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On October 30 2011 03:09 alexhard wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2011 03:02 Woony wrote:On October 30 2011 02:59 Talin wrote:On October 30 2011 02:54 alexhard wrote:On October 30 2011 02:48 Dakota wrote:
I'm pretty sure everyone that is even somewhat-famous in the e-sports scene gets the same bad criticism from the same shitty people. I know its hard, but just try to ignore them, and know that the vast majority of people in the community respect and love what you do for SC2. The top reply on reddit is by djwheat. Is he one of the "the same shitty people" you're talking about? Because his criticism was right on the spot and, unlike the original troll post, well articulated and inoffensive. Are we talking about this post? I love how you are so passionate and intimate about the BW scene and what is stands for. But your ongoing attacks towards any non-BW related eSports is quite frankly fucking bullshit. You disrespect every gamer who has participated in eSports for the past 13 years.
You act as if no one else ever even cared about another game. That other gamers didn't put blood, sweat, and tears into their game of choice.
You claim that BW is the only eSport, but I think eSports is the thousands of gamers (whether they play CS, Carom 3D, BW, WC3, Street Fighter, etc) who have a level of passion for the game that transcends what's normal. The same gamers who compete on the highest tier of their level.
You just said fuck you to Justin Wong and Daigo.
You just said fuck you to Zero4 and Tox1c.
You just said fuck you to cArn and Frod.
How can you say fuck you to the legends who have put just as much of an effort into their game as someone like Flash or Jaedong? It's pretty much a direct attack, it has nothing to do with anything Milkis wrote in his post and Milkis' post didn't imply any of that at all. His post was straight up inflammatory and an invitation to the lynch mob to go to work. Yes, it was somewhat inflammatory, but what do you except when you make a such a controversial post at a place that doesnt share your opinion? As I said, it's like making a post on TL about how Starcraft is inferior to Counterstrike. But Milkis' post didn't simply say that all other games are inferior to BW (such an opinion I could actually understand). What he said was that the professionals who play any game other than BW are not actually sportsmen/women, and that those activities are not esports. Because the composition of the audience is different.
That's not actually what he said but the audience part is still a fair point
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Well, this sucks. You were a great translator. The only thing I ever really had a problem with was the way you just started to throw out info in the EG/Puma fiasco and never even looked at EG for anything. Then you got pissed when Alex blamed part of the fervor on you. But I've accepted that that's probably just me applying a code of journalism to a community that doesn't want it yet, and that's my bad.
More important thing in here though, is look at this guys. He's one of the only consistent translators that will translate tweets for us and Korean articles and stuff like that. Whatever happened to the "best community in the world" that you guys keep calling yourselves? Oh, yeah. It's a "great community" until I go into a justin.tv chat/LR thread/or anywhere that anyone said anything even remotely controversial. That's right. Silly me.
Also, Milkis, you can't interact with this community unless you have thicker skin. Being that elitist about BW, to the point of belligerence, is silly. You said yourself that you knew people wouldn't agree with you. What do people on the internet do when they don't agree with you? They start bitching. And those bitches turn into ad hominem, into overreaction, and into straight out, full retard statements.
I've been teasing threads in SC2 general with people that complain because battle.net kiddies called them a fag or hated on them for playing Terran. C'mon. They not only got onto the internet, they got onto battle.net, a playground full of teenagers. You not only tried to (knowingly) shit on every esport game that's not BW, you tried to do it without people getting irrationally pissed. And that's not going to happen here. It just won't.
Everyone should click on "Liquid Team News," look at the recent player posts, and read the first post Tyler posted in this thread. It's essentially "you gotta say these kinds of things better." And that's exactly right.
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Haha, you have my sympathy. I feel like I'm very similar to you, in that I have a thin skin. And the comments on this thread makes me feel bad for you. If I were in this situation I would never come back to eSports, haha.
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makes you think about the "great, friendly and awesome" sc2 community :<
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I appreciate everything you've done as far as translating and helping MLG, and I hope that whatever you choose to do in the future you are successful.
That being said your reddit post directly attacked what many individuals outside of BW have been working so hard for. You chose very poor wording and basically mocked the hours that every other professional gamer has put into their respective game.
Instead of playing victim, learn from your mistakes and move on, don't choose the poor me route, it will get you nowhere.
edit: And people calling djwheat's reply to milkis' reddit post should read the context and decide for themselves, I for one am glad he stood up for esports.
