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Title pretty much says it all. Couldn't think where to put this, so I thought of putting here.
I should really do more blogs, but writing lately has been pretty stale and so are the subjects. I'm thinking of buying a camera for pictures; that would help me want to write and describe the image, but that's for another time
This past weekend, I flip and flopped between games I wanted to play. I wanted to play Civilization V, but didn't want to get into it. I wanted to play Dota 2 and CSGO, but solo-queuing is so harsh (since moving from NA to EU, finding new people to play with is a bit difficult).
So I considered going back to a MMO. I used to play Guild Wars 2 and before that, a shitload of Ragnarok Online (like back in 2004 and shit). I missed the feeling of progression, being a part of a large group of people all striving for common goals.
I like MMOs because you never feel as much pressure to succeed as you do in competitive games like CSGO, Dota 2 or SC2 and yet; I couldn't bring myself to play Guild Wars 2. Even with the new update and despite the fact that there is no arena mode (like wtf?). I just couldn't do it.
I almost installed EVE Online or Archeage just to see if I would feel comfortable and I couldn't. The thing, for me, with MMOs, is that I can't get into it unless I am there at the very beginning. I hate how competitive and frustrated I get with the feeling with being among the best, but it is also a strong motivator for me to keep playing certain games (or in life, in general).
So when it came to installing Guild Wars 2, I justified not playing it with a bunch of excuses: I don't have any friends who play anymore, the game population looks dead or I didn't want to pay 20 freakin' Euros to server transfer (all my characters are on North America).
But the truth of the matter is is that I was gone for a long time and now I feel behind from everyone else.
Ultimately, it leads to the rationale that, if I am so far behind from everyone else, it is pretty futile for me to progress because I assume, stupidly, that everyone is progressing at a similar if not, faster speed that me and thus I will always be outclassed.
So what justifies people to play MMOs? Is it the social experience or the feeling of accomplishment, regardless if compared to others who are farther and thus, potentially, better? Comparison is my biggest weakness and hindrance to enjoying some things.
Subscriptions are in the same vein of obligation or justification. I have never played for a single subscription-based thing: Not Netflix, not World of WarCraft, nada. I only recently started buying things in Free-to-Play games. The way people explain subscriptions to me is that instead of going to the movies or having a beer is that they spend it on this instead.
But I never do any of those things and when I do, I don't feel obligated to further enjoy it throughout the month. 12$ + Popcorn is about the equivalent of a movie for me. For me, paying subscription so I can continue playing a product makes no sense to me. Some people equate it to time enjoyed = value earned, but I feel that's just getting down to the rut of things. If we're using movies/beer as a comparison to justifying paying a subscription, how is playing a variety of other games for equal time enjoyed not better than paying a continuous amount for one game?
Anyways, that's my two reasonings that I want to play a MMO, but just can't get into it. I like how with EVE Online, you can pay for your subscription through Isk, that's really smart and if the game didn't feel so overwhelming or if someone held my hand for 6 months (rofl), I could probably see how that fairs.
Early morning here in Germany, nice weather. Learning how to play Go (Baduk) thanks to some TL members who are really cool.
Thanks
  
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On May 05 2014 16:45 Onekobold wrote:Show nested quote +On May 05 2014 16:34 Torte de Lini wrote:
So what justifies people to play MMOs? fun usually
Can you elaborate on the fun part?
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social experience + merchanting. something about selling stuff or buying stuff at low price and selling is fun. With new patch or event or something market could shift drastically. I think for some of the more "competitive" MMOs with like PvP aspects, people usually wanna get that end game stuff and kill each other lol
but #1 is social experience I think. any game is more fun with friends and MMOs (which can be gruesomely boring/grindy) can be pretty fun with some buddies.
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Ah rats! I clicked on this blog hoping to find an answer 
or i guess i was hoping for some trashtalk on MMOs, because I dont think they're fun.. I guess its justified by the fact that people have different taste in games.. I dont like them, never did...
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MMOs probably have the highest variance in demographics: You have some of the most hardcore gamers ever made playing alongside people who would never play another kind of game (other than farmville/candy crush), especially in WoW. The reasons for playing are as diverse as the people. Some people enjoy the non stressful atmosphere of leveling, questing and exploring. Others go straight for PVP or raiding and ignore the rest. I quit WoW several times and my rule was, as soon as I wasn't 100% having fun, I would quit.
