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Terran were doing marine scv all in since day 1, Naniwa just showed the new toss metagame, probe and nothing else rush! trolololol
Koreans as usual have no sense of what sports are all about, it's normal that a person will underperform in a tournament if his previous games were completely shit, see football worldcups, or any other sport you wanna mention, teams will do this shit and so will single players. Plus as Naniwa said, he could've just 4gated or double proxy gate some cheese action and lose anyway, instead he decided to just worker rush same deal same result.
Stop whining moralists, Naniwa deserves to be where he is cause when it counts he plays his A game, the games he played before the Nestea game prove it as he went heads to heads every game.
To the Koreans players who said "disrespectful to who couldnt participate to the tournament", F**K off and practice harder so maybe next time if you don't suck you might be there instead of wasting time minding about other ppl's actions!
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On December 13 2011 23:54 Pehrfect wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:41 BadgerBadger8264 wrote:
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What he did is in no way good for starcraft or the GSL. By worker rushing he flat out disrespected his fans.
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Should it really be up to the players to always try to do what's "good for starcraft or the GSL"? I can agree that this was probably not good for GOM/GSL, but in an international tournament like this, maybe GOM should have considered not showing games that don't matter in case something like this would happen.
they probably thought that with all the drama and "rivalry" between nani and nestea that the story behind the game was worth showing it..
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How he played doesn't change anything. Don't get you panties in a bunch.
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On December 13 2011 23:53 Femari wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:48 Waterflow wrote:On December 13 2011 23:44 Angel_ wrote:On December 13 2011 23:38 MildSeven wrote:
Understanding this from the Korean perspective, what Naniwa did was absolutely taboo, because of the long Korean tradition and emphasis on trying your best even when it didn't affect results. Consider this, what would Boxer or NaDa do, look at HerO as well, trying his hardest even though he ended up 0-4 anyways. I personally can understand the rationale behind Naniwa's move, but if we look at this from a broader scope of what Esports means to the Korean culture, what the integrity of each game is to them, then this is more serious than it seems.
I think it's also really sad many people here replied things such as "fuck esports mainstream bullshit", or "are you mad?" (to those who frown upon Naniwa's actions) and supporting Naniwa's actions in the most cliche "he's so badass, i am so counter-culture for supporting him"-attitude. I for one really enjoying each and every game, even when not much is on the line, because when I watch the GSL, i usually know for a fact that players do try even when nothing much is on the line. Like MC fighting his little heart out against DRG even though he would have gone through either way.
Beyond this, It's silly to argue with fanboys for naniwa, just like it was silly to argue with any other fanboy to see things rationally. But aside from that, there is a standard for professionalism. And it's a standard that in general, koreans take very very seriously. It's something I wish we took as seriously. All the people defending such actions...I don't understand. That doesn't mean anyone should really go out of their way just to badmouth someone ever, but to defend his actions and behavior either shows a lot of willful blindness, or a completely different view on how "serious" and legitimate esports is trying to be. Then maybe the organizers should think about not making the players have to play a match that is totally pointless for the players since it doesn't lead to any advancement for any of the players. That's exactly what it is. Pointless. A fight for nothing. Maybe Naniwa shouldn't agree to those terms then.
And what term that he agreed on did he break???? Can you link me the rule that state you are not alowed to worker rush?
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Im gonna clear some things up before im done for today ^^
1. I love South-Korea and the people. (except for the jackasses talking smack about naniwa).
2. I can understand why some naniwa fans who are not as hardcore of a fan as i am can get dissapointed by NaNiwa's decision to just throw that game.
3. But for god sake........ don't jump @ his personality. It was a game that didn't matter since it was pointless. You should know that NaNiwa has a huge winning ego (when there's something to fight for).
He gets in his gaming-mode and does whatever he wants. It has nothing to do with what he's like in real life etc. Because in real life he's not in game-mode where all he cares about is winning. So don't judge the guy so hard. People are being way to hatefull on him as a person here.
You don't actually know him irl. I don't eighter. But i have enough iq to not judge him from behind a monitor.
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NaNiwa best Toss in world, Koreans are just hypocrites
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On December 13 2011 23:56 romanov wrote:
MC just posted this:
오늘 경기를 보고 할말을 잃었다 정말 프로라는 단어를 알기는 하는걸까 나의 프로패셔널 마인드의 롤모델은 화이트라 아저씨다. 팬들을 정말 사랑하며 정말 끝까지 경기를 포기하지않고 모든사람에게 친절하다. 화이트라 아저씨를 싫어하는사람이 있을까?
