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So basically, this was my reaction in the last lecture I gave. Kids cannot properly add fractions, can't understand what "x < 3" means really, the average note for the last exam was around 4/20 (make it E-), and what do they do ?
They don't give an effity damn. They chat, they don't write correction nor the exercises we do TOGETHER, they can't hear me, sadly not over the sound of how awesome maths are, but over their own sound.
In the last entry, someone told me that I might not have "the right mindset to educate the young minds". Well, I think it's the opposite : their young minds are not in the correct mindset to be educated (by me in particular). Somewhere in their middle-school life, something IS missing. Sometimes I even think the missing link was primary cycle.
I got mixed feelings about this class, but none are really positive.
1) I don't see any future for them. They are young, but there are too much things they do not realize about basic behaviour ; I do not know how they could pretend to have a basic job later.
2) I feel sorry for them : obviously their environment is not as easy as the one for my "good" class. This is maybe the main factor of their problem, but what can I do ? I am no educator. This was their parents' job, or their middle-school/primary-school teachers'. Why do I have to accept these kids in class ?
3) They drivin' me mad. iMad. "u mad bro ?" "MAD WITH THE STRENGHT OF A THOUSAND SUNS" and I have to stay (relatively) calm. I can't make them understand how badly they're fucking their life with this attitude, because they don't listen to what I say. Is it because they hate maths ? Is it because of me ? Is it only because they are young and fool ? I can't have another hour with them like the last was : I just can't keep my cool if things get overboard again. If I let my wrath upon them, basically I tell them "ok you win, here is my full power." I may have silence for a moment, but I will lose the little respect they have for me.
Basically I feel like I spend my time for my classes like this : for the "good" class, I prepare activities, examples, I give them the best I can, and they learn new things. For the "bad' class, I anticipate the moment they'll crack and prepare some sanctions, threats, etc ; I already know we won't have time to do the most interesting examples, and that I'll spend an infinite-like part of my time with them saying the same things again and again and again on the basic notions.
I am tired, but I somehow gained hope last week that I could win this matchup. Stay tuned for more highschool action (I hope next time it won't be a [vent] entry).
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Don't worry you aren't alone I've done a lot of substituting work in high school and honestly I feel your pain. I've had kids in grade 10 who do not even know their multiplication tables, and I mean like 4 x 8 = ? WELL FUCK BREAK OUT THE CALCULATOR!
Keep at it, I'm sure you'll get through to them eventually, maybe put a bit of the fear into them about how prospectless they'll be if they don't get serious.
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the main problem is usually the teacher who is unable to get the class silent.
no offense, but even in horrible classes there is teachers who get the class where it needs to be.
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On October 04 2012 21:23 KalWarkov wrote: the main problem is usually the teacher who is unable to get the class silent.
no offense, but even in horrible classes there is teachers who get the class where it needs to be.
I strongly agree, but it is so hard when you have no idea whatsoever of what to do to obtain a durable silence. I tried stuff, some worked nicely for some days, other failed instantly... I still don't get durable silence, and I start to be short in terms of ideas.
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Please understand it's also partly your fault. You CAN make this class good. Especially if you can't even keep them silent.
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If you are the full time teacher for these kids (as in you see them every day) have u tried using a punishment and reward system? I've known teachers that have used their own currency system to bring a style of order to their classrooms.
EG. Answering questions and starting productive discussion could be rewarded with 1 currency where as disruptions such as talking or distracting other students could be penalized. And at the end of the year (or semester) they can use the currency they have garnered to hold a mini auction and bid on stupid prizes like pen flashlights etc.
I've seen one teacher use a system similar to this to turn whole classrooms around to the point where he had some of the most troubling kids staying behind asking for study tips or cleaning his classroom to gain more of the currency.
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I also used to hate math with a passion when I was young. Teachers hated me, but I just could not bring myself to even give the slightest fuck about math. In other words, I can relate to these kids...
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It's a losing battle for you no matter what, and it's just something that many (I'd even go and say majority) of the teachers go through on a regular basis. How each teacher deals with these kinds of situations come with experience, I suppose.