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The social experience. Its that simple. Probably no other game type encourages you to get together in groups of people and work together. If you dont find that group of people you enjoy playing with, you probably wont play MMOs for long. I probably wouldnt have at least. But if you do, it can keep you playing forever. I still have my WoW subscription active since forever. The game itself is definitely not the reason I keep logging in from time to time (very little now, more at new patches with new raids etc) but playing something with numerous people you've got to know throughout the years is more than enough reason for me. Paying those 13 euro (or whatever it is, not keeping track anymore lol) each month to keep friendships going seems like a good deal to me.
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I'm with you here Torte.
I want to be there at the start, be one of the highest levels, be in one of the best guilds. Starting late significantly reduces the fun.
Shoutout to Delirium in Hero Online, those were the days 
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Torte, play dota with me. solo q sucks!
On the topic of fun in MMORPGs, I find WoW to be the only MMO besides Aion (for some reason) that can keep my interest. Playing the game for fun is a great experience, especially with friends. I go 3v3 arenas with my 2 RL mates, do LFR , complete achievements, level up new characters, socialize, raid, do old content which I did when it was new, play the auction house etc.
If you wanna play WoW, try joining a guild you like quickly (or the TL guild lol) and have fun.
MMORPGs are what you want them to be. Being in a hardcore guild requires a lot of time, being in a casual one takes one/a few hour(s) a week at best.
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Yup, social experience, if i can't find a good group of people to play an MMO with, i'll get bored, fast. I mean i enjoy playing it, the levelling, progression, raiding, pvp but its just not enough without people to enjoy it with.
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You can't get into competitive games when you feel behind... but you take up 囲碁?
That's an odd choice to make.
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On May 05 2014 16:50 JohnChoi wrote:
social experience + merchanting. something about selling stuff or buying stuff at low price and selling is fun. With new patch or event or something market could shift drastically. I think for some of the more "competitive" MMOs with like PvP aspects, people usually wanna get that end game stuff and kill each other lol
but #1 is social experience I think. any game is more fun with friends and MMOs (which can be gruesomely boring/grindy) can be pretty fun with some buddies.
I like that too! I love playing the economy, but I find it can be either hit or miss. Either you do very well or you completely miss the mark and small gains are not worth the dedication and watch. It also takes a lot of tutelage if you're coming in brand new and the market has long been established. But that's my insecurity speaking.
On May 05 2014 17:24 MagnuMizer wrote:Ah rats! I clicked on this blog hoping to find an answer or i guess i was hoping for some trashtalk on MMOs, because I dont think they're fun.. I guess its justified by the fact that people have different taste in games.. I dont like them, never did...
I used to do MMOs because I had no achievement or goals in life, now it's not true, but once in awhile I get the urge. I think it is also because I don't have a sense of community of friends yet. I tried looking for some recently, but no luck.
On May 05 2014 17:39 Jerubaal wrote:
MMOs probably have the highest variance in demographics: You have some of the most hardcore gamers ever made playing alongside people who would never play another kind of game (other than farmville/candy crush), especially in WoW. The reasons for playing are as diverse as the people. Some people enjoy the non stressful atmosphere of leveling, questing and exploring. Others go straight for PVP or raiding and ignore the rest. I quit WoW several times and my rule was, as soon as I wasn't 100% having fun, I would quit.
Oh for sure, I agree! I like to conisder myself with a lot of effort and determination; average ability to excel or achieve rofl! I love PVP in MMOs, it is the first thing I look for a MMO.
Good rule, I should follow it. My co-workers currently play FF14, but it has a subscription model.
On May 05 2014 17:43 Kreb wrote:
The social experience. Its that simple. Probably no other game type encourages you to get together in groups of people and work together. If you dont find that group of people you enjoy playing with, you probably wont play MMOs for long. I probably wouldnt have at least. But if you do, it can keep you playing forever. I still have my WoW subscription active since forever. The game itself is definitely not the reason I keep logging in from time to time (very little now, more at new patches with new raids etc) but playing something with numerous people you've got to know throughout the years is more than enough reason for me. Paying those 13 euro (or whatever it is, not keeping track anymore lol) each month to keep friendships going seems like a good deal to me.
100% true, you're right. I suppose the answer is really just that simple.
