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Hi, I was at a party recently, a regular, suburban Australian party, and a very close friend who has recently been travelling brought along a Canadian. We talked and talked and talked some more. She had travelled a lot and being the kind of person I am (I'm very interested in other cultures) I had a lot of questions to ask, until all of a sudden she suggested I go to Canada.
My first thought was - "You're crazy."
I said that and immediately her tone changed. "Do I sound crazy?" she asked. Of course I said no, and then we started talking about why the thought sounded crazy. The bottom line was in my mind I was so sucked in to the day-to-day. I have a job (doing something I don't want to do mind you), and a house, and enough money to support my habits and my hobbies. So the thought had never crossed my mind.
But one thing's for sure, she definitely wasn't crazy. She was a nice friendly person, living a fun life doing fun things, meeting new people from different cultures.
Then she said "This is what being a Canadian's like."
My mind was blown. Could this really be what being a Canadian's like? Being nice and fun and friendly. See, in Australia, the culture is based heavily on drinking, having barbecues, being friendly in the sense that if someone's around you'll say G'day, or if someone needs a hand with something you'll lend it. But you never really get to know anybody unless you have a reason to. It just shocked me deeply that here was this person that I just met at a party, who spent the time to actually get to know me, and was convincing me that there is a better place for someone like me to be.
So I actually decided, why not. I should go to Canada. I have a friend who wants to move there and if we do it together it will be so much easier for the both of us. Being an Australian over there too I assume it will give me a new talking point, a new lease on life so to speak, everything will be different. The internet will be better in terms of ping. There will be greater opportunities in terms of the games industry, specifically when it comes to indie games. It will give me easier access to things like conventions in the US which I have always wanted to go to, and then there's things like MLG.
I went home that night and barely slept at all. I couldn't shake the thought, is Canada the right move? I posted on facebook about it and every friend I have that has travelled said they have never heard anything bad about Canada (except for the weather, which I'm almost certain I could handle.) I looked up the culture and society and in every single way, it seems better than Australia's. Not a lot better mind you, but just the little things.
So I just wanted to ask for people's opinions on Canada in general, if any Canadian's see this or if anyone's travelled there, how would you rate it?
And I ask here specifically because TL'ers always seem to have good opinions on things.
P.S In the mean time, time to apply for a visa :D
 
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It depends on where in Canada
Where exactly would you be?
In my neck of the woods, it's pretty good. Though, I get laughed at alot for where my house is in my city, as it's supposedly part of the ghetto. Canada is nice, pretty and we're quite friendly. Even though our polar bear friends and igloos are slowly going away. D;
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Learn to play hockey and speak french.
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On April 15 2012 14:38 Fallians wrote:
Learn to play hockey and speak french.
This too, and slowly incorporate eh into your speech
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What province are you looking at? What city?
Most Aussies I meet either work on ski hills or as tree planters or, most often, both. But since I'm a tree planter, and my boss recruits heavily from people living in the Kootenays (a region in the Rocky Mountains), I suppose that's... kinda what you'd expect. Every year at the end of our planting season we have a big fancy-ish award night in honour of one legendary Australian planter from way back...
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Three things.
1. In Canada, people apologize when they walk past you in the opposite direction on the sidewalk.
2. We have a corrupt and deeply offensive government.
3. Depending on where you move you'll either be living in a vibrant urban art centre or a gold rush ghost town. Your choice.
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Is this for a visit/touring Canada?
Or
Staying in Canada?
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Honestly, I don't mean to be rude here, but I think you're the crazy one if you believe that an entire country of people are "nice and fun and friendly", like robots. There is no place on earth where every single person is the same in a country, you are always going to get a spectrum of different personality types. In fact, you'd probably find the exact same spectrum of people in Canada as you do in Australia, some are nice, some are mean, some are friendly, some are not.
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If you're into parties and you come to a big city like Toronto I think you'll still go to parties here. That part of you won't change.
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Depends on where you want to go. East/West coast is pretty good, although I live much farther inland. If you can survive the winter (-30 in January is the norm in my area) Canada is a pretty good place to live.
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On April 15 2012 14:36 X10A wrote:
It depends on where in Canada
Where exactly would you be?
Toronto was suggested, and where I have been looking/thinking about. Although honestly it would depend a lot on where I find work, and what type of accommodation is available which I probably wouldn't try to narrow down until I get a positive response from the visa application.
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On April 15 2012 14:48 Zapdos_Smithh wrote:
Honestly, I don't mean to be rude here, but I think you're the crazy one if you believe that an entire country of people are "nice and fun and friendly", like robots. There is no place on earth where every single person is the same in a country, you are always going to get a spectrum of different personality types. In fact, you'd probably find the exact same spectrum of people in Canada as you do in Australia, some are nice, some are mean, some are friendly, some are not.
There is much truth in this. You'll see plenty of "drinking, having barbecues, being friendly in the sense that if someone's around you'll say G'day, or if someone needs a hand with something you'll lend it." Plenty of fucking assholes and god damn geniuses and fucking asshole geniuses. Blithering racists and shut-in nerds and flaky artist-types and drunk-ass college kids (god damn engineers) and worldly renaissance men and everything else in all possible permutations and combinations.
Like you'd find in Australia, I'd bet.
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On April 15 2012 14:52 skipgamer wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2012 14:36 X10A wrote:
It depends on where in Canada
Where exactly would you be? Toronto was suggested, and where I have been looking/thinking about. Although honestly it would depend a lot on where I find work, and what type of accommodation is available which I probably wouldn't try to narrow down until I get a positive response from the visa application.
You should be aware that Toronto is the most mean-spirited city in Canada. Not to say that you'd hate it, there's always something happening in Toronto so you'll never be bored. But it's business-like, not very inspiring, and someone will be a dick to you daily.
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they have milk bags watch out LOL <3 Canada
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On April 15 2012 14:58 lolmlg wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2012 14:52 skipgamer wrote:On April 15 2012 14:36 X10A wrote:
It depends on where in Canada
Where exactly would you be? Toronto was suggested, and where I have been looking/thinking about. Although honestly it would depend a lot on where I find work, and what type of accommodation is available which I probably wouldn't try to narrow down until I get a positive response from the visa application. You should be aware that Toronto is the most mean-spirited city in Canada. Not to say that you'd hate it, there's always something happening in Toronto so you'll never be bored. But it's business-like, not very inspiring, and someone will be a dick to you daily.
