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1998 : I'm not playing StarCraft

Blogs > Denar
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Denar
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
France1633 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-16 09:39:47
October 16 2013 08:37 GMT
#1
StarCraft came out in 1998, and it would later on be the reason for the existence of TeamLiquid, and an esports scene we love.
But I didn't get on it, totally missed the train, because that year I was playing other games.


This takes us quite back in time, but in 1997 I was a huge Warcraft 2 fan. I had been playing the first Warcraft a bit, but the second was the one to really hook me and make me love the Real-time Strategy Genre. It was all about playing the campaign or games against the AI at a time where I didn't have Internet, but it was amazing, and I had spent countless hours on the game and its "Beyond The Dark Portal" expansion.
During that year, the hype was strong about Blizzard's upcoming RTS, StarCraft. There were ads in game magazines, we didn't have much information, but it was a Blizzard RTS in a sci-fi setting and I was really excited for it.
The only problem was that in 1997, the game was not coming out. Blizzard were having some development hiccups and overhauled the project, delaying the release of this game I was anticipating so much.
And when I managed to get my hands on 2 other RTS, I ended up spending an insane amount of time on them and eventually forgot about StarCraft.



War Wind

[image loading]


The first game was War Wind, released in 1996. It featured 4 distinct races with very different gameplays and feelings to them. The art style of the game was also very similar to StarCraft making it the perfect substitute.
The things that I liked most about the game were that the races were actually more asymmetric in their gameplay than pretty much any game at the time, and you could upgrade units to enhance their abilities.
All in all, that game was good, and I spent a lot of time playing it, but it has been forgotten in the trail of StarCraft (though it got a sequel that I have never played)



Z

[image loading]


While I liked War Wind a lot, I have to admit that my drug at the time was this game : Z

Z was a RTS with a fantastic concept that didn't involve resource collection. The map had zones that you could control by sending an infantry unit to its flag. Controlling a zone allowed you to use its facilities, such as factories that build units.
Building a unit takes some time, depending on the number of zones you control. But the most vicious feature to be in this game, which made it the most fun was that a unit construction was not cancelled or reset when a zone is captured. When a player is 3 seconds away from getting a very powerful tank unit, and he sees a simple infantry unit coming in to capture the flag, and then witnesses the tank coming out of the factory with his opponent's color, is one of the most fun things I have experienced as a gamer.

On top of these great game mechanics, the campaign was lengthy enough, and with tons of humor, like in the intro cinematic.
Another thing I remember about the game : when you were winning, the music accelerates, your units tell you to attack and finish it, and a woman voice starts telling you : "You are the best" and other nice things. But if you were losing the game, that same woman voice would start to insult you in a very withering manner. This was hilarious, but it actually contributed to a big adrenaline rush when finishing a game, so that every game left a big impression on you.


Z was a hell of a great game, but didn't leave that much of a legacy, and the financial problems suffered by The Bitmap Brothers didn't help I guess.
In the end, I missed out on StarCraft because of those 2 games, but had a ton of fun meanwhile. And I came back to Blizzard RTS when they released Warcraft 3 a few years later.

****
FFW_Rude
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
France10201 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-16 08:58:10
October 16 2013 08:57 GMT
#2
Oh my god ... Warwind... This game was hard as fuck !

Z was a really good RTS too. Warwind was so complex... What's the sequel of that game ?
If you like old RTS games try earth 2140,2150,2160 (for me earth 2150 is the best). Or Warzone 2100
#1 KT Rolster fanboy. KT BEST KT ! Hail to KT playoffs Zergs ! Unofficial french translator for SlayerS_`Boxer` biography "Crazy as me".
nttea
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Sweden4353 Posts
October 16 2013 08:59 GMT
#3
Would it be worth playing z today? It looks awesome!
FFW_Rude
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
France10201 Posts
October 16 2013 09:01 GMT
#4
I was wondering too if Warwind works on W7 ? And if so. Where can i find it ? Abandonware or this game is still selling ?
#1 KT Rolster fanboy. KT BEST KT ! Hail to KT playoffs Zergs ! Unofficial french translator for SlayerS_`Boxer` biography "Crazy as me".
DinoToss
Profile Joined August 2013
Poland507 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-16 09:12:22
October 16 2013 09:07 GMT
#5
Thank you i was trying to remember the game's name for years (War wind).

nttea : Z sequel (Z:Steel soldiers)was pretty awesome when i played it. And i remember the graphics where pretty innovative when it came out.