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well, I think part of the reason for the lack of discipline is the subject they are learning. I remember back in my youthful days I was pretty much one hell of a rebellious and noisy kid, but whenever I was learning about something that interested me, I was able to sit down and do my work quietly. Maybe kids these days don't like math. I know for one I HATED math. So consequently there were a lot of unwanted noises coming out of me in my math classes.
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You should get a job that doesn't make you write vent blogs. Seems like you dont really like your profession at all, so why do you do it? Go teach at a university where students might actually care.
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You don't sound like a particularly competent teacher when dealing with people who don't enjoy your subject. Try to understand that you're not right, you're not wrong, you have an opinion based upon YOUR experience; they have an opinion based upon theirs. Try to empathise, if you can't empathise you're going to be an appalling teacher, get stressed out and run out crying.
Patience, empathy, tolerance... all incredibly important for a teacher.
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Well, uncooperative students are a bitch to handle, but it's your responsibility to do so. You have to find some way to grab their attention, and make sure their attention doesn't wander off somewhere else. If you're letting do whatever they want, then you already lost the battle. If their basic behavior is wrong like you said, then correct them. That's your role as an educator, to guide them along the correct path of life.
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I got one girl who's like 16 and can't do -3 + 4. I was in shock for 5min.
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On October 05 2012 01:04 Erasme wrote: I got one girl who's like 16 and can't do -3 + 4. I was in shock for 5min. You're a teacher? also that would make me depressed.
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To all those guys on the high horses: do you actually have any idea what happened in the last ten years in european schools? If you don't, then it is likely that you have no fucking idea what is it abour and are talking down to someone who does not really deserve.
So let me put this in short: today's elemntary school is hell. In half of the classes of 10years-olds, there are childern behaving like mad, running aroudn in the middle of the class, sitting on tables, swearing, hurting others and generally not giving a shit about the lesson. It is really beyond imagination, at least for my generation of people used to an almost absolute discipline at school.
The main reason is in the changes in society (for the worst) that we are seeing and thus the changes in parenting. The childern, coming from their homes to the school, have no notion of discipline. It is not their fault, just nobody ever told then what discipline is. Then, when the teacher wants to change that, they go, cry to their parents and these parents go and scream at the boss of said teacher. When I was in scholl (yeah, I know what a cliche is that) and got bad marks, or, god forbid, a note from the teacher about my behaviour, my parents would straighten me up (no physical beating, just a lot of other shit). Nowadays, they go and straighten the teacher - or do not give a shit at all.
The result is that the half of the children are unctrollable, self-entitled idiots. I honestly dread the time when the generation of today's 10 year olds grows up and runs the world. The sad thing is that it is not their fault, they are not collectively mentally handicapped. It is just that the human brain cannot evolve for a correct function in contemporary society unless it is kept in order. Another result is more and more young teachers quitting after a couple of years in the job, resulting in teachers bascially dieing out.
So please, next time you think you now better than a teacher, think twice.
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On October 05 2012 01:18 PassiveAce wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2012 01:04 Erasme wrote: I got one girl who's like 16 and can't do -3 + 4. I was in shock for 5min. You're a teacher? also that would make me depressed. I'm a poor student who teach maths. :p Tbh she simply can't get priority right.
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What level do you teach at? Lycée/Collège?
A good friend of mine described his own math teacher that he had in 3eme (9th grade for you yankees). Basically the teacher would distribute detention like flowers. For example
"Who knows the answer? those who do raise their hands." then he'd put those who didn't raise their hands in detention. those who would talk in class were given detention. if the kid was upset about "wait, but Mr, !!", the teacher would just say add another hour.
during detention, the teacher would do math exercises so that those detained would understand math.
if the kid is really being an asshole and disrupting the class, you can just kick him out. do it enough times and he'll just shut the fuck up. he SHOULD.
where exactly do you teach?
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On October 05 2012 01:27 opisska wrote: To all those guys on the high horses: do you actually have any idea what happened in the last ten years in european schools? If you don't, then it is likely that you have no fucking idea what is it abour and are talking down to someone who does not really deserve.
So let me put this in short: today's elemntary school is hell. In half of the classes of 10years-olds, there are childern behaving like mad, running aroudn in the middle of the class, sitting on tables, swearing, hurting others and generally not giving a shit about the lesson. It is really beyond imagination, at least for my generation of people used to an almost absolute discipline at school.
