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Simply put, standard jewish-christian religious culture believes we got only 1 shot to make outselves worthy of illumination, heaven, etc...
But what about autists, and other people who suffer from severe mental disabilities and can barely experience the world, why their 1 shot is a horrible experience at life, one where he couldnt even be properly held accountable by his actions, how could this kind of existance be reasonably justified in their system ? well im sure you all heard a few explanations.
But in my opinion, theres just a failure of concept there, if we are really working with a god that has infinite love, inteligence, and power, he would have a very specific reason for someone to be born in such a horrible contition, and in my mind that is punishment.
how difficult would it be for him, to program the universe with a system of kharma, so people can be born, make their mistakes, and then be born again, and pay for them in a way that allows them to keep evolving.
We think we know love, but big religious heads cant fathom how many chances god will really give us, just dont stay away from god to stay away from church, they are not the same,
With churches you either surrender to their house of faith or you are utterly lost and godless, and theres no middle ground, nowdays I feel theres less to gain visiting the church than simply maintaining a health work ethic, morally speaking.
Religion is cultural
Faith is universal
Reencarnation seems absurd at first, but if there is an almighty and powerfull god that wants us to experience material life to achieve illumation Ill take a leap of faith and say that, our daddy would give us some coins to continue playing.
 
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So you can actually make yourself worthy of heaven?!
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even if there was some sort of all-knowing all-powerful god who created us and watches over us (i don't see why anyone believes this), it is an even greater stretch to imagine that we could hope to comprehend this unimaginably complex being's motives or capabilities.
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What? I can't even finishing reading your absurd reasoning of a post.
God promises eternal life in heaven for being a good [insert your religion], reincarnation is an idea mostly dominant in religions such as Taoism and Buddhism.
But to each their own, believe what you will. I know there are a very minority of Christian that believe in reincarnation, so I guess you have something in common.
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On May 28 2011 12:29 IvanC wrote:
So you can actually make yourself worthy of heaven?!
I think we are all worthy, but in different degrees, and we will reencarnate until we are unworthy of stepping in such trivial trialing place
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So many philosophical threads.
To help you understand judeo-christianity, the jews thought the same thing(God judges unfairly), but God corrected them. The God portrayed in the media and philosophy books is quite different than the one in the Bible. I highly recommend reading it to understand it. Read Genesis, Job, John, and Romans for the brunt of the Bible.
Isaiah 55:8
"For My thoughts are not your thoughts, Nor are your ways My ways," declares the LORD.
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Do you even understand the basics of Christianity?
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On May 28 2011 12:31 darmousseh wrote:So many philosophical threads. To help you understand judeo-christianity, the jews thought the same thing(God judges unfairly), but God corrected them. The God portrayed in the media and philosophy books is quite different than the one in the Bible. I highly recommend reading it to understand it. Read Genesis, Job, John, and Romans for the brunt of the Bible. Show nested quote +Isaiah 55:8
"For My thoughts are not your thoughts, Nor are your ways My ways," declares the LORD.
"No honest theologian therefore can deny that his acceptance of Jesus as Christ logically binds every Christian to a belief in reincarnation - in Elias case (who was later John the Baptist) at least." —Robert Graves
`But I tell you, Elijah has already come, and they did not recognize him, but have done to him everything they wished. In the same way the Son of Man is going to suffer at their hands.' Then the disciples understood that he was talking to them about John the Baptist." —Jesus, (Matthew 17:12, 13)
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On May 28 2011 12:30 D10 wrote:
I think we are all worthy, but in different degrees, and we will reencarnate until we are unworthy of stepping in such trivial trialing place
And we should take your word because you're the one in charge, right?
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On May 28 2011 12:36 Essentia wrote:
Do you even understand the basics of Christianity?
What part specifically, the holy trinity, the belief in the sacrifice of christ, the original sin, the tons of pagan rituals added to christian ones to expand their influence over roman conquests, the parts of the bible who were mistranslated to illustrate a cultural point ?
Yes I do.
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On May 28 2011 12:36 Essentia wrote:
Do you even understand the basics of Christianity?
Yeah I was going to ask this too.
I think your reasoning is very good and interesting, but the religion can't be "rewritten" so it's basically just a fancy way to disagree with Christianity and we have enough of that already.
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On May 28 2011 12:37 IvanC wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2011 12:30 D10 wrote:
I think we are all worthy, but in different degrees, and we will reencarnate until we are unworthy of stepping in such trivial trialing place And we should take your word because you're the one in charge, right?
No, always question others, a guy in a forum shouldnt change your life, dont be asinine
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On May 28 2011 12:37 IvanC wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2011 12:30 D10 wrote:
I think we are all worthy, but in different degrees, and we will reencarnate until we are unworthy of stepping in such trivial trialing place And we should take your word because you're the one in charge, right?