Edit this to:
나니와가 화이트라 아저씨를 보고 좀 마인드를 바꿨으면 좋겠다. 상대방 생각도안하고 그런식의 행동은 올바르지 않다고생각한다. 만약 내가 3승0패 1위진출확정이고 나니와가 0승3패인데 난 어차피 1위니까 너랑 게임 안해라고 하고 시작하자마자 gg치면
2nd edit ^^:
자신의 기분이 어떨지는 생각했으면 좋겠다. 뭐 돈이 안걸려있으니까 상관없다라고하면 더이상 해줄말은 없다 그냥 너는 프로가 아니다라는 말만 해주고싶을뿐. 나니와를 보며 어제 지고나서 정말 분해하던 현덕이형이 정말 멋있게 느껴질뿐이다.
Anybody that can translate?
Say you lost the game today to see to know what the word really pro's that tell of my professional mind is Mr. Sandy Trapani rolmodeleun whiteboards. I really love the fans and the game does not give up until the end is kind to everyone. Travelers who do not like Uncle whiteboards?
Travelers came to see Uncle Henry and the whiteboards to be updated I'd mind. Design and conduct that kind of person I think that is not correct. I ^ 3 1 0 L is defined output wijin Naniwa 0 W 3 paeinde I called anyway and do not start a game with you as soon as winikka hit gg
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On December 13 2011 23:57 aderum wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:53 Femari wrote:On December 13 2011 23:48 Waterflow wrote:On December 13 2011 23:44 Angel_ wrote:On December 13 2011 23:38 MildSeven wrote:
Understanding this from the Korean perspective, what Naniwa did was absolutely taboo, because of the long Korean tradition and emphasis on trying your best even when it didn't affect results. Consider this, what would Boxer or NaDa do, look at HerO as well, trying his hardest even though he ended up 0-4 anyways. I personally can understand the rationale behind Naniwa's move, but if we look at this from a broader scope of what Esports means to the Korean culture, what the integrity of each game is to them, then this is more serious than it seems.
I think it's also really sad many people here replied things such as "fuck esports mainstream bullshit", or "are you mad?" (to those who frown upon Naniwa's actions) and supporting Naniwa's actions in the most cliche "he's so badass, i am so counter-culture for supporting him"-attitude. I for one really enjoying each and every game, even when not much is on the line, because when I watch the GSL, i usually know for a fact that players do try even when nothing much is on the line. Like MC fighting his little heart out against DRG even though he would have gone through either way.
Beyond this, It's silly to argue with fanboys for naniwa, just like it was silly to argue with any other fanboy to see things rationally. But aside from that, there is a standard for professionalism. And it's a standard that in general, koreans take very very seriously. It's something I wish we took as seriously. All the people defending such actions...I don't understand. That doesn't mean anyone should really go out of their way just to badmouth someone ever, but to defend his actions and behavior either shows a lot of willful blindness, or a completely different view on how "serious" and legitimate esports is trying to be. Then maybe the organizers should think about not making the players have to play a match that is totally pointless for the players since it doesn't lead to any advancement for any of the players. That's exactly what it is. Pointless. A fight for nothing. Maybe Naniwa shouldn't agree to those terms then. And what term that he agreed on did he break???? Can you link me the rule that state you are not alowed to worker rush?
I'm talking about the whole playing pointless matches thing. If he feels like he doesn't have to play a pointless match, which he has since stated in the post match interview, he shouldn't agree to play all the matches no matter what the result.
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Fuck choya
User was temp banned for this post.
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I don't get the big deal...
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On December 13 2011 23:59 BananaMann wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:56 romanov wrote:
MC just posted this:
오늘 경기를 보고 할말을 잃었다 정말 프로라는 단어를 알기는 하는걸까 나의 프로패셔널 마인드의 롤모델은 화이트라 아저씨다. 팬들을 정말 사랑하며 정말 끝까지 경기를 포기하지않고 모든사람에게 친절하다. 화이트라 아저씨를 싫어하는사람이 있을까?
Edit this to:
나니와가 화이트라 아저씨를 보고 좀 마인드를 바꿨으면 좋겠다. 상대방 생각도안하고 그런식의 행동은 올바르지 않다고생각한다. 만약 내가 3승0패 1위진출확정이고 나니와가 0승3패인데 난 어차피 1위니까 너랑 게임 안해라고 하고 시작하자마자 gg치면
2nd edit ^^:
자신의 기분이 어떨지는 생각했으면 좋겠다. 뭐 돈이 안걸려있으니까 상관없다라고하면 더이상 해줄말은 없다 그냥 너는 프로가 아니다라는 말만 해주고싶을뿐. 나니와를 보며 어제 지고나서 정말 분해하던 현덕이형이 정말 멋있게 느껴질뿐이다.