The main reason is in the changes in society (for the worst) that we are seeing and thus the changes in parenting. The childern, coming from their homes to the school, have no notion of discipline. It is not their fault, just nobody ever told then what discipline is. Then, when the teacher wants to change that, they go, cry to their parents and these parents go and scream at the boss of said teacher. When I was in scholl (yeah, I know what a cliche is that) and got bad marks, or, god forbid, a note from the teacher about my behaviour, my parents would straighten me up (no physical beating, just a lot of other shit). Nowadays, they go and straighten the teacher - or do not give a shit at all.
The result is that the half of the children are unctrollable, self-entitled idiots. I honestly dread the time when the generation of today's 10 year olds grows up and runs the world. The sad thing is that it is not their fault, they are not collectively mentally handicapped. It is just that the human brain cannot evolve for a correct function in contemporary society unless it is kept in order. Another result is more and more young teachers quitting after a couple of years in the job, resulting in teachers bascially dieing out.
So please, next time you think you now better than a teacher, think twice.
I went to primary school in the late 80s, early 90s (yes, I'm that old) and I wouldn't wish that on anyone. Yes, we had discipline. We also had absolute silence for our 50 minute classes and corporal punishment (not after the fall of communism though). It wasn't an environment that fostered a love for learning and knowledge.
Guess what, we had generations who were taught obedience to authority and the idea that might makes right. It didn't turn out too well. I doubt a generation of self-entitled idiots will do much worse.
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Have you heard of self-fulfilling prophecies, or the pygmalion effect in teaching?
Here are some interesting links: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pygmalion_effect
http://www.cehs.ohio.edu/gfx/media/pdf/kelsey.pdf (40-something page paper)
http://blogs.edweek.org/teachers/teaching_now/2011/04/gifted_as_a_self-fulfilling_prophesy.html (the opposite applies too, students treated as incapable, surprise surprise, remain that way).
I'm going to qualify my next statement by saying that although I've never taught a math class myself, I have taught dance classes, I have seen this bias, and have some teaching experience (tangential as it may be, I wasn't the only one teaching those kids). Here it comes:
I think your attitude towards your students is complete shit and you need to look at yourself first before you start piling all the failures at their feet.
You just started teaching this year, this is your first class (I've browsed your previous blogs). Sure you might expect your students to be capable of more given that they've been taking math classes longer than you've been teaching them, but for fuck's sake, you've been teaching for LESS THAN A MONTH, with no prior experience. Starting from the assumption that your students are the stupid ones when you're operating with so little experience and knowledge yourself just stinks of incompetence and a terrible attitude of passing the blame along.
Yes there are going to be students, even classrooms and schools of students that are unruly as all hell, I don't know what's been happening in French schools, but it's still your responsibility to bring order to your classroom
My advice to you is to read up more on pedagogy, take seminars, examine your own teaching habits compared to what other teachers in your school are doing, ask others for help. Just do everything you can to make sure you're actually capable of teaching and building a good classroom environment before you go shit-talking your students on the internet.
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I don't think you can blame someone for not seeing the relevance of a completely abstract subject. I myself like math. For me it has relevance because it's about understanding systems where the rules are concrete. I'm not saying you should use word problems, or try to relate the material to real life situations, but perhaps they would find the material more interesting if you presented the subject matter as a system they could learn to manipulate, if they knew the correct rules. As for the ones who don't want to learn, I don't think they will unless they decide they want to. You should certainly try, but I would recommend against investing yourself in getting them to learn what you want them to. Interest is a far greater motivator than fear. No, I am not a teacher, and no, I don't envy your position. I have, however, been a student that was terrorized by teachers who had decided I was lazy. One of them even made this clear to me in front of the entire class. However you may feel, some of your students may be desperate to avoid your scrutiny, and I would implore you not to vent on them. (Though I recognize you have said you don't). Ultimately school is a social construct, and your expectations are based on that construct. If it were just you, and not society, that expected children to learn to add fractions, I don't think you would be quite as troubled by the fact that they don't want to.
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Was wondering, how old are your students ?