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I'm actually a speech therapist and even those without a license could probably yell you were extremely nervous when you "translated." Your hand was shaking, your voice was quavering. Nothing to be ashamed of. A lot of people love you here and it's be great if you could work on your weaknesses rather than run away from them.
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On October 30 2011 03:08 Starcraftplaylist wrote:
I would guess it's a more popular opinion in the brood war forums.
Real world parallel: Don't say you are an undercover nigger at a KKK-meeting
You do understand that exact analogy (which is very accurate) proves how shit of an argument that is?
It actually justifies the ideology KKK promotes within their own circle. -_-
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Welcome to the internet. If you can't handle the attention, don't look for it.
You got your 5 seconds in the spotlight and then you took a huge shit on everybody, what do you expect? Flowers?
Bye.
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On October 30 2011 03:09 alexhard wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2011 03:02 Woony wrote:On October 30 2011 02:59 Talin wrote:On October 30 2011 02:54 alexhard wrote:On October 30 2011 02:48 Dakota wrote:
I'm pretty sure everyone that is even somewhat-famous in the e-sports scene gets the same bad criticism from the same shitty people. I know its hard, but just try to ignore them, and know that the vast majority of people in the community respect and love what you do for SC2. The top reply on reddit is by djwheat. Is he one of the "the same shitty people" you're talking about? Because his criticism was right on the spot and, unlike the original troll post, well articulated and inoffensive. Are we talking about this post? I love how you are so passionate and intimate about the BW scene and what is stands for. But your ongoing attacks towards any non-BW related eSports is quite frankly fucking bullshit. You disrespect every gamer who has participated in eSports for the past 13 years.
You act as if no one else ever even cared about another game. That other gamers didn't put blood, sweat, and tears into their game of choice.
You claim that BW is the only eSport, but I think eSports is the thousands of gamers (whether they play CS, Carom 3D, BW, WC3, Street Fighter, etc) who have a level of passion for the game that transcends what's normal. The same gamers who compete on the highest tier of their level.
You just said fuck you to Justin Wong and Daigo.
You just said fuck you to Zero4 and Tox1c.
You just said fuck you to cArn and Frod.
How can you say fuck you to the legends who have put just as much of an effort into their game as someone like Flash or Jaedong? It's pretty much a direct attack, it has nothing to do with anything Milkis wrote in his post and Milkis' post didn't imply any of that at all. His post was straight up inflammatory and an invitation to the lynch mob to go to work. Yes, it was somewhat inflammatory, but what do you except when you make a such a controversial post at a place that doesnt share your opinion? As I said, it's like making a post on TL about how Starcraft is inferior to Counterstrike. But Milkis' post didn't simply say that all other games are inferior to BW (such an opinion I could actually understand). What he said was that the professionals who play any game other than BW are not actually sportsmen/women, and that those activities are not esports. Because the composition of the audience is different.
That is incredibly inflammatory and elitist - how would a sportsperson feel if another sportsperson in a high profile sport (e.g. football or tennis) says that your activity is not a true sport.
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I'm sorry, this is plain drama queen, passive aggressive behavior. You're a big boy, learn to deal with criticism if you're going to write your opinion on the internet.
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Are you pleased you little, internet fucks!? Look at what you have done to one of the most passionate people inside e-sports community! From a person I was inspired by, from a person who showed me what you can do for others, from THE ONE who brought MKP to MLG and made us all proud of what can be done, he became someone who under all this shit you have made lost his love. I don't want to live on this world anymore.
Milkis I wish there was better world in which you could be yourself. If it isn't Starcraft community for you, please do make a change. In this day I feel shame for our community.
Hope to hear from you again. Love you.
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On October 30 2011 03:11 Kuhva wrote:
Good Job small vocal minority you are killing eSports.
Milkis you are a huge, irreplaceable asset to community I can only hope you some day give it another shot to stick two fingers up at some narrow minded haters.
He's replaceable.
I didn't really care about his post on reddit. I saw it. Wasn't offensive to me even though I didn't agree with him. Thought "well, that's gonna piss off a bunch of people and he's gonna get flak for it" so why couldn't he think that?
The problem I have is that now he's whining "oh, poor me, I'm so e-famous it has ruined my tragic life". And just yesterday he was saying "Oh I'd stream Amnesia but no one would watch it".
Drama queen. Baby. Everything everyone else has said.