You should be aware that Toronto is one of the most expensive cities in Canada. That and Vancouver.
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On April 15 2012 14:48 Zapdos_Smithh wrote:
Honestly, I don't mean to be rude here, but I think you're the crazy one if you believe that an entire country of people are "nice and fun and friendly", like robots. There is no place on earth where every single person is the same in a country, you are always going to get a spectrum of different personality types. In fact, you'd probably find the exact same spectrum of people in Canada as you do in Australia, some are nice, some are mean, some are friendly, some are not.
Really, that's a huge bummer. Of course I wouldn't expect everyone to be the same, but from what I've read there just seems to be a more culturally accepting vibe about Canada. I don't know if you've ever been to Australia, but there is real seperation and segregation within most of the community. Australians stick to themselves, Vietnamese stick to themselves, Europeans stick to themselves, Middle-eastern's stick to themselves. And if you spend time with any of these groups you will usually find them complaining about others (especially Australian's complaining about others.)
Perhaps, you are right, it may just be a pipe-dream.
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By the way, if you're moving to Toronto and plan on renting an apartment you need to do some serious research before you sign anything. There are particular buildings that are notorious for being exploitative of immigrants and full of crime.
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depends on what you're looking for. big city? outdoors? cold? coast/ocean? There's a wide range in Canada.
I suggest just looking up each major city in each province to get yourself a feel. Vancouver/Toronto/Calgary/Edmonton/Ottawa would be a decent start.
I suggest Vancouver, though it's rated the most expensive place to live in all of NA... yikes :S
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On April 15 2012 15:01 Tamburlaine wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2012 14:58 lolmlg wrote:On April 15 2012 14:52 skipgamer wrote:On April 15 2012 14:36 X10A wrote:
It depends on where in Canada
Where exactly would you be? Toronto was suggested, and where I have been looking/thinking about. Although honestly it would depend a lot on where I find work, and what type of accommodation is available which I probably wouldn't try to narrow down until I get a positive response from the visa application. You should be aware that Toronto is the most mean-spirited city in Canada. Not to say that you'd hate it, there's always something happening in Toronto so you'll never be bored. But it's business-like, not very inspiring, and someone will be a dick to you daily. You should be aware that Toronto is one of the most expensive cities in Canada. That and Vancouver.
Just wondering, where would either of you suggest? I think I'll just travel around on a holiday before even thinking about moving by the direction this thread is going.
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On April 15 2012 15:02 skipgamer wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2012 14:48 Zapdos_Smithh wrote:
Honestly, I don't mean to be rude here, but I think you're the crazy one if you believe that an entire country of people are "nice and fun and friendly", like robots. There is no place on earth where every single person is the same in a country, you are always going to get a spectrum of different personality types. In fact, you'd probably find the exact same spectrum of people in Canada as you do in Australia, some are nice, some are mean, some are friendly, some are not. Really, that's a huge bummer. Of course I wouldn't expect everyone to be the same, but from what I've read there just seems to be a more culturally accepting vibe about Canada. I don't know if you've ever been to Australia, but there is real seperation and segregation within most of the community. Australians stick to themselves, Vietnamese stick to themselves, Europeans stick to themselves, Middle-eastern's stick to themselves. And if you spend time with any of these groups you will usually find them complaining about others (especially Australian's complaining about others.) Perhaps, you are right, it may just be a pipe-dream.
No offense but you seem really wishy-washy about the whole thing. People act like people. Two immigrants from Russia will become friends in a place like Canada for no other reason than that they both speak Russian. It's how human beings behave. But Canada is a country of cultural interaction and if you want to meet Italians or something then you can always go to Little Italy and talk to them and eat meatballs. In my city people describe distances in terms of how many shwarma places you pass on the way. But if you don't want shwarma just go next door and have pho. Whatever.
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Prepare yourself for overpriced and limited internet service.
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On April 15 2012 15:04 skipgamer wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2012 15:01 Tamburlaine wrote:On April 15 2012 14:58 lolmlg wrote:On April 15 2012 14:52 skipgamer wrote:On April 15 2012 14:36 X10A wrote:
It depends on where in Canada
Where exactly would you be? Toronto was suggested, and where I have been looking/thinking about. Although honestly it would depend a lot on where I find work, and what type of accommodation is available which I probably wouldn't try to narrow down until I get a positive response from the visa application. You should be aware that Toronto is the most mean-spirited city in Canada. Not to say that you'd hate it, there's always something happening in Toronto so you'll never be bored. But it's business-like, not very inspiring, and someone will be a dick to you daily. You should be aware that Toronto is one of the most expensive cities in Canada. That and Vancouver. Just wondering, where would either of you suggest? I think I'll just travel around on a holiday before even thinking about moving by the direction this thread is going.
Well, you should also be aware that Canada is enormous and it's very expensive to travel. We don't have budget airlines. Inter-city bus travel isn't cheap. And you'd basically need to travel the maximum distance possible to go from Vancouver to Montreal.
If you want to live somewhere interesting, you should probably go to Montreal. It's not particularly far from Toronto so you could always visit, but it's got a lot more character and the music scene has three times as much life.
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On April 15 2012 15:04 skipgamer wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2012 15:01 Tamburlaine wrote:On April 15 2012 14:58 lolmlg wrote:On April 15 2012 14:52 skipgamer wrote:On April 15 2012 14:36 X10A wrote:
It depends on where in Canada
Where exactly would you be? Toronto was suggested, and where I have been looking/thinking about. Although honestly it would depend a lot on where I find work, and what type of accommodation is available which I probably wouldn't try to narrow down until I get a positive response from the visa application. You should be aware that Toronto is the most mean-spirited city in Canada. Not to say that you'd hate it, there's always something happening in Toronto so you'll never be bored. But it's business-like, not very inspiring, and someone will be a dick to you daily. You should be aware that Toronto is one of the most expensive cities in Canada. That and Vancouver. Just wondering, where would either of you suggest? I think I'll just travel around before even thinking about moving by the direction this thread is going.
Heh. Well, I don't exactly know you well, but...
BC would be your best choice climate-wise, being "the warm province". Vancouver's expensive, but often considered the best city in Canada. The Queen Charlotte Islands have some of the most beautiful forests in the world, provided you find a part of them that haven't been logged yet. Lots of Australians in the mountains, too. You guys fucking love snowboarding, apparently.