Anybody that can translate? Say you lost the game today to see to know what the word really pro's that tell of my professional mind is Mr. Sandy Trapani rolmodeleun whiteboards. I really love the fans and the game does not give up until the end is kind to everyone. Travelers who do not like Uncle whiteboards? Travelers came to see Uncle Henry and the whiteboards to be updated I'd mind. Design and conduct that kind of person I think that is not correct. I ^ 3 1 0 L is defined output wijin Naniwa 0 W 3 paeinde I called anyway and do not start a game with you as soon as winikka hit gg
Thank you for google translating, I never thought of that before...
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On December 13 2011 23:59 BananaMann wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:56 romanov wrote:
MC just posted this:
오늘 경기를 보고 할말을 잃었다 정말 프로라는 단어를 알기는 하는걸까 나의 프로패셔널 마인드의 롤모델은 화이트라 아저씨다. 팬들을 정말 사랑하며 정말 끝까지 경기를 포기하지않고 모든사람에게 친절하다. 화이트라 아저씨를 싫어하는사람이 있을까?
Edit this to:
나니와가 화이트라 아저씨를 보고 좀 마인드를 바꿨으면 좋겠다. 상대방 생각도안하고 그런식의 행동은 올바르지 않다고생각한다. 만약 내가 3승0패 1위진출확정이고 나니와가 0승3패인데 난 어차피 1위니까 너랑 게임 안해라고 하고 시작하자마자 gg치면
2nd edit ^^:
자신의 기분이 어떨지는 생각했으면 좋겠다. 뭐 돈이 안걸려있으니까 상관없다라고하면 더이상 해줄말은 없다 그냥 너는 프로가 아니다라는 말만 해주고싶을뿐. 나니와를 보며 어제 지고나서 정말 분해하던 현덕이형이 정말 멋있게 느껴질뿐이다.
Anybody that can translate? Say you lost the game today to see to know what the word really pro's that tell of my professional mind is Mr. Sandy Trapani rolmodeleun whiteboards. I really love the fans and the game does not give up until the end is kind to everyone. Travelers who do not like Uncle whiteboards? Travelers came to see Uncle Henry and the whiteboards to be updated I'd mind. Design and conduct that kind of person I think that is not correct. I ^ 3 1 0 L is defined output wijin Naniwa 0 W 3 paeinde I called anyway and do not start a game with you as soon as winikka hit gg
jesus
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United Kingdom20326 Posts
I dont understand what the big deal is, r/starcraft etc has like 50 posts about this... He probe rushed in a game that didnt matter, so what? They were both out anyway
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On December 13 2011 23:49 BadgerBadger8264 wrote:Show nested quote +I as Naniwa fan dont feel offended at all. I think only ones offended in this whole history are Nestea fans. And only because Naniwa didnt give them chance to gloat how Nestea is awesome by wining against Nestea (if he would have won).
Honestly i dont like Korean culture. For me its full of bullshit hidden behind tradition. It's cool that you don't feel "offended", but he is still dissapointing a lot of people. A lot of other (deserving) pro gamers could be in this high profile tournament instead of Naniwa and a lot of people paid or stayed up late to watch him play, and he's disrespecting every single one of those people. Regardless of if you feel "offended", you would've rather seen him play out his game and it's simply unprofessional not to do this. And good job on shitting on an entire culture in one sentence. But don't worry, I personally don't feel offended by you offending Korean culture, so because one person doesn't it's probably alright.
Honestly I have mixed feelings about this whole match. For one I am a bit disappointed that I didn´t get to see them play, but at the same time if you are a fan of Naniwa you are a fan of his desire to be the best at all costs. He wants to win when it matters ergo he can be very tilted when he loses. If he feels that they won´t play at their best since noone has anything to lose or win then in Naniwas tilted eyes there is no point.
If GOM would have been smart about it they would atleast let them play before the group play. All players agree BO1 is frustrating, then add the frustration of beeing "cheezed" out in all of your games and then be forced to play a showmatch.
I am biased as I am a fan of Naniwa since I think his play at the MLGs with the FF and decision making was flawless. On top of that I fukking hate short cheeze games no matter who played and who won/lost. When anyone(including koreans) cheezes to a fast win I feel disappointed but hey noone is ever complaining about rock scissor paper. Would it have been so much more fullfilling if let´s say Nestea would have 6 pooled Naniwa for the win instead of Naniwa prushing with probes? According to alot of people here that would be fully acceptable and not BM/disrespect although I find it f'ing disgusting.
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@oGsMC
After watching today's games I lost all words. Does he know the meaning of the word "pro". The role model for my professional mindset is Mr. WhiteRa. He really loves his fans and never gives up and is nice to everyone. Is there anyone that hates WhiteRa? I hope Naniwa can look at WhiteRa and change his mindset a bit. He doesn't even think about his opponent and in my opinion that sort of behaviour isn't right. If I had 3 wins and 0 losses and was already guaranteed first place while Naniwa was at 0 wins and 3 losses I wonder what he'd think if I just gg'ed out straight away since I'm already 1st and don't want to play him. If he says it doesn't matter because there's no money on the line then I don't think there's anything else I could say except that you are not a pro. After seeing what Naniwa did it makes me think that HerO who was really disappointed in himself after losing is a really amazing person.
