• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 04:17
CEST 10:17
KST 17:17
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists14[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Fresh Flow9[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash10[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy21
Community News
2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers11Maestros of the Game 2 announced32026 GSL Tour plans announced11Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail1MaNa leaves Team Liquid22
StarCraft 2
General
MaNa leaves Team Liquid 2026 GSL Tour plans announced Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail Oliveira Would Have Returned If EWC Continued
Tourneys
GSL CK: More events planned pending crowdfunding 2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) SEL Doubles (SC Evo Bimonthly)
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 521 Memorable Boss The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 520 Moving Fees Mutation # 519 Inner Power
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Gypsy to Korea ASL21 General Discussion Pros React To: Tulbo in Ro.16 Group A Data needed
Tourneys
Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Ro16 Group A [ASL21] Ro16 Group B
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Any training maps people recommend? Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Starcraft Tabletop Miniature Game
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
[G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Reappraising The Situation T…
TrAiDoS
lurker extra damage testi…
StaticNine
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2389 users

A Dishonored Man Writes Letters to Garrett

Blogs > Deleted User 135096
Post a Reply
Deleted User 135096
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
3624 Posts
October 18 2012 19:52 GMT
#1
[image loading]

It wasn't the easiest decision. Normally when I'm considering purchasing a game I find that I look at what various features I might find attractive, or decidedly not so, and then try to make a decision upon that careful weighing of elements. With Dishonored I found that something was holding me back from immediately jumping on it as soon as it was released. A lot of this has to do with how I saw the game, and what it was or wasn't doing that I particularly found appealing. In the end, due to a number of good reviews, and no small part to RPS coverage, I decided to finally bite the bullet and enter the city of Dunwall despite my apprehensive stance towards the game.

Now, I probably should explain why I felt that way about a game that seemingly everyone was/is excited about. Mostly the cause of my apprehension was due to the overly obvious elements taken from both Bioshock, and more importantly Thief. This isn't to say that I didn't like either of those games, in fact the Thief series is one of my favorite series of games period (I + II being two of my favorite games of all time), but I'd like to begin my thoughts on Dishonored and what I found that I really liked, and why my apprehensive stance was in the end, somewhat warranted (and will require a more thorough explanation).

The Good, the Bad, and the Unfortunate Wrath of the Trickster
The biggest thing that Dishonored has going for it is the setting for this narrative piece. With the naval and seafaring overtones, a blend of mechanical age steam punk-like technology, a distinct colonialist affectation, and a meticulously crafted visual array of set pieces Dishonored boasts a very interesting world in which to inhabit. This is thanks in no small part to the concept artist Viktor Antonov, who also penciled the concept art for Half-Life 2. But you probably already knew that. Now while I would be very interested to see this 'unique' blend of pre and post-industrial styles, I would be remiss if I didn't point out that this is hardly 'unique'. Thief II: The Metal Age already had blended these two elements in a very compelling manner more than 12 years ago. That's not to say it's bad, because I did enjoy the overall flare of the narrative, just that I've seen it before, and more expertly executed.

In fact, Dishonored is in an odd position for younger gamers. For those who have never played Bioshock (that seems unlikely) or the Thief Series (much more likely), Dishonored is probably going to feel like a breath of fresh air in comparison to some of the other offerings of late. Unfortunately, for those of us who have played these games, Dishonored ends up reading like a love letter to them, rather than truly being its own entity. Let's look at the combat for some indications.

The combat system consists of essentially 4 elements, the ability to fight and defend with your sword, which was very Dark Messiah-like (and probably the best part of that game bar none), use of your secondary weapon, and finally use of your plasmids, err... I mean magic. OK, so let's be honest here, your magical abilities even from the trailers I could tell were essentially ripped from Bioshock's corpse and repurposed along with getting a new coat of paint, and while I enjoyed using and abusing these abilities they never felt very novel. I would call this a relatively minor quip but it does get at a rather unfortunate problem throughout %75 of the entire game (regarding combat). The last element that isn't really combat oriented, but very important is your ability to navigate the levels while being undetected. This is where your magical abilities feel "bleh", because %99 of the time I used 1 ability which allowed me to navigate the levels with relative ease. I had no need for %75 of the game to use anything else but 1 ability, which from a excitement factor was kind of droll and uninteresting. However this leads to my biggest problem with the game, Difficulty.

Are you Silent Enough?
A little preface on how I play. When I have the chance to play a stealth oriented game I jump at the chance, largely due in part to my love for the aforementioned Thief series. However there are some additional things to mention. I have never been satisfied with the difficultly of Thief, or Hitman, or any other stealth oriented game, and therefore I've always imposed arbitrary restrictions on myself to make it harder, or more believable. Let's be honest here, there's no way you could incapacitate everyone in an area, and not have a noticeable effect on the environment. To that end, I years ago decided to try to not just not kill anyone, but not even touch them. If one guard wasn't on patrol, that's a tell that something's up, and that asking for changes in the system to occur is not wise. Additionally for Dishonored specifically, when you get your magic you have the option to get a very Arkham Asylum 'night vision' where you can see through walls, and even detect where enemies were looking. Yea, fuck that, that would make it way too easy.