Moving east you get Alberta, or "Canada's America". I've no love for Calgary, but Edmonton ain't bad. More crime than Calgary, but it's a far more interesting city. There's a restaurant there that makes the best god damn bison burger ever, too.
Then you hit Saskatchewan, my province. Population one million, with two "major" cities. The capitol, Regina, has a bit of a reputation for crime. I live in Saskatoon, which is kinda divided between "the poor side" west of the river and the yuppie/university side on the east. Saskatchewan's a good choice if you're in to hunting or kayaking or... y'know, nature stuff, but otherwise, probably not much for you. The Ness Creek Music Festival's alright if you're in to that sort of thing.
Manitoba is like Saskatchewan if Regina and Saskatoon were combined in to one mosquito-ridden city. They have the Red River Rampage, though. And Propagandhi and The Weakerthans are way better bands than The Sheepdogs. And they just got their hockey team back, which is pretty baller.
Farther east still gets you Ontario. Big province, lots of wilderness and what-not. Most people live in the Great Lake area. There's Toronto, of course. Ottawa's nicer, though. But who cares about Ottawa when you could go for...
Quebec. Or more specifically, Montreal, the English-est city in the province. Very cool city. Not knowing French makes things harder on you the farther you get from that city.
And then there are the maritime provinces and Newfoundland and Labrador and the territories, which... well, I've never been to any of them. Other people could talk about them better than I.
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I've seen your spiders.
What the fuck are you doing in Australia?
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On April 15 2012 15:03 mintiefresh wrote:
depends on what you're looking for. big city? outdoors? cold? coast/ocean? There's a wide range in Canada.
I suggest just looking up each major city in each province to get yourself a feel. Vancouver/Toronto/Calgary/Edmonton/Ottawa would be a decent start.
I suggest Vancouver, though it's rated the most expensive place to live in all of NA... yikes :S
Yeah, I've been looking around online at different places, I still think Toronto (how can anybody not like the maple leafs) seems like the best bet, possibly Ottawa. Definitely Ontario, sure montreal is interesting, but it seems more like the place I'd like to travel to every now and again, not actually live in.
Either way, thanks for keeping the head level TL. Knew I could count on you guys for good advice.
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On April 15 2012 15:17  SK.Testie wrote:I've seen your spiders the fuck are you doing in Australia?
LOL saw that vid on your stream <3
edit: ok i added the protoss sign by mistake gg
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On April 15 2012 15:19 skipgamer wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2012 15:03 mintiefresh wrote:
depends on what you're looking for. big city? outdoors? cold? coast/ocean? There's a wide range in Canada.
I suggest just looking up each major city in each province to get yourself a feel. Vancouver/Toronto/Calgary/Edmonton/Ottawa would be a decent start.
I suggest Vancouver, though it's rated the most expensive place to live in all of NA... yikes :S how can anybody not like the maple leafs
Oh, go anywhere in Canada outside of Toronto and we'll fill you in.
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On April 15 2012 15:19 skipgamer wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2012 15:03 mintiefresh wrote:
depends on what you're looking for. big city? outdoors? cold? coast/ocean? There's a wide range in Canada.
I suggest just looking up each major city in each province to get yourself a feel. Vancouver/Toronto/Calgary/Edmonton/Ottawa would be a decent start.
I suggest Vancouver, though it's rated the most expensive place to live in all of NA... yikes :S Yeah, I've been looking around online at different places, I still think Toronto (how can anybody not like the maple leafs) seems like the best bet, possibly Ottawa. Definitely Ontario, sure montreal is interesting, but it seems more like the place I'd like to travel to every now and again, not actually live in. Either way, thanks for keeping the head level TL. Knew I could count on you guys for good advice.
Ottawa is less expensive and less interesting. You will need a car, no exceptions. The bus system is slow and inadequate. If you want to see a good band you'll need to go to Toronto or Montreal, no exceptions. But it's a clean, safe place to live, with many high tech opportunities.
Edit: And Montreal is like, one hour away by train.
Edit again: Well, possible exception for the car thing if you don't mind commuting for two hours every day, or if you both live and work downtown. The latter is your best bet for actually enjoying life, although most of the tech jobs are in the west end.
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What do you have to lose from moving? What would you do if you stayed in Australia? It sounds like your job isn't that important to you. At best, you have an amazing time and memories and stories that last a lifetime, and at worst you don't like it and you move back to Australia and keep doing what you would have otherwise been doing.
Live a bit, do it, but keep some money stored away if you ever have to/want to jump ship back to Australia.
Sterotypes in-coming: Canada obviously has a very wide spectrum of personality types, but my general impression from interacting with both nations is that Australia is more party-friendly and fun-loving (hence previous comments about Australians loving our mountains for snowboarding), but Canadians are more culturally accepting and culturally integrated. At any rate, get involved in the right social circles and I'm sure you'll meet people who share the same interests and disposition.
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If you want a place with warm and outgoing people who aren't afraid to randomly start conversations, STAY AWAY FROM VANCOUVER. REPEAT, DO NOT COME TO VANCOUVER. Also don't go to Toronto because it's Toronto and no one likes them.
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On April 15 2012 15:12 lolmlg wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2012 15:04 skipgamer wrote:On April 15 2012 15:01 Tamburlaine wrote:On April 15 2012 14:58 lolmlg wrote:On April 15 2012 14:52 skipgamer wrote:On April 15 2012 14:36 X10A wrote:
It depends on where in Canada
Where exactly would you be? Toronto was suggested, and where I have been looking/thinking about. Although honestly it would depend a lot on where I find work, and what type of accommodation is available which I probably wouldn't try to narrow down until I get a positive response from the visa application. You should be aware that Toronto is the most mean-spirited city in Canada. Not to say that you'd hate it, there's always something happening in Toronto so you'll never be bored. But it's business-like, not very inspiring, and someone will be a dick to you daily. You should be aware that Toronto is one of the most expensive cities in Canada. That and Vancouver. Just wondering, where would either of you suggest? I think I'll just travel around on a holiday before even thinking about moving by the direction this thread is going. Well, you should also be aware that Canada is enormous and it's very expensive to travel. We don't have budget airlines. Inter-city bus travel isn't cheap. And you'd basically need to travel the maximum distance possible to go from Vancouver to Montreal. If you want to live somewhere interesting, you should probably go to Montreal. It's not particularly far from Toronto so you could always visit, but it's got a lot more character and the music scene has three times as much life.
This could just be a locational thing but I thought bus travel was pretty cheap. What's your idea of expensive?