There was also that game that i loved to play, but i only had demo it was "mechwarrior" RTS. Kinda in a anime style maybe? About 99-2000.

My wrist really started to flare up. My colossi number started to pile up and with the last of my concentration I prepared for a win.
Zeon0
Profile Joined September 2010
Austria2995 Posts
October 16 2013 09:09 GMT
#6
On October 16 2013 17:59 nttea wrote:
Would it be worth playing z today? It looks awesome!

Yes. But it can be trouble to makr it run on new systems. Bit with some google skills its not that big of a problem
Hater of MKP since GSL Open Season 2 | Fanboy of: NesTea Stephano IdrA DIMAGA MorroW ret DongRaeGu Snute SaSe Mvp ThorZaIN DeMusliM
DinoToss
Profile Joined August 2013
Poland507 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-16 09:15:39
October 16 2013 09:14 GMT
#7
If you count Bullfrog games like Dungeon Keeper or Theme hospital as RTS, you can count me as another "I was not playing Starcraft in 98". Though i played Starcraft demo for days. I remember there was 3 missions, i played the shit out of them.

I think i bought original starcraft like few years after.
My wrist really started to flare up. My colossi number started to pile up and with the last of my concentration I prepared for a win.
nttea
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Sweden4353 Posts
October 16 2013 09:15 GMT
#8
On October 16 2013 18:09 Zeon0 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 16 2013 17:59 nttea wrote:
Would it be worth playing z today? It looks awesome!

Yes. But it can be trouble to makr it run on new systems. Bit with some google skills its not that big of a problem

I was mostly concerned about ui and if it's actually fun to play, i played dune2 a while ago and it was pretty much a pain in the ass having to click one unit at a time and the sound was awful and gameplay waay worse than i remembered. Would not recommend
FFW_Rude
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
France10201 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-16 09:16:23
October 16 2013 09:16 GMT
#9
And don't forget Total annihilation !
#1 KT Rolster fanboy. KT BEST KT ! Hail to KT playoffs Zergs ! Unofficial french translator for SlayerS_`Boxer` biography "Crazy as me".
DinoToss
Profile Joined August 2013
Poland507 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-16 09:20:38
October 16 2013 09:17 GMT
#10
On October 16 2013 18:15 nttea wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 16 2013 18:09 Zeon0 wrote:
On October 16 2013 17:59 nttea wrote:
Would it be worth playing z today? It looks awesome!

Yes. But it can be trouble to makr it run on new systems. Bit with some google skills its not that big of a problem

I was mostly concerned about ui and if it's actually fun to play, i played dune2 a while ago and it was pretty much a pain in the ass having to click one unit at a time and the sound was awful and gameplay waay worse than i remembered. Would not recommend

Imo you should give Z sequel a chance, few years ago i wanted to make it work on W7 but failed but i guess nowadays it should be figured out. It was pretty awesome and challanging. Definitely different from Starcraft from what i remember.

It's in 3d and shouldnt be too clunky.

Total Annihilation is a no-brainer. But honestly the most fun SINGLE-PLAYER RTS for me was original C&C and RA 1995/1996 respectively. I played the shit out of them. And i loved the movies inbetween missions, and the whole story and Klepacki's music. Everyone should play the originals, sequels were much worse. Though RA2 and Tiberian Sun was ok, a specially Tiberian Sun because it had this weird "Mech" spin.