Overreaction much? Notice the "I think" specifying that it's his opinion.
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On May 28 2011 12:39 D10 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2011 12:36 Essentia wrote:
Do you even understand the basics of Christianity? What part specifically, the holy trinity, the belief in the sacrifice of christ, the original sin, the tons of pagan rituals added to christian ones to expand their influence over roman conquests, the parts of the bible who were mistranslated to illustrate a cultural point ? Yes I do.
Do you have any more 'proof' than one verse which could more reasonably be interpreted in another way?
Btw, babysitting this thread makes you look like a troll.
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Im a Spiritist, albeit a very light one, I believe in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiritist_Codification , I dont expect anyone to take it seriously.
But its christianity with a ton of hindu and buddhist concepts, such as reencarnation, kharma, meditation, and etc...
suposedly this was revelaed to a french doctor who in his attempt to prove all these mediums were just a bunch of fakes, wrote letters to many of them all across france asking the same questions, and they were all answered exacly the same, signed by the same "entity" the spirit of truth.
go ahead, lol at me =P I dont care
PS: im only baby sitting this thread because im killing time until I can smoke a J
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I believe that the simple act of living constructs the afterlife you go to. An atheist will just cease to exist, soulless like they said they were. A mentally retarded person could create an afterlife of their liking if they had an enjoyable time on this planet. And someone who believes in reincarnation will burn their last identity upon being reborn. This all makes logical sense to me and after writing this it seems spiritual belief is held to preserve our true self if we want this. I personally won't be told it's impossible to do such a thing.
So the real question is: do you have a soul?
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On May 28 2011 12:48 MiniRoman wrote:
I believe that the simple act of living constructs the afterlife you go to. An atheist will just cease to exist, soulless like they said they were. A mentally retarded person could create an afterlife of their liking if they had an enjoyable time on this planet. And someone who believes in reincarnation will burn their last identity upon being reborn. This all makes logical sense to me and after writing this it seems spiritual belief is held to preserve our true self if we want this. I personally won't be told it's impossible to do such a thing.
So the real question is: do you have a soul?
Well according to the spiritist doctrines, yes, and so does all living things.
In plants and crystals theres principles of sapience, upon millions of life cycles will hop to more complex forms, until the beast becomes a man, and the man becomes something more.
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when you die, you die.
think diablo. hardcore mode.
that's life.
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this is kind of off topic, but i was thinking about religion and my belief in god while i was bored in my class, and i came to realize that god isn't really "real". he is has no physical form. god didn't create us. we created god. god is just a representation of our faith and our will to believe.
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On May 28 2011 12:22 D10 wrote:
Simply put, standard jewish-christian religious culture believes we got only 1 shot to make outselves worthy of illumination, heaven, etc....
I just want to point out that the Christians don't try to make themselves worthy of illumination (well some do, but they have a misunderstanding of the bible). One of my favorite bible verses sums up what the bible really says:
When Jesus's disciples ask what they must do to get to heaven, he replies "do the work of God." They ask what the work of God is...
Jesus answered, "The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent." John 6:29 (NIV)
You see, salvation is not earned, it is a gift from God... all you need to do is accept it. People with autism and other disabilities are just as capable of accepting this gift as any other person. Now, granted, some people are so severely disabled that they can't even comprehend simple things, much less the concept of forgiveness and salvation. I have a few things to say about that:
First and foremost, I can't tell you if they are forgiven or not. The bible simply does not say. That being said, by understanding that God is perfectly just, it is likely that he will take into account extenuating circumstances such as disabilities. But I am not God, so I can't tell you if this is the case or not.
Secondly, I want to address your argument that "if God was perfectly understanding and kind etc. why does he have people born with disabilities?" This is really a great question, and can be further extended to "why does he allow anything bad or wrong to happen?" The answer is that at first, none of that stuff did happen, but then WE sinned. It is OUR fault that the world is not perfect. Now, if you still want God to eradicate things that are wrong, where do you draw the line? Unfair circumstances? Evil deeds? Evil thoughts? The truth is, that if God were to eliminate wrong things, then we, human beings, would be eliminated. It is his mercy that lets us live, even in our broken conditions (be them physically or mentally broken or both). Still, living broken isn't exactly a great life. Luckily it doesn't end there!
That's why God unleashed his wrath (wrath that was supposed to be aimed at us) at Jesus, so that we could one day live as unbroken beings, the way it was meant to be! So I don't see physical disabilities of humans any differently than I do spiritual disabilities (the fact that we sin). Luckily, the disabilities can be fixed by acknowledging them, and simply accepting the gift of salvation that God has offered.
One of the smartest comments in this thread
The God portrayed in the media and philosophy books is quite different than the one in the Bible. I highly recommend reading it to understand it. Read Genesis, Job, John, and Romans for the brunt of the Bible
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EPT
