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On June 05 2015 02:22 looknohands119 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2015 01:18 purakushi wrote:
My biggest complaint is the indicator spam. SC2 has more than enough UI clutter. =\ If people can stand the crappy UI's in many MOBAS, I'm sure they can deal with new indicators. Although, maybe toning down the thickness of the lines used in the targeting circle would be a good idea.
The indicator itself is fine (could use a thinning, though). It just gets obnoxious when there are 4+ taking up 60% of the screen. And I thought the sieged tank/tempest range indicator was terrible.
Way too much clutter, even if it is "useful". SC2 suffers overall from too much crap on the screen.
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On June 05 2015 01:18 purakushi wrote:
My biggest complaint is the indicator spam. SC2 has more than enough UI clutter. =\
On June 05 2015 02:22 looknohands119 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2015 01:18 purakushi wrote:
My biggest complaint is the indicator spam. SC2 has more than enough UI clutter. =\ If people can stand the crappy UI's in many MOBAS, I'm sure they can deal with new indicators. Although, maybe toning down the thickness of the lines used in the targeting circle would be a good idea.
Agree with purakushi concern. After playing a bit on the beta today the indicator does not look that bad in game, but I agree with the previous answer ; making the lines less thick and agressive would be a good beginning. I didn't have to play against many liberators so maybe indicators everywhere are indeed really annoying (the screenshots suggest so). I hope they hear this concern about both the liberator and the cyclone (the range indicator for the T is fine, but for his opponent ? wtf ?).
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On June 04 2015 19:29 qxc wrote:
I was not aware the targeting thing was a bug.
It was confirmed a bug on blizz forums. I quoted the source in the patch thread.
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On June 05 2015 01:00 TronJovolta wrote:
All these idiots spouting "dernt merk it a moba ermergerd" should also have to post their sc2 account. We know your silver, bro. Your feedback doesn't matter.
I have nothing to hide behind
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/291937/1/Jonas/
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Doesn't seem like it would be useful without the bug. You'd have to stack circles in order to do enough damage to be useful and to protect the unit. You'd be sacrificing area for damage. Or you'd be forced to spread them which would dilute the power of the unit and make them easier to kill. Just rush within the individual circles and kill the units one by one.
What would be the point? It'd be all things the Cyclone does anyway, besides splash, and you don't need the ground attack upgrade for the liberator to deter mass light air. The only difference would be the burst damage and the fact the Cyclone moves.
Guess I'll hold judgement until we see the patched version. Just thought that was a good way to distinguish it from the siege tank and Cyclone.
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On June 04 2015 20:09 Cyro wrote:Show nested quote +Wtf? How could this be a bug? Liberators deploys at range 7 maximum so what is the point in having 15 attack range in the first place if it can't shoot into other circles? Yea, that sounds silly. Why would they put it at range 15 but not allow you to shoot further than ~9 range under any circumstance? sc2 units don't have a turn speed, that's only one of the acceleration numbers AFAIK
Obvoiusly you don't mod a lot. There is static turning speed and movement turning speed.
In general, air units in SC2 are programmed to feel really, really clunky and not responsive. Simple changes like scan range, damage point, adding deceleration to a unit, removing delays, adding angular shot to a weapon can make units much more responsive.
Once I started a discussion about values that made movement clunky with some mod, but it got buried. Maybe I have to finish it.
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United Kingdom20340 Posts
On June 05 2015 18:24 JCoto wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2015 20:09 Cyro wrote:Wtf? How could this be a bug? Liberators deploys at range 7 maximum so what is the point in having 15 attack range in the first place if it can't shoot into other circles? I was not aware the targeting thing was a bug. Yea, that sounds silly. Why would they put it at range 15 but not allow you to shoot further than ~9 range under any circumstance? Faster turn and accelartion speed. sc2 units don't have a turn speed, that's only one of the acceleration numbers AFAIK Obvoiusly you don't mod a lot. There is static turning speed and movement turning speed. In general, air units in SC2 are programmed to feel really, really clunky and not responsive. Simple changes like scan range, damage point, adding deceleration to a unit, removing delays, adding angular shot to a weapon can make units much more responsive. Once I started a discussion about values that made movement clunky with some mod, but it got buried. Maybe I have to finish it.
Which units have turn rate and which don't? I can't really recall any, yet stuff like the delay before firing is really obvious
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We know we have a good unit when the only thing people whine about is "the ugly circles" on the ground. LOL.
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On June 05 2015 18:56 Pr0wler wrote:
We know we have a good unit when the only thing people whine about is "the ugly circles" on the ground. LOL.
Broken DPS is also a thing I think. A bad move, GG.
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On June 05 2015 19:29 JCoto wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2015 18:56 Pr0wler wrote:
We know we have a good unit when the only thing people whine about is "the ugly circles" on the ground. LOL. Broken DPS is also a thing I think. A bad move, GG.
Lol, what the... ?
