On October 19 2011 02:49 Chef wrote: It raises awareness, but at the same time I'm pretty sure everyone already has an opinion so there's no sense in raising awareness. It's just the kind of pretend activism people do to feel like they are doing something but really they're completely useless.
I'm pro-abortion because it reduces crime as long as you don't consider killing fetuses a crime (with mom's permission) and I don't.
So it's not like a issue like cancer or AIDs where there are people who just don't know a lot about it but would universally agree its something worth thinking about, it's an issue which is really opinionated and requires serious debate to come to a legal conclusion.
I agree that most people are aware of the issue and have formed an opinion about it, but I honestly think a lot of them have a misconception of when abortions are performed, who is having them, and how often.
Take a look at some pro-life posters. They show fully formed fetuses, or live babies, and women who look like they're at least 8 months pregnant and say "This is what you're killing! This is what's happening!" when the stats simply do not agree. The vast majority (something like 92%) of abortions occur in the first trimester and the women having them are not just random sluts who bang random dudes daily with no thought of the consequences.
People have formed plenty of opinions on the subject, but usually from sensationalist and entirely wrong information.
If everyone thought that way, no one would vote. What if every single person in the world covered their mouth with duct tape? Would you still think that wouldn't be a big deal?
My opinion is that it is no one but the parents business. Government, church, no one should be gettig into my (theoretical) wives womb.
I guess my question is where is the practicality?
Exactly,Government, church, no one should be gettig between my bullet and some human i point at.After all,she is just 20 years old reaction of two cells.
My opinion is that it is no one but the parents business. Government, church, no one should be gettig into my (theoretical) wives womb.
I guess my question is where is the practicality?
Exactly,Government, church, no one should be gettig between my bullet and some human i point at.After all,she is just 20 years old reaction of two cells.
Yeah because 2 "cells" (did you go to school?) + 20 years is the same as "2 cells" without 20 years.
On October 19 2011 00:35 unichan wrote: I hate this argument lol, other people have differing opinions on when life starts - just because the mass of cells can't feel or think or anything doesn't mean it's not alive to some people ~_~. Personally I changed my stance to neutral on this issue to avoid the shitstorm, but if you're a pro lifer on TL (or anywhere on the internet, really) you're going to have a hard time. Political discussions on the internet are dumb imo because the discussions will usually be 95% liberal
I don't know why everyone thinks the girl wearing duct tape on her mouth is stupid, she's doing something for a cause that she cares about. Even if you don't think it's effective, this thread proves that it is. It's like someone wearing an ugly jacket - if you don't like it, ignore it. It's not going to interfere with your life unless you let it.
Edit: Also I know plenty of athiest pro-lifers, it's not just some religious thing
No, it doesn't. I proves that people have opinions and it makes people think about their stance on the subject. It does not get HER point across, though. Unless she tells everyone the context (as in she silences her voice, because so many babies have had their voice silence by being aborted) it doesn't do anything to convice anyone about pro-life, all it does is stir up discussion.
Yeah, it stirred up discussion on a site of male liberals so obviously no one is going to be turned to her point of view - but what if it started discussion somewhere else where there wasn't as obvious of a bias? My point is, lay off the poor girl, she isn't doing anything wrong. Talking about abortion rights on a site of male liberals is completely pointless and is just going to cause a bunch of guys reinforcing each others views and patting each other on the back and collectively jumping on and tearing apart anyone who comes in with an opposing view.
what the fuck ? you actually know generations of women fought to get this right ? ofc what she is doing is wrong
Just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't mean they are wrong. I'm sure generations of Kim Jong Ils fought for dictatorship or whatever is going on in North Korea too, but I'm not wrong because I don't support that.
Unichan, I like you but this is easily one of the dumbest analogies I've ever read on this site. I think a lot of young women entirely take for granted the ability to control their own reproductive choices.
Anyways I do support abortion rights, but everyone should have to pay for their own abortion fully and it should be regulated - kind of like what OmniEulogy said, but more relaxed
All this does is punish poor women. Wealthy women will be able to afford the procedure, and poor women will resort of back alley abortions which are incredibly dangerous.
There are way too many misconceptions about abortion. Here is a fun video giving a look at the demographics of just who is having abortions:
My real question to people who oppose abortion though is this: What should the penalty be? How do you want to punish those who have abortions? (Assuming you want it to be illegal)
Wah, like I said, I don't really care atm T_T I am a little kid so something like this doesn't affect me, and if something doesn't affect me I have a hard time forming an educated opinion about it because I don't really care . Since I don't know too much about it, I just feel like people should be more responsible but I haven't had experience with that kind of stuff yet since I am a little kid. Like I said before, in a forum of male liberals there is really not going to be an intelligent discussion (look at some of the posts here other than mine) so I always try to contribute to the other side a little because I feel bad even while knowing about neither side X_x, I do try to understand both sides though. I agree my analogy was pretty retarded though LOL I laughed while writing it
Well, I dunno how a few days old fertilized egg is that much more human or alive as the egg and sperm alone,where exactly does she draw the line. Black and white thinking, probably a good thing something is keeping her quiet if she can't acknowledge the possibility of grey areas. Also she probably doesn't know the first thing about what's even going on in there, I know I don't. Only the lies-to-children at best.
e. It's kinda funny though, like nowadays shutting up for a few days means something? + Show Spoiler +
Even that didn't "do" anything, nor any of the similar acts. In the present day you'd have to do something even more radical, people consume disgusting media everyday. What does a kid with her mouth taped shut do?
On October 19 2011 03:01 Enervate wrote: What is one vote going to do in an election?