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I realy cant believe that naniwa did that i know he has some manner problems, but this this is just stupit actually u can clearly say that bronse league players would of had a better chance there cause i mean WHAT .... speechless!
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On December 13 2011 23:55 See.Blue wrote:
I love how its only <500 post count-ers who are the ones who connect with Nani's behavior and as such are trying desperately to deflect from/justify it lol
Yes, because post count is highly relevant and gives your opinions way more substance.
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On December 13 2011 23:48 Waterflow wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:44 Angel_ wrote:On December 13 2011 23:38 MildSeven wrote:
Understanding this from the Korean perspective, what Naniwa did was absolutely taboo, because of the long Korean tradition and emphasis on trying your best even when it didn't affect results. Consider this, what would Boxer or NaDa do, look at HerO as well, trying his hardest even though he ended up 0-4 anyways. I personally can understand the rationale behind Naniwa's move, but if we look at this from a broader scope of what Esports means to the Korean culture, what the integrity of each game is to them, then this is more serious than it seems.
I think it's also really sad many people here replied things such as "fuck esports mainstream bullshit", or "are you mad?" (to those who frown upon Naniwa's actions) and supporting Naniwa's actions in the most cliche "he's so badass, i am so counter-culture for supporting him"-attitude. I for one really enjoying each and every game, even when not much is on the line, because when I watch the GSL, i usually know for a fact that players do try even when nothing much is on the line. Like MC fighting his little heart out against DRG even though he would have gone through either way.
Beyond this, It's silly to argue with fanboys for naniwa, just like it was silly to argue with any other fanboy to see things rationally. But aside from that, there is a standard for professionalism. And it's a standard that in general, koreans take very very seriously. It's something I wish we took as seriously. All the people defending such actions...I don't understand. That doesn't mean anyone should really go out of their way just to badmouth someone ever, but to defend his actions and behavior either shows a lot of willful blindness, or a completely different view on how "serious" and legitimate esports is trying to be. Then maybe the organizers should think about not making the players have to play a match that is totally pointless for the players since it doesn't lead to any advancement for any of the players. That's exactly what it is. Pointless. A fight for nothing.
You really think that a match that's technically pointless where he had the chance to overcome nestea in a real game and show that he was capable of giving his best even though it was pointless....
is nothing?
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and you're seriously blaming the organizers a player being a shit?
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Kennigit Americans saying it hasn't happened in NBA/NFL. This happened in premiere league though - thanks @Ingebrigtsen93 http://t.co/wxklNgxL
really great tweet from kenningit
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On December 14 2011 00:04 Angel_ wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:48 Waterflow wrote:On December 13 2011 23:44 Angel_ wrote:On December 13 2011 23:38 MildSeven wrote:
Understanding this from the Korean perspective, what Naniwa did was absolutely taboo, because of the long Korean tradition and emphasis on trying your best even when it didn't affect results. Consider this, what would Boxer or NaDa do, look at HerO as well, trying his hardest even though he ended up 0-4 anyways. I personally can understand the rationale behind Naniwa's move, but if we look at this from a broader scope of what Esports means to the Korean culture, what the integrity of each game is to them, then this is more serious than it seems.
I think it's also really sad many people here replied things such as "fuck esports mainstream bullshit", or "are you mad?" (to those who frown upon Naniwa's actions) and supporting Naniwa's actions in the most cliche "he's so badass, i am so counter-culture for supporting him"-attitude. I for one really enjoying each and every game, even when not much is on the line, because when I watch the GSL, i usually know for a fact that players do try even when nothing much is on the line. Like MC fighting his little heart out against DRG even though he would have gone through either way.
Beyond this, It's silly to argue with fanboys for naniwa, just like it was silly to argue with any other fanboy to see things rationally. But aside from that, there is a standard for professionalism. And it's a standard that in general, koreans take very very seriously. It's something I wish we took as seriously. All the people defending such actions...I don't understand. That doesn't mean anyone should really go out of their way just to badmouth someone ever, but to defend his actions and behavior either shows a lot of willful blindness, or a completely different view on how "serious" and legitimate esports is trying to be. Then maybe the organizers should think about not making the players have to play a match that is totally pointless for the players since it doesn't lead to any advancement for any of the players. That's exactly what it is. Pointless. A fight for nothing. You really think that a match that's technically pointless where he had the chance to overcome nestea in a real game and show that he was capable of giving his best even though it was pointless.... is nothing? - and you're seriously blaming the organizers a player being a shit?
It was a showmatch. Same things happens at MLG - or did with the old format - in groupstages.
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EPT