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Also, Ottawa has a pretty good bus system, not sure what lolmlg is talking about. As long as you don't live in like Kanata or suburbia, you shouldn't take more than 40 minutes to get basically anywhere in the city. The fact it's cornered into a river makes bus routes only half as complicated compared to a normal city.
Try living in Regina or any of the prairie cities for truly horrible public transpo.
Ottawa is a pretty well 'sized' city where you have the better aspects of a big city and the better aspects of a small city. If I were to move back to Canada, Ottawa would be my top choice.
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Fuck Toronto, come to Montreal.
I had an old TLer by the name of Fireblast! come and stay at my place for a good while, he can tell how great this city is!
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On April 15 2012 15:55 Hidden_MotiveS wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2012 15:12 lolmlg wrote:On April 15 2012 15:04 skipgamer wrote:On April 15 2012 15:01 Tamburlaine wrote:On April 15 2012 14:58 lolmlg wrote:On April 15 2012 14:52 skipgamer wrote:On April 15 2012 14:36 X10A wrote:
It depends on where in Canada
Where exactly would you be? Toronto was suggested, and where I have been looking/thinking about. Although honestly it would depend a lot on where I find work, and what type of accommodation is available which I probably wouldn't try to narrow down until I get a positive response from the visa application. You should be aware that Toronto is the most mean-spirited city in Canada. Not to say that you'd hate it, there's always something happening in Toronto so you'll never be bored. But it's business-like, not very inspiring, and someone will be a dick to you daily. You should be aware that Toronto is one of the most expensive cities in Canada. That and Vancouver. Just wondering, where would either of you suggest? I think I'll just travel around on a holiday before even thinking about moving by the direction this thread is going. Well, you should also be aware that Canada is enormous and it's very expensive to travel. We don't have budget airlines. Inter-city bus travel isn't cheap. And you'd basically need to travel the maximum distance possible to go from Vancouver to Montreal. If you want to live somewhere interesting, you should probably go to Montreal. It's not particularly far from Toronto so you could always visit, but it's got a lot more character and the music scene has three times as much life. This could just be a locational thing but I thought bus travel was pretty cheap. What's your idea of expensive?
If you've ever taken a bus between cities in Spain you'll know what a reasonably priced bus ticket costs. They have competition. Ontario has a government-sponsored monopoly.
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On April 15 2012 15:57 TheKwas wrote:
Also, Ottawa has a pretty good bus system, not sure what lolmlg is talking about. As long as you don't live in like Kanata or suburbia, you shouldn't take more than 40 minutes to get basically anywhere in the city. The fact it's cornered into a river makes bus routes only half as complicated compared to a normal city.
Try living in Regina or any of the prairie cities for truly horrible public transpo.
Ottawa is a pretty well 'sized' city where you have the better aspects of a big city and the better aspects of a small city. If I were to move back to Canada, Ottawa would be my top choice.
Regina isn't a national capital.
If you live in Kanata, or Barrhaven, or Orleans (i.e. you live anywhere in Ottawa where people live in a house, especially one that costs less than a million dollars) then you will be subjected to long trips on the bus. If you plan to work in Kanata then you'd better either live in Kanata or live downtown within a five minute walk of the transitway, otherwise you will spend more than an hour on the bus each way, guaranteed.
That is, if the bus drivers don't go on strike, which they tend to do.
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prepare to get be raped in the ass by the cold.
i live in texas and have family in calgary, and i have to say that outside of 5 months of the year, its just too fucking cold to function as a normal human being
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On April 15 2012 15:50 Taku wrote:
If you want a place with warm and outgoing people who aren't afraid to randomly start conversations, STAY AWAY FROM VANCOUVER. REPEAT, DO NOT COME TO VANCOUVER. Also don't go to Toronto because it's Toronto and no one likes them.
Dear Lord, this. I have lived here my entire life and the ONLY stranger I have ever had randomly strike up a conversation with me was a guy from (friendly?) Manitoba. I'm not saying it's impossible to make friends, I'm sure part of the reason I've never made a friend that I didn't meet through other friends/school/sports teams is that I'm a shy/cold-at-first type as well, but I'm sure the first few weeks in this city would suck for someone who knows no one here. I *do* love living here, but seeing as you put "But you never really get to know anybody unless you have a reason to" as one of your reasons as wanting to explore somewhere else, I probably wouldn't come here unless you do an absurd amount of research and decide that second place isn't even close. It's also way more expensive than every other/most other places in Canada. (some people say Toronto is the most expensive city in Canada, I suppose it depends on what/how you measure it)
If it counts for anything, I'd love to move to Quebec and learn French/pick up some of the Quebecois culture if only I had the chance. Maybe I'll try to go to an English university there for grad school? I'd also consider the Maritimes. It's rarely the first place brought up when someone mentions Canada, but it looks absolutely gorgeous. Definitely on my bucket list.
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On April 15 2012 16:23 danson wrote:
i live in texas
Mystery solved. Wear a coat next time bro.
On April 15 2012 16:26 Wafflelisk wrote:
(some people say Toronto is the most expensive city in Canada, I suppose it depends on what/how you measure it)
Vancouver was recently named the second-most expensive housing market in the entire English-speaking world.
(Sydney was #1.)
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No one has mentioned the taxes yet. If you are a single guy with no kids expect to pay at least 45% income tax right off the bat. Then there is the sales taxes like GST, PST etc. It depends somewhat on your tax bracket of course but the taxation makes it hard to succeed. Half your income goes to a bloated socialist nanny-state where you will be paying the wages of those who are mooching off the government.
That being said... If you can accept this reality then Canada does have a lot going for it. Clean in most places, the great outdoors, mostly friendly people and a low crime rate. I would recommend Calgary as it has a lot of high tech industry, lively nightlife scene and a booming economy with no PST. If you can handle the weather and like winter sports theres some great skiing not far in Banff. The Canadian Rockies are some of the most beautiful things you will ever see.
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Agree Canada is very diverse (in some parts at least). I think more than Australia.
It depends where you live though.
In Toronto, Ontario, there is such great diversity. There are "towns" for many many different cultures. The "chinatown" there is huge, it is like a full city.
If you live in a place like Toronto (or rather, metro toronto), it may be a good experience, since you can go/move to whatever part of it you want.
Anyways I do not know australian culture that much. As long as you have other reasons (like better game industry importunity) than just thinking/hoping that the social side of Canada will suit you more than Australia, I think it's ok.