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Don't worry, the next generation of students is too fat too run around that much
(in my country 25% of 8 year olds were overweight now, that is more scary)
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On one hand, I understand the OP. You got one tough class to control, right from the start. It's not easy, it's painful, and basically every experienced teacher will say that the first few years of teaching is absolute crap.
However, on the other hand I also think that your attitude is not very good. So you have a talented group that does well with your way of teaching --- good for you, but you have to adjust the way you teach according to the class. It basically sounds like you're a very smart person, and a person who loves math, but you have trouble relating to young minds who have less interest in the subject. Easier said than done, yes, but the last thing you want to do is give up. Keep trying your best. You give them your best shot, and even if it doesn't work, you're that much more knowledgeable. Just don't give up, and especially think carefully about your attitude. While I understand very well where you are coming from, the fact is that it's not completely their fault. Yes, you cannot be blamed too much because you just begun. NOBODY should demand perfection. However, your responsibility is to give your best shot every single day. I also realize that it's going to be very hard to regain their respect so much that they'll keep quiet and try their best to learn.... But never go to the class with the attitude that you've given up.
I am also studying to become a maths teacher, and I suggest trying out some of these things... -Start a class by asking the whole class what their goals are. What do they want from math? Do they have a specific grade that they'd like to have. If they get unruly, you can remind them that this isn't exactly going towards their goals. If they set the goals THEMSELVES, it has way more power than something you try to set them, because they understand that they dig their own grave. -Don't let the class get to the point where they all talk. This is obviously a tough class to handle, so you need to be strict from the beginning. If the whole class talks, you let it get too far. In other words, the moment the FIRST person starts talking his own thing, interrupt him and tell him to listen to you. If you don't let the first one talk, they wont talk as a group. If the same person persists, throw him out. -Another thing you may want to try (which slightly contradicts with the above) is, along with discussing their goals, propose something like 'lets try to have fun while working hard'. My uncle who was a very succesful math's teacher tried to have this philosophy in his class, and it was very succesful. It basically fools them to thinking they have actual freedom in the class if they just do what they're told properly. Of course, this requires you to give small breaks in between the teaching, tell stories, etc. -I feel that a very strong argument towards their lack of motivation is that they simply DON'T KNOW where their interests lie, or their talents. By ignoring the subject completely they close away TONS AND TONS of careers that can take them very far in life. And this is only because they never gave math a CHANCE. They really can't argue much against that logic. Even if they try their best and get mediocre results, it still affects a lot on which college they apply to, a lot of jobs respect your math grades, and it has everyday uses too. Besides, if the teacher spends a lot of time preparing for as interesting of a lesson as he can, its their job to do homework and at least TRY. You can tell them that there is no point in games where the teacher wants to make their studying and school life miserable, a game of tactics against the students if you will, because whats the point if they don't try?
Just tell them straight up how it is, the arguments and methods I provided are just an example which I will use for any problem students after I graduate Be strict. Don't give up. If you are strict and never give them more leash during class, controlling them as a whole will be easier too. If there are a few specific individuals who always cause trouble and disrupt and mess up the whole class, pick them out and talk to them, face to face after class.
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LOL
As someone who has seen what goes on in French schools I know personally that it can be quite, quite tough for teachers to get anything into their students' thick heads. Believe me when you see the attitude of some kids these days. No respect for teachers or anything. Some of them are actually quite fucking stupid as well and do everything possible to just either piss the teacher off and not get any work done. These people actually exist and I've seen them in action myself.
I have a few family members who work as teachers. I've also read accounts of teachers who talk about poor classes. I've heard of such accounts from friends who were in such classes. Unfortunately vodka, to be polite, you're completely ignorant about the situation of some schools in France where terrible kids do exist, who have irresponsible parents who are hardly better.
So there's no need to be a dick to the OP and tell him his attitude is complete shit. This isn't the first time I've seen this kind of vent post from a French teacher. I'm GLAD that this particular teacher actually cares enough about his students to get annoyed when they don't listen. OP himself said that they're ruining their future. 4/20 is self explanatory, no one should get those sort of grades.
