• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 11:01
CEST 17:01
KST 00:01
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S Season 1 - RO12 Group A: Rogue, Percival, Solar, Zoun11[ASL21] Ro8 Preview Pt1: Inheritors16[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt2: All Star10Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists22[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Fresh Flow9
Community News
2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers25Maestros of the Game 2 announced92026 GSL Tour plans announced15Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail1MaNa leaves Team Liquid25
StarCraft 2
General
Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists Code S Season 1 - RO12 Group A: Rogue, Percival, Solar, Zoun Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool MaNa leaves Team Liquid Maestros of the Game 2 announced
Tourneys
GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) SC2 INu's Battles#15 <BO.9 2Matches> WardiTV Spring Cup RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event SEL Masters #6 - Solar vs Classic (SC: Evo)
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 523 Firewall Mutation # 522 Flip My Base Mutation # 521 Memorable Boss
Brood War
General
Data needed Pros React To: Leta vs Tulbo (ASL S21, Ro.8) ASL21 General Discussion [TOOL] Starcraft Chat Translator JaeDong's ASL S21 Ro16 Post-Review
Tourneys
Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Ro8 Day 2 [ASL21] Ro8 Day 1
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Any training maps people recommend?
Other Games
General Games
Daigo vs Menard Best of 10 Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Dawn of War IV Diablo IV
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread 3D technology/software discussion Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
streaming software Strange computer issues (software) [G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Sexual Health Of Gamers
TrAiDoS
lurker extra damage testi…
StaticNine
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2398 users

I just can't comprehend it. - Page 2

Blogs > Zealos
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 All
Hesmyrr
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Canada5776 Posts
March 20 2012 17:51 GMT
#21
All the story about people breaking stuff in rage makes me wince in terror.
How filthy rich are you bastards QQ
"If watching the MSL finals makes you a progamer, then anyone in Korea can do it." - Ha Tae Ki
Kasha_Not_Kesha
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
United States71 Posts
March 20 2012 20:06 GMT
#22
Gold League Zerg here. It sounds like you're too focused on playing the perfect, beautiful, pro-style macro game, and you're ignoring the obvious fact that SCII isn't a game of economies, it's a game of war.

You don't win by saturating your natural faster than your opponent, or out-droning him, or by mining out the whole map.

You win by killing your opponent.

On March 20 2012 05:24 Zealos wrote:
[Lost] after getting cannon rushed. Play the same guy today, and he follows my drones round wherever they go so he can lay his little balls of fun to destroy any hope of expanding. Anywhere.


1-base All-in. If he's doing that extensive a cheese, a 1-base push will meet negligible resistance. If he's following your drones around wherever they go and dropping pylons and/or cannons, his base is going to be empty when you stroll in with a few lings. Or 6 Roaches.

I love getting cannon rushed in ZvP, because every fortification he throws down to stop me from expanding is a fortification he won't have to defend against my fast Roach push, or my Nydus attack, or my Zergling all-in.

I feel like roaches literally can't damage his little ball of lasery goodness.


Roaches aren't a good DPS unit, they're a good massable tank unit. To put this into perspective for you, Roaches barely have more DPS than Zerglings. It's something like 7.2:8. Roaches are high burst damage, low DPS. Good for focusing down a small number of high health units. They're good at pushing through a death-wall (literally a wall created due to death. Zerglings quickly run into a death wall when attacking into a Terran base that is fortified with siege tanks).

But Roaches aren't the end-all be-all counter to Protoss; they're actually countered pretty well by Stalkers. Roaches are an early-game solution for 1-1.5 base warpgate pushes, not the hard counter for Colossus-Stalker deathballs.

The easiest solution is throwing in some Hydralisks; very high DPS Zerg ranged units. They're [supposed] to do damage, Roaches are supposed to tank.

He only needs 2 voids to stop me from putting ANY pressure on till I have spire tech


False; build a Hydralisk den. There's more to ZvP than Roach-Muta (or whatever Air unit you're going for). Hydralisks don't take too long to produce, do WAY more DPS than Mutalisks, and are a much better response to a deathball-centric Protoss than Mutalisks could ever be. A Spire takes 200/200, and 100 seconds to build. A Hydralisk Den takes 100/100, and 40 seconds to build. If you want to put pressure on your opponents during that mid-game period, Spire is the last thing you want. Spire tech is really best in the Late-Game; your mid-game options via Spire are basically Mutalisks.

Mutalisks do a staggering 5.9 DPS. They're worse than Zerglings at any sort of engagement. They're your mid-game Spire unit. You obviously can't directly engage a Protoss army with that kind of DPS, and you can't put pressure on a competent Protoss with that shit, and if he sees that you're committing a lot to your Mutalisks, he can pretty confidently just A-move to your main and kill you; there's no way you have the units or tech to handle his army if you're going to Mutalisks.

and after a pool, 3 hatch, I can tell you that is very late


Your tech should only be late if you don't tech at all until you're fully saturated on 3-base, which you should lose for doing regardless. If you must play a macro game vs. Protoss, do it intelligently and tech up while droning up.

letting him take his third, and as I'm sure a lot of zerg's can sympathize, once the toss gets a third base, it feels like a slow descent into an inevitable doom.


