been slowing moving away from bw, if you didnt notice wat? | ||
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Lokian
United States699 Posts
yes individual leagues are all koreans too but its individual which is less heavy on the korean part. its like only celebrating canada day in america or something. bad comparison i know ;p Proleague in SHANGhai china... so exciting lol | ||
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palexhur
Colombia730 Posts
On July 26 2011 03:30 gueva RA wrote: kespa just got into sc2. they have been slowing moving away from bw, if you didnt notice What have you been smoking? | ||
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mmdmmd
722 Posts
On July 26 2011 04:11 Lokian wrote: i can understsand an individual league in another country, but a korean team league in a non-korean place? yes individual leagues are all koreans too but its individual which is less heavy on the korean part. its like only celebrating canada day in america or something. bad comparison i know ;p Proleague in SHANGhai china... so exciting lol It's a business decision. | ||
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gueva RA
Ukraine19 Posts
Know your facts instead of posting like that to announce your ignorance to the whole world. User was warned for this post User was banned for this post. | ||
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
On July 26 2011 04:45 gueva RA wrote: Know your facts instead of posting like that to announce your ignorance to the whole world. Post your own first? unless you have sources his post is as good as yours. | ||
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gueva RA
Ukraine19 Posts
On July 26 2011 04:49 Kipsate wrote: Post your own first? unless you have sources his post is as good as yours. Kipsate with your post count you should know where to look. Go to kespa website. Do it now. | ||
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jambOng
United States86 Posts
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ArvickHero
10387 Posts
On July 26 2011 05:04 gueva RA wrote: Kipsate with your post count you should know where to look. Go to kespa website. Do it now. I see... a lot of promotion for the PL Grand Finals. Dunno what you are talking about Though, I did read somewhere that KeSPA did say they were looking to start getting involved with SC2. Dunno how its gonna work, with GOM and the SC2 Players' association and all, but it'll be interesting. However, that bit of news was really recent, long after the decision to hold the PL Finals in Shanghai. There is no indicator that KeSPA is trying to "slowly move away from BW". | ||
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rasers
Sweden691 Posts
On July 26 2011 05:04 gueva RA wrote: Kipsate with your post count you should know where to look. Go to kespa website. Do it now. and the site shows what? | ||
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ZeroChrome
Canada1001 Posts
On July 26 2011 05:04 gueva RA wrote: Kipsate with your post count you should know where to look. Go to kespa website. Do it now. umm are you sure you are looking at the KeSPA website? There is no mention of SC2 on the homepage at all. | ||
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swanized
Canada2480 Posts
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Kenpachi
United States9908 Posts
On July 26 2011 04:45 gueva RA wrote: Know your facts instead of posting like that to announce your ignorance to the whole world. are you offended? whats with the hostility? | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
On July 25 2011 23:32 naneri wrote: What the hell that chinese website shop.gamefy.cn it requested a chinese name and chinese ID to register after which it was possible to buy a ticket. How the hell am i supposed to have this if i am foreigner and we do not have 15 digits in our IDs? That is sick why kespa did allow a foreign organization to perform the ticket sale. Now i am messed up, only because i am not chinese. That is totaly unfair. They have to check an ID otherwise anyone would buy tickets. And since every country has a different ID numbering it would be really difficult for the shop to recognize a valid ID from every single country Any way, unless you are a tourist that came to Shanghai for a few weeks, I'm sure you could have found someone to buy tickets for you I think we got enough tickets so you can have one. I bought two even though I needed only one just in case other TLers couldn't get some. | ||
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kdgns
United States2427 Posts
