• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 21:51
CEST 03:51
KST 10:51
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL20] Ro24 Preview Pt1: Runway122v2 & SC: Evo Complete: Weekend Double Feature3Team Liquid Map Contest #21 - Presented by Monster Energy9uThermal's 2v2 Tour: $15,000 Main Event18Serral wins EWC 202549
Community News
Maestros of The Game—$20k event w/ live finals in Paris7Weekly Cups (Aug 11-17): MaxPax triples again!10Weekly Cups (Aug 4-10): MaxPax wins a triple6SC2's Safe House 2 - October 18 & 195Weekly Cups (Jul 28-Aug 3): herO doubles up6
StarCraft 2
General
RSL Revival patreon money discussion thread What mix of new and old maps do you want in the next 1v1 ladder pool? (SC2) : I made a 5.0.12/5.0.13 replay fix Geoff 'iNcontroL' Robinson has passed away #1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time
Tourneys
Maestros of The Game—$20k event w/ live finals in Paris Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) $5,100+ SEL Season 2 Championship (SC: Evo) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 487 Think Fast Mutation # 486 Watch the Skies Mutation # 485 Death from Below Mutation # 484 Magnetic Pull
Brood War
General
Victoria gamers Flash Announces (and Retracts) Hiatus From ASL New season has just come in ladder BW General Discussion [ASL20] Ro24 Preview Pt1: Runway
Tourneys
[ASL20] Ro24 Group C [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Cosmonarchy Pro Showmatches [ASL20] Ro24 Group B
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Fighting Spirit mining rates [G] Mineral Boosting Muta micro map competition
Other Games
General Games
General RTS Discussion Thread Beyond All Reason Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Total Annihilation Server - TAForever
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
High temperatures on bridge(s) Gtx660 graphics card replacement Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment"
TL Community
The Automated Ban List TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale
Blogs
The Biochemical Cost of Gami…
TrAiDoS
[Girl blog} My fema…
artosisisthebest
Sharpening the Filtration…
frozenclaw
ASL S20 English Commentary…
namkraft
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1889 users

Think back on the GSL March Group Selections

Blogs > Smurphy
Post a Reply
Smurphy
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States374 Posts
March 11 2011 00:06 GMT
#1
CONTAINS March GSL Spoilers. Stop reading if you aren't up-to-date on the GSL.

What was going on in SanZenith's mind when MC spoke up at the Group Selection show? I find this question incredibly intriguing. First, let me set the background so we can try to understand what SanZanith was thinking when MC spoke up. Also, what must SanZenith be thinking for his upcoming match against MC.

The format of how the groups would be determined is very interesting and leads to lots of interesting storylines. Thirty-two players would be separated into eight groups of four players each. First, the top 8 players from the previous GSL (MVP, MKP, Nestea, Jinro, Choya, Idra, Nada, and Trickster) selected which group they wanted to be a part of and selected a second player for their group. The player these top 8 seeds chose would be their first opponent. Then these chosen players would chose a 3rd player from each group. Those third players would then chose a 4th player for each group. I found the thoughts of the players and who they did or did not select to be very interesting. Also, the reasons for why they chose certain players were sometimes very amusing. The reasons ranged from choosing an easy opponent, choosing a rival, choosing someone who would make a fun match-up, to choosing someone to exact some revenge.

Nestea had the third selection and chose SanZenith to be the second member of his group and to be Nestea's first opponent. Simply saying that Nestea was the be the favorite in this matchup would be a gross understatement. Nestea is the GSL season 2 champ and has demonstrated consistently rock-solid play in all aspects of the game. SanZenith had recently demonstrated incredibly poor play and is known for making some of the biggest blunders in GSL history. On top of all that, Nestea has seemingly god-like abilities to stop what must inevitably be SanZenith's plan: to 4-gate or otherwise rush Nestea.

[image loading]
Artosis: "One zergling normally won't hold this off."

Nestea had an incredible hold against a 5-gate Voidray attack from Choya. Nestea scouts Choya's Voidray and sees an expansion go up. After clearing the scouting overlord Choya cancels the Nexus and throws a 5-gate + Voidray + Phoenix at Nestea. Choya shows up at Nestea's door with the Phoenix, Voidray, 4 Stalkers, 2 zealots, 1 sentry, and forward pylon. Nestea has a spore crawler and a singular zergling at his front door. As Artosis so eloquently puts it "1 zergling normally won't hold this off." A few comments from Tastosis about how Nestea is dead, some mis-micros from Choya, and Nestea pulls off an incredible hold. That's what SanZenith is up against: a champion with god-like abilities to survive against the strategy SanZenith is most likely to use.