But before moving, have you considered simply vacationing there first?
Btw like others have said, the tax is huge. But things are so nice there. In Michigan, USA there are so many holes/cracks in the roads. In Canada it is a rare sight to see a crack (maybe really thin ones, but no cracks like 1 cm or more, at least in the parts of toronto i've been in)
Also things like free health care and insurance and such.
I live in USA and you could say Canada is more "socialist" than USA. You pay higher tax but they use it to help the general people. It could help or hurt you. If you happen to get some rare disease or something or need surgery, the high tax could pay off easily. If your needs don't make the tax pay off for the amount you pay, I think it is important to examine what kind of person you are. On one hand it's like you wasted a lot of money, but on another you know the money is being used for "good" things or to help other people. Maybe if you are a generous person who would rather pay less tax and use your own money to help others in the ways you prefer to and/or feel are best, you will not prefer the higher tax in Canada.
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To pay 45% income tax in Canada, you'd need to make like $130 000 per year, and the 45% would only apply to maybe $5 000 of that amount. So you're astoundingly wrong there.
I don't know why people from the US are always so obsessed with taxes. I think about taxes when it's time to file or when there's an election but otherwise it means nothing.
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On April 15 2012 16:03 lolmlg wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2012 15:57 TheKwas wrote:
Also, Ottawa has a pretty good bus system, not sure what lolmlg is talking about. As long as you don't live in like Kanata or suburbia, you shouldn't take more than 40 minutes to get basically anywhere in the city. The fact it's cornered into a river makes bus routes only half as complicated compared to a normal city.
Try living in Regina or any of the prairie cities for truly horrible public transpo.
Ottawa is a pretty well 'sized' city where you have the better aspects of a big city and the better aspects of a small city. If I were to move back to Canada, Ottawa would be my top choice. Regina isn't a national capital. If you live in Kanata, or Barrhaven, or Orleans (i.e. you live anywhere in Ottawa where people live in a house, especially one that costs less than a million dollars) then you will be subjected to long trips on the bus. If you plan to work in Kanata then you'd better either live in Kanata or live downtown within a five minute walk of the transitway, otherwise you will spend more than an hour on the bus each way, guaranteed.
It's a provincial capital.
Anyways, I doubt the OP is looking to become a homeowner right after jumping off the plane. He would probably be renting a place in Ottawa proper, meaning the buses work just fine. Statements like "you'll need a car, no exceptions" are just downright false. I survived 4 years in Ottawa(Nepean, not downtown) without a car just fine, and even buses going out to places like Kanata (where I went often due to friends) are pretty good and fast (transportation within Kanata is a different matter).
EDIT: Don't worry too much about taxes despite the groaning and complaining going on here (eh, it's taxes, who doesn't want to complain?). It's really not a burden and if your lower-income, you really don't pay much. Through my life I've certainly gained more from canada's social services than what I've personally contributed, so perhaps I'm more willing to accept taxes than others.
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I know it's a provincial capital. It also has less than a fifth of the population of Ottawa. There's no comparison to be made. The capital city of a country should be held to a certain standard. Cities in Europe with similar populations often have three different modes of public transportation. Ottawa has a flaky bus system and continual in-fighting over the future of the tiny light rail line. And the bus coverage is cut every year. If you live and work downtown there's no problem. If you live or work anywhere else and plan to own furniture then good luck.
Speaking of less than fifths, four years is less than a fifth of how long I've lived in Ottawa in my lifetime. Want to know how long it takes to get to the airport from Barrhaven by bus on a weekday? An hour and a half. If you make all your connections. The drive is 25 minutes and costs over $30 by taxi.
It's nice that you have this small-town view where everything is amazing but Ottawa has substandard public transportation and everyone who lives here agrees. I've spent time in many different cities so I have a lot to compare it to.
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West coast, that's all I have to say. Try Victoria or North Vancouver.
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Substandard transpo =/= "you must own a car, no exceptions".
Ottawa clearly doesn't have top-notch public transpo (I currently live in seoul, which DOES have world-class public transpo, and spent significant time in other cities as well, so my perspective isn't limited to a small-town view), and it's certainly a huge boost to have a car if you live in the suburbs (because, well duh it's a suburb; people don't tend to move to the suburbs unless they already have a car), but you can live a pretty normal life in Ottawa-proper without a car.
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Vancouver has some of the best public transit in the world. Skytrain <3
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On April 15 2012 18:34 TheKwas wrote:
Substandard transpo =/= "you must own a car, no exceptions".
Ottawa clearly doesn't have top-notch public transpo (I currently live in seoul, which DOES have world-class public transpo, and spent significant time in other cities as well, so my perspective isn't limited to a small-town view), and it's certainly a huge boost to have a car if you live in the suburbs (because, well duh it's a suburb; people don't tend to move to the suburbs unless they already have a car), but you can live a pretty normal life in Ottawa-proper without a car.
Haha, you know, it's possible to "survive" without a job or apartment at all. You can panhandle downtown and dodge the whole problem, right?
He said he wants to work for a game company, so he's probably looking for a tech job. The two places to find a tech job are downtown and Kanata. Kanata is the suburbs. If he's not going to own a home or live in the suburbs then he's not going to live in Kanata. You have to choose where you live and work carefully if you're going to avoid punishing bus tours is the point, and sometimes you can't choose. The only reason I "survived" my first job in Kanata was because my neighbour worked on the same street and gave me a lift four days of the week. And while I didn't mind the two hour commute so much in university, the fact that the bus stopped running at midnight definitely fucked up a lot of plans.
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I missed that bit about the game industry. Anyways, within Ottawa-proper I never felt burdern by public tranpo for most of my purposes compared to my stays in other cities. Obviously the 12 oclock shutdown of most routes suck, but that's pretty standard in any city. "must own a car, no exceptions" is a pretty damning statement when what you really mean is "must own a car if you plan on working in the suburbs"
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On April 15 2012 14:29 skipgamer wrote:
See, in Australia, the culture is based heavily on drinking, having barbecues, being friendly in the sense that if someone's around you'll say G'day, or if someone needs a hand with something you'll lend it. But you never really get to know anybody unless you have a reason to.
I know this is a little off topic, but you've inspired me.
Is this true? Can any other Aussies confirm? Drinking and not being bothered by strangers sounds pretty sweet. In the US, it seems like you either live somewhere where everyone wants to know your business or where everyone's an asshole. I may need a visa.
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The Maritimes for some good times.
