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On February 05 2013 12:55 WolfintheSheep wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2013 12:34 Eskiya23 wrote:On February 05 2013 08:44 BlaineMono wrote:
Marketing dominates TL recently. It's either discussion about awesome Asus commercial, or sponsorship changes or buying LG monitors. Noone really seems to give a shit about the game. It's all about the show.
People like Incontrol shouldn't even be relevant to ANYONE on this site. Who the fuck is this guy? I don't hate him, nor do I like him. I just don't give a fuck. He's totally irrelevant. If you think otherwise, please realize that you don't give a shit about this game, you care about the show. And that's fine, but please realize this and say up front that you're in for the show. Please don't take this as a hate towards Incontrol, cause it's not. In terms of competitive SC2 he doesn't exist, there is nothing that will change that. He is 100% talk, PR and marketing and he himself knows that.
Truth means little to TL folk, it seems. Yes, marketing rules the world. Yes, a man has to pay his bills. But taking part in that is nothing to be proud of. Please don't say that it's perfectly normal, don't justify it.
A statement can either be true or false. So simple...
User was warned for this post Quoted for truth. Incontrol with his ''0-5'' in every group and hogging up MLG slots, he became quite the thorn in the eye for most competitive players. The whole drama of Incontrol vs Destiny, or TotalBiscuit is only in SC2 for the money and many other incidents doest exactly help. CombatEX is very vocal about his opinion on this matter, but every other StarCraft 2 player already knew. People forget that he is a PR & Marketing guy now, a spokesperson representing certain brands or whathaveyou. Of course he will play things off as a joke, tell you to buy Razer now instead of SS and just purely market the brand and/or himself. Dont expect him to act otherwise. I suggest you guys to read Animal Farm by George Orwell, a great book about this kind of corporate occurences. Playing the victim role isnt going to help either. There is a fine line between selling and selling out. 1) You don't know any players. At all. Maybe some signed some autographs. Maybe some responded to a few of your post. But to pretend that you speak on behalf of them is sheer arrogance. 2) No one forgot InControl's job. Perhaps these "people" you refer to are goldfish. In which case, I wouldn't recommend using them for an argument. 3) Name dropping a famous book does make your rant any more coherent. I suggest you read War and Peace to figure out why. 4) Clearly you despise any organization that accepts money from, and promotes, any sponsor. This is why you would never post on TeamLiquid, a team that would dare to market Razer products to you despite being non-committal in their gaming gear preferences prior to big fat checks. 5) "Fine line between selling and selling out" is a cute line. Very poetic. However, if it was supposed to mean something, I suggest actually writing some content instead of a tagline. I suppose InControl is selling his noble integrity, because now he gags on his own vomit every time he promotes Razer? Clearly he believed that Razer was the devil one week ago, and he now has no soul left.
First of all, whoa Incontrol defence force ! I dont know any players? At all? Quite some big assumptions you are making there. Just accusing me of arrogance (ad hominem) isnt going to take away that Incontrol had (alot) of incidents in the past, which just seems to add up. There are a lot of shady stuff going under the radar that you might not even heared about, like un-resheduled coaching sessions etc. It all piles up.
He is a PR & Marketing guy now, a spokesperson representing certain brands. Therefore he will ''jokingly'' have a go at Razor, but when its Razor picking up EG he will ofcourse apologise and tell everybody it was nothing to worry about.
Cant people just thank the sponsors like Stephano does, instead of glorifying the SS product and having to contradict oneself later on?
Want some more poetry? In my previous post I have listed some of the incidents/facts Incontrol has caused, without any personal attacks or insults. People who post in a critical way about Incontrol get warnings, posts on reddit get downvoted to oblivion. Guess people like the beautifull lie rather than the painfull thruth.
+ Show Spoiler +In no way do I deny what Incontrol has done for esports in a positive light, his Kingston Hyper X casts as well as features on 2GD show are quite hilarious. Just because someone is put on a pedestal doesnt mean we cant critisize him
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I own a Razer keyboard, a SS mouse pad, 3 Razer mice and 1 SS mouse and I don't use any of them except for the mouse pad. I just stick with my cheap 15 dollar Microsoft blue optical mouse, works perfectly.
