• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 07:44
CEST 13:44
KST 20:44
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2914Serral wins Maestros of the Game 243ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12
Community News
Weekly Cups (July 27-Aug 2): SHIN's big week0SC4ALL II: Brood War - $2500 - Dec 5-67SC4ALL II announced - $10,000 prize pool, Dec 5-64PIG STY FESTIVAL 8.0! (13 - 23 August)11Neeb returns to progaming; rejoins ONSYDE18
StarCraft 2
General
Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) Clem: "I don't have that much hope in Blizzard" Geoff 'iNcontroL' Robinson has passed away Neeb returns to progaming; rejoins ONSYDE State of the Game podcast archive?
Tourneys
Tasteless Time Warp: SC Evo Showmatch (May 25) SC4ALL II announced - $10,000 prize pool, Dec 5-6 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament PIG STY FESTIVAL 8.0! (13 - 23 August) RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 537 Hostile Territory Mutation # 536 Railroad Switch Mutation # 535 Assembly of Vengeance
Brood War
General
ASL22 General Discussion [Personal Project Share] Terran Defense v0.60 Data needed BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3 2v2v2v2 Tournament SC4ALL II: Brood War - $2500 - Dec 5-6
Strategy
Any training maps people recommend? Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread ZeroSpace Early Access is Now Live! General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish TSM pausing esports and CLG Dead
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank TL Mafia Community Thread NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
The Clem Fan Club INnoVation Fan Club The Scarlett Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! Series you have seen recently... [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 McBoner: A hockey love story
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Simple Questions Simple Answers FPS when play League Of Legend on laptop
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Northern Ireland Global Starcraft
Blogs
Please support my new stand…
Peanutsc
What is a Gamer?
TrAiDoS
Hello guys!
LIN1s
ASL S22 English Commentary…
namkraft
Poker (part 2)
Nebuchad
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 3874 users

Skins in LotV

Blogs > stuchiu
Post a Reply
1 2 Next All
stuchiu
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Fiddler's Green42661 Posts
September 30 2015 22:22 GMT
#1
Problems with Implementation of Skins in LotV

Given the enormous success of skins in other games like LoL, Dota2 and CS:GO and their integral role in increasing popularity for thier games (http://www.pcgamer.com/how-400-virtual-knives-saved-counter-strike/), many people have advoated for the implementation of skins into SC2.

There are currently three problems:

1 - Technology.

In CS:GO there are at most 30 models that can be skinned (10 guns, 10 pistols, 10 knives). In LoL, 10 heroes. In dota 2, each ero can be modded with different sets and couriers. The problem with SC2 is that in a general game, it can be anywhere from 200-500 or models to alter. And then you double or quadruple that in team games. Presumably this causes a strain and creates performance issues for the game.

2 - Identity

The second problem is the inherent difference of identity between SC2 and CS:GO/LoL/Dota2. In those games you control a “hero” unit that represents who you are in the game. In SC2 you are a commander of an army and there is less personal investment as you send your soldiers to get slaughtered by the hundreds. Of course this is probably the smallest problem of the three.

3 - Market/incentives

Part of the popularity of skins in games like Dota2/CS:GO is that there is an entire economy built around buying, selling and trading skins. It isn’t enough to just buy/sell skins, but you’d need to also have an infrastructure to allow it, which requires resources and time.

Solutions:

Limit the amount of skins a player can put on into a game. For instance, let there be a loadout screen where they can equip 10 units to have their bought skin. This avoids the performance issue as there won’t be as much slow down and it makes those units “special” creating an identity for the player. Another option is to tie it to unit rank. After a certain amount of kills, the unit is “promoted” in both rank and appearance (Though I can’t speak on the feasibility of this one.)

Achievements:

Random aside, but I’d like there to be esports related achievement/portraits. for instance, if I ragequit 4 games in a row without typing GG, I want a portrait of Idra.

****
Moderator
Rehio
Profile Joined March 2011
United States1718 Posts
September 30 2015 22:25 GMT
#2
For the performance issues (and those who say playing against skins is annoying), I always kind of wondered: Why not an option to just.. turn it off?

Is it really bad to give the players options like that? Or is the technology for that more complex than I'd think?
prOpSnuffe
Profile Joined September 2010
Sweden241 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-09-30 22:39:37
September 30 2015 22:39 GMT
#3
On October 01 2015 07:25 Rehio wrote:
For the performance issues (and those who say playing against skins is annoying), I always kind of wondered: Why not an option to just.. turn it off?

Is it really bad to give the players options like that? Or is the technology for that more complex than I'd think?


If your opponent can't see your skins people won't buy them. If you couldn't show of your cool skins in CSGO the value of every skin would sink tremendously.
Best starcraft 2 player of all time? INnoVation
riotjune
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United States3394 Posts
September 30 2015 23:34 GMT
#4
How bout an option to buy something that can turn everyone else into a skin/model of your own choosing?