Original C&C was my first originally bought game, i remember dragging my dad to buy it. I remember making saves before finishing mission just to rewatch certain movies lol.
My wrist really started to flare up. My colossi number started to pile up and with the last of my concentration I prepared for a win.
Gowerly
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United Kingdom916 Posts
October 16 2013 09:21 GMT
#11
I skipped SC to play Total Annihilation. However, Z was one of my favourite games of the time, as well.
Telling a unit with low health/low tech to attack one of higher status was cleverly done, too, with the units suggesting "You're Joking?!"
The multiple ways to win (entering the castle or just blowing it up from outside range) was great. The way the units were generated, the way you could set up static defenses as well as blow up/repair the factories to hinder your opponent, it was all really well done and, as far as I'm aware, the best non-resource collecting RTS there has been.
I will reduce you to a series of numbers.
FFW_Rude
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
France10201 Posts
October 16 2013 09:23 GMT
#12
On October 16 2013 18:21 Gowerly wrote:
I skipped SC to play Total Annihilation. However, Z was one of my favourite games of the time, as well.
Telling a unit with low health/low tech to attack one of higher status was cleverly done, too, with the units suggesting "You're Joking?!"
The multiple ways to win (entering the castle or just blowing it up from outside range) was great. The way the units were generated, the way you could set up static defenses as well as blow up/repair the factories to hinder your opponent, it was all really well done and, as far as I'm aware, the best non-resource collecting RTS there has been.


Ground Control was quite a good non-ressource collecting RTS too. But you needed a Fin powerfull computer that costed so much at this time.
#1 KT Rolster fanboy. KT BEST KT ! Hail to KT playoffs Zergs ! Unofficial french translator for SlayerS_`Boxer` biography "Crazy as me".
Denar
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
France1633 Posts
October 16 2013 09:25 GMT
#13
On October 16 2013 17:59 nttea wrote:
Would it be worth playing z today? It looks awesome!


I think it is really worth it, it still looks good like you say because it was a bit cartoony so it aged very well, and the gameplay is very easy to get into, while being hard to master.

If you want to play it, you could take a look at "The Zod Engine" : http://zod.sourceforge.net/

It is an open-source remake of Z, I have not tried it yet, but it adds multiplayer, and should work without any setup pain on modern systems
DinoToss
Profile Joined August 2013
Poland507 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-16 09:30:47
October 16 2013 09:28 GMT
#14
On October 16 2013 18:23 FFW_Rude wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 16 2013 18:21 Gowerly wrote:
I skipped SC to play Total Annihilation. However, Z was one of my favourite games of the time, as well.
Telling a unit with low health/low tech to attack one of higher status was cleverly done, too, with the units suggesting "You're Joking?!"
The multiple ways to win (entering the castle or just blowing it up from outside range) was great. The way the units were generated, the way you could set up static defenses as well as blow up/repair the factories to hinder your opponent, it was all really well done and, as far as I'm aware, the best non-resource collecting RTS there has been.


Ground Control was quite a good non-ressource collecting RTS too. But you needed a Fin powerfull computer that costed so much at this time.

OMG Ground control, i remember spending all my money on it and i never, ever regretted it. It had the MOST amazing graphics of any RTS. Only Homeworld would compare. You could zoom in so close that you could see bullet SHELLS coming out of marine guns and tanks.



It came out in 2000...

I would also say that
Sacriface and Battlezone were amazing hybrid FPS/TPP/RTS games. But yea saying they were RTS would be quite a stretch regardless one of the best games ever.
My wrist really started to flare up. My colossi number started to pile up and with the last of my concentration I prepared for a win.
FFW_Rude
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
France10201 Posts
October 16 2013 09:30 GMT
#15
On October 16 2013 18:25 Denar wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 16 2013 17:59 nttea wrote:
Would it be worth playing z today? It looks awesome!


I think it is really worth it, it still looks good like you say because it was a bit cartoony so it aged very well, and the gameplay is very easy to get into, while being hard to master.

If you want to play it, you could take a look at "The Zod Engine" : http://zod.sourceforge.net/

It is an open-source remake of Z, I have not tried it yet, but it adds multiplayer, and should work without any setup pain on modern systems


Oh that is really cool !