By the time a Protoss feels safe getting a third, I should be fully saturated on three bases, expanding to my 4th (and oftentimes my 5th as well) and I should be somewhere between 140-200 supply. If he takes his third sooner than that he's vulnerable to a big push from me as long as I scout it. If he takes his third then, I'll usually just push anyway, as I can quickly remax and attack again, teching up to get my end-game units/tech while doing so.
Human beings are literally made up of potential more than anything else.
Bunn
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Estonia934 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-20 22:07:14
March 20 2012 22:04 GMT
#23
You should take a short break from the game, and get your mind cleared.

You said that you have tried Stephano's style, but obviously you've done it wrong. Stephano doesn't lose to a few void rays, instead he builds some extra queens or spores. If you don't want to die, you MUST scout. Scouting is the key for zerg success. Other things you should do, is harrasment with your lings and denying bases.

I was in the same mindset at you for a while, but after taking a break from it for few weeks, I more focused and calm(in the game). Also, don't forget to go outside every day, or you'll brain will just stop working.

//Forgot to mention that if you crush the P's first timing attack, your chances of winning are well over 50%
"There are no limits. There are plateaus, but you must not stay there, you must go beyond them. If it kills you, it kills you. A man must constantly exceed his level." - Bruce Lee
Frostfire
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States419 Posts
March 20 2012 22:16 GMT
#24
High diamond Zerg here. I understand how you feel. Vs Toss I feel I can get the early and mid game down easy with a few spines and roach ling festor. The part that makes me incredibly mad is lategame when they can switch from mass air (causing me to make corruptors) back into mass ground (which causes me to morph to broods) and then back into mass air. It makes me so upset because I cant use any of my broodlords at all. Protoss is easy in the beginning for me but lategame, it's incredibly hard. The worst part is when after they go back to mass air, in the big engagement they put a DT at every expo.
"In solitude, we are least alone"
Prev 1 2 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
OSC
13:00
King of the Hill #246
WardiTV630
TKL 285
Liquipedia
INu's Battles
11:00
INu's Battles#15
SHIN vs ByuNLIVE!
IntoTheiNu 1024
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Serral 1646
TKL 285
Hui .189
trigger 80
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 37269
Calm 5519
Sea 2350
Mini 672
Shuttle 468
firebathero 452
EffOrt 446
Light 404
Hyuk 378
BeSt 360
[ Show more ]
ggaemo 255
Leta 178
actioN 151
Dewaltoss 125
Hyun 114
hero 100
ToSsGirL 79
Killer 73
Sharp 70
Hm[arnc] 63
Pusan 62
[sc1f]eonzerg 48
Free 48
yabsab 24
Rock 20
Barracks 18
scan(afreeca) 17
910 16
Shine 16
zelot 14
GoRush 12
Terrorterran 11
Sacsri 11
IntoTheRainbow 11
SilentControl 10
JulyZerg 7
Dota 2
Gorgc4602
qojqva1756
monkeys_forever282
syndereN214
Other Games
singsing2341
B2W.Neo1104
hiko890
DeMusliM386
crisheroes284
Grubby192
ArmadaUGS85
Rex40
QueenE39
Trikslyr13
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream78
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 11
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Adnapsc2 8
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• escodisco3896
• Michael_bg 2
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis4228
• TFBlade1676
Other Games
• WagamamaTV274
Upcoming Events
Big Brain Bouts
59m
Replay Cast
8h 59m
Replay Cast
17h 59m
RSL Revival
18h 59m
Classic vs GgMaChine
Rogue vs Maru
WardiTV Invitational
19h 59m
IPSL
1d
Ret vs Art_Of_Turtle
Radley vs TBD
BSL
1d 3h
Replay Cast
1d 8h
RSL Revival
1d 18h
herO vs TriGGeR
NightMare vs Solar
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 22h
[ Show More ]
BSL
2 days
IPSL
2 days
eOnzErG vs TBD
G5 vs Nesh
Patches Events
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Jaedong vs Light
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
Afreeca Starleague
3 days
Snow vs Flash
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
GSL
4 days
Classic vs Cure
Maru vs Rogue
GSL
5 days
SHIN vs Zoun
ByuN vs herO
Replay Cast
6 days
Escore
6 days
The PondCast
6 days
WardiTV Invitational
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-04-30
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
Escore Tournament S2: W5
KK 2v2 League Season 1
StarCraft2 Community Team League 2026 Spring
2026 GSL S1
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026

Upcoming

Acropolis #4
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Maestros of the Game 2
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.