Should just be like Quake 3 where you can turn everyone into Keel because he was the loudest and biggest/easiest target to hit.
ETisME
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
12822 Posts
October 01 2015 05:38 GMT
#5
does that point no.1 really work that way?
as long as the skins aren't changing the base model (not sure the right turn, basically the physical model), shouldn't the performance be similar?
其疾如风,其徐如林,侵掠如火,不动如山,难知如阴,动如雷震。
rotta
Profile Joined December 2011
5634 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-10-01 08:05:44
October 01 2015 08:05 GMT
#6
On October 01 2015 08:34 riotjune wrote:
How bout an option to buy something that can turn everyone else into a skin/model of your own choosing?

Should just be like Quake 3 where you can turn everyone into Keel because he was the loudest and biggest/easiest target to hit.

cl_minmodels 1 was pretty much a given in my CS days. I like portraits and skins but not at the cost of peformance. My pc is struggling as it is.
don't wall off against random
TheOneAboveU
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Germany3367 Posts
October 01 2015 08:38 GMT
#7
On October 01 2015 14:38 ETisME wrote:
does that point no.1 really work that way?
as long as the skins aren't changing the base model (not sure the right turn, basically the physical model), shouldn't the performance be similar?

In my own experience the zergling skin most of all (with speed upgrade) is really slowing down the performance of the game for me. It's also annoying as hell, because I can't estimate the number of lings coming my way with these stupidly large wings.
Moderatoralias TripleM | @TL_TripleM | Big Dark Energy!
Ansibled
Profile Joined November 2014
United Kingdom9872 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-10-01 09:28:17
October 01 2015 09:28 GMT
#8
Team logo portraits is something that would be awesome to have.

LoL does this and I think Riot splits the money on team icons with the teams (dunno how exactly) so something like this could be good for teams as well.
'StarCraft is just a fairy tale told to scare children actually.'
TL+ Member
FFW_Rude
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
France10201 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-10-01 09:55:28
October 01 2015 09:43 GMT
#9
On October 01 2015 07:25 Rehio wrote:
For the performance issues (and those who say playing against skins is annoying), I always kind of wondered: Why not an option to just.. turn it off?

Is it really bad to give the players options like that? Or is the technology for that more complex than I'd think?


Non you are right. Quake III had an option to turn off skins. In 1999.

On October 01 2015 08:34 riotjune wrote:
How bout an option to buy something that can turn everyone else into a skin/model of your own choosing?

Should just be like Quake 3 where you can turn everyone into Keel because he was the loudest and biggest/easiest target to hit.


It was into Sarge
#1 KT Rolster fanboy. KT BEST KT ! Hail to KT playoffs Zergs ! Unofficial french translator for SlayerS_`Boxer` biography "Crazy as me".
boxerfred
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
Germany8360 Posts
October 01 2015 11:54 GMT
#10
i wanna choose my own color
y0su
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
Finland7871 Posts
October 01 2015 13:07 GMT
#11
On October 01 2015 20:54 boxerfred wrote:
i wanna choose my own color

you're not the only one that's grown tired of blue vs red! and I do think this would provide some options.

The other thing I do think could have some marketability is portraits and decals. Unfortunately there's already a lot of them in the game, but I do think there could be room for growth there (even if just a little).
Heyoka
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Katowice25012 Posts
October 01 2015 13:42 GMT
#12
While I think people really overvalue what skins would do in SC2, as its considerably harder to monetize than something like Dota or CSGO, I also think the reasons for having none are kind of bs.

Technology for example, even outside the proposed solution you outlined, SC2 is a five year old game. Can people REALLY have that many performance issues? Who is out there playing SC2 on a laptop that's from 2009? That population seems like it would be tiny.

On October 01 2015 07:22 stuchiu wrote:
Random aside, but I’d like there to be esports related achievement/portraits. for instance, if I ragequit 4 games in a row without typing GG, I want a portrait of Idra.


I'd love this.
@RealHeyoka | ESL / DreamHack StarCraft Lead
ETisME
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
12822 Posts
October 01 2015 15:19 GMT
#13
On October 01 2015 17:38 TheOneAboveU wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 01 2015 14:38 ETisME wrote:
does that point no.1 really work that way?
as long as the skins aren't changing the base model (not sure the right turn, basically the physical model), shouldn't the performance be similar?

In my own experience the zergling skin most of all (with speed upgrade) is really slowing down the performance of the game for me. It's also annoying as hell, because I can't estimate the number of lings coming my way with these stupidly large wings.

Isn't that because the zergling skin added extra physics because of the longer wings?
其疾如风,其徐如林,侵掠如火,不动如山,难知如阴,动如雷震。
riotjune
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United States3394 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-10-01 16:42:32
October 01 2015 16:41 GMT
#14
On October 01 2015 18:43 FFW_Rude wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 01 2015 07:25 Rehio wrote:
For the performance issues (and those who say playing against skins is annoying), I always kind of wondered: Why not an option to just.. turn it off?

Is it really bad to give the players options like that? Or is the technology for that more complex than I'd think?


Non you are right. Quake III had an option to turn off skins. In 1999.