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I could always tell you were just a sensitive guy, but you know what, shit happens and if you don't want to deal with it then that's fine, the SC community can be harsh, but so were you in your article. Either way hope this mulls over and you still go to MLG and stuff, grab some thick skin on the way my friend
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On October 30 2011 03:14 Baptista wrote:
Are you pleased you little, internet fucks!?
On October 30 2011 03:14 Baptista wrote:
In this day I feel shame for our community.
Hope to hear from you again. Love you.
You do understand this makes you seem like a hypocrite, right?
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Oh well :/
Thank you for all your hard work.
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He'll be back. They always come back !
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On October 30 2011 03:10 Woony wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2011 03:06 Talin wrote:On October 30 2011 03:02 Woony wrote:On October 30 2011 02:59 Talin wrote:On October 30 2011 02:54 alexhard wrote:On October 30 2011 02:48 Dakota wrote:
I'm pretty sure everyone that is even somewhat-famous in the e-sports scene gets the same bad criticism from the same shitty people. I know its hard, but just try to ignore them, and know that the vast majority of people in the community respect and love what you do for SC2. The top reply on reddit is by djwheat. Is he one of the "the same shitty people" you're talking about? Because his criticism was right on the spot and, unlike the original troll post, well articulated and inoffensive. Are we talking about this post? I love how you are so passionate and intimate about the BW scene and what is stands for. But your ongoing attacks towards any non-BW related eSports is quite frankly fucking bullshit. You disrespect every gamer who has participated in eSports for the past 13 years.
You act as if no one else ever even cared about another game. That other gamers didn't put blood, sweat, and tears into their game of choice.
You claim that BW is the only eSport, but I think eSports is the thousands of gamers (whether they play CS, Carom 3D, BW, WC3, Street Fighter, etc) who have a level of passion for the game that transcends what's normal. The same gamers who compete on the highest tier of their level.
You just said fuck you to Justin Wong and Daigo.
You just said fuck you to Zero4 and Tox1c.
You just said fuck you to cArn and Frod.
How can you say fuck you to the legends who have put just as much of an effort into their game as someone like Flash or Jaedong? It's pretty much a direct attack, it has nothing to do with anything Milkis wrote in his post and Milkis' post didn't imply any of that at all. His post was straight up inflammatory and an invitation to the lynch mob to go to work. Yes, it was somewhat inflammatory, but what do you except when you make a such a controversial post at a place that doesnt share your opinion? As I said, it's like making a post on TL about how Starcraft is inferior to Counterstrike. It wasn't somewhat inflammatory, it was straight up inflammatory. The topic of the post just isn't a good enough excuse for personal attacks. You don't like it? Then write a civil and argumented response as to why you think what he said was wrong, in the same tone that the original post was written in. Not "BOOHOO YOU SAID FUCK YOU TO EVERYONE (...not -_-), YOU MUST BURN". If nothing else, responding like that only makes you look like you don't really have an argument to make in the first place. If I make a post in the BW forum about how SC2 is way better than BW, am I going to be attacked? Yes. Does my post justify the attacks? No. Should I have seen it coming and not made that post in a place where people have a complete opposite opinion? Yes. Or, well you can make such a post but you have to be able to deal with the criticism/hate.
The thing is - you don't have to deal with it or at least you shouldn't have to deal with it.
You're only forced to deal with it because the moderation is not up to standards (or in reddit's case, non-existant).
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Taking the internet too seriously never leads to good things. On one hand, Milkis made a post full of poor arguments and got called out for it. On the other hand, some people took things too far with personal insults. The SC2 online community - like every other online community - is full of assholes and trolls. Focusing on what they think or have to say is fruitless. Can't say I'm glad to see him go, but if he's that concerned with being attacked online, perhaps the internet isn't the best place for him.
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On October 30 2011 03:08 Cozopt wrote:
I respected you and loved what you did, but now I don't.
If every big name in the community reacted to criticism by quitting then most people wouldn't exist.
Get over it, you know you're a good translator, and everyone loves what you've done.
Trolls are trolls.
What? lol
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On October 30 2011 03:13 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2011 03:08 Starcraftplaylist wrote:
I would guess it's a more popular opinion in the brood war forums.
Real world parallel: Don't say you are an undercover nigger at a KKK-meeting You do understand that exact analogy (which is very accurate) proves how shit of an argument that is? It actually justifies the ideology KKK promotes within their own circle. -_-
Well, the point isn't about how the hate is justified or not. The point is that IF YOU KNOW WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN and you still carry on, you have to able to deal with the repercussions of your actions, whether the reception you get is justified or not.
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EPT