If everyone thought that way, no one would vote. What if every single person in the world covered their mouth with duct tape? Would you still think that wouldn't be a big deal?
It's about principle, not practicality.
nothing says i want to change the issues by purposefully being impractical
On October 19 2011 03:01 Enervate wrote: What is one vote going to do in an election?
If everyone thought that way, no one would vote. What if every single person in the world covered their mouth with duct tape? Would you still think that wouldn't be a big deal?
My opinion is that it is no one but the parents business. Government, church, no one should be gettig into my (theoretical) wives womb.
I guess my question is where is the practicality?
Exactly,Government, church, no one should be gettig between my bullet and some human i point at.After all,she is just 20 years old reaction of two cells.
Yeah because 2 "cells" (did you go to school?) + 20 years is the same as "2 cells" without 20 years.
Well yeah.Egg and sperm are both cells.You can read that in any book about life.And i said "reaction" .Man i am not even english man and i know what that word means.Reaction is response to another event.That means you (reaction) are response to sexual intercourse(event) between your mum and dad.(i just hope i did not shatter your imagination or something about SEX!)
No joke after word joke.
The point it,is,what we can say is murder? is it 20 years old human,is it 3 years old kid or -x unborne human(Can we even talk about human being?)?Or is it chicken you have on your plate?If there is a soul,what will happen with it?Maybe that soul was ment to be inventor of thermo nuclear fusion.And i can go on,about anthropocentrismand stuff.But i wont becouse,what does it matter here.
On October 18 2011 23:38 Djzapz wrote: Maybe she's wearing tape because she realizes that she should shut up and not tell actual people how to live their life...
That's pretty much exactly what abortion is....telling someone they can't live their life, because you're going to end it as soon as it starts.
Yeah you know what's better? Letting a kid be born to a crack addicted mother. Pretty sure life is pretty close to over when you're born addicted to crack too.
Some other awesome things about abortion cures:
Rape babies Broken condom babies Unhealthy fetuses (If you're going to tout pro-life shit, you better be prepared to discuss quality of life too)
I'm sure there are more.
This is true, but I'm sure there'd still be a lot of crazies who would say hold responsibility and blame on the woman, not care about the upbringing of the child, and would mandate she have and raise the child as though to punish her, all in the name of this sanctity of unborn babies. But seriously, rape is pretty common, and I'll be damned if a woman isn't allowed an abortion after such a traumatic experience. People would really wish to traumatize her further by forcing her to have the baby? I'd even say broken condoms are an issue as well. It's not a matter of irresponsibility as the couple was being responsible. It's a matter of poor manufacturing. Sure the chest-thumpers will say they shouldn't have been doing anything in the first place, but if they don't want broken condom pregnancies to happen, why don't the fools develop some 100% preventing contraception that's as cheap and available as condoms?
On October 18 2011 22:59 Thrill wrote: I wish this would be a 24/7, 365 day year-a-round thing for men who are against abortion. Would make the public debate on a woman's right to much more bearable to listen to.
So if my gf got pregnant and wanted to abort the child I have no say in my childs future? Lets be real now.
On October 18 2011 22:59 Thrill wrote: I wish this would be a 24/7, 365 day year-a-round thing for men who are against abortion. Would make the public debate on a woman's right to much more bearable to listen to.
So if my gf got pregnant and wanted to abort the child I have no say in my childs future? Lets be real now.
No you don't. It's tough, but that's the way it is. If she wants to keep it and you want to abort it you have no say either.
On October 18 2011 22:59 Thrill wrote: I wish this would be a 24/7, 365 day year-a-round thing for men who are against abortion. Would make the public debate on a woman's right to much more bearable to listen to.
So if my gf got pregnant and wanted to abort the child I have no say in my childs future? Lets be real now.
On October 18 2011 22:59 Thrill wrote: I wish this would be a 24/7, 365 day year-a-round thing for men who are against abortion. Would make the public debate on a woman's right to much more bearable to listen to.
So if my gf got pregnant and wanted to abort the child I have no say in my childs future? Lets be real now.
its not a child yet, thats kinda the reason its ok to abort it. its no ones child because its not a child. at the moment its just a women and her body. thats why its her choice.
It's her body. If you required unanimous consent from both parents to have an abortion you'd have situations where (if the man wanted the baby, but the woman didn't) men could essentially force women to have babies for them, against their will.
That's pretty strange. I've only seen people do that for gay rights when they stay silent to represent the repression of expression that gay people experience regularily. To do that for aborted fetuses makes... somewhat some sense? If she doesn't like how it's nobody's choice to be aborted, then it's also nobody's choice to be born. None of use really had a say in if we wanted to be around today. It's not the same thing as gay rights for sure.
I was pro-choice about 2 weeks ago around the time of this posting. I figured, it's her mind her body, and what about in the cases of rape or incest or something like that?
On November 04 2011 08:04 Ir0nClad wrote: I was pro-choice about 2 weeks ago around the time of this posting. I figured, it's her mind her body, and what about in the cases of rape or incest or something like that?
EPT
. Since I don't know too much about it, I just feel like people should be more responsible but I haven't had experience with that kind of stuff yet since I am a little kid. Like I said before, in a forum of male liberals there is really not going to be an intelligent discussion (look at some of the posts here other than mine) so I always try to contribute to the other side a little because I feel bad even while knowing about neither side X_x, I do try to understand both sides though. I agree my analogy was pretty retarded though LOL I laughed while writing it![[image loading]](http://www.thewitness.org/archive/mayjune2003/img/BurningMonk.jpg)