Show nested quote +
On October 01 2015 08:34 riotjune wrote:
How bout an option to buy something that can turn everyone else into a skin/model of your own choosing?

Should just be like Quake 3 where you can turn everyone into Keel because he was the loudest and biggest/easiest target to hit.


It was into Sarge

Yea Sarge was a good choice too, you could always tell where he was from a mile away because he jumped lol. I liked Keel because of his robotic clunk clunk footsteps, and I think his model represented the hitbox better over the other big model, Tank.

I think force model resulted in 1v1 players walking more and jumping less between battles/item spawn times in order to get the jump on the other guy heh

Though after a while one might get sick of playing against the same model over and over, one always had the option to turn off force model (during casual matches )
rotta
Profile Joined December 2011
5634 Posts
October 01 2015 17:06 GMT
#15
How about skins for select buildings instead of units, like food so far, maybe bases too? It seems Blizzard is considering more skins:

[image loading]
don't wall off against random
Musicus
Profile Joined August 2011
Germany23579 Posts
October 01 2015 17:34 GMT
#16
I think for units skins in sc2, it could be a skin package and it redesigns every unit. So you can only have one unit skin active at a time.

For example my whole army will have the JAGW logos and uniforms if I had bought the JAGW skin.

Pretty sure that would help a lot with performance issues.

Buildings could have different skins I guess?
Maru and Serral are probably top 5.
Rathwirt
Profile Joined January 2011
United States42 Posts
October 01 2015 18:51 GMT
#17
Idk about unit skins, I don't want to have to keep track of all the different looks random units can have. I know there are a few already. I like the building skin idea more. Custom colors are cool too. And I say this as somebody who really does buy a lot of custom looks in games.
boxerfred
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
Germany8360 Posts
October 02 2015 00:04 GMT
#18
however I just watched Polt do a LotV PvT and he played Marauders only because of Adepts. Hell, that was boring af. Skins wouldn't help.
Dingodile
Profile Joined December 2011
4139 Posts
October 02 2015 15:53 GMT
#19
I think one "modified" skin per race is enough. best solution would be thor, ultra and collossus. No-Go on buildings and units that isn't 6supply. skins for zerglings is/was a very poor idea, incredibly hard to see how much they are.
Grubby | ToD | Moon | Lyn | Sky
Roggay
Profile Joined April 2010
Switzerland6320 Posts
October 02 2015 18:24 GMT
#20
The thing you are underestimating with csgo is how much better the game is right now than it was in the hiddenpath days. The game when it came out was a louzy piece of steaming crap and the fact the csgo became more and more popular also comes down to the fact that valve did a great job at fixing the core mechanics and making it good. Of course, the skins helped a ton, hell, a lot, but if you want to retain those players, you have to have a good game. And I think a lot of people are just done with sc2, me included.

As you have mentionned, there is also the problem that it is significantly harder to make skins "a thing" in sc2. In that aspect, csgo is the perfect game for skins : you have your weapons in front of you all of the time cycling through them, people can pick them up, people watch you play with them during the game etc...
1 2 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
INu's Battles
11:00
#19 - Day 2
Percival vs Cure
Classic vs Clem
IntoTheiNu 1014
WardiTV526
LiquipediaDiscussion
OSC
10:00
Vespene Cup #3
deth7
Liquipedia
The PondCast
10:00
Episode 104
CranKy Ducklings32
LiquipediaDiscussion
KCM Race Survival
10:00
Season 3 Week 5
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 1250
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Lowko324
deth 7
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 22758
Bisu 1438
firebathero 777
Soulkey 668
EffOrt 464
BeSt 296
Light 251
Soma 215
Larva 182
Mong 180
[ Show more ]
Stork 165
Snow 129
Last 115
ggaemo 114
Dewaltoss 113
hero 107
ZerO 106
actioN 101
Rush 80
JYJ 77
Pusan 76
Hyun 57
Mind 57
Sea.KH 38
Sharp 37
[sc1f]eonzerg 36
JulyZerg 29
ToSsGirL 27
sorry 24
Bale 22
Icarus 22
Sexy 21
Barracks 19
soO 18
ajuk12(nOOB) 16
Liquid`Ret 16
Sacsri 16
Noble 15
NotJumperer 9
Dota 2
BananaSlamJamma180
League of Legends
JimRising 283
Counter-Strike
shoxiejesuss1919
olofmeister1542
ScreaM1416
byalli838
kRYSTAL_37
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King80
Other Games
singsing2281
B2W.Neo238
Liquid`LucifroN132
ZerO(Twitch)20
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 8
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 76
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP6
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos1504
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
12h 16m
Escore
22h 16m
IntoTheTV X SOOP
23h 16m
RSL Revival
1d 21h
herO vs SHIN
Clem vs Solar
Serral vs Rogue
RSL Revival
2 days
WardiTV Weekly
3 days
The Patches Monday
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
PiG Sty Festival
5 days
PiGosaur Cup
5 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
5 days
Kung Fu Cup
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.