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AVATAR – my thoughts
After so many of my friends calling this ‘the best movie they’ve ever watched’ and ‘mindblowingly’ good, I felt I should spend the money needed to watch this one in the cinema. Normally, I would just download this off some torrent site, but then I wouldn’t get to experience the awesome special effects this movie has. The few bucks I imagined spending, quickly grew to way more than anticipated and when all expenses were covered, I realized I could’ve bought the DVD with money spent that night, for me and my sister to watch this movie: this James-Cameron-licensed-motion picture better deliver. Spoilers incoming by the way – but if you haven’t seen this movie, you won’t understand anything, ‘cause I’m not going through the plot like a slave.
'OMG SO GOOD' - 'ORLY'
The Effects
Yes, they’re good, amazingly good. My god is this movie a pleasure to look at. The colors, the Na’vi, the explosions – I cannot put my finger on anything that in any way felt wrong or misplaced. It’s clear where the vast amount of the ginormous $500 mio. went – the special effects, and since 90% of the movie takes place among the Na’vi people, this part of the movie had better rock my socks off. And it did.
The effects are not exactly revolutionary though: I remember seeing similar stuff at the London Science Museum some five years back, but the magnitude and detail has probably never been seen before. All in all indescribably beautiful.
Yes it’s pretty – and this picture is a bad one actually
6/6
The Plot
This is where the movie really lacks depth: sure it might be pretty, but a movie isn’t really that good, unless there’s a kick-ass story to help digest the entire thing. And Avatar doesn’t have that story. In fact, Cameron apparently decided not to write a new script, when Disney had already done the entire thing for him: Avatar is hardly anything but Pocahontas painted with more expensive colors. This is really sad, considering how much money went into this thing. Still the story of Pocahontas’ is a classic and it’s not that bad watching it a second time, but it’s not original content. And it’s predictable. As hell. After the first 30 minutes you know how’s going to end, and the only thing I was wondering about in the end, was whether Jake would die near the end. (He didn’t)
Another complaint of mine is the duration: some movies warrant 150+ minutes, but in my humble opinion Avatar did not. Too much filler content and too much showing off with the special effects. In the hands of a good editor this movie would’ve been 30 minutes shorter and more of an intense experience: I was bored near the end, due to plot predictability and too much random bullshit.
With all that said, most of the time you are entertained and the plot is not entirely horrible. It’s just not good enough for a $500 mio. dollar movie
![[image loading]](http://iamhilarious.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/pocahontas-avatar-750x730.jpg)
It’s that obvious – poor job, Cameron, poor job
2/6
The Characters
Oh god. Nothing brought my piss to a boil more than the empty human/Na’vi shells that we’re supposed to care for during this nearly 3 hour movie. I honestly didn’t care when so many of the bi-characters died near the end: I knew jack-shit about them, they were so horribly underdeveloped. Most Sci-Fi movies solve this by having an opening scene involving the main character/someone else important and said persons family, so when said person is in trouble we care about said person. In Avatar we know that Jack Sully has a dead brother… and that’s about it. Poor fucking job. Had 10 minutes of this movie been dedicated to some actual character development, this movie would’ve improved dramatically.
Actually, Jack Sully is not the worst example of bad character development. He’s empty, but he’s consistently empty. Norm Spellman, Jacks Avatar-controlling partner, is so inconsistent it made me want to scream. At first he likes Jack and welcomes him aboard the team. The next moment he’s envious of Jack because he gets to date the tribe leader’s daughter as an Avatar (which, by the way, includes a love scene this movie could’ve been without). A few scenes later they’re the best of friends. What the fuck happened to warrant this behavior? Did he have a change of heart? Did the duke it out in a cut-out scene? I don’t know, but I sure as hell had a hard time categorizing their relationship.
There is only one character I really felt somewhat for in the movie, and that’s Neytiri, the tribe leader’s daughter: she has a family, a home to protect and shows love and compassion towards Sully. She loses her father, her lover and part of Na’vimity (humanity as a Na’vi – clever huh?) in a few moments and it’s one of the best moments in the movie. Unfortunately just as you get involved emotionally Sully comes in with a shitty line, and you’re back marveling at the view, but loathing the characters.
There: the characters, this picture says it all, ‘cause they are all empty’
1/6
The Cast
I don’t follow the acting scene much, but none of the actors really impressed me, and in fact I felt that some of them were miscast quite badly. Michelle Rodriguez does not deserve to be in a movie of this magnitude and I’m still wondering why she’s in it: she’s a bad actor, period. (also someone suggested to me that’s she’s in the movie to appeal to the male audience, but she’s not exactly hot. Megan Fox would’ve shut me right up, if that’s what you were going for) Sigourney Weaver was in Aliens and it’s hard not to compare her to her role as Ellen Ripley in an amazing movie, and for that reason I REALLY felt they should’ve found someone else. Giovanni Ribisi will always be Phoebes brother to me and can therefore NOT play the role as a corporate swine. I also felt he’s performance was overall pure, but that also stems mostly from a very poor overall scripted character: like Norm he’s so inconsistent.
Other actors did their part well: the voice actors for the Na’vi were overall very well chosen and really impressed me. Stephen Lang also did a good job with Miles Quaritch, but that guy is all muscle, no emotion, so how hard can it be. The rest of the cast did an OK job in my eyes, nothing extraordinary, but not painful to experience wither.