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First of all, you can already how awesome us Canadians are from the supportive and informative posts in this thread. :D I know moving to Canada seems like a pretty random decision (I still think so) but if you're the adventurous type, hey, why not.
As a resident of Toronto who's lived here 13 years, here are a few things you should know (and I'll offer some opinions on things said about Toronto):
- Toronto, as you already know, is the biggest city in Canada in terms of population. Count the GTA (Greater Toronto Area), and we have like several million (and that's a lot for Canada). There is a lot of diversity, I'm not sure if the most diverse place in Canada, but there certainly is no short of immigrants from all over the world. If you want to experience foods and cultures around the world in one place, Toronto is a good one.
- Our public transportation service SUCKS. I would rank it as one of the worst in North America. The system hasn't evolved much since the 1980's, it's mad jammed in rush hour, it's unreliable, and not very cheap either. It almost encourages people to get a car ASAP. That being said, our downtown is much too hard to access with cars due to poor road network configurations and lack of parking spaces, so subway is a must when travelling to/from/within downtown.
- Living costs are relatively high, but I wouldn't say it's the highest in Canada. Altogether (rent, insurance, gas, food, internet, phone, leisure) personally, I think I spend about $2000/month.
- Job market in the city is decent... and most of the "office" jobs are concentrated either in the downtown core, or near the airport.
- Nightlife is also decent if you live in the downtown, but elsewhere, the options are pretty limited.
Any more questions, I can probably answer, so feel free to PM me if you're seriously considering Toronto!
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skip,
It's one thing to be an avid traveller as I one as well, but moving to an entirely different country is another and these stereotypes really have to end lmao.
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On April 15 2012 23:25 OpticalShot wrote:
First of all, you can already how awesome us Canadians are from the supportive and informative posts in this thread. :D I know moving to Canada seems like a pretty random decision (I still think so) but if you're the adventurous type, hey, why not.
As a resident of Toronto who's lived here 13 years, here are a few things you should know (and I'll offer some opinions on things said about Toronto):
- Toronto, as you already know, is the biggest city in Canada in terms of population. Count the GTA (Greater Toronto Area), and we have like several million (and that's a lot for Canada). There is a lot of diversity, I'm not sure if the most diverse place in Canada, but there certainly is no short of immigrants from all over the world. If you want to experience foods and cultures around the world in one place, Toronto is a good one.
- Our public transportation service SUCKS. I would rank it as one of the worst in North America. The system hasn't evolved much since the 1980's, it's mad jammed in rush hour, it's unreliable, and not very cheap either. It almost encourages people to get a car ASAP. That being said, our downtown is much too hard to access with cars due to poor road network configurations and lack of parking spaces, so subway is a must when travelling to/from/within downtown.
- Living costs are relatively high, but I wouldn't say it's the highest in Canada. Altogether (rent, insurance, gas, food, internet, phone, leisure) personally, I think I spend about $2000/month.
- Job market in the city is decent... and most of the "office" jobs are concentrated either in the downtown core, or near the airport.
- Nightlife is also decent if you live in the downtown, but elsewhere, the options are pretty limited.
Any more questions, I can probably answer, so feel free to PM me if you're seriously considering Toronto!
TTC is acronym for "Take the Car"
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Canadians, on average, are fucking awesome.
I'm sure thats probably true for many countries though, if you want to travel go travel. If you really like it maybe you could consider staying there. You can go there if you want to, its not like its impossible.
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Just to answer some of the questions. I'm living alone no girlfriend etc, so there isn't much to lose really because most of my friends are moving on in life with families. I work in logistics (bleh =\) currently in a management position while doing freelance graphic design work and making flash/indy games/mods and gaming in my spare time, also have a ba in digital art and qualifications in small business management. So even though my work history/qualifications are a bit iffy in terms of not hitting one field/industry only, I'm far from uneducated and can't imagine it being impossible to find a liveable salary (I hope, of course I'll look in to this more once visa is accepted, there's also the option of getting a transfer within the company as they have operations in canada.)
I'll be coming with at least one friend, planning to share accommodation at least to begin with just to make things easier, and I'm fairly confident I will be able to buy a cheap car on arrival if necessary for work.
Living costs are fairly high in Melbourne too so I don't think that will come as too much as a shock. If I wanted cheap I'd go to Thailand or Dubai or something. But that's not what it's about, Canada just genuinely seems like a better country with better opportunities for travelling from.
So as for whether it's possible, that's almost a definite assuming getting the Visa goes well, It's not like I'm talking about moving out tomorrow, more like in a year or so time. I was just more-so interested in how Canadians themselves were in terms of culture and as a society, but as someone pointed out early on people will always be different no matter where they are. Still, from what people have said since it pretty much aligns with what I've heard elsewhere, that there really is nothing bad apart from the weather (and i like the cold, beats 40c heat and bush-fires down here in summer.) The idea of moving makes sense to me, but I'll probably just travel a bit first to see the different cities before thinking about settling somewhere. I just don't want to double my cost and time in flights, travel, spending money, by coming out for a non-working holiday first. I think it will be obvious if it doesn't suit and then I can just go back to Aus.
On April 15 2012 15:17 SK.Testie wrote:
I've seen your spiders.
What the fuck are you doing in Australia?
It is fun to clean spiderwebs though
+ Show Spoiler +
Anyway, thanks again TL as always, given me a bit more to think about.
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On April 15 2012 14:59 cmen15 wrote:
they have milk bags watch out LOL <3 Canada
Man I was raised with bagged milk. It's so normal to me. I thought it was the industry standard!
I still get surprised when others go WTF looooollll.
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I live in Toronto and have actually had several conversations with complete strangers on the subway and such, which it sounds like you might be interested in.
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On April 15 2012 15:02 skipgamer wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2012 14:48 Zapdos_Smithh wrote:
Honestly, I don't mean to be rude here, but I think you're the crazy one if you believe that an entire country of people are "nice and fun and friendly", like robots. There is no place on earth where every single person is the same in a country, you are always going to get a spectrum of different personality types. In fact, you'd probably find the exact same spectrum of people in Canada as you do in Australia, some are nice, some are mean, some are friendly, some are not. Really, that's a huge bummer. Of course I wouldn't expect everyone to be the same, but from what I've read there just seems to be a more culturally accepting vibe about Canada. I don't know if you've ever been to Australia, but there is real seperation and segregation within most of the community. Australians stick to themselves, Vietnamese stick to themselves, Europeans stick to themselves, Middle-eastern's stick to themselves. And if you spend time with any of these groups you will usually find them complaining about others (especially Australian's complaining about others.) Perhaps, you are right, it may just be a pipe-dream.