In general I think 'gaming gear' is just a big ripoff. standard mice and keyboards work just as well.
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On February 05 2013 05:06 Sn0_Man wrote:
It is a bit sad the community is dumb enough to warrant a post like this, but a man's gotta do what a man's gotta do. GL with razer.
You'll understand if this doesn't influence my purchasing decisions the way you want it to though.
word
User was warned for this post
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Why would you even post this, I don't understand. Retards are retards and will continue to be retards, who cares if said retards throw some mindless, retarded insults at your twitter or reddit, if they can't understand business. Why create this post full of unnecessary drama when the truth is nobody with a couple neurons with functional dendrites linking them even gives a fuck about this.
I'm going to write something pretty annoying here, but whatever, sometimes I get the feeling you create your own drama, then make a fuss about it to create some more drama from it, then write a post on TL to make some MORE drama about some small thing. I don't know, maybe there's a PR thing going on (seems likely), but all of this just seems like a massive spotlight call to me, and all posts of this type seem the same, just attention calls.
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i think its weird how a lot of people only buy 1 brand. I personally use a microsoft keyboard a SS mousepad and a razer mouse. Its what fits me best
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You know you're a part of a dumb-as-a-brick community when a blog post like this is neccessary.
"Hey guys, this company pays me and my team money to front their gear. This is actually how business work, who-da-thunk?"
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On February 05 2013 04:48 iNcontroL wrote:
TLDR: Had a great time with SS.
As a German, I can't say the same.
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I don't know if this is the right place , but does it mean taht stormville showmatch are over ? ( some of the prizes were from steelseries , and the site is down ).
Do razer also provide official babe to the house ? ( this dreamhack will never be forget )
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On February 06 2013 02:02 StarVe wrote:As a German, I can't say the same.
hahahahah
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On February 05 2013 23:44 mordk wrote:
Why would you even post this, I don't understand. Retards are retards and will continue to be retards, who cares if said retards throw some mindless, retarded insults at your twitter or reddit, if they can't understand business. Why create this post full of unnecessary drama when the truth is nobody with a couple neurons with functional dendrites linking them even gives a fuck about this.
I'm going to write something pretty annoying here, but whatever, sometimes I get the feeling you create your own drama, then make a fuss about it to create some more drama from it, then write a post on TL to make some MORE drama about some small thing. I don't know, maybe there's a PR thing going on (seems likely), but all of this just seems like a massive spotlight call to me, and all posts of this type seem the same, just attention calls.
Well this post caused zero drama... As I intended so I guess you're just wrong. But yeah.. That theory of me intentionally doubling up on drama sounds legit.
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
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On February 05 2013 05:16 iNcontroL wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2013 05:06 Sn0_Man wrote:
It is a bit sad the community is dumb enough to warrant a post like this, but a man's gotta do what a man's gotta do. GL with razer.
You'll understand if this doesn't influence my purchasing decisions the way you want it to though. yep. I woke up to someone tweeting me "motherfucker" and I read reddit/TL and see myself being called a hypocrite, leechcontrol etc etc... really hurtful stuff. It's expected.. I am "the face" or spokesperson or w/e in many situations so I get that flak. Just needed to try and get my thoughts out there and hopefully make a difference.
I thought this was a completely pedantic and silly blog post until I got to this comment.
Sigh...
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On February 06 2013 02:02 StarVe wrote:As a German, I can't say the same.
Granted, he was the founder of 88.. 
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On February 05 2013 13:19 OmniEulogy wrote:
I actually just feel bad for you after reading some of your comments. People actually attack you over this? I think they are all just trying to get a rise out of you... I can't see how anybody with half a brain could come to some of the conclusions I've read and actually mean it.
<3 Geoff. Hell of a job you've got yourself lol
I agree with the most part...
On the other hand, there has to be a reason that he disproportionately receives more than his fair share of the vitriol...
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+ Show Spoiler +On February 05 2013 05:55 sLideSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2013 05:46 iNcontroL wrote:On February 05 2013 05:39 sLideSC2 wrote:On February 05 2013 05:36 crms wrote:
Just stop. He was indirectly employed by Steelseries at the time and now he is indirectly employed by Razer. This happens all the time in the real world and this is 100% why you don't trust sponsored personalities on gear recommendations.
