• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 12:00
CET 18:00
KST 02:00
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12
Community News
Weekly Cups (Dec 15-21): Classic wins big, MaxPax & Clem take weeklies2ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career !10Weekly Cups (Dec 8-14): MaxPax, Clem, Cure win4Weekly Cups (Dec 1-7): Clem doubles, Solar gets over the hump1Weekly Cups (Nov 24-30): MaxPax, Clem, herO win2
StarCraft 2
General
Weekly Cups (Dec 15-21): Classic wins big, MaxPax & Clem take weeklies ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career ! Micro Lags When Playing SC2? When will we find out if there are more tournament Weekly Cups (Dec 8-14): MaxPax, Clem, Cure win
Tourneys
$100 Prize Pool - Winter Warp Gate Masters Showdow $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Winter Warp Gate Amateur Showdown #1 RSL Offline Finals Info - Dec 13 and 14!
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 505 Rise From Ashes Mutation # 504 Retribution Mutation # 503 Fowl Play Mutation # 502 Negative Reinforcement
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Anyone remember me from 2000s Bnet EAST server? soO on: FanTaSy's Potential Return to StarCraft Klaucher discontinued / in-game color settings How Rain Became ProGamer in Just 3 Months
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] LB QuarterFinals - Sunday 21:00 CET Small VOD Thread 2.0 [BSL21] WB SEMIFINALS - Saturday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Game Theory for Starcraft Current Meta Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Beyond All Reason Path of Exile General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Survivor II: The Amazon Sengoku Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List TL+ Announced Where to ask questions and add stream?
Blogs
The (Hidden) Drug Problem in…
TrAiDoS
I decided to write a webnov…
DjKniteX
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
Thanks for the RSL
Hildegard
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1040 users

Twitch Chat Mod Rant

Blogs > codonbyte
Post a Reply
codonbyte
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States840 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-04-15 21:32:33
April 15 2015 21:25 GMT
#1
Hey guys, you know what really sucks? When two different streamers are streaming the same SC2 game, and they have different delays. Why is this a problem? Well, as most people on teamliquid have figured out, twitch chat contains a lot of dicks (don't get me wrong, most twitch chat users are awesome, and twitch chat in general is awesome, but that's a topic for another blog *wink wink*). And so what will happen is that users from the less-delayed stream will come to the chat and spoil the game for the viewers of the more-delayed stream, usually unintentionally, but not always.

That is exactly what I had to deal with last night during the WCS NA qualifiers. My favorite Sc2 player, Avilo, was playing in the qualifier, and he was of course streaming his games. He set a 5 minute delay because he really didn't want anybody to stream-cheat him during the qualifiers.

Avilo took out his first two opponents, advancing through ro69 and ro32. Then in the ro16 he was to face QXC. BasetradeTV decided to cast his games between QXC. It's always really exciting when someone else casts a game by your favorite player. Unfortunately, however, BasetradeTV only had a delay of 3 minutes, as opposed to Avilo's 5 minute delay. This meant that you really couldn't watch both streams simultaneously via multitwitch, which is what I usually like to do in this situation. I decided to watch the game through Avilo's stream because I enjoy watching his first-person view while he plays. I usually do this even when watching replays of him.

So Avilo and QXC get into the game, stuff happens, the game is going along, and then someone types "gg map" into chat. Then someone else types it as well, and suddenly it seems like everyone is typing "gg map" in chat. It quickly became apparent that Avilo had lost the game and typed "gg map" to qxc (he doesn't like the current maps). Yet it didn't look like he had lost the game. We had just had the last two minutes of his game spoiled for us! GRRRR!!!

You know, I gotta say, I never quite realized until now how truly awful it is to be spoiled. It's the absolute WORST. It really sucked for Avilo's fans, who'd been watching the game through his stream, to have the ending spoiled like that. And the fact that some of the people who'd spoiled us were flaming him did not help at all. It almost felt like they were rubbing the fact that they had spoiled us in our faces (although most of them probably didn't realize that there was a delay difference).

In hindsight, I should probably have started dishing out temp-bans the instant I saw what was obviously a spoiler in chat. Maybe if I had done that I would have been able to save some of Avilo's viewers from being spoiled (when someone gets banned on twitch, their messages will be deleted for viewers who are using the built-in web-chat). At the time I felt like everyone had already been spoiled, and temp-banning large numbers of people is never something you want to do unless absolutely necessary. Oh well, hindsight 20/20.

That was only the first game, there would be at least one more game (maybe two), and I wasn't going to have those games spoiled if I could help it. I quickly added a command to Chatty to display a warning message explaining that there was a delay discrepancy and that any spoilers would result in automatic temp-bans.

The second game started, and predictably a stream of viewers from basetradetv came pouring in. I tried to timeout spoilers as quickly as possible, but I found it difficult to recognize them quickly enough. At that point I gave up on the possibility of watching Avilo's stream spoiler-free, and I opened up a multitwitch to basetradetv and Avilo.

I attempted to follow both streams as best I could, trying to keep two different game-states in my head at the same time, keeping track of what bases had been taken, what units were on the minimap, what tech was built, and in addition to all that I was trying to pick out spoilers from Avilo's chat based on all the information I was juggling on both streams. Holy fuck, talk about sensory overload.

In addition to all the spoilers and trying to keep track of two different streams and two different minimaps all at once, I still had to deal with the usual twitch-chat problems. At times I got flooded with people who came into chat just to flame. Nothing unusual about that. What really irked me though, were people who came in and tried to incite drama drama between avilo and basetradetv. They'd come into chat and say "holy crap! Rifkin is really bashing Avilo hard!" Um dude, I have their stream open. Rifkin isn't bashing anyone.

I almost never perm-ban people, but damn I was tempted to perm these kids. "Oh look, Avilo and Rifkin don't hate each other. BETTER CHANGE THAT!". Yeah, this community isn't hateful enough, let's make sure everyone hates each other. That'll help keep this game alive [twitch meme removed]. Just another reminder that you can't believe everything you read in twitch chat.

During that tournament, I experienced twitch chat at its worst. However, I also, in a way, experienced twitch chat at its best. A number of viewers thanked me for protecting them from the spoilers. A few complimented me on how level-headed I remained (at the time I certainly didn't feel level headed, lol). And overall, many loyal fans stuck around to cheer avilo on even through the shitstorm.

I guess the moral of the story is to always set your stream delay to the minimum delay allowed by the tournament you're playing in. That way, someone decides to cast your game, there won't be any spoiler issues. Next time Avilo plays in a tournament I'll be sure to look into what the minimum delay allowed by the tournament is ahead of time. I'm pretty sure for WCS it is three minutes.

Of course, the "always use minimum allowed delay" policy can be problematic for tournaments that don't require any delay at all. What's a player supposed to do in that case? Stream without delay and pray they don't get stream-cheated? Put on a delay and risk having their viewers get spoiled if someone else decides to cast one of their games? That's a major dilemma.

I'm pretty sure we've had the opposite problem before. I seem to recall repeatedly warning viewers not to post spoilers if the go over to basetradetv.

Overall, I enjoyed the tournament, in spite of all the spoilers and flames. Avilo made it to the ro16, and the games (from what little I was able to catch) were entertaining, as they always are. Oh yeah, and "gg map" is the most awesome quote ever. In fact, I think I may have found a replacement for that chair emoticon he has that nobody ever uses.

Okay, that's the end of my rant. Time to go watch avilo's vods (since I didn't really get to watch the games as they were happening :p).

*
Procrastination is the enemy
FFGenerations
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
7088 Posts
April 16 2015 02:51 GMT
#2
go ahead and perm ban malicious users
they can probably still contact you by pm to apologise if they want to make up
Cool BW Music Vid - youtube.com/watch?v=W54nlqJ-Nx8 ~~~~~ ᕤ OYSTERS ᕤ CLAMS ᕤ AND ᕤ CUCKOLDS ᕤ ~~~~~~ ༼ ᕤ◕◡◕ ༽ᕤ PUNCH HIM ༼ ᕤ◕◡◕ ༽ᕤ
Dingodile
Profile Joined December 2011
4139 Posts
April 16 2015 10:17 GMT
#3
I have a quesition about stream delay. 0sec delay is possible? I noticed sometimes, if streamers show chat at stream, the chat has some delay on stream.
Grubby | ToD | Moon | Lyn | Sky
FFGenerations
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
7088 Posts
April 16 2015 14:07 GMT
#4
i have negative delay sometimes when i watch tb play hearthstone

omg
Cool BW Music Vid - youtube.com/watch?v=W54nlqJ-Nx8 ~~~~~ ᕤ OYSTERS ᕤ CLAMS ᕤ AND ᕤ CUCKOLDS ᕤ ~~~~~~ ༼ ᕤ◕◡◕ ༽ᕤ PUNCH HIM ༼ ᕤ◕◡◕ ༽ᕤ
scott31337
Profile Joined January 2013
United States2979 Posts
April 16 2015 15:53 GMT
#5
"The stream must be broadcast on a minimum 5 minute delay; "

Hmmmmm interesting.

Source (2015 WCS Player Handbook)
THIS WAGON IS HITTING MAFIA FOR SURE BOYS!
Ctone23
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
United States1839 Posts
April 16 2015 18:00 GMT
#6
On April 16 2015 06:25 codonbyte wrote:
Just another reminder that you can't believe everything you read in twitch chat.


You're too easy to troll
TL+ Member
codonbyte
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States840 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-04-17 02:28:13
April 16 2015 19:45 GMT
#7
On April 17 2015 00:53 scott31337 wrote:
"The stream must be broadcast on a minimum 5 minute delay; "

Hmmmmm interesting.

Source (2015 WCS Player Handbook)

Oh really? Well, Avilo had a 5 minute delay, and BasetradeTV was over 2 minutes ahead of him (I had both streams open at the same time)...
On April 16 2015 19:17 Dingodile wrote:
I have a quesition about stream delay. 0sec delay is possible? I noticed sometimes, if streamers show chat at stream, the chat has some delay on stream.

When I'm talking about delay, I'm talking about the delay that a streamer intentionally sets. However, because of the way twitch video is streamed, there is a varying amount of latency that you will experience. This latency is affected by a number of factors, such as how good your ISP is, how overworked twitch's server is, the speed of light, whether or not your CPU is choking, etc. Generally, I've found latency to usually be between 5 and 30 seconds. So, if a streamer is streaming with 0 delay, their stream will usually be 5-30 seconds behind.

Edit: oh lol this is my 800th post :p

Edit 2: Actually I just talked to ThePharside in BasetradeTV chat, and he said the delay they were using was fine. He also said the delay restriction only applies to casters; players aren't required to use any delay when streaming their own games.
Avilo set his stream delay to 3 minutes today (same as basetradetv), so there were no spoilers in either stream.
Procrastination is the enemy
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 19h
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Liquid`VortiX 188
IndyStarCraft 118
trigger 101
White-Ra 97
BRAT_OK 79
DivinesiaTV 20
MindelVK 9
StarCraft: Brood War
EffOrt 764
actioN 234
ggaemo 111
sorry 95
Hyun 83
hero 73
Snow 66
Oya187 61
yabsab 48
Mind 39
[ Show more ]
soO 34
Yoon 33
ToSsGirL 30
910 22
HiyA 21
zelot 14
ivOry 9
Barracks 0
Dota 2
syndereN899
BananaSlamJamma419
League of Legends
Trikslyr54
Counter-Strike
allub120
Other Games
FrodaN2074
fl0m711
Beastyqt611
hiko588
Lowko408
Fuzer 355
DeMusliM126
XaKoH 100
QueenE84
Mew2King59
RushiSC17
nookyyy 16
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 56
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV1299
League of Legends
• Nemesis3195
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Invitational
19h
Gerald vs YoungYakov
Spirit vs MaNa
SHIN vs Percival
Creator vs Scarlett
Replay Cast
1d 16h
WardiTV Invitational
1d 19h
ByuN vs Solar
Clem vs Classic
Cure vs herO
Reynor vs MaxPax
Replay Cast
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
Krystianer vs TBD
TriGGeR vs SKillous
Percival vs TBD
ByuN vs Nicoract
Replay Cast
5 days
Wardi Open
5 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

YSL S2
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
BSL Season 21
Slon Tour Season 2
CSL Season 19: Qualifier 2
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22

Upcoming

CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Big Gabe Cup #3
OSC Championship Season 13
Nations Cup 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.