My parents lived in Canada all their lives. A few years ago after they retired they spent a few months travelling in Australia. They came back and couldn't get over how friendly all the Australians were.
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On April 15 2012 14:38 Fallians wrote:
Learn to play hockey and speak french.
One does not simply.....
Learn to play hockey.
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canada sucks try panama instead
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Move to northern BC if you dont mind the cold and you enjoy having tons of money
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On April 15 2012 22:45 lifeisgood99 wrote:
Come to Montreal :D
Could work, especially if you were looking for a job in the game industry. If you live downtown (the only place I would consider living if I moved to Montreal) French is definitely not necessary. My only concern for OP would be that he would have a hard time meeting new people. There are tons of students in the area, but you might be more interested in meeting people your own age.
Montreal is a great place to be if you are young and single, not really sure if I'd want to stay and raise a family here though. Also, Montrealers are notorious for being impolite lol (can't really say if this is actually true though).
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The west coast of Canada is great. The culture is about enjoying yourself basically. Go skiing, snowboarding, kayaking, boating all in one day. Drinking isn't massive, hockey is huge at least in Vancouver. You're more likely to be invited for a coffee than a beer I find. Suburbs are boring baby-making factories, but the downtown life is very exciting in my opinion, if you can even afford it.
I don't know if it is worth a move from a stable life, it is a big risk in to the unknown for you.
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Canada11310 Posts
Canada is a wonderful place and the west coast is great and so you should come.
However, if this is your sole reason:
My mind was blown. Could this really be what being a Canadian's like? Being nice and fun and friendly. See, in Australia, the culture is based heavily on drinking, having barbecues, being friendly in the sense that if someone's around you'll say G'day, or if someone needs a hand with something you'll lend it. But you never really get to know anybody unless you have a reason to. It just shocked me deeply that here was this person that I just met at a party, who spent the time to actually get to know me, and was convincing me that there is a better place for someone like me to be.
Then, I am reminded of a Dr Seuss book: I Had Trouble Getting To Solla Sollew. If you are looking for a place where you never have troubles at least very few, then I'm afraid Canada is not your place either.
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I've heard many things about Australia and Canada, but nothing more true than a lot of people saying it is very much alike. Don't hold me to that, but that's only what I've heard. The Canada they may be speaking of may be a completely different Canada I'm very accustomed too. Also, just to further clarify, West and Eastern Canada are somewhat similar; however, just be ready to meet people who do not speak english and are native Francophones.
We are jolly, we like hockey, and we also love beer, so you'll totally enjoy your stay!
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On April 15 2012 16:55 ElMeanYo wrote:
No one has mentioned the taxes yet. If you are a single guy with no kids expect to pay at least 45% income tax right off the bat. Then there is the sales taxes like GST, PST etc. It depends somewhat on your tax bracket of course but the taxation makes it hard to succeed. Half your income goes to a bloated socialist nanny-state where you will be paying the wages of those who are mooching off the government.
That being said... If you can accept this reality then Canada does have a lot going for it. Clean in most places, the great outdoors, mostly friendly people and a low crime rate. I would recommend Calgary as it has a lot of high tech industry, lively nightlife scene and a booming economy with no PST. If you can handle the weather and like winter sports theres some great skiing not far in Banff. The Canadian Rockies are some of the most beautiful things you will ever see.
45% is not right unless you're making quite a bit of money and it also depends on the province. http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/ndvdls/fq/txrts-eng.html
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On April 15 2012 16:55 ElMeanYo wrote:
No one has mentioned the taxes yet. If you are a single guy with no kids expect to pay at least 45% income tax right off the bat. Then there is the sales taxes like GST, PST etc. It depends somewhat on your tax bracket of course but the taxation makes it hard to succeed. Half your income goes to a bloated socialist nanny-state where you will be paying the wages of those who are mooching off the government.
That being said... If you can accept this reality then Canada does have a lot going for it. Clean in most places, the great outdoors, mostly friendly people and a low crime rate. I would recommend Calgary as it has a lot of high tech industry, lively nightlife scene and a booming economy with no PST. If you can handle the weather and like winter sports theres some great skiing not far in Banff. The Canadian Rockies are some of the most beautiful things you will ever see.
Don't forget the Death Panels where we cull off some of the mooches on life support.
I'm honestly curious how high US taxes are, that you need to jump up to 45% to sound ludicrous.
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On April 16 2012 03:01 jjun212 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2012 14:59 cmen15 wrote:
they have milk bags watch out LOL <3 Canada Man I was raised with bagged milk. It's so normal to me. I thought it was the industry standard! I still get surprised when others go WTF looooollll.
I haven't ever seen bagged milk and I've been most places west of Toronto. Someone explain the concept to me and what area of the country it's common in?
Didn't see this explicitly stated anywhere else, but you should realize that Canada is a huge and diverse country. It's like the different areas of Australia: Daintree rainforest, red centre, north end, east coast urban centres, chill Canberra, etc. The country is pretty awesome everywhere but it's still a complex decision to choose a place for a home. The main difference is obviously the climate (you'll get snow pretty much everywhere except on the coasts) but there is also a different cultural mix. Aboriginals are treated pretty much the same way.
Some small things:
1. You don't need to know French. It's spoken in certain communities but it is very much the "second language" for most of the country. Unless you're in rural locations or Quebec, most people who speak French also speak English anyway.
2. Spend some time visiting areas you're interested in before you make any commitments.
3. As others have said, people are people. I think on average Canadians are pretty good people but I don't know if it's even a tangible difference or a factor in your decision. I will say that people won't have any negative prejudices about your background or accent, so that isn't a problem at all, and it could get you favorable attention in the way of conversation from some people.
Edit: Oh, and obviously you'll get better ping. I don't think that should impact your decision though.
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Canada11310 Posts
Bagged milk we used to have in BC when I was in elementary. I'm not sure when it was phased out but they don't sell it anywhere I live anymore. We used to have a plastic container and handle that you would put the milk bag in and then you'd cut the corner off the bag to pour it.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/vrUL7.jpg)
stolen from google
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On April 16 2012 11:08 Falling wrote:
Canada is a wonderful place and the west coast is great and so you should come.