On July 26 2011 10:05 endy wrote: They have to check an ID otherwise anyone would buy tickets. And since every country has a different ID numbering it would be really difficult for the shop to recognize a valid ID from every single country Any way, unless you are a tourist that came to Shanghai for a few weeks, I'm sure you could have found someone to buy tickets for you I think we got enough tickets so you can have one. I bought two even though I needed only one just in case other TLers couldn't get some. The point of the ID is to prevent ticket scalping, they do it with all form of tickets, trains, planes, etc. Usually a passport number is good enough, but it'll probably only work if you call them, the chinese media organization covering it has been giving out tickets as well, as a form a promotion, It'll be nice to go but I'll just be watching it on TV...its too hot in shanghai lol | ||
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hacklebeast
United States5090 Posts
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
On July 26 2011 12:01 hacklebeast wrote: Just out of curiosity, how much do the tickets cost? I was under the impression (admittedly with no experience) that the events were free. Free standing tickets 7.8 USD for seating tickets, including an awesome collector SPL T-shirt. I would pay 20 USD easily just for the T-shirt, so I consider the ticket free. edit : Gamefy just confirmed the tickets were sold out in 10 minutes. | ||
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hacklebeast
United States5090 Posts
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Fionn
United States23455 Posts
On July 26 2011 12:24 endy wrote: Free standing tickets 7.8 USD for seating tickets, including an awesome collector SPL T-shirt. I would pay 20 USD easily just for the T-shirt, so I consider the ticket free. edit : Gamefy just confirmed the tickets were sold out in 10 minutes. Wow that's fast. How many seats were there? 500? | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
On July 26 2011 13:08 Fionn wrote: Wow that's fast. How many seats were there? 500? I just checked on Gamefy's orders history. There were 695 orders of seating tickets, around 20% of them were cancelled, and most people bought two tickets, few people bought only one. That makes 556 effective orders , and I'd say people bought 1.7 ticket on average, so that makes 950 seats. There were also 201 orders of free standing tickets, some of them were cancelled too, I'd say that makes around 250 standing tickets. | ||
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phosphorylation
United States2935 Posts
any estimates? | ||
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Ribbon
United States5278 Posts
On July 26 2011 03:30 gueva RA wrote: kespa just got into sc2. they have been slowing moving away from bw, if you didnt notice This makes no sense for the following reasons 1. KeSPA can't enter SC2 for another year even if they want to (which we don't know they do) because GOM's contract expires. 2. If KeSPA wants to replace BW in Korea with SC2 in Korea, they're morons. BW had a shaky year, and SC2 is (SLOWLY) growing in Korea, but BW >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> SC2 in Korea, and that'll be the case for a LONG time. I'm sure KeSPA wouldn't mind being in both scenes, but replacing BW for SC2 in Korea is a terribad trade. 3. If KeSPA wants to do BW in Korea, and "export" SC2 for the benefit of the foreign scene and the handful of Koreans so interested, that's probably a smart decision. But then there's zero reason to move away from BW. They'd just do BW for Korean audiences and a handful of foreigners and do SC2 for the foreign audiences and a handful of Koreans. 4. If KeSPA wants to take over SC2 so they can do SC2 events abroad and attach BW to it to try and make BW more popular in the foreign world, that's probably the one outcome fans of both games can appreciate (I think BW can ride the foreign e-sports wave more than most posters here think it can, which is good for BW). But then moving away from BW would be counter-productive and silly. tl;dr: There is absolutely no scenario where it's sensible for KeSPA to move away from BW into SC2. KeSPA's only uses for SC2 are as A.) A side project like WC3, B.) A venue through which to advertise BW to the foreign world, or C.) A bargaining chip for future fights with Blizzard ("If we can't do BW the way we like we'll have to cancel the Mountain Dew 2013 Big SC2 Game Thing"), and none of those require replacing BW. KeSPA is hosting the PL finals in China because they want more Chinese people watching Brood War. Full stop. No conspiracy theory needed or wanted. | ||
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ffreakk
Singapore2155 Posts