So vodka, please be quiet. You don't know what you're talking about, you haven't ever taught anything nor do you see what happens in France. I agree with OP shit talking about his students on the internet. Believe me, I'm forcing myself to be much more polite than I'd like to be with you. Just please don't talk shit when you don't know what you're talking about.
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Sounds like you need to start dishing out the punishment. First things first - take note of who's talking to who. Write down the names of friends who you are constantly telling to be quite. Separate the students by giving them assigned seats far away from their friends now. This is coming from a student who hates people who don't shut up during class. I mean seriously, I got this awesome ass forensics class and every single day the teacher has to stop his lecture to tell people to stop talking. It really pisses me off, but I guess that's my own personal rant. Anyways, allow the students who do work well (if there are any) a chance to pick where they sit etc. Reward them somehow.
Now that you've got them separated, this should eliminate a lot of the talking. If they continue to talk to whomever is around them, then you ramp up the punishment. Give them a warning first. If they continue again later in class, give them a homework assignment (LOL). But don't punish the whole class with a homework assignment if just a few people screw it up. Say you'll take the assignment away at the end if they behave.
Who doesn't hate homework? Now that they've gotten the idea that being a dumbass in class = homework, this should clear up most of your idle chatter. If they don't do the homework, call home or give them detention or something.
Just start being more forceful and punishing. My forensics class teacher never punishes students. Sure he yells at them and tells them to quiet down, but 10 seconds after he tells them that, the students start running their mouths again. I'm constantly wishing he was a bit more eager to hand out punishments. It's ridiculous how many times he has to stop class. It sounds like you have a similar dilemma so I think you should try my method.
yours truly, -Hewhohateshisclassmates
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I completely understand you. I know a lot of people that act like that, and there's literally nothing you can do about it. Bad parenting is on the rise, and I'm pretty sure everyone knows why.
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Back in high school, I had a teacher that spent a portion of each class teaching us how to "attract the opposite sex". It was actually quite effective because people seemed to be paying more attention to the rest of the lectures.
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'Learn what I teach or be punished'. Definitely not an evil paradigm... XD
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On October 05 2012 02:33 Vod.kaholic wrote:Have you heard of self-fulfilling prophecies, or the pygmalion effect in teaching? Here are some interesting links: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pygmalion_effecthttp://www.cehs.ohio.edu/gfx/media/pdf/kelsey.pdf (40-something page paper) http://blogs.edweek.org/teachers/teaching_now/2011/04/gifted_as_a_self-fulfilling_prophesy.html (the opposite applies too, students treated as incapable, surprise surprise, remain that way). I'm going to qualify my next statement by saying that although I've never taught a math class myself, I have taught dance classes, I have seen this bias, and have some teaching experience (tangential as it may be, I wasn't the only one teaching those kids). Here it comes: I think your attitude towards your students is complete shit and you need to look at yourself first before you start piling all the failures at their feet. You just started teaching this year, this is your first class (I've browsed your previous blogs). Sure you might expect your students to be capable of more given that they've been taking math classes longer than you've been teaching them, but for fuck's sake, you've been teaching for LESS THAN A MONTH, with no prior experience. Starting from the assumption that your students are the stupid ones when you're operating with so little experience and knowledge yourself just stinks of incompetence and a terrible attitude of passing the blame along. Yes there are going to be students, even classrooms and schools of students that are unruly as all hell, I don't know what's been happening in French schools, but it's still your responsibility to bring order to your classroom My advice to you is to read up more on pedagogy, take seminars, examine your own teaching habits compared to what other teachers in your school are doing, ask others for help. Just do everything you can to make sure you're actually capable of teaching and building a good classroom environment before you go shit-talking your students on the internet.
Ok, so while I find your words aggressive, I will answer nicely.
Like I said, it was a vent blog. I needed to let some steam out. At the time I wrote this part, I just got back from school and the day was awful. I vented and while I vented, I was reading what I was writing. And I felt bad. And to those who think venting is useless, I am glad you are undestructible robots who can endure every shit throw at them, even if it's the first time you receive a certain kind of shit you were not used to : society needs you.
If I wrote the post with the exact mindset I had when I got home and started the computer, then everybody in the world could have seen that I was talking shit about them. That I despised them. That they were like a immense pile of shit I had to take care of without gloves. And so on.