Let them do their thing, let them market, let them get paid. You do your own due diligence to find out which products YOU think are the best and buy accordingly.
Sad community making me sad. Yes but when he's telling us to trust him that's a different story. ???? You mean the interview where I talk about taking over the world with monster shooting robots and our CEO's sole drive being to own a gold car? You are going to cite that as an opinion piece from me? No. No.. no no no no no no. If you can find an interview where I am NOT joking around and I say "Razer sucks" or w/e FINE use that against me. But if you want to use an interview where almost literally everything I say is untrue and a joke.. COME ON. It's not too hard to believe you're opinion when it's not an uncommon opinion, even if the rest of the interview was a joke.
If you can't spot basic human emotions or obviously sarcastic/non-serious banter then you need to stop posting and really comprehend what you are reading.
Incontrol stated clearly throughout the blog and in 2 answers to you that he was not serious, and explaining the situation exactly. He even took the time to explain the joke video he posted with Anna Prosser. You can't seriously think he was being serious in that video when he 1) monster destroying robots 2) Tells us of Garfield's ambition to own a yellow car (ala Simpsons Chester Lampwick story) 3) Mocks the competitors of EG's sponsors lightheartedly.
I think you just want to start trouble, because its clear you lack the patience or concentration to understand the subject at hand.
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This thought process is entirely understandable from a business perspective. I, and many others, take no issue with that. We reconize such sponorships as the equivalent of a celeberity endorsement, and treat them as such.
If you want to explore causes, I think the fundamental issue comes from the sometimes blurred line you have in modern media between impartial sources (essentially friends & family) that can be trusted to be frank, forthcoming and tell you everything about what they know and believe because they have no vested interested, and advertising endorsements, which give you some level of surety but not at the same level of friends & family. I don't mean to imply that there isn't any trust, but rather degree of trust is slightly different. Confusing the two is probably what causes a lot of the backlash.
First off, I think that celebery endorsement does imply some level of quality for a product. I don't know of many celeberties that endorse products they hate. On a fundamental level, that is pretty much guarenteed, or the celeberty risks his or her long term reputation. This gives you a minimum standard of quality: the product you are looking at is likely both suitable and good.
I would not expect, however, that same celeberty (with their endorsement) to come out in a public forum and give a detailed breakdown and accounting for all the situations where one product or another might be preferable, and a very detailed description of the strengths and weaknesses of each. While someone like you would be in the perfect position to do something like this, you cannot as you are sponsored by company or another. Instead, we rely on journalists, reviewers, and most importantly friends, family, and those who we identify with who share our quirks and tastes, even if we cannot put those quirks and tastes into words.
I'm sure both steelseries and razor are good products, but if I had to ask, which one is better, in what situations, and why? would you be able to answer that in detail? I'm sure you would, but not in public, as it may be problematic from a sponsorship perspective.
Generally, 'friends and family' recommendations are always what a person believes to be best for a given situation, and don't change unless they are unsatisfied with the product in some way. This dissatisfaction is usually given voice in a strong negative reason (poor customer service, feature/function mismatch, didn't live up to expectations, device broke, etc.)
Switching from one to the other is seen by those who take it as a 'friend and family' recommendation as the one you selected (before) being the best, despite the fact with sponsorship you never meant to imply that either is or was the absolute best. To them, now that you have a new endorsement, you must either think that this is better (a new best), and if so want to know why you believe that, or you are doing it because the money is needed, or it really doesn't matter all that much which one is the best (which is also an undesirable answer as people always want maximum value for their money, and want to feel good about what they have done/purchased.)
Interestingly, part of the problem stems itself from the close connection with the community. No one takes a corperate sponsorship as a friend and family level recommendation. This is evidenced by the fact fact that such celeberty endorcements are given more weight when celeberies come out off the record as truly loving a product and use it not just in offical capacities, but in all unoffical ones.