So here I am with all of these arbitrary restrictions, as well as playing on the hardest difficulty, and what is my overall feeling on navigating this world without anyone noticing me in the slightest? Well, unfortunately for most of this game, it was almost boring in how easy it was. Only in a few places did I start to have to think creatively, or had a feeling of true uncertainty or angst at needing to complete a technical series of moves precisely. Having been through a number of Thief games, this is admittedly old hat, but what I discovered was that the AI was about as good as the last Thief game. That in it of itself is both a compliment, and an insult. Great because they got the series of necessary mechanics right, but rather unsettling because the last Thief game was in 2004, and the AI has barely improved since then, and even regressed in some areas (environmental awareness is flat out terrible).

Only when I got to the last %25 of the game did I finally have to start thinking creatively to traverse the situation, and never once did I feel that I really had to be overly cautious. In fact I was most of the time, when I would get noticed, testing the system to see just how obtuse the AI was. So in combination with game breaking magic skills which allowed me to traverse the levels in ways that I'm not sure they intended, and the thick-headed AI, I was more disappointed than pleased. I didn't hate it, but it is 2012, and we should be constantly trying to improve upon things, not trying to satisfy the status quo of 8 years ago.

Narrative Problems
The thing about the narrative that I have a less than positive feeling about is that they glossed over far too much of the important things. The opening sequence for example is quite quick, and never gives you the feeling of settling into this world, or that you have any idea of how it functions. One of the great things about The Dark Project was that each narrative piece, each level served a purpose to introduce the world, it's inhabitants, the factions vying for power, and was done in a manner where you got more than just a sentence or 0:30 snippet telling you what these elements were or why they were that way.

In Dishonored, you are the Lord Protector, and should understandably know Dunwall very well, as well as the political system you serve, etc... But you don't, and they are never presented to you in a direct manner. I was relegated to reading secondary texts to gain understanding into this world, but that isn't a very good substitute as it removes your personal experience from the overall situation. For example, being the Lord Protector you should have a lot of knowledge of Dunwall, and be able to navigate it fairly well, and if you had the quest markers active that was easy. But again due to my predilections, I immediately turned that off because it's a soft form of cheating. I would actually have preferred to be able to refer to a map in order to check that I am going the right way. This was another reason Thief was fantastic. It used its means of navigation as a subtle reinforcement to the overall world and atmosphere-building of the game. Making things easier only subverts the atmospheric intensions (a cautionary tale for modern gaming companies).

Unfortunately one of the biggest flaws of the game is also the story arc...sort of. Throughout the game I had an instinctual feeling that something wasn't right, and that we'd do what we needed to do only to have another reveal happen. And guess what...well funny enough my instinct wasn't really instinct per se, but more a direct recollection of Thief I's story and how that unfolded. In fact, almost every element of Dishonered's story is taken piecemeal from the three Thief games and are only slightly retooled. This, like the AI is simultaneously a good thing, and a bad one, because when the major reveal happens, I had been aware of it 'going to happen' two missions previous and was hardly surprising. I should however say that once this reveal happened that I finally began to really enjoy the game, as it felt much more alive than previous (part of that reason was due to introducing multiple elements or character types and never exploring them until a specific and later point in the game, which was the biggest tell that something was up). Overall, the broadcasting of the story arc was rather droll and hurt their intentions of having a shocking reveal that you've been working for....wait this sounds familiar again...

Verticality and Level Design
I know I haven't spoken about the interesting verticality of the level design, or the overly linear or one direction-ness of it (which is another problem in some places), but I will just keep this section short. Overall I liked the additional verticality that Dishonored is able to work with, and that is another nice element, but due to your skills it ends up becoming way to easy to abuse the high ground advantage to navigate each level. If that weren't enough, the level design is rather linear, which in some cases works well, but in others backfires miserably. Having a penchant for coming at problems sideways I always am looking for alternate routes, and found that some routes that I could clearly abuse were disallowed, because they didn't want me going that way. Or another bad design was the Sokolov mission where I bypassed the entire compound with a well executed double jump teleport (or whatever you'd like to call it).

Finalmente, Musings
If my experience of Dishonored hasn't been a truly eye opening experience or full of exuberance I apologize as it is only because I've seen all of this done before, and with far better skill. This isn't to say that Dishonored isn't a good game, because it is good. I have enjoyed it in how and what it does, but my experiences with a far better IP casts a rather unfriendly light upon Dunwall in a way that shows its faults, frayed edges and patchwork composition. If I were to recommend this game I would say, it's a good game and that you should probably play it, but not with the unbridled eagerness that I could state about other more carefully crafted products, because at the end of all this, Dishonored has too many loose threads and too many oddities about it or obvious references (keeper glyphs come to mind) to truly make it a great* game.

I would love to hear how everyone else has felt about Dishonored, what they liked, loved, or didn't like as they progressed through the game and their thoughts. I will probably go through this game one more time as a raving murderous bastard to get a more complete picture, but it might be a while before I do that.

*I have been known to hold a rather high standard towards games, so this description may seem to be less positive than it is intended to be.

****
Administrator
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18856 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-18 20:50:43
October 18 2012 20:50 GMT
#2
Well I was looking forward to Dishonored, but what's been keeping me from buying it is the notion that my many hours spent playing the Thief games might sour the experience. Those games had style that is rare nowadays. Should I get Dishonored?
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
Deleted User 135096
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
3624 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-18 22:10:57
October 18 2012 21:23 GMT
#3
I was pretty much in the same boat. All in all the experience was fun, but it won't be anything really new if you've played Thief. I think that Thief had a much better sense of its style, narrative arc, and put them together in a more compelling manner, but Dishonored does a pretty good job of using those elements in a way that is overall fun.

If I were to distill it down as best I can, I think I would say that It's about as good as say Thief III:Deadly Shadows (a rather inexact comparison though), which I enjoyed quite a bit, but remember that I'm also comparing it to an eight year old game, so I wouldn't expect anything that's really new.
Administrator
willz22912
Profile Joined November 2010
United States255 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-19 02:11:49
October 19 2012 02:08 GMT
#4
I definitely agree with you on many points here and I even wrote a similar game review for my school newspaper heh. Unfortunately for my review, I didn't really focus on the negatives too much, but I wasn't overly positive with it either.

The main point that you draw that it is essentially a re-imagining of several previously made games, but to be fair, in this day and age how often do you get a completely unique new game with completely new mechanics that are not borrowed from the generation before?

Honestly, the problem that I had with it is that if you try and enjoy the combat system, you basically mess up the "good guy" ending, and that made me turn to the no-kill/no-detection play-style. The issue with that is that the game basically pigeon-holes you into a certain way of playing since you are not allowed to kill anyone if you choose this route, so 80% of the abilities become worthless/unusable. Sleep darts/blink/Enhanced eyes were all you needed to get through it, and it got really dull and repetitive just blinking through most of the level avoiding everything. I should probably just try a combat play-through to see what I was missing on that side, but the story is pretty bland and makes it hard to really replay it through after you've experienced it once.

Edit: In fairness, now that I think about it, a lot of the combat videos people have made on youtube chaining certain spells together into combos looked really well done and fun to execute, so after doing the good guy ending, a murderous mayhem going all out with the combat system looks like a completely different game from the stealth version.
Deleted User 135096
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
3624 Posts
October 19 2012 03:07 GMT
#5
considering that I never touch people in a 'true stealth' manner I think I missed some of the other nuances. Apparently some people said that if you took out some sentries that others would take over their routes which would be an improvement, albeit that would beg the question as to why the chain of command isn't informed and a state of heightened awareness put into effect (low security maybe not, but high security would be a definite). It's subtle nuance-like stuff that prevented this game from really building on what previous games already have done.

Also I like that you do acknowledge that many games today are somewhat all re-imaginings of other things that worked well in other games, and that does hold merit for sure. To be clear I guess, my main issue with this is that it doesn't distance itself nearly enough from its source material (read too obvious), and shows its reliance on those games (maybe not reliance per se but it could be construed as such). In fact some of the major story arc ideas of Dishonored follows The Dark Project's arc almost exactly, though the details are albeit different.
Administrator
james5
Profile Joined September 2012
United Kingdom26 Posts
October 19 2012 06:10 GMT
#6
Thanks for this information.
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 1h 43m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft: Brood War
Horang2 1234
actioN 656
Zeus 537
BeSt 356
ggaemo 198
PianO 119
Larva 115
Nal_rA 100
EffOrt 54
Sharp 53
[ Show more ]
sSak 49
ToSsGirL 44
Sacsri 17
Dota 2
XaKoH 434
NeuroSwarm152
XcaliburYe56
League of Legends
JimRising 601
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox478
Mew2King10
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor243
MindelVK10
Other Games
gofns5752
Happy265
PiGStarcraft176
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream6805
PGL Dota 2 - Secondary Stream2257
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH268
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos824
Upcoming Events
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1h 43m
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
2h 43m
Ladder Legends
6h 43m
IPSL
7h 43m
JDConan vs TBD
Aegong vs rasowy
BSL
10h 43m
StRyKeR vs rasowy
Artosis vs Aether
JDConan vs OyAji
Hawk vs izu
CranKy Ducklings
15h 43m
Replay Cast
1d
Wardi Open
1d 1h
Afreeca Starleague
1d 1h
Bisu vs Ample
Jaedong vs Flash
Monday Night Weeklies
1d 7h
[ Show More ]
RSL Revival
1d 17h
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Barracks vs Leta
Royal vs Light
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
2 days
RSL Revival
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
The PondCast
4 days
KCM Race Survival
4 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Escore
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
6 days
Ladder Legends
6 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
6 days
BSL
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: W3
RSL Revival: Season 4
NationLESS Cup

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
StarCraft2 Community Team League 2026 Spring
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: W4
Acropolis #4
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.