Quoting Nestea through translator John: "I want to have an easy match for my first match in the round of 32." Nestea elaborates that late-game Protoss is very good against Zerg but SanZenith Protoss isn't that good. SanZenith responds "I agree" and elaborates that he doesn't even want to advance.

[image loading]
Nestea: "I want to have an easy match for my first match in the round of 32."

So the stage is set: Nestea and SanZenith will play first in their group and everyone, including SanZenith, agree that SanZenith is ****ed. What is a guy like SanZenith going to do? The Korean commentators ask SanZenith if he is intentionally going to lose. SanZenith: "No, but I'm going to pick the strongest opponent that I can."

[image loading]
SanZenith: "I'm going to pick the strongest opponent that I can."

The big mean bully (Nestea) has just picked on the little guy (SanZenith) and now the little guy is going to find a bigger, meaner bully to get some revenge. Who's going to be the champion for our little fighter? SanZenith initially says he wanted to choose TheBest (T) because he was ranked #1 on the ladder. Unfortunately for SanZenith, TheBest was already chosen.

[image loading]
MC: "You want a strong player who can beat Nestea? How about me."

oGsMC steps up and tells SanZenith: I'm your man. Not only does MC say that he'll beat MC but he tells SanZenith that he's willing to pick a weaker opponent with his own pick that SanZenith wants to face. SanZenith responds that this offer is very tempting but that he doesn't really want to play against Protoss.

[image loading]
SanZenith: "I don't want to play against Protoss."

I find this moment incredibly fascinating. What's going on inside SanZenith's head at this specific instance in time when MC speaks up. SanZenith eventually picks SlayersBoxer. SlayersBoxer states that he is 0-5 against Nestea and doesn't understand. SanZenith explains that he couldn't find anyone who could beat Nestea so he picked someone who he wanted to face. I think his choice gives some insight into what he must have been thinking.

Personally, I think "I don't want to play against Protoss" is true but a large understatement. SanZenith's thoughts must have been more like "Are you ****ing kidding me? I don't want to play against you. I've got a chance against these guys!"

If this estimation of SanZenith's thoughts are true what must his thoughts be for his upcoming match against MC. First, in the group stage, everyone thought SanZenith had no hope. But maybe SanZenith knew he had a chance. Maybe SanZenith was just pulling everyone's leg when he said he didn't even want to win and that he was going to choose a hard opponent. Maybe he was secretly confident in his abilities against Boxer and Nestea.

But is his fear of Protoss legitimate? If so, does that mean the circumstances for this upcoming match are quite different. Where previously everyone thought SanZenith had no chance but he had confidence in himself this time even SanZenith may not have confidence in his own chances.

What are your opinions on what SanZenith must have been thinking and what he must be thinking now?

HeroHenry
Profile Joined November 2010
United States1723 Posts
March 11 2011 00:18 GMT
#2
Very nice read and I don't think his fear of Protoss is legitimate and might shock everyone again when he plays MC this Saturday or whenever they play.
Geovu
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Estonia1344 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-03-11 00:21:02
March 11 2011 00:19 GMT
#3
Dude it's M freaking C.

Also, no Toss apart from MC or Inca likes PvP, lol

He is going to get raped by MC, but that doesn't mean San's PvP is bad, it just means that MC is the Kratos protoss
apalemorning
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Canada509 Posts
March 11 2011 00:34 GMT
#4
arent you the guy i 3-0'ed in a practice matchs, then told you to stop relying on cheese and you blocked communication with me? LOL.



anyways. stoked for mc games <3
immortal/roach is pretty good against stalkers
awu25
Profile Joined April 2010
United States2003 Posts
March 11 2011 01:21 GMT
#5
Isn't SanZenith the guy who was like half student/half progamer? If that is the case, I'm sure he just went into the games with half-ass confidence and thought maybe I'll get lucky and beat a legend that I think I have somewhat of a shot against.
FuRong
Profile Joined April 2010
New Zealand3089 Posts
March 11 2011 01:23 GMT
#6
I think San was definitely bluffing to some degree (in that he knew he wouldn't be as much of a pushover as everyone thought), but I still don't know if he really believed he could beat Nestea.

Based on what we've seen so far, he seems to like the macro games, and multitasking across several bases is his main strength. PvP is the complete opposite of this, and in the past he's lost some pretty embarrassing PvPs which is why most people think he's gonna get stomped. In San's favour is the fact that everyone also thought his PvZ was horrible until the game against Nestea, so we can't necessarily use his past form as a basis for his present skill.

I think San's PvP is probably a lot better than it was when he got roflstomped out of GSL January, but MC is just too good in the mirror and will probably 3-0 him anyway.
Don't hate the player, hate the game
Turgid
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States1623 Posts
March 11 2011 01:44 GMT
#7
On March 11 2011 09:18 HeroHenry wrote:
Very nice read and I don't think his fear of Protoss is legitimate and might shock everyone again when he plays MC this Saturday or whenever they play.