Also i wanted to pointed out for TA fans that there was a project a long time ago with TA in 3D (it's called : Total annihilation spring) and it's REALLY good (and free) and you could even play FPS because you could enter and control units.
FPS in a Krogoth was something !

+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]

[image loading]
[image loading]
#1 KT Rolster fanboy. KT BEST KT ! Hail to KT playoffs Zergs ! Unofficial french translator for SlayerS_`Boxer` biography "Crazy as me".
nttea
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Sweden4353 Posts
October 16 2013 10:56 GMT
#16
On October 16 2013 18:25 Denar wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 16 2013 17:59 nttea wrote:
Would it be worth playing z today? It looks awesome!


I think it is really worth it, it still looks good like you say because it was a bit cartoony so it aged very well, and the gameplay is very easy to get into, while being hard to master.

If you want to play it, you could take a look at "The Zod Engine" : http://zod.sourceforge.net/

It is an open-source remake of Z, I have not tried it yet, but it adds multiplayer, and should work without any setup pain on modern systems

Thanks a lot for this!
ImbaTosS
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United Kingdom1685 Posts
October 16 2013 12:36 GMT
#17
On October 16 2013 18:28 DinoToss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 16 2013 18:23 FFW_Rude wrote:
On October 16 2013 18:21 Gowerly wrote:
I skipped SC to play Total Annihilation. However, Z was one of my favourite games of the time, as well.
Telling a unit with low health/low tech to attack one of higher status was cleverly done, too, with the units suggesting "You're Joking?!"
The multiple ways to win (entering the castle or just blowing it up from outside range) was great. The way the units were generated, the way you could set up static defenses as well as blow up/repair the factories to hinder your opponent, it was all really well done and, as far as I'm aware, the best non-resource collecting RTS there has been.


Ground Control was quite a good non-ressource collecting RTS too. But you needed a Fin powerfull computer that costed so much at this time.

OMG Ground control, i remember spending all my money on it and i never, ever regretted it. It had the MOST amazing graphics of any RTS. Only Homeworld would compare. You could zoom in so close that you could see bullet SHELLS coming out of marine guns and tanks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXJ1WBkpqT8

It came out in 2000...

I would also say that
Sacriface and Battlezone were amazing hybrid FPS/TPP/RTS games. But yea saying they were RTS would be quite a stretch regardless one of the best games ever.

Oh that's sick!! I remember playing this game!!! I was only 8 or 9 at the time, but the sounds and the style take me straight back as if it were yesterday.

I wonder if it's made by the same devs as "MDK" (anyone remember those games??). The ricochet sounds, some of the animations and the music are very similar or the same.

Other classics I was playing then and still play occasionally now, are the Jedi Knight games, Caesar III, and Commandos. Caesar III is so hard and intricate that Caesar IV was an epic disappointment when it took 1 day to complete. I feel like there was a tendency to make games harder then. I play single player titles from 10 years ago and find myself thinking that's how it should be.

1 other classic I played then and still play now every day- BroodWar. A massive achievement.
EleGant[AoV]
FFW_Rude
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
France10201 Posts
October 16 2013 12:46 GMT
#18
On October 16 2013 21:36 ImbaTosS wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 16 2013 18:28 DinoToss wrote:
On October 16 2013 18:23 FFW_Rude wrote:
On October 16 2013 18:21 Gowerly wrote:
I skipped SC to play Total Annihilation. However, Z was one of my favourite games of the time, as well.
Telling a unit with low health/low tech to attack one of higher status was cleverly done, too, with the units suggesting "You're Joking?!"
The multiple ways to win (entering the castle or just blowing it up from outside range) was great. The way the units were generated, the way you could set up static defenses as well as blow up/repair the factories to hinder your opponent, it was all really well done and, as far as I'm aware, the best non-resource collecting RTS there has been.


Ground Control was quite a good non-ressource collecting RTS too. But you needed a Fin powerfull computer that costed so much at this time.

OMG Ground control, i remember spending all my money on it and i never, ever regretted it. It had the MOST amazing graphics of any RTS. Only Homeworld would compare. You could zoom in so close that you could see bullet SHELLS coming out of marine guns and tanks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXJ1WBkpqT8

It came out in 2000...