On July 26 2011 14:07 Ribbon wrote: This makes no sense for the following reasons 1. KeSPA can't enter SC2 for another year even if they want to (which we don't know they do) because GOM's contract expires. 2. If KeSPA wants to replace BW in Korea with SC2 in Korea, they're morons. BW had a shaky year, and SC2 is (SLOWLY) growing in Korea, but BW >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> SC2 in Korea, and that'll be the case for a LONG time. I'm sure KeSPA wouldn't mind being in both scenes, but replacing BW for SC2 in Korea is a terribad trade. 3. If KeSPA wants to do BW in Korea, and "export" SC2 for the benefit of the foreign scene and the handful of Koreans so interested, that's probably a smart decision. But then there's zero reason to move away from BW. They'd just do BW for Korean audiences and a handful of foreigners and do SC2 for the foreign audiences and a handful of Koreans. 4. If KeSPA wants to take over SC2 so they can do SC2 events abroad and attach BW to it to try and make BW more popular in the foreign world, that's probably the one outcome fans of both games can appreciate (I think BW can ride the foreign e-sports wave more than most posters here think it can, which is good for BW). But then moving away from BW would be counter-productive and silly. tl;dr: There is absolutely no scenario where it's sensible for KeSPA to move away from BW into SC2. KeSPA's only uses for SC2 are as A.) A side project like WC3, B.) A venue through which to advertise BW to the foreign world, or C.) A bargaining chip for future fights with Blizzard ("If we can't do BW the way we like we'll have to cancel the Mountain Dew 2013 Big SC2 Game Thing"), and none of those require replacing BW. KeSPA is hosting the PL finals in China because they want more Chinese people watching Brood War. Full stop. No conspiracy theory needed or wanted. I dont see any reason to believe that Kespa is moving away from BW. If anything, Kespa embracing SC2 is the same as them having Kart Rider and Sudden Strike n all that stuff, aka minor leagues. Their main focus has always been BW, which has much better Star Power, fanbase n all that. | ||
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moopie
12605 Posts
I wonder if they just didn't think they could fill a larger venue. | ||
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dukethegold
Canada5645 Posts
*cringes* I knew this was going to happen. If I have to guess, it's due to very poor planning and last minute decision that led to this. Likely they were unable to book a grander location before the deadline. | ||
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Ryo
8787 Posts
On July 26 2011 03:30 gueva RA wrote: kespa just got into sc2. they have been slowing moving away from bw, if you didnt notice Don't try to make up "facts" if you don't follow BW, especially when the evidence indicates otherwise. | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
On July 26 2011 15:24 dukethegold wrote: *scanning through info regarding event location and seating* *cringes* I knew this was going to happen. If I have to guess, it's due to very poor planning and last minute decision that led to this. Likely they were unable to book a grander location before the deadline. Kespa / Shinhan Bank asked for prestigious locations. After the Orient Pearl Tower, they picked Nanjing Road. Jinshan beach would have been perfect, but it's just a very simple beach 20 km South of Shanghai. Also the main objective of these finals in Shanghai is to negotiate broadcasting contracts with local TV channels and esports related companies. It doesn't matter if 3 or 20 thousand people show up in Shanghai, as long as they promote decently the streams and TV channels throughout the whole China. It sure is sad for the Korean fans and the fans in Shanghai, but all in all, it's a good operation for Kespa / sponsors. | ||
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Sinedd
Poland7052 Posts
damn... on the side note - GO GO SKT !!!! | ||
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naneri
Kyrgyzstan165 Posts
On July 26 2011 16:33 Sinedd wrote: So this epic final, the revenge for the last year will be played in some small location ? and they will charge for tickets ? damn... on the side note - GO GO SKT !!!! the only charge for those with T-Shirt so it is fair. But it is unfair for foreigners, cause they have no way to buy one unless they have chinese friends | ||
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Ryo
8787 Posts
http://t.qq.com/Bisu_Korea http://www.fomos.kr/board/board.php?mode=read&keyno=119590&db=issue&cate=&page=1&field=&kwrd= | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
On July 27 2011 03:15 Ryo wrote: According to Fomos, this is Bisu's real weibo: http://t.qq.com/Bisu_Korea http://www.fomos.kr/board/board.php?mode=read&keyno=119590&db=issue&cate=&page=1&field=&kwrd= yeah he created it a week ago and already got over 3500 followers ! I need a Korean interpret to PM him to tell him I'll bring the whole team to the best clubs in Shanghai after their victory over KT. We can't let Reach join us, he'll get all the girls~~ | ||