However, if this is your sole reason:
Then, I am reminded of a Dr Seuss book: I Had Trouble Getting To Solla Sollew. If you are looking for a place where you never have troubles at least very few, then I'm afraid Canada is not your place either.
Thanks for the concern (and i love the dr Suess reference) but its not that... Well it is, but it's different. There's a whole other life out there that I have to experience. It could be worse, or better, I don't know. If it get's worse I'll just come back, but if I never try it I'll never know.
On April 16 2012 13:44 Durak wrote:
Edit: Oh, and obviously you'll get better ping. I don't think that should impact your decision though.
I dunno man, do you know how frustrating it is to not be able to land key spells like ravage and frostbite in time due to lag as a support in dota2? Let alone have access to u.s.e in-house leagues which are unplayable from aus. It sounds nerdy, and it is, but it just means there are more opportunities and less frustration when it comes to online games which is a huge hobby of mine.
On April 15 2012 16:55 ElMeanYo wrote:
No one has mentioned the taxes yet.
And thanks for bringing it up, I looked in to it, it seems liveable. And why do people always throw socialist in with nanny-state?
"I believe Socialism is the grandest theory ever presented, and I am sure it will someday rule the world. Then we will have attained the Millennium.… Then men will be content to work for the general welfare and share their riches with their neighbors.”
-Andrew Carnegie
I wish I had the time to reply to more posts, so many good points being brought up, things to think about etc...
edit: That being said I printed out my passport application, just going to get a friend at work to sign it :D Once that's done I can apply for the visa. I can't stop thinking about this idea, whoever the girl at the party was I think that was just the catalyst for the thought. Nothing said so far has really turned me off it (the weather will be an interesting change). People have just made me realise it just requires that I bring a bit more money, and make sure I'm organised, not only with stuff here. But for when I get to Canada too.
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Well, as a person that was born and raised in Toronto Canada and have lived in Melbourne for 2 years. My personal feeling is that Melbourne is WAY BETTER. Since I lived for only 2 years in one city, it doesn't make me an expert on Austrialia culture or anything. This is more a comparison of Toronto vs Melbourne than anything else, I am not sure where you are in Australia at the moment so I don't know how helpful my comments will be.
A few observations and personal opinions
Torontotians are generally as a whole, not nice. I actually found the people of Melbourne to be a lot nicer. (I was in Melbourne as a 'Mormon' missionary so I talked to people every moment I could on public transportation or on the street. The general sense I got was that the people of Melbourne were relaxed, friendly and easy to strike up a conversations with. In toronto that is a LOT harder. I tried doing the same thing here and people look at you if you are crazy, maybe it's because I don't wear a missionary tag anymore but I do think there is a different mentality here. Toronto's metropolis population is about the same as Melbourne's so I can't say these differences are the result of urbanization.
Toronto is a lot more muliticultural, you have people from everywhere here. From my observations, the population in Melbourne was either white, oriental or from aboriginal descent, very few black and brown. Toronto is a true melting pot of the world, and how nice people can be heavily influenced by their cultural background.
Toronto's weather is depressing.... compared to Australia's. My trip to Australia ended 5 years ago and I still dream of living there. I miss the sunshine and the palm trees in winter. Most of the months in Toronto are cold and depressing. Toronto is also less green, with fewer parks, trees and in a general sense a lot more dirty than Melbourne's. Trams, (called street cars here) look much older and the city itself just doesn't look as modern.
I hear that the minimum wage in Australia is much higher than Canada's while the costs of living is slightly higher. So that is one thing you might want to consider. You probably would be making less here while expending approximately the same kinda $$.
Finally if I was to choose a place to live, I would go with Australia. Come for a visit, see how it is then you will see how it is really like.
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Well, if you are moving to Canada, it will be either Vancouver or Toronto. I have never lived in Van, so I cannot give you advice, but the place is crazy expensive, so good luck with that.
If you live in Toronto, the mega city of Canada, you may find many things you might not like here. First of all, VERY multicultural, and you will feel like you are in Shanghai or New Delhi. As the poster above said, it truly is a cultural melting pot, and as a result, religions as well. LOTS of muslims, christians, and jews in Toronto. If you go to Dundas Square, which is pretty much the core of downtown Toronto, you will see Christian and Muslim group preaching like everyday in public. I don't understand how there has not been any known physical conflicts...
Downtown condos and apartments are very expensive and overpriced. The housing market has NOT gone down for now 12 years in a row, and a LOT of Middle Eastern wealthy oilers/Chinese buy lots of houses/condos here. There are condos being built EVERYWHERE and very expensive. The prices will probably and hopefully go down soon..
The tax is very high, but you get a very good medical services here. OF course, you will have to wait couple months to do anything. Toronto makes it's money from parking and speed tickets, so gotta be careful when driving here and parking in places. there are all kinds of parking signs and rules and a good example is a new sign they implemented secretly front of my apartment, where one day they posted up - Right turn at red light before 9 AM is forbidden - and every morning there are 2 police cars parked secretly behind a tree waiting for right turn drivers.
Travelling really depends on what kind of job you have. If you have no vision of your life in your 30's or 40's, raising children and etc, then by all means, live your life and travel. However, with living expense really high, the maximum amount of time you can travel while making good enough money to support a family is at max 1 month. People working in government organizations (best benefits and good pay) get only 5 weeks of vacation in their 20+ years of working. If you are younger, that reduces to 2-3 weeks.
So, if your main idea of coming here is to travel and have fun, think it over. Enjoying life is great, but travelling all over the world while working and saving up money for children's educational costs + paying rent/or buying condo + owning a car = impossible. That is, unless you are like at least a director level at a company.
Edit: I should also note that Toronto has THE WORST Public transportation system of any major cities in the world. This stupid city's council and public transportation organization is so stupid that they would prefer to build a street car to clog the already busy streets and kill their economy instead of building subway lines where it is really necessary. Probably the only city in the world that prefers street car OVER subway... ridiculous! (And I am paying my tax for this garbage, so if you don't want your tax money gone to something absolutely dreadful, something to consider too!)
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As far as all this "Canadians are nice", "Australians are nice" stuff goes?
In my admittedly limited experience, people really like and are nice to foreigners who speak the same language. The locals want to impress the foreigner and make them feel good about the country, and there is no real communication barrier.
I mean, except when you guys try to say the word "pawn". "I found it at the pawn store." Cracks me up every time.
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If you come to British Columbia, you need to bring cash. Its crazy expensive here.
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EPT