I would also say that
Sacriface and Battlezone were amazing hybrid FPS/TPP/RTS games. But yea saying they were RTS would be quite a stretch regardless one of the best games ever.

Oh that's sick!! I remember playing this game!!! I was only 8 or 9 at the time, but the sounds and the style take me straight back as if it were yesterday.

I wonder if it's made by the same devs as "MDK" (anyone remember those games??). The ricochet sounds, some of the animations and the music are very similar or the same.

Other classics I was playing then and still play occasionally now, are the Jedi Knight games, Caesar III, and Commandos. Caesar III is so hard and intricate that Caesar IV was an epic disappointment when it took 1 day to complete. I feel like there was a tendency to make games harder then. I play single player titles from 10 years ago and find myself thinking that's how it should be.

1 other classic I played then and still play now every day- BroodWar. A massive achievement.


I might have an original MDK disc somewhere...

Commandos... lol... the unfinishable game.
#1 KT Rolster fanboy. KT BEST KT ! Hail to KT playoffs Zergs ! Unofficial french translator for SlayerS_`Boxer` biography "Crazy as me".
HolyExlxF
Profile Joined March 2011
United States256 Posts
October 16 2013 13:00 GMT
#19
One of my favorite games, while not RTS, also consumed my time when SC came out. Deadlock 2: Shrine Wars was one of the coolest games I had ever played. I only had the demo for the longest time, which capped a game at 15 turns or something like that, and I remember playing it so much that I would always try and find the most efficient way to blitz to high tech and make super units.

Another semi-RTS/RTT that I loved was the Close Combat series. The A Bridge Too Far demo was probably my most played game for a year before my Dad bought the entire series that Christmas.
ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ
Hryul
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Austria2609 Posts
October 16 2013 13:08 GMT
#20
On October 16 2013 21:46 FFW_Rude wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 16 2013 21:36 ImbaTosS wrote:
On October 16 2013 18:28 DinoToss wrote:
On October 16 2013 18:23 FFW_Rude wrote:
On October 16 2013 18:21 Gowerly wrote:
I skipped SC to play Total Annihilation. However, Z was one of my favourite games of the time, as well.
Telling a unit with low health/low tech to attack one of higher status was cleverly done, too, with the units suggesting "You're Joking?!"
The multiple ways to win (entering the castle or just blowing it up from outside range) was great. The way the units were generated, the way you could set up static defenses as well as blow up/repair the factories to hinder your opponent, it was all really well done and, as far as I'm aware, the best non-resource collecting RTS there has been.


Ground Control was quite a good non-ressource collecting RTS too. But you needed a Fin powerfull computer that costed so much at this time.

OMG Ground control, i remember spending all my money on it and i never, ever regretted it. It had the MOST amazing graphics of any RTS. Only Homeworld would compare. You could zoom in so close that you could see bullet SHELLS coming out of marine guns and tanks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXJ1WBkpqT8

It came out in 2000...

I would also say that
Sacriface and Battlezone were amazing hybrid FPS/TPP/RTS games. But yea saying they were RTS would be quite a stretch regardless one of the best games ever.

Oh that's sick!! I remember playing this game!!! I was only 8 or 9 at the time, but the sounds and the style take me straight back as if it were yesterday.

I wonder if it's made by the same devs as "MDK" (anyone remember those games??). The ricochet sounds, some of the animations and the music are very similar or the same.

Other classics I was playing then and still play occasionally now, are the Jedi Knight games, Caesar III, and Commandos. Caesar III is so hard and intricate that Caesar IV was an epic disappointment when it took 1 day to complete. I feel like there was a tendency to make games harder then. I play single player titles from 10 years ago and find myself thinking that's how it should be.

1 other classic I played then and still play now every day- BroodWar. A massive achievement.


I might have an original MDK disc somewhere...

Commandos... lol... the unfinishable game.

I recently bought commandos and it was awesome. I did finish it, but somehow didn't bother with the xp.
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