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digmouse
China6329 Posts
Quote with some pics i took back in June at G-League Finals. + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/cZcN7.jpg) ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/NyFP4.jpg) and epic professional shots I steal from cnfrag.com + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/7fmXN.jpg) ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/zjf8K.jpg) and FYI, those 2 pics are taken on the 1st night which is a bad rainy day. | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
Only 1000 seating tickets were issued + around 200 VIP seats + 200 tickets won in various contests or given to staff relatives. It's gonna be almost the same as the OSL finals. Btw, will you be attending ? Did you manage to get tickets ? | ||
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dukethegold
Canada5645 Posts
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digmouse
China6329 Posts
On July 27 2011 11:38 endy wrote: ^^^ Only 1000 seating tickets were issued + around 200 VIP seats + 200 tickets won in various contests or given to staff relatives. It's gonna be almost the same as the OSL finals. Btw, will you be attending ? Did you manage to get tickets ? yes I will be there, since I work for a esports media site, will be covering the whole event as well WCG China finals on the same day (4th Aug. to 7th Aug). | ||
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PineappleLumpsToss
New Zealand2434 Posts
On July 27 2011 11:50 digmouse wrote: yes I will be there, since I work for a esports media site, will be covering the whole event as well WCG China finals on the same day (4th Aug. to 7th Aug). I'm so envious of you and any others here that will be able to attend! Would love it if you could take the time to describe the event itself after the fact. Would be great to hear perspectives from those who were there on the day. | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
On July 27 2011 11:50 digmouse wrote: yes I will be there, since I work for a esports media site, will be covering the whole event as well WCG China finals on the same day (4th Aug. to 7th Aug). Oh that's awesome, do you speak Korean or have a Korean interpret ? Do you have some kind of press card that gives you special access ? On July 27 2011 12:13 PineappleLumpsToss wrote: I'm so envious of you and any others here that will be able to attend! Would love it if you could take the time to describe the event itself after the fact. Would be great to hear perspectives from those who were there on the day. I'll either make a detailed blog as I did for the OSL finals in Shanghai, either do some coverage for TL | ||
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everstarleague
China89 Posts
On July 26 2011 14:07 Ribbon wrote: This makes no sense for the following reasons 1. KeSPA can't enter SC2 for another year even if they want to (which we don't know they do) because GOM's contract expires. 2. If KeSPA wants to replace BW in Korea with SC2 in Korea, they're morons. BW had a shaky year, and SC2 is (SLOWLY) growing in Korea, but BW >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> SC2 in Korea, and that'll be the case for a LONG time. I'm sure KeSPA wouldn't mind being in both scenes, but replacing BW for SC2 in Korea is a terribad trade. 3. If KeSPA wants to do BW in Korea, and "export" SC2 for the benefit of the foreign scene and the handful of Koreans so interested, that's probably a smart decision. But then there's zero reason to move away from BW. They'd just do BW for Korean audiences and a handful of foreigners and do SC2 for the foreign audiences and a handful of Koreans. 4. If KeSPA wants to take over SC2 so they can do SC2 events abroad and attach BW to it to try and make BW more popular in the foreign world, that's probably the one outcome fans of both games can appreciate (I think BW can ride the foreign e-sports wave more than most posters here think it can, which is good for BW). But then moving away from BW would be counter-productive and silly. tl;dr: There is absolutely no scenario where it's sensible for KeSPA to move away from BW into SC2. KeSPA's only uses for SC2 are as A.) A side project like WC3, B.) A venue through which to advertise BW to the foreign world, or C.) A bargaining chip for future fights with Blizzard ("If we can't do BW the way we like we'll have to cancel the Mountain Dew 2013 Big SC2 Game Thing"), and none of those require replacing BW. KeSPA is hosting the PL finals in China because they want more Chinese people watching Brood War. Full stop. No conspiracy theory needed or