• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 19:01
CEST 01:01
KST 08:01
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2914Serral wins Maestros of the Game 243ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12
Community News
Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16)34Reynor: GSL Loss Wasn't About Preparation Format16[IPSL] Spring 2026 Grand Finals - This Weekend!5Weekly Cups (July 6 - 12): Protoss strike back12BSL Season 22 Full Overview & Conclusion8
StarCraft 2
General
Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) [D] Wireframe Casting Removed Clem: "I don't have that much hope in Blizzard" Reynor: GSL Loss Wasn't About Preparation Format Is the larve respawn broken?
Tourneys
Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) WardiTV Summer Cup 2026 GSL CK #5 Race War RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event HomeStory Cup 29
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
New Map Maker - Looking for Advice - Love or Hate Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 534 Burning Evacuation Mutation # 533 Die Together Mutation # 532 Nuclear Family
Brood War
General
Etiquete rules in Asl? BW General Discussion Recent recommended BW games Recommended FPV games (post-KeSPA) Pros Debate: Zerg Unfairly Nerfed? (ASL S22 map)
Tourneys
Escore Tournament - Season 3 Small VOD Thread 2.0 [IPSL] Spring 2026 Grand Finals - This Weekend! [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers Creating a full chart of Zerg builds Relatively freeroll strategies
Other Games
General Games
General RTS Discussion Thread Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Beyond All Reason Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI Russo-Ukrainian War Thread UK Politics Mega-thread YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club The HerO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Series you have seen recently...
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread MLB/Baseball 2023 McBoner: A hockey love story Tennis[sport] Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Simple Questions Simple Answers FPS when play League Of Legend on laptop How to clean a TTe Thermaltake keyboard?
TL Community
Northern Ireland Global Starcraft The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Poker (part 2)
Nebuchad
The Experiences We Want and …
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Evil Gacha Games and the…
ffswowsucks
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 7325 users

definition of skill ceiling

Blogs > HelpMeGetBetter
Post a Reply
HelpMeGetBetter
Profile Blog Joined November 2012
United States766 Posts
Last Edited: 2024-08-11 03:09:31
August 11 2024 03:08 GMT
#1
[image loading]

Me.

I’ve only seen 1 other player with a higher number. A couple others with high 30s.

Every goal I’ve set for myself, I have failed at. I cannot lower my goal any further.
Watching vods, streams, replays, live events, trying to find a coach, keeping my own spreadsheet of statistics - nothing works. Spent 12 years on this.
Starcraft is my favorite game - and it still is. Just which I could be a little better, but whatever talent is required to reach the next level, I simply don’t have it.

Rant over. Had to vent.

JimmyJRaynor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada17692 Posts
August 11 2024 09:15 GMT
#2
Only play when the game is fun. The nano second you are not 100% amped to play. Do something else. If this means you are only playing 10 days a month... so be it.

Try some brain balancing exercises. Employ some deep relaxation techniques. Go shoot some hoops. Make yourself a decent basketball player. Go to a batting cage and hit some baseballs. In other words, Improve your base level of athleticism. At that point, revisit SC2.

Create a new account in SC2 that is your experimentation account. Split your play time into 2 sections. Section 1. Playing to Win At All Costs. Section 2: Experimentation Play.

Experiment with watching the mini map 70% of the time. I don't care how many armies you lose. Watch the mini map. Move hotkeyed groups via the minimap and not the main map. Employ many disorienting techniques that other players use when they play. This experimentation account might end up in Gold. Who cares.
Ray Kassar To David Crane : "you're no more important to Atari than the factory workers assembling the cartridges"
Mizenhauer
Profile Blog Joined February 2015
United States1942 Posts
August 13 2024 11:46 GMT
#3
On August 11 2024 12:08 HelpMeGetBetter wrote:
[image loading]

Me.

I’ve only seen 1 other player with a higher number. A couple others with high 30s.

Every goal I’ve set for myself, I have failed at. I cannot lower my goal any further.
Watching vods, streams, replays, live events, trying to find a coach, keeping my own spreadsheet of statistics - nothing works. Spent 12 years on this.
Starcraft is my favorite game - and it still is. Just which I could be a little better, but whatever talent is required to reach the next level, I simply don’t have it.

Rant over. Had to vent.


This probably won't give you any relief, but just because you're in diamond doesn't mean you haven't improved. The game is only as hard as the people you play against and mmr only exists to express your standing among other players. If everyone keeps getting better (you included) you're going to stay at a similar mmr, even if you've improved a bunch over the years.
┗|∵|┓Second Place in LB 28, Third Place in LB 29 and Destined to Be a Kong
HelpMeGetBetter
Profile Blog Joined November 2012
United States766 Posts
August 14 2024 00:12 GMT
#4
On August 13 2024 20:46 Mizenhauer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 11 2024 12:08 HelpMeGetBetter wrote:
[image loading]

Me.

I’ve only seen 1 other player with a higher number. A couple others with high 30s.

Every goal I’ve set for myself, I have failed at. I cannot lower my goal any further.
Watching vods, streams, replays, live events, trying to find a coach, keeping my own spreadsheet of statistics - nothing works. Spent 12 years on this.
Starcraft is my favorite game - and it still is. Just which I could be a little better, but whatever talent is required to reach the next level, I simply don’t have it.

Rant over. Had to vent.