As far as I know the "broken" DPS is a result of an already known bug that will be fixed.
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Looks like a flying vulture but fatter
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This unit is super fun to play with or against. It adds some micro and some positional gameplay, and complements both bio and mech. Of course it needs some tweaking (maybe the air attack should be buffed), but it is a fun unit, which is really what matters.
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On June 05 2015 19:29 JCoto wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2015 18:56 Pr0wler wrote:
We know we have a good unit when the only thing people whine about is "the ugly circles" on the ground. LOL. Broken DPS is also a thing I think. A bad move, GG.
Let me explain you the process of balancing a unit :
- Overtune its stats
- This way, players are encouraged to use the unit
- Slowly tune down the unit until you reach the right point
Here was your lesson, my preasure.
On June 05 2015 18:56 Pr0wler wrote:
We know we have a good unit when the only thing people whine about is "the ugly circles" on the ground. LOL.
You got it totally right sir
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On June 05 2015 18:56 Pr0wler wrote:
We know we have a good unit when the only thing people whine about is "the ugly circles" on the ground. LOL.
Concerns with graphics are the most annoying ones because once they're there, you have to deal with them forever. So yeah I don't like how the range indicator looks, the range indicators for cyclones annoy me too, the minimap bothers me even after the fix and I hate skins/decals and would pay to be able to disable them.
As for the unit, I don't think T needed another ground control/zoning unit at all. Like everything else added in LotV, this unit is superfluous "fun" and "flash" instead of elegance.
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id rather have them change the way liberators fire into other circles. (for example really just limited to 9 range, not 15 with another liberators circle.
Example , you have two liberators A and B (shootable area)
(AB)----(AB)----- A ---- B bad (current design), B gets extra range due to the bug
(A) ------(AB)-- A ---- B actually interesting design
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On June 04 2015 22:23 Jonas  wrote:I really wish that blizzard would get this MOBA bullshit out of my starcraft game. The Liberator, Ravager, and Disruptor all have abilities that feel like they would fit better as DotA hero skills than they do in a competitive RTS game. Just add more simple units that, when used in the right hands, become something amazing. The Adept is a step in the right direction, and the lurker (with correct numbers) has that potential, too. The liberator just doesn't feel that way to me. Starcraft is a beautiful game; it doesn't need flashy skills or gimmicky unit design to hinder that beauty.
How the heck is the Liberator a Moba mechanic? How many zoning, immobile siege units do you see in MoBAs? The Liberator is basically a combination of a Valkyrie and a Siege Tank. It's entirely a RTS thing.
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On June 06 2015 10:32 Captain Peabody wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2015 22:23 Jonas wrote:I really wish that blizzard would get this MOBA bullshit out of my starcraft game. The Liberator, Ravager, and Disruptor all have abilities that feel like they would fit better as DotA hero skills than they do in a competitive RTS game. Just add more simple units that, when used in the right hands, become something amazing. The Adept is a step in the right direction, and the lurker (with correct numbers) has that potential, too. The liberator just doesn't feel that way to me. Starcraft is a beautiful game; it doesn't need flashy skills or gimmicky unit design to hinder that beauty. How the heck is the Liberator a Moba mechanic? How many zoning, immobile siege units do you see in MoBAs? The Liberator is basically a combination of a Valkyrie and a Siege Tank. It's entirely a RTS thing.
there is some weird logic going on that more abilities = Moba designed.
I wonder who started it.
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I tested this unit a bit and it seemed to overkill targets. For example, 2 liberators will both fire on 1 zergling, wasting dps. I'm not sure though.
Can someone confirm or deny?
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On June 06 2015 11:33 ETisME wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 10:32 Captain Peabody wrote:On June 04 2015 22:23 Jonas wrote:I really wish that blizzard would get this MOBA bullshit out of my starcraft game. The Liberator, Ravager, and Disruptor all have abilities that feel like they would fit better as DotA hero skills than they do in a competitive RTS game. Just add more simple units that, when used in the right hands, become something amazing. The Adept is a step in the right direction, and the lurker (with correct numbers) has that potential, too. The liberator just doesn't feel that way to me. Starcraft is a beautiful game; it doesn't need flashy skills or gimmicky unit design to hinder that beauty. How the heck is the Liberator a Moba mechanic? How many zoning, immobile siege units do you see in MoBAs? The Liberator is basically a combination of a Valkyrie and a Siege Tank. It's entirely a RTS thing. there is some weird logic going on that more abilities = Moba designed. I wonder who started it.
I dunno anything about dota clones, but a lot of LotV abilities are like World of Warcraft raid boss abilites. The bad guy puts a circle around you, and if you don't move out of it fast enough, you explode and your raid party loses the fight.
I'm sure people would like them better if they didn't telegraph your intentions in such an obnoxious fashion to your opponents. Ravagers would be really neat if your opponent didn't know whether you were targeting him directly, or leading your shot to anticipate his dodge...this would REALLY be great against air units.
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EPT