On May 05 2014 18:12 Laurens wrote:I'm with you here Torte. I want to be there at the start, be one of the highest levels, be in one of the best guilds. Starting late significantly reduces the fun. Shoutout to Delirium in Hero Online, those were the days
Yeah, you know what I mean! I hate starting late; because I feel like I can never get past a certain point than others who started at the very beginning, sometimes I'm the same with electronics where I feel I won't be able to fully utilize my money's worth of an object until the next upgrade comes out or something.
On May 05 2014 18:15 Wintex wrote:
Torte, play dota with me. solo q sucks!
On the topic of fun in MMORPGs, I find WoW to be the only MMO besides Aion (for some reason) that can keep my interest. Playing the game for fun is a great experience, especially with friends. I go 3v3 arenas with my 2 RL mates, do LFR , complete achievements, level up new characters, socialize, raid, do old content which I did when it was new, play the auction house etc.
If you wanna play WoW, try joining a guild you like quickly (or the TL guild lol) and have fun.
MMORPGs are what you want them to be. Being in a hardcore guild requires a lot of time, being in a casual one takes one/a few hour(s) a week at best.
How are you at Dota 2? :D I don't play ranked, but I play a lot of unranked. I haven't in awhile though given I always solo-q. I don't mind playing alone, I just like communicating and playing with friends too though.
I did a lot of PVP awhile back for a bunch of games and it really is the most enjoyable. I don't find PVE that appealing unless the people I am playing with hilarious and fun. I take it serious, but sometimes it feels like an endless grind.
Nah. I definitely won't be playing WoW ): But thanks for the invite!
On May 05 2014 18:38 Dagobert wrote:
You can't get into competitive games when you feel behind... but you take up 囲碁?
That's an odd choice to make.
I don't take the same approach with board games. It really relaxes me and this is going to sound both ironic and contradictory, but being at the very bottom of something, where everything is new and I can be naive and innocence is a comforting feeling.
A lot of helpful people want to review and play teaching games with me too, so that's really endearing and makes me happy.
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I think it is also varies to some extent on the MMORPG. EVE players tend to be a different demographic and have different motivations from WoW or (sigh) Runescape players. Heck, even maplestory. It's interesting to see the various subsets of users on TL who partake in each of these games.
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i have no experience with subcription MMOs but ive played a lot of F2P MMORPGs and I can tell you most of them have streamlined their game into making it super beginner friendly and as easy as possible for you to get into it. Just get a couple of friends to play with you and jump into one if you wanna burn some time
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I started playing Planet Side 2 less than a week ago, and I absolutely love the game even though I'm constantly dying. It's one of the few games where I've actually had fun while still getting owned.
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Can't ever get into mmorpg no matter how good they are supposed to be.
Takes way too long to walk to places, huge grinding and just very time consuming to do frustrating yet necessary quest.
I don't mind grinding games, I play disagea, monster hunter etc just for the grinding.
But mmo has a different definition of grind
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United Kingdom14103 Posts
i always just feel guilty
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Lalalaland34498 Posts
Just addressing some of your concerns regarding Guild Wars 2 and EVE:
Guild Wars 2 is probably one of the least 'oh I started late, I'm behind everyone now' games. There is definitely more of a gear grind in GW2 than there was in GW1, but the different is small, relatively insignificant, and people aren't going to scream at you about catching up. You still do the exact same content as everyone else. You might be out of the loop with some of the living story (since it updates every couple weeks, and 'old' living story content is removed), but that's simply lore related stuff, and doesn't actually impact how you play the game.
EVE: yes, in many ways you start 'behind' everyone else in EVE because of the time-based skill system. However you can easily leapfrog it all by purchasing characters on the official character bazaar. What that means is that your limitations in EVE are how to make isk, and your knowledge of how the game works. The TL community in EVE is still somewhat active (albeit nowhere near as much as it used to be) and hanging around with them for a month or two will make you already better than 90% of the EVE population out there.
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You start about 3000 years behind in Go though, its a pretty long grind to catch up
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I don't touch MMOs anymore. Used to play WoW, Runescape, and MapleStory as a kid. After the initial excitement, most of the players don't really enjoy playing, its just a time-sucking addiction and endless grind for online status. If I were to grind like that, I'd rather do it in the real world where at least I can get some real cash out of it.
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