This probably won't give you any relief, but just because you're in diamond doesn't mean you haven't improved. The game is only as hard as the people you play against and mmr only exists to express your standing among other players. If everyone keeps getting better (you included) you're going to stay at a similar mmr, even if you've improved a bunch over the years.


my MMR has not stayed the same or gone up, it actually has gone down. further proving skill ceiling exist.
Jealous
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
10348 Posts
September 07 2024 17:03 GMT
#5
On August 14 2024 09:12 HelpMeGetBetter wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2024 20:46 Mizenhauer wrote:
On August 11 2024 12:08 HelpMeGetBetter wrote:
[image loading]

Me.

I’ve only seen 1 other player with a higher number. A couple others with high 30s.

Every goal I’ve set for myself, I have failed at. I cannot lower my goal any further.
Watching vods, streams, replays, live events, trying to find a coach, keeping my own spreadsheet of statistics - nothing works. Spent 12 years on this.
Starcraft is my favorite game - and it still is. Just which I could be a little better, but whatever talent is required to reach the next level, I simply don’t have it.

Rant over. Had to vent.


This probably won't give you any relief, but just because you're in diamond doesn't mean you haven't improved. The game is only as hard as the people you play against and mmr only exists to express your standing among other players. If everyone keeps getting better (you included) you're going to stay at a similar mmr, even if you've improved a bunch over the years.


my MMR has not stayed the same or gone up, it actually has gone down. further proving skill ceiling exist.

He's saying the skill you have now has to be far greater than it was 12 years ago for you to still be able to hit Diamond. The player you were 12 years ago who hit Diamond wouldn't make it out of Gold today, or something like that.
"The right to vote is only the oar of the slaveship, I wanna be free." -- бум бум сучка!
WombaT
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Northern Ireland27207 Posts
September 13 2024 20:21 GMT
#6
On August 11 2024 18:15 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
Only play when the game is fun. The nano second you are not 100% amped to play. Do something else. If this means you are only playing 10 days a month... so be it.

Try some brain balancing exercises. Employ some deep relaxation techniques. Go shoot some hoops. Make yourself a decent basketball player. Go to a batting cage and hit some baseballs. In other words, Improve your base level of athleticism. At that point, revisit SC2.

Create a new account in SC2 that is your experimentation account. Split your play time into 2 sections. Section 1. Playing to Win At All Costs. Section 2: Experimentation Play.

Experiment with watching the mini map 70% of the time. I don't care how many armies you lose. Watch the mini map. Move hotkeyed groups via the minimap and not the main map. Employ many disorienting techniques that other players use when they play. This experimentation account might end up in Gold. Who cares.

Great suggestions
'You'll always be the cuddly marsupial of my heart, despite the inherent flaws of your ancestry' - Squat
HelpMeGetBetter
Profile Blog Joined November 2012
United States766 Posts
September 15 2024 02:12 GMT
#7
On September 14 2024 05:21 WombaT wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 11 2024 18:15 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
Only play when the game is fun. The nano second you are not 100% amped to play. Do something else. If this means you are only playing 10 days a month... so be it.

Try some brain balancing exercises. Employ some deep relaxation techniques. Go shoot some hoops. Make yourself a decent basketball player. Go to a batting cage and hit some baseballs. In other words, Improve your base level of athleticism. At that point, revisit SC2.

Create a new account in SC2 that is your experimentation account. Split your play time into 2 sections. Section 1. Playing to Win At All Costs. Section 2: Experimentation Play.

Experiment with watching the mini map 70% of the time. I don't care how many armies you lose. Watch the mini map. Move hotkeyed groups via the minimap and not the main map. Employ many disorienting techniques that other players use when they play. This experimentation account might end up in Gold. Who cares.

Great suggestions


I've tried it all throughout the years. Crated new accounts and everything.
"This time its going to be different"
And never is. Just end up the same place as always - not even close to my goal. Always hitting that wall.
If I had the talent or whatever is needed for this, I would have succeeded a long time ago. I just don't have it.

Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
PSISTORM Gaming Misc
23:00
FSL playoffsTeamLeague STvsASH
Liquipedia
The PiG Daily
22:00
Best Games of SC
ByuN vs Clem
MaxPax vs TBD
Serral vs ByuN
GgMaChine vs Bunny
PiGStarcraft427
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft427
ViBE156
JuggernautJason118
StarCraft: Brood War
ZZZero.O 49
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm109
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox301
Mew2King155
Heroes of the Storm
Trikslyr65
Other Games
gofns9430
tarik_tv5904
Grubby2880
shahzam1074
ToD289
XaKoH 156
Liquid`Hasu135
PPMD28
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1263
BasetradeTV169
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• musti20045 36
• davetesta33
• RyuSc2 18
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota21751
Other Games
• Shiphtur798
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
59m
RSL Revival
9h 59m
Clem vs Lambo
Scarlett vs Cure
CranKy Ducklings
10h 59m
Epic.LAN
13h 59m
IPSL
16h 59m
Dragon vs Hawk
RSL Revival
1d 9h
Classic vs Trap
herO vs SHIN
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 10h
OSC
1d 13h
IPSL
1d 16h
Bonyth vs Ret
WardiTV Weekly
2 days
[ Show More ]
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
PiGosaur Cup
4 days
The PondCast
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
CrankTV Team League
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
CrankTV Team League
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-07-13
HSC XXIX
Eternal Conflict S2 E2

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
Acropolis #4
YSL S3
CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
Escore Tournament S3: W3
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
SCTL 2026 Spring
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026

Upcoming

ASL S22 SEASON OPEN Day 1
Escore Tournament S3: W4
ASL S22 SEASON OPEN Day 2
Escore Tournament S3: W5
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HSC XXX
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
Light Tournament 2026
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale
Eternal Conflict S2 E3
Logitech G Connect 2026
StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.