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FuRRie
Belgium815 Posts
I'd like to point one 'issue' with creating an players union etc. Creating a union is good, and might help in improving living conditions and all the other things. Problem that occurs is, there will always will be people who "don't care", and who will play without a decent contract, without an honest fee, and who don't mind to play 12-15 hours a day. They will get fed up and leave early, ... but they will always exist. | ||
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KristianJS
2107 Posts
On May 19 2010 23:06 yomi wrote: The structure of the leagues is too intense. How can they run three leagues concurrently with no offseason? Of course the conditions are brutal. Exactly. The problem is of course the fact that going to see a match costs nothing, so money is earned through advertisement alone, which means there's no incentive whatsoever to have any lengthy off-season, and there's a huge incentive to cram as many games into the year as possible. Like I said earlier, they should start charging for tickets for matches. If they get more money in like that there'd be more incentive to lighten the load. | ||
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Madkipz
Norway1643 Posts
Point is, they want to have their work recogniced and paid properly. In order to topple the sponsors, you must gather icons and start protesting, refuse to play untill your demands are met, what happened with boxers players union? sad stuff ;( | ||
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JohannesH
Finland1364 Posts
You can look at every other job for kids of that age and say they deserve to get more. Especially jobs that involves something that appeals to kids like video games, music, etc. The progaming industry is happy to give you a shot at being a progamer, but they can't afford to pay much for it. It's not just a job but a lifestyle... Compare to something like being an au pair, you won't make money but if you enjoy it then its worth considering (though progaming still has that tiny chance of making money big time). Practice partners are still in a position where they can pretty easily leave if they want to. If you can't afford to have practice partners in-house it seems that then you'd just be practicing with the same crowd over internet Improving the living conditions and practice schedules wouldn't require more money though... I don't see how forcing people to play 12 hours makes them improve much better than a more loose schedule, its just so fucking much... Realistically many players would still practice more on their free time but I would imagine they'd have a better morale too if they have choice over it. | ||
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hypercube
Hungary2735 Posts
Changing the maps every season hurts players too: getting extra practice time on a new map is worth more than practicing on a map that's been played for a year. Just modifying maps between starleagues instead of replacing them would help too, because many ideas would remain the same but the gameplay would change enough to provide entertainment. | ||
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Auronz
Brazil119 Posts
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Bebop07
United States291 Posts
On May 20 2010 05:52 Auronz wrote: Everyone can call me crazy but..I think the bar has been set so incredibly high that its really necessary to play that much. Thing is..if they don't make them play that much, the really determined players will do it anyway to get that edge. I look at it a different way as the coaches and what not know that if these kids really want their dreams to come true of being famous and great, they have to put in these insane amounts of hours until BW is basically like breathing. Sounds like I'm splitting hairs but I do think there's a difference between someone who plays 8 hours as apposed to 12-13 or even all nighters..even if it doesn't drastically change your play it will at least give you the confidence you're training harder than everyone else and thats big for competition.It's quite bad... I wonder, is it even worth to practice that much per day? I don't think you're still learning after the 8th hour when your brain needs a rest. | ||
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Ekyelka
Czech Republic7 Posts
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Yuusha
Japan34 Posts
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WeSt
Portugal918 Posts
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KingV
United States97 Posts
Now that I think about it, the only way this situation could get better is a lockout. They need a players association and a strong leader. They should fight for what they deserve even if it means no Starcraft on TV for a while | ||
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The6357
United States1268 Posts
I've read from book 1 - 24 twice...but not sure where to get the next books or text files =( that's the greatest martial art novel ever :D | ||
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Not_Computer
Canada2277 Posts
Saying to a young progamer, "You wanted to play games, so don't complain if we leave you to rot while we benefit from you promoting our brands" is like saying to a soldier, "You wanted to shoot guns, so don't complain if we leave you to die while we benefit from you fighting for the country". | ||
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Tankbusta
United States109 Posts