Today celeberties, together with advances in communication technology, have created closer connections between fans and professionals that form a level of understanding that lies somewhere between the two. EG especailly understands how important it is to form that connection, where you blur the line between business and personal. The more invested others become and the more trust you engender, the more marketable you are to both fans and sponsors. At the same time, the closer you get the more likely people are to view your recommendations, direct or indirect, as one of a friend or family and expect that level of fidelity and trust. When that happens, an endorsement morphs into a 'friend and family' full-fledged best of class recommendation.
It can either be just business, or it can be about connecting with others on a personal level. Sometimes it can be both at the same time. Sometimes when they blur together people cannot tell the difference, and I think that is where you see this particular slice of outrage. It comes when people want to take your endorsement as a 'friend and family' recommendation, when it isn't really.
I think my point is fairly clear, but let me illustrate with another example:
I love soda, and I love both coke and pepsi. I drink both, I enjoy both, I think they are both great products. I'd be happy to take a sponorship from either one of them for what I do, becuase I like their products and enjoy them. Personally, though, I prefer coke, and that will not change unless something drastic changes (e.g. coke bottling plants have serious health concerns).
Ultimately, what people looking for recommendations want is that very last line. Only close friends and family with no vested interest can provide that last line. Sponsored celeberies can provide some level of assured quality, but not that last line. Part of being successful as a public figure in this day and age is to connect with people so that you can blur the line between the two. Inevitably though, confusing a 'friend and family' recommendation and a 'sponsored celeberty' recommendation will cause backlash and vitrol from those who did so. It won't be a large segement, I don't believe, but there will always be some.
Still, I think for those who do, the candor and explaination will help.
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On February 05 2013 22:44 Eskiya23 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2013 12:55 WolfintheSheep wrote:On February 05 2013 12:34 Eskiya23 wrote:On February 05 2013 08:44 BlaineMono wrote:
Marketing dominates TL recently. It's either discussion about awesome Asus commercial, or sponsorship changes or buying LG monitors. Noone really seems to give a shit about the game. It's all about the show.
People like Incontrol shouldn't even be relevant to ANYONE on this site. Who the fuck is this guy? I don't hate him, nor do I like him. I just don't give a fuck. He's totally irrelevant. If you think otherwise, please realize that you don't give a shit about this game, you care about the show. And that's fine, but please realize this and say up front that you're in for the show. Please don't take this as a hate towards Incontrol, cause it's not. In terms of competitive SC2 he doesn't exist, there is nothing that will change that. He is 100% talk, PR and marketing and he himself knows that.
Truth means little to TL folk, it seems. Yes, marketing rules the world. Yes, a man has to pay his bills. But taking part in that is nothing to be proud of. Please don't say that it's perfectly normal, don't justify it.
A statement can either be true or false. So simple...
User was warned for this post Quoted for truth. Incontrol with his ''0-5'' in every group and hogging up MLG slots, he became quite the thorn in the eye for most competitive players. The whole drama of Incontrol vs Destiny, or TotalBiscuit is only in SC2 for the money and many other incidents doest exactly help. CombatEX is very vocal about his opinion on this matter, but every other StarCraft 2 player already knew. People forget that he is a PR & Marketing guy now, a spokesperson representing certain brands or whathaveyou. Of course he will play things off as a joke, tell you to buy Razer now instead of SS and just purely market the brand and/or himself. Dont expect him to act otherwise. I suggest you guys to read Animal Farm by George Orwell, a great book about this kind of corporate occurences. Playing the victim role isnt going to help either. There is a fine line between selling and selling out. 1) You don't know any players. At all. Maybe some signed some autographs. Maybe some responded to a few of your post. But to pretend that you speak on behalf of them is sheer arrogance. 2) No one forgot InControl's job. Perhaps these "people" you refer to are goldfish. In which case, I wouldn't recommend using them for an argument. 3) Name dropping a famous book does make your rant any more coherent. I suggest you read War and Peace to figure out why. 4) Clearly you despise any organization that accepts money from, and promotes, any sponsor. This is why you would never post on TeamLiquid, a team that would dare to market Razer products to you despite being non-committal in their gaming gear preferences prior to big fat checks. 5) "Fine line between selling and selling out" is a cute line. Very poetic. However, if it was supposed to mean something, I suggest actually writing some content instead of a tagline. I suppose InControl is selling his noble integrity, because now he gags on his own vomit every time he promotes Razer? Clearly he believed that Razer was the devil one week ago, and he now has no soul left. First of all, whoa Incontrol defence force ! I dont know any players? At all? Quite some big assumptions you are making there. Just accusing me of arrogance (ad hominem) isnt going to take away that Incontrol had (alot) of incidents in the past, which just seems to add up. There are a lot of shady stuff going under the radar that you might not even heared about, like un-resheduled coaching sessions etc. It all piles up. He is a PR & Marketing guy now, a spokesperson representing certain brands. Therefore he will ''jokingly'' have a go at Razor, but when its Razor picking up EG he will ofcourse apologise and tell everybody it was nothing to worry about. Cant people just thank the sponsors like Stephano does, instead of glorifying the SS product and having to contradict oneself later on? Want some more poetry? In my previous post I have listed some of the incidents/facts Incontrol has caused, without any personal attacks or insults. People who post in a critical way about Incontrol get warnings, posts on reddit get downvoted to oblivion. Guess people like the beautifull lie rather than the painfull thruth. + Show Spoiler +In no way do I deny what Incontrol has done for esports in a positive light, his Kingston Hyper X casts as well as features on 2GD show are quite hilarious. Just because someone is put on a pedestal doesnt mean we cant critisize him
So which pro-gamers do you know then?
Do tell.
Also, ultra serious context of Razer insult:
Comments before Razer joke (12:30 in that video): He finds out how much Brad Pitt's wardrobe costs, and then buys something slightly more expensive
Then he makes fun of AMD and Razer for not sponsoring them.
Comments after discussing companies that don't sponsor EG:
"Boobs."
...
Dude. Come on.
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On February 05 2013 22:44 Eskiya23 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2013 12:55 WolfintheSheep wrote:On February 05 2013 12:34 Eskiya23 wrote:On February 05 2013 08:44 BlaineMono wrote:
Marketing dominates TL recently. It's either discussion about awesome Asus commercial, or sponsorship changes or buying LG monitors. Noone really seems to give a shit about the game. It's all about the show.
People like Incontrol shouldn't even be relevant to ANYONE on this site. Who the fuck is this guy? I don't hate him, nor do I like him. I just don't give a fuck. He's totally irrelevant. If you think otherwise, please realize that you don't give a shit about this game, you care about the show. And that's fine, but please realize this and say up front that you're in for the show. Please don't take this as a hate towards Incontrol, cause it's not. In terms of competitive SC2 he doesn't exist, there is nothing that will change that. He is 100% talk, PR and marketing and he himself knows that.
Truth means little to TL folk, it seems. Yes, marketing rules the world. Yes, a man has to pay his bills. But taking part in that is nothing to be proud of. Please don't say that it's perfectly normal, don't justify it.
A statement can either be true or false. So simple...
User was warned for this post Quoted for truth. Incontrol with his ''0-5'' in every group and hogging up MLG slots, he became quite the thorn in the eye for most competitive players. The whole drama of Incontrol vs Destiny, or TotalBiscuit is only in SC2 for the money and many other incidents doest exactly help. CombatEX is very vocal about his opinion on this matter, but every other StarCraft 2 player already knew. People forget that he is a PR & Marketing guy now, a spokesperson representing certain brands or whathaveyou. Of course he will play things off as a joke, tell you to buy Razer now instead of SS and just purely market the brand and/or himself. Dont expect him to act otherwise. I suggest you guys to read Animal Farm by George Orwell, a great book about this kind of corporate occurences. Playing the victim role isnt going to help either. There is a fine line between selling and selling out. 1) You don't know any players. At all. Maybe some signed some autographs. Maybe some responded to a few of your post. But to pretend that you speak on behalf of them is sheer arrogance. 2) No one forgot InControl's job. Perhaps these "people" you refer to are goldfish. In which case, I wouldn't recommend using them for an argument. 3) Name dropping a famous book does make your rant any more coherent. I suggest you read War and Peace to figure out why. 4) Clearly you despise any organization that accepts money from, and promotes, any sponsor. This is why you would never post on TeamLiquid, a team that would dare to market Razer products to you despite being non-committal in their gaming gear preferences prior to big fat checks. 5) "Fine line between selling and selling out" is a cute line. Very poetic. However, if it was supposed to mean something, I suggest actually writing some content instead of a tagline. I suppose InControl is selling his noble integrity, because now he gags on his own vomit every time he promotes Razer? Clearly he believed that Razer was the devil one week ago, and he now has no soul left. First of all, whoa Incontrol defence force ! I dont know any players? At all? Quite some big assumptions you are making there. Just accusing me of arrogance (ad hominem) isnt going to take away that Incontrol had (alot) of incidents in the past, which just seems to add up. There are a lot of shady stuff going under the radar that you might not even heared about, like un-resheduled coaching sessions etc. It all piles up. He is a PR & Marketing guy now, a spokesperson representing certain brands. Therefore he will ''jokingly'' have a go at Razor, but when its Razor picking up EG he will ofcourse apologise and tell everybody it was nothing to worry about. Cant people just thank the sponsors like Stephano does, instead of glorifying the SS product and having to contradict oneself later on? Want some more poetry? In my previous post I have listed some of the incidents/facts Incontrol has caused, without any personal attacks or insults. People who post in a critical way about Incontrol get warnings, posts on reddit get downvoted to oblivion. Guess people like the beautifull lie rather than the painfull thruth. + Show Spoiler +In no way do I deny what Incontrol has done for esports in a positive light, his Kingston Hyper X casts as well as features on 2GD show are quite hilarious. Just because someone is put on a pedestal doesnt mean we cant critisize him
It endlessly amuses me that you an write so very much without saying anything of substance.
You have not shown that any other play reviles InControl, save for CombatEx and Destiny...which really speaks for itself.
You also haven't stated what InControl has sold out to, or what people seem to be "forgetting", or what "lie" people supposedly like...or what "truth" is supposedly "painful". Hence why you sound so poetic...it's all cute taglines that are so generic they could mean anything.
I suppose, if you strip away all of the rhetoric, you mess of text could be translated to:
- You didn't like seeing InControl in the MLG groups.
- You don't like InControl's jokes.
- You don't like people plugging sponsors beyond name dropping.
And instead of stating your personal opinions for what they are, you feel the need to supplant your hatred onto that of the entirety of the Pro Player Community, and rather than accepting that your personal feelings are entirely subjective, you instead need to believe that every other person has no long-term memory or has to lie to themselves.
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Geoff I appreciate you coming out and making this blog to clarify the reasons and thoughts behind this. It is a shame too many people want to pin you as a hypocrite and don't understand your responsibilities as a representative of your sponsors.
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On February 06 2013 03:17 iNcontroL wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2013 23:44 mordk wrote:
Why would you even post this, I don't understand. Retards are retards and will continue to be retards, who cares if said retards throw some mindless, retarded insults at your twitter or reddit, if they can't understand business. Why create this post full of unnecessary drama when the truth is nobody with a couple neurons with functional dendrites linking them even gives a fuck about this.
I'm going to write something pretty annoying here, but whatever, sometimes I get the feeling you create your own drama, then make a fuss about it to create some more drama from it, then write a post on TL to make some MORE drama about some small thing. I don't know, maybe there's a PR thing going on (seems likely), but all of this just seems like a massive spotlight call to me, and all posts of this type seem the same, just attention calls. Well this post caused zero drama... As I intended so I guess you're just wrong. But yeah.. That theory of me intentionally doubling up on drama sounds legit.
I just fail to understand why even make a post like this, seriously, I don't get it.
Why do you even care what a bunch of retards think about EG changing sponsors and your previous attitude towards your now new sponsor? Does it even matter? I seriously don't get it, it's business that is all, there's nothing more to it, and anyone sensible enough can understand and see that, so why even address this issue?
That said, it IS your blog so I guess you can write whatever the hell you want, but it just seems so pointless to me, retards will always be retards, haters gonna hate, you name it, it's the internetz this is the stuff that happens all the time in it.
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EPT