As I was writing the beta version of the blog, I realized I was angry at them. and that it was bad : it is not their only fault. They are kids. This is why I wrote lines about the negative feelings I had for them, but it seems that those lines were not understood as they were meant to.
I don't know if you can imagine the amount of culpability I feel everytime I fail an hour with a class. Sure, it's not at the exact time I end the lesson. Sometimes, it's when I am at house. Sometimes it's when I am playing a game. Sometimes, it's when I want to sleep. Sometimes, it wakes me up in the night. It's been a month since I started, and I questionned myself almost every day, as well as the content of my lessons. Is this too hard ? Too easy ? Am I too strict ? Not Enough ? Should I emphasize this or that ? Why can't I obtain basic attention ? Am I uninteresting ? How can I be more ? Wait, there is not enough training exercises there. Oh wait, do they even know this ? Should I do some more revisions ? Fuck, we already spent two weeks on this, they still can't get it ? But when will I start next chapter ? And the other class has already finish this one and the average grade are twice better than them ? Wow, I should differentiate my lessons. But wait, I can't spent 3 weeks on this basics, because of those 8 particular kids who already are bored, they will create disorder. I must give them harder work. Wait, I didn't even start to write the content and it's already 9 pm !
Oh you're right, I didn't look at myself here, I had not the time to do so. But that's okay, I can just look at myself later. Like during the night. Or maybe during the class. You know, those awkward moments when your teacher can't decide if he must punish you, the class, or not, and when your friends are laughing their ass off, other are sighing, other are sleeping, other are asking him questions without even waiting for him to let them speak.
I did sure think they were all morons when I took their tests and started to put grades ranging from E- to C- on basic middle-school knowledge they did work for the previous 2 years of their life. You're right, I was totally thinking "gosh, they're retarded lol, it's not my fault because my explanations were perfect lolol, I already too good at teaching I should reroll." Did you really think I tried to be a teacher with this kind of thoughts in the first place ? If I had only those feelings, I would not have spent 2 years of my fucking life to obtain that concours, I would have stick to SCIENCE and I would have lost some years trying to obtain that Ph. D I wanted to have so bad it is hurting my heart and my mind now when I read REAL maths.
I didn't start with the assumption they were stupid. And they are not. How can I know ? Hell they handle me better than I handle them. They know perfectly how the punishment system is done and what I won't do because I still feel the need to try to give to all of them the best lesson I can. And guess what ? When they are silent and attentive for JUST SOME MINUTES I get good answers and enlightment in their eyes, and you know what, they even use my explanations to create their own solution to homework. And guess more : when they just read their paper where what I wanted them to learn is written, they most of the time read it correctly. So why don't they want to stay attentive for at least 30 minutes ? Why can't they follow my advices ? Why don't they just listen to me ?
As one TLer put it, this is my job. I have to take account of 40 students and do 40 different lessons in one hour - I try to do so. And is it also my job to force them to be interested and to make them work ? This is what I really question nowadays : those kids don't want to do maths. Why do we force them ? Basic teachings ? Try to explain this to them, that's what other teachers tried in middle-school.
Now next time you read "[Vent]" in front of an entry in this blog, be sure that you'll have the feeling I hate my work and kids and that I'm an elitist asshole. And I truly hope my next entry won't be venting.
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it will all pay off in college! Just dont become like the people that always socialize during class then say wtf why didnt I do good?