A mixed bunch, acting wise
3/6
Conclusion
This movie is worth a view, alone for the amazing special effects and 3D animation and for that alone it will go down in history (and the obscene amount of money it has made). But that’s it. The plot is lackluster, the characters poorly executed and the cast… meh, OK, I guess. I really expected quite a bit more out of this movie, but I was entertained throughout 99 % of the movie and that’s quite seldom for me. I will NOT be buying the DVD that’s for certain, since the movie would just be a bad sci-fi movie without the 3D glasses and a 40 foot screen. Go see it, it’s the most expensive movie ever made and the effects are good, but don’t watch it a second time.
4/6
(a small four, but the special effects carry this movie)
Again, these are just my thoughts, and I mostly wanted to counter the people calling this ‘the movie of the decade’, since it’s really not that good. Compare to a house: from the outside it looks amazing and you are wondering how the hell it can look so good, but once you go inside you realize no real effort’s been made with regards to furniture and design. And the fundament is unstable, with some drain damage here and there.
 
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Avatar is the geodesic dome of movies... a sign of what's to come. A harbinger of new technology that is able to bring new forms of entertainment.
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Just watch it high and enjoy the visuals.... Story? what story
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On January 19 2010 08:22 MetalMarine wrote:
Just watch it high and enjoy the visuals.... Story? what story
That's basically my mindset. Forget the story and just let the effects amaze you.
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On January 19 2010 08:28 meeple wrote:Show nested quote +On January 19 2010 08:22 MetalMarine wrote:
Just watch it high and enjoy the visuals.... Story? what story That's basically my mindset. Forget the story and just let the effects amaze you.
Movies have to be more than just pretty. If this were the case, I may as well watch a tech demo.
As for TC, I agree with you entirely. There is no denying that this movie is visually stunning. Anybody that thinks otherwise is a moron. Sure, the plot is derivative and told time and time again. Personally, I don't care if the story was the same, but I don't feel that it was told well.
As for the characters, the only character that I felt had any sort of well thought out character development was Neytiri. As the movie went on, this was the only character that I tend to sympathize with. There were scenes where a certain character died via helicopter and I felt absolutely nothing for that character. I know James Cameron wanted me to feel something for that character at that moment, but it just wasn't there. It fell flat. It follows as such that the cast wasn't too great outside of Zoe Saldana who coincidentally did the only character that I thought was effective - Neytiri.
Avatar is clearly an event movie and can only be truly appreciated in the theater. With that being said, I don't think it warrants repeated viewings. It needed more than just awesome graphics. I didn't outright hate it, but it could've been better. It's just so-so.
In conclusion, it was a great writeup. And I'm glad to hear your points on this movie. 
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All I could think of the film at the end was how at first, the xel naga protoss without technilogy fought the terran with wraith, goliath, and marines because the terran was trying to expand for more mienrals. Then, the zerg ally, who was controlled by the overmind, who was actually controling the foolish protoss as well, went with mass mutas and ultralisks which pwnt the terran, all because the terran forgot to make medics and siege tanks.
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Snet
United States3573 Posts
Thanks for actually putting some effort into your thread compared to other Avatar threads floating around this site. I agree, the story and characters were pretty bad, but the visuals were excellent (and good enough to be worth the watch).
My conclusion is about the same as yours. It is worth the money to see it in imax, but I would definitely not watch it a second time, or buy the dvd.
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Yeap. Agree with you on all counts. Just don't post this in the Avatar thread. You'll have a horde of bleary-eyed fanboys screaming at you and posting text walls of why they're right.
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I agree about the characters, and I also think that as an action movie it was pretty tame, Sully is never in much danger until the colonel finds his real body.
I didn't care about the story though, so I'd give it about a 4/5 for the incredible cinematography and immersiveness. The review was well written and gets a 5/5.
I wouldn't buy the DVD or download it either. It needs to be seen in theaters for the full effect.
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Nice to see a well thought out review like this. I would have to agree with you on pretty much all accounts; the visuals are spectacular, and even more so in 3D, but the story certainly was lacking. Won't be buying this one, but should definitely be seen in theaters
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Hadn't realised it was a pocahontas rip. Never seen that one you see. Well that changes my opinion of the movie somewhat.
Nice write up!
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Agreed 100%. The movie was so unbelievably predictable.
I remember when they killed off half the characters and I didn't care at all. Usually I care, but as you said, they were so underdeveloped and crappy I didn't even know them.
The movie even had a montage...I can always do without a montage. And explain to me how nobody else in all those years thought to just fly over that bigass dragon thing in order to tame it.
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On January 19 2010 08:31 WindCalibur wrote:
All I could think of the film at the end was how at first, the xel naga protoss without technilogy fought the terran with wraith, goliath, and marines because the terran was trying to expand for more mienrals. Then, the zerg ally, who was controlled by the overmind, who was actually controling the foolish protoss as well, went with mass mutas and ultralisks which pwnt the terran, all because the terran forgot to make medics and siege tanks.
Too much StarCraft?
Anyhow I loved your writeup and totaly agree with your conclusions. Altho I knew even from previews of the movie itself this ain't gonna be some story oriented movie you still manage to support some great facts about this movie which most ppl in their threads/blogs fail to do so.
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Physician
United States4146 Posts
- 4/6 is pretty harsh given the 3xperience u get for the $ u pay
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On January 19 2010 09:07 Physician wrote:
- 4/6 is pretty harsh given the 3xperience u get for the $ u pay
If you consider $ spent making it versus quality (subjective) it's probably not that good a ratio... I thought it was a great movie, fun to watch, but make no mistake, