• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 01:00
CET 06:00
KST 14:00
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT30Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book19Clem wins HomeStory Cup 289HomeStory Cup 28 - Info & Preview13Rongyi Cup S3 - Preview & Info8
Community News
BGE Stara Zagora 2026 cancelled10Blizzard Classic Cup - Tastosis announced as captains12Weekly Cups (March 2-8): ByuN overcomes PvT block4GSL CK - New online series18BSL Season 224
StarCraft 2
General
BGE Stara Zagora 2026 cancelled BGE Stara Zagora 2026 announced ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT Terran AddOns placement Blizzard Classic Cup - Tastosis announced as captains
Tourneys
2026 KongFu Cup Announcement [GSL CK] Team Maru vs. Team herO StarCraft Evolution League (SC Evo Biweekly) WardiTV Team League Season 10 Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2)
Strategy
Custom Maps
Publishing has been re-enabled! [Feb 24th 2026] Map Editor closed ?
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 516 Specter of Death Mutation # 515 Together Forever Mutation # 514 Ulnar New Year
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ ASL21 General Discussion BW General Discussion Gypsy to Korea Are you ready for ASL 21? Hype VIDEO
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL22] Open Qualifiers & Ladder Tours IPSL Spring 2026 is here! ASL Season 21 Qualifiers March 7-8
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2 Fighting Spirit mining rates Zealot bombing is no longer popular?
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread PC Games Sales Thread No Man's Sky (PS4 and PC)
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Five o'clock TL Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Vanilla Mini Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Mexico's Drug War Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread NASA and the Private Sector
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [Manga] One Piece
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2026 Football Thread General nutrition recommendations Cricket [SPORT] TL MMA Pick'em Pool 2013
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Laptop capable of using Photoshop Lightroom?
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
FS++
Kraekkling
Shocked by a laser…
Spydermine0240
Gaming-Related Deaths
TrAiDoS
Unintentional protectionism…
Uldridge
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1741 users

Attack - Defense - Economy correlations.

Blogs > etofok
Post a Reply
etofok
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
138 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-09-26 13:09:24
January 11 2015 21:16 GMT
#1
Attack - Defense - Economy correlations: a projection from other games.

Small edit: I used highly popular games to illustrate the system that any game has, including dota. Being aware is the first step of any improvement.
It's like when a human first time in his life sees an apple, and then another apple - he acquires the ability to find apples in a basket of other fruits by himself.


There are 3 fundamental pillars that hold up games that have any sort of tactics or strategies:

Attack - Defense - Economy


[image loading]


This is the basic triangle, and it is quite similar to the famous Rock-Paper-Scissors one. However there are differences:

1) The elements have specified parameters while Paper beats Rock 10 out of 10 without any drawbacks.
2) Decisions players make affect their long-term game, meaning the very ability to strategize emerges.
3) Each move (decision) has a different value each turn / second you play because of the aforementioned points.

For example, you can accumulate a certain amount of Rocks and when you have too much of it, you’ll beat the Paper. If you are too ahead you can do pretty much whatever, because you've already snowballed out of control.


+ Show Spoiler +
Worth mentioning, there are differences between the words “Strategy” and “Tactic”. In short:

“Strategy” is a long-term behavior that consists of following some specific and circumspect guidelines.
“Tactics” are the local moves to perform on the path of following those guidelines.

Same thing - different scale.


At some point they might blend into each other and become too blurry to surely distinguish which is which, however in general these are correct definitions.




Both Attack (offense) and Defense are straightforward: you are either preparing / performing an attack or you're preparing for an incoming attack to deflect it with little to no losses.

But the Economy part is what most players overlook.


Any action you perform to get stronger without any actual confrontation with your opponents counts as an Economy move.


In traditional strategy games, such as Starcraft and Warcraft you invest your time and money - resources you possess - into:

1) Acquiring a higher technology level or
2) Making further expansions and production facilities or
3) Researching essential upgrades for your army or
4) ...



Almost every other game has this crucial gameplay element at the very least at its “Tactics” or even smaller scales.

In Dark Souls, for instance, in a boss fight you can drink a healing potion to heal up, you can use a specific item to imbue your weapon with an element that plain out increases the damage you do.

You are not attacking, neither you are defending, however in that moment you’re virtually investing your precious seconds into your health bar or into your further damage output. This move requires from a player an okay timing otherwise you'll get a spear right into your head in the process.

The most vivid example of this I can give you: http://gifyoutube.com/gif/m2qYkx

1) My Defense responses against their Attack moves
2) My Economy move (weapon enhancement) vs Their Economy move & Idling
3) One successful Attack move when the opportunity presented itself.
Needless to say, because of the correct Eco move I was able to bring both of them down in time to close the fight.


If you can’t wrap your head around the idea “how the hell healing is making me stronger” - think about the health bar as insufficient from the start. If during a fight you had to use more than the initial 99 health points in order to stay alive, let's say something like 567 HP - because you healed up so much - this is clearly the definition of making your character stronger: in that fight you essentially had 568 health points, but you paid a cost of playing several Eco moves.



In Dota / League you can safely consider Eco moves as farming and getting experience for your heroes, because the hero is your main and the only valuable asset: it is simultaneously a technological tree, your main production facility to generate gold and your entire army as one entity.
[image loading]

At any point in a game players have to choose one of these 3 vectors to go for.

A friendly reminder that each move (A / D / E) has a different value depending on a situation: overextending as a carry without buyback deep into late game nullifies all the previous choices and instantaneously loses you a game.


Now check this out: ADEgame.

The game will show you this exact topic in action:
1) Importance of every move and why you should choose carefully
2) How pitiful players look when they do completely random stuff without any plan in their head
3) How can anyone create a new metagame just by slightly adjusting the rules
4) Some specific scenarios to play against - when your opponent has a plan
5) Other helpful explanations

Just open up the link and once you’re in as your starting point click the Guide button.


Cheers.

etofok
The king, the priest, the rich man—who lives and who dies? Who will the swordsman obey?
Archeon
Profile Joined May 2011
3265 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-19 00:50:59
January 19 2015 00:45 GMT
#2
Interesting writeup.

While i can see the defense point, it's not the way most strategy games work according to my experience. To be exact I dont know a single strategy game where investing into defense more than into offense is a viable strategy except maybe for the stronghold series.
In most strategy games I know it's common to use offensive forces for defense because that allows to go out on the map and increase your economy while forcing the enemy to stay on his, generating advantage over time. In some games you mix defensive with offensive forces to be safe against early rushes, but most settle for a meta that goes offense->map control/eco->offense. That can be applied to Dota as well.

I think this is a deliberate decision by the developers. They could increase the starting economy or introduce efficient ways to increase your eco inside of your base (it's possible to build most of strongholds eco in the base), but nobody likes to play against turtle and even less people like to watch it.

In Dota I dont think there exists a concept of putting resources into your strategic defense aside from the draft where you can draft something like kotl razor sk. But even there pure 4 protect 1 is overall pretty much dead because it generates to much economic disadvantage.
low gravity, yes-yes!
etofok
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
138 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-19 18:36:09
January 19 2015 16:48 GMT
#3
While i can see the defense point, it's not the way most strategy games work according to my experience. To be exact I dont know a single strategy game where investing into defense more than into offense is a viable strategy except maybe for the stronghold series.

In Dota I dont think there exists a concept of putting resources into your strategic defense aside from the draft where you can draft something like kotl razor sk. But even there pure 4 protect 1 is overall pretty much dead because it generates to much economic disadvantage.


It's not about "defense" as a strategy, it is about using this option when it's needed, simply because this option is always the least desirable one - it gives you nothing.

It's only a response as a preparation, meaning you sacrifice your time/energy/progression to avoid losing more time/energy/progression. An undeflected attack might be crippling. If a team/player can't, or don't understand how use Defense at the right time - they are in clear disadvantage, i.e. pointless feeding.

For example when you see 0 people on the map you probably should gather up or go back - to play safer. Otherwise your AM dies to a gank, for instance.

Stepping aside from Dota, if in a strategy game you can do only Defense / Economy without any Attack - the definition of horrible design, see the end of Sc2 WoL TvZ for the reference. This is an intricate problem - balancing the numbers in such correlations, but nonetheless a solvable problem that's for sure.

In most strategy games I know it's common to use offensive forces for defense because that allows to go out on the map and increase your economy while forcing the enemy to stay on his, generating advantage over time.


Yes, you basically apply pressure to acquire some map control while powering up at home. But these moves are often predictable and already "metagame-ish". In a sense, both players are content with this situation most of the time because, in Sc2 for instance, of asymmetrical balance: Stalker+zealot pushes out marines back home, Marauder+CC pushes back Stalkers back, Hellions can control the map against Zerg for some time etc.

Even in dota if you see SD/Lesh/Sky you have no other option but to expect mid smoke ganks and alike.
The king, the priest, the rich man—who lives and who dies? Who will the swordsman obey?
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
00:00
Code For Giants Cup #28
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
NeuroSwarm 179
ProTech132
UpATreeSC 123
StarCraft: Brood War
ToSsGirL 16
Dota 2
monkeys_forever458
resolut1ontv 90
League of Legends
JimRising 697
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King179
Other Games
summit1g11614
C9.Mang0404
WinterStarcraft366
RuFF_SC244
Liquid`Ken12
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1477
ComeBackTV 67
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 209
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Scarra2449
• Lourlo1126
• Stunt300
Upcoming Events
CranKy Ducklings
5h 1m
RSL Revival
5h 1m
MaxPax vs Rogue
Clem vs Bunny
WardiTV Team League
7h 1m
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
12h 1m
BSL
15h 1m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 5h
RSL Revival
1d 5h
ByuN vs SHIN
Maru vs Krystianer
WardiTV Team League
1d 7h
Patches Events
1d 12h
BSL
1d 15h
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
1d 19h
Replay Cast
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
WardiTV Team League
3 days
GSL
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
WardiTV Team League
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
WardiTV Team League
6 days
Korean StarCraft League
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-03-13
WardiTV Winter 2026
Underdog Cup #3

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Jeongseon Sooper Cup
BSL Season 22
RSL Revival: Season 4
Nations Cup 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual

Upcoming

CSL Elite League 2026
ASL Season 21
Acropolis #4 - TS6
2026 Changsha Offline CUP
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
CSLAN 4
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
NationLESS Cup
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.