I doubt that he will. Even the game against NesTea had some "What are you doing San"(I feel like this is going to be a catchphrase for pro SC2 for some time) moments. You cannot make mistakes in PvP against an opponent like MC. You will immediately lose the game.
(╬ ಠ益ಠ)
ch33psh33p
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
7650 Posts
March 11 2011 02:26 GMT
#8
On March 11 2011 10:44 Turgid wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 11 2011 09:18 HeroHenry wrote:
Very nice read and I don't think his fear of Protoss is legitimate and might shock everyone again when he plays MC this Saturday or whenever they play.

I doubt that he will. Even the game against NesTea had some "What are you doing San"(I feel like this is going to be a catchphrase for pro SC2 for some time) moments. You cannot make mistakes in PvP against an opponent like MC. You will immediately lose the game.


Everyone makes mistakes, MC has more than made his share.
secret - never again
Turgid
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States1623 Posts
March 11 2011 02:40 GMT
#9
You think MC makes more mistakes than other players?
(╬ ಠ益ಠ)
OskO
Profile Joined February 2011
Argentina369 Posts
March 11 2011 03:24 GMT
#10
Interesting. Maybe he was saving a cool kick ass PvP gamestyle for this match (?).
I think he picked that way for the reasons that he stated in the 1st place... I mean, there is no point on scheming in secrecy at that stage. But if he did it... I think it went pretty well xD

I just hope they pull some creative stuff in order to avoid 4Gate/Collossi fests.
Though we strike at you from the shadows, do not think that we lack the courage to stand in the light.
Ghin
Profile Blog Joined January 2005
United States2391 Posts
March 11 2011 04:48 GMT
#11
I don't really remember sanzenith making huge mistakes (except maybe blocking his nexus vs check lol) in his earlier season games, but I do remember people like inca and check doing early timing attacks to remove him from the tournament. He obviously must have some skill if he made it to ro64 in Season 1 and 2 and has consistently stayed in Code S.
Legalize drugs and murder.
Dhalphir
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Australia1305 Posts
March 11 2011 08:47 GMT
#12
The thing is...MC is awesome, and Sanzenith is greatly improved. When you watch these guys play on the ladder on their streams, you realise how narrow the skill differences between them are. HuK routinely gets beaten by what you would call "lesser" players, and in a couple of games vs IMMvP he took one game off him and lost another. The skill margins are razor thin, and PvP is such a volatile matchup.

I agree that oGsMC is strongly favoured in this battle, but all mirror matches are very volatile, and PvP the most so, so its not a sure thing.
Supporting TypeII Gaming - www.typeii.net - TypeReaL, TypePhoeNix, TypeSuN, TypeDBS!!
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Online Event
00:00
The 5.4k Patch Clash #2
CranKy Ducklings107
davetesta28
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 152
NeuroSwarm 151
RuFF_SC2 134
StarCraft: Brood War
ggaemo 64
Icarus 0
Dota 2
monkeys_forever652
Counter-Strike
fl0m1541
Stewie2K119
Other Games
summit1g9281
tarik_tv8536
shahzam618
C9.Mang0521
JimRising 375
ViBE238
Maynarde108
Trikslyr78
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1131
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH190
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Doublelift4592
Counter-Strike
• Shiphtur307
Upcoming Events
The PondCast
8h 9m
WardiTV Summer Champion…
9h 9m
Zoun vs Bunny
herO vs Solar
Replay Cast
22h 9m
LiuLi Cup
1d 9h
BSL Team Wars
1d 17h
Team Hawk vs Team Dewalt
Korean StarCraft League
2 days
CranKy Ducklings
2 days
SC Evo League
2 days
WardiTV Summer Champion…
2 days
Classic vs Percival
Spirit vs NightMare
CSO Cup
2 days
[ Show More ]
[BSL 2025] Weekly
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
SC Evo League
3 days
BSL Team Wars
3 days
Team Bonyth vs Team Sziky
Afreeca Starleague
4 days
Queen vs HyuN
EffOrt vs Calm
Wardi Open
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
Rush vs TBD
Jaedong vs Mong
Afreeca Starleague
6 days
herO vs TBD
Royal vs Barracks
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Jiahua Invitational
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
HCC Europe

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Qualifiers
ASL Season 20
CSL Season 18: Qualifier 1
SEL Season 2 Championship
WardiTV Summer 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025

Upcoming

CSLAN 3
CSL Season 18: Qualifier 2
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
LASL Season 20
BSL Season 21
BSL 21 Team A
Chzzk MurlocKing SC1 vs SC2 Cup #2
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
EC S1
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters Fall
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
Roobet Cup 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.