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Very interesting blogs, please keep doing them. Its so interesting to read about a teachers perspective when you are a high school kid like me. I sympathize with my teachers a lot nowadays. I failed the previous year, so im repeating it. This time tho, i got 1 on 1 lessons from 5 subjects at school , and i got to know the teachers a lot more, which changed my perspective on school as a whole totally. I always felt bad for the teachers in my previous years (i failed because i lacked motivation to do shit at home[played wow and watched SPL instead] but i always paid attention during classes and behaved respectfully) and i know how annoying and challenging a class can be. People totally dont want to learn sometimes, and changing them might be impossible[i really liked my maths teacher and thought he was the best teacher i ever met, but that didn't motivate me to study it harder or even at all-my interests simply lied elsewhere, and it wasnt his fault] Judging from what you wrote, you will do a good job ~~ if you just have some patience you will solve all those problems slowly. You have a tryhard mindset in teaching it seems, and tryhards always go far :D Some people like ahzz have a very good point in this thread. If i could suggest something, try to get a grip on what are the students goals (i guess all of them want to pass the year at least) and try to help them reach it. (if they want high grades make it clear that it will require some cooperation. Also, if they want to just barely pass, you will need to adjust what are you doing a bit probably. There are always a few people aiming higher and a few aiming lower, but try to get an average and go by it )
I always thought teachers should present themselves more like "masters" , people with vast knowledge of their subject, that are at [WILLING] students disposal, and whose time shouldnt be wasted by retarded, or just unmotivated people like the past me, rather than those guys that are forced to teach everybody, even if nobody wants it.
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On October 05 2012 02:12 hypercube wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2012 01:27 opisska wrote: To all those guys on the high horses: do you actually have any idea what happened in the last ten years in european schools? If you don't, then it is likely that you have no fucking idea what is it abour and are talking down to someone who does not really deserve.
So let me put this in short: today's elemntary school is hell. In half of the classes of 10years-olds, there are childern behaving like mad, running aroudn in the middle of the class, sitting on tables, swearing, hurting others and generally not giving a shit about the lesson. It is really beyond imagination, at least for my generation of people used to an almost absolute discipline at school.
The main reason is in the changes in society (for the worst) that we are seeing and thus the changes in parenting. The childern, coming from their homes to the school, have no notion of discipline. It is not their fault, just nobody ever told then what discipline is. Then, when the teacher wants to change that, they go, cry to their parents and these parents go and scream at the boss of said teacher. When I was in scholl (yeah, I know what a cliche is that) and got bad marks, or, god forbid, a note from the teacher about my behaviour, my parents would straighten me up (no physical beating, just a lot of other shit). Nowadays, they go and straighten the teacher - or do not give a shit at all.
The result is that the half of the children are unctrollable, self-entitled idiots. I honestly dread the time when the generation of today's 10 year olds grows up and runs the world. The sad thing is that it is not their fault, they are not collectively mentally handicapped. It is just that the human brain cannot evolve for a correct function in contemporary society unless it is kept in order. Another result is more and more young teachers quitting after a couple of years in the job, resulting in teachers bascially dieing out.
So please, next time you think you now better than a teacher, think twice. I went to primary school in the late 80s, early 90s (yes, I'm that old) and I wouldn't wish that on anyone. Yes, we had discipline. We also had absolute silence for our 50 minute classes and corporal punishment (not after the fall of communism though). It wasn't an environment that fostered a love for learning and knowledge.Guess what, we had generations who were taught obedience to authority and the idea that might makes right. It didn't turn out too well. I doubt a generation of self-entitled idiots will do much worse.
Even though I'm a young man, not even done with highschool, I was going to say something like what you said about the discipline thing. People saying that "kids these days have no discipline!" have been around since the beginning of time. Furthermore as we have learned from conformity studies in psychology, being taught to respect authority blindly and not having to be controlled by it without consent is a bad thing. It's important for kids to be self-motivated and to learn that way and not to be motivated simply by punishment.
About the OP: I really think your expectations for middle school kids are off. Your higher level class is that becauase they get the material, and your lower level class is put there because they don't. Now from that second group there are some smart kids that have no sort of motivation, and your punishment is hurting this even more. Another part includes the kids that would understand if you were to increase your patience in helping them, maybe write something like, "You were so close! Please come after school so I can help you get this right next time." Finally there will be idiots in the class too, but instead of giving up on them so prematurely, why don't you try to win them over and make them enjoy you, if they enjoy you they will learn.
EDIT: I read the OP's reply and now I feel bad, I'm sorry my comment was so pointed I was just a bit annoyed because I see teachers vent about this, especially in middle-highschool, and it annoys me when I see them give up on students prematurely. At least that is what it seemed like, I'm sorry if I was too harsh in my comment.
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I think I underestimated you, thanks for the explanation.
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Just do the best you can to help the ones that wants to learn, and try to best you can to help the rest realize why they have to learn. That's your job as a teacher.
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