wanted. don't worry! Even in 2006, there was more less bw fans than w3 in China, but everything revolved.Today there are less w3 fans too, but there are still less sc2 fans, you could see the clicks of sc2's vods. I can dare say, because of the change and onlinemode of sc2, blz is miss the only one chance that sc2 could prevail in China like bw and w3, still I don't think sc2 is as the same level as bw and w3, the mass of online games like wow and making friend mode is the most popular, it is impossible to have more fans who like the tactics, the sense of star. So bw, w3, sc2 are just like sport match , you can watch it but you must not play it. Speaking of watch match ,I will choose bw or even w3, because they are clear to watch. For the screen of today, 2d mode game match is still the best way to watch. 8.6's final, it is said there is still chance to slip in the scene or surround it with a telescope, the scene and bisu, flash it self is the idea. | ||
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digmouse
China6329 Posts
On July 27 2011 12:15 endy wrote: Oh that's awesome, do you speak Korean or have a Korean interpret ? Do you have some kind of press card that gives you special access ? I dont speak Korean but is trying to get a translator, and yes as a official media partner member i have press access, so if time allows (I would be busy rounding up that day's WCG final coverage too) I will definitely do some coverage for TL too. | ||
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kdgns
United States2427 Posts
On July 27 2011 12:50 digmouse wrote: I dont speak Korean but is trying to get a translator, and yes as a official media partner member i have press access, so if time allows (I would be busy rounding up that day's WCG final coverage too) I will definitely do some coverage for TL too. What chinese esports media site do you work for? | ||
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godemperor
Belgium2043 Posts
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digmouse
China6329 Posts
On July 27 2011 13:07 kdgns wrote: What chinese esports media site do you work for? Replays.Net, you may have heard of it if you followed W3 scene before. | ||
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Kaolla
China2999 Posts
On July 27 2011 13:10 godemperor wrote: Seat are good but real fans STAND! this aint football or a concert ^^; Where can you apply for press tickets?? | ||
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Sawamura
Malaysia7602 Posts
On July 27 2011 13:10 godemperor wrote: Seat are good but real fans STAND! I don't mind standing as long i can get to watch my favourite team gets lock into a mortal COMBAT !. | ||
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Ryo
8787 Posts
http://esports.dailygame.co.kr/global/list.php?c=1058 | ||
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Taekwon
United States8155 Posts
And I'm confident it'll be made. | ||
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supernovamaniac
United States3046 Posts
On August 04 2011 19:12 Ryo wrote: Some days back, DES started a Global section, so far Chinese is the only sub-section. I guess Kespa were serious when they said they were going to spread PL culture to China. http://esports.dailygame.co.kr/global/list.php?c=1058 When I talked to the CJ Entus Sports Management Sr. Analyzer, he was pretty serious with KeSPA dipping into Chinese scene. The BW teams might also start some SC2 teams, but that just means that KeSPA will be running some tourney in the near future (After contract ends). Right now, he was talking about the popularity of BW in China atm, and KeSPA's desire to start making the scene more global, starting with the country with 2nd largest popularity. | ||
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xarthaz
1704 Posts
On July 27 2011 13:10 godemperor wrote: Seat are good but real fans STAND! Agreed we need some action down there. fans going crazy, mosh pit at front of stage, speakers roarin at 130dB, entire Shanghai hearing Kim Cheul Min going berzerk with crazy screaming | ||
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Ryo
8787 Posts
On August 04 2011 20:23 supernovamaniac wrote: When I talked to the CJ Entus Sports Management Sr. Analyzer, he was pretty serious with KeSPA dipping into Chinese scene. The BW teams might also start some SC2 teams, but that just means that KeSPA will be running some tourney in the near future (After contract ends). Right now, he was talking about the popularity of BW in China atm, and KeSPA's desire to start making the scene more global, starting with the country with 2nd largest popularity. Definitely sounds promising. I hope they can find a solution to the MBCGame problem too. | ||
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