On May 19 2010 16:23 Creationism wrote: Although the story is very compelling, taking a step back and looking at the situation from a different point of view helps. Progaming, besides the highest level, really has absolutely no service to society. "Service to society"? Professional Golf doesn't give anything back to society simply from playing the game. Neither does professional Football, or Basketball. You could argue that these games might raise money for chairty, but there's absolutely no reason an e-sports game cannot do the same beyond it not being popular enough. It is never about a service to society, it is about a service people want and are willing to pay for. On May 19 2010 16:23 Creationism wrote: It is basically a form of entertainment through competition in a genre that honestly has a large amount of negative externalities. This is different from sports in that sports require something called physical talent and narrows the pool down, while gaming's requirements are a lot lax. How are they more lax? I do not know how it is in China, but where I grew up you couldn't throw a stick without it hitting an athlete. Being able to keep 200 APM after 10 hours of gaming takes a different kind of indurance than running 20 miles, but both require it. | ||
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In)Spire
United States1323 Posts
This makes me want to cry.. T.T | ||
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Xyik
Canada728 Posts
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JWD
United States12607 Posts
Fomos should take note. I don't even think they have one true reporter there. Journalism is not about asking lame, neat little canned questions and glossing over every major controversy! What news source is this from? Pressian? Never heard of it…whoever published this article, it deserves more credit in the OP. Addressed so many issues that I have been waiting for any real news on for what seems like forever now (copyright, the lowdown on "cyber university," what happens to progamers who don't make it…). If only this reporter worked on eSports full time, so he could actually go in-depth on some of these controversies! Man, this article makes eSports journalism in Korea look like a travesty. As an outsider it is extremely frustrating how little transparency there is — here in the states, news agencies are all over every professional league. This is especially true for major sports leagues but even smaller eSports ventures like MLG have had big exposes written about them in major news sources. In Korea, it seems like everyone is content to read the shallow crap that Fomos churns out day-to-day? None of the news sources I've read (limited, of course, by what's translated at TL) seem interested in getting the "real story" behind progaming at all, even when some fascinating controversy pops up. Like, why hasn't Fomos run a major spread on the intricacies of the copyright debate between KeSPA and Blizzard? This is an issue that jeopardizes all of SC progaming in Korea and, as far as I know, they're not at all interested in reporting on it. That is a major What The Fuck. I remember trying to cover KeSPA's free agency system and the bind that it put Jaedong in last fall, and reading Fomos's articles on the topic almost in awe of how uninformative and convoluted they were. Maybe something was lost in translation, but they read more like KeSPA propaganda than real reportage. So frustrating. Maybe someone more in tune with the Korean media can enlighten me on this: why is there not a greater meritocracy in coverage of eSports? All of the major news sources in progaming: OGN, MBC, Fomos, Daily News (is better, but not by much) seem to be getting away with not producing any good coverage of the most serious issues in Korea's BW scene. How is this possible? Like, how can it possibly be that a few informal interviews with Ret and Rekrul and Artosis are far more informative on the true state of Korean eSports than nearly every article to come out of Korea in the past 9 years? Like, why do we need Artosis to tell us in his weekly interview that Jaedong only enrolled in "university" to evade the military? Why wasn't that the first line in Fomos's article on his enrollment? There's so much bullshit here. | ||
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ryanAnger
United States838 Posts
With e-sports being as big as it is in Korea, I don't think the strike would last long before they gave in to the gamers demands. | ||
l10f
United States3241 Posts
On May 20 2010 14:00 ryanAnger wrote: Honestly, what would happen if every pro gamer just stopped playing? Go on strike until they get their rights? With e-sports being as big as it is in Korea, I don't think the strike would last long before they gave in to the gamers demands. It'll be really hard to unite all the progamers, seeing how some of them fare very well. Also, there are always people willing to take their spots if some progamers start striking. Also, it may bring down the already damaged e-sports scene completely. | ||
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JWD
United States12607 Posts
On May 20 2010 14:00 ryanAnger wrote: Honestly, what would happen if every pro gamer just stopped playing? Go on strike until they get their rights? With e-sports being as big as it is in Korea, I don't think the strike would last long before they gave in to the gamers demands. First the players need to get organized, and that is difficult because I think the existing "players organization" is basically an appendage of KeSPA and the players are not allowed to have agents. But hot damn would I love to see a holdout for better pay / more player rights. Another major obstacle is that (and this is easy to forget) these are a bunch of kids. A lot of them really are dumb enough that they just want to "play the game," regardless of the rights they will have as a progamer. It will take some big leadership to unite the players and convince them all to strike. That is one reason I am disappointed Boxer has been so silent since the end of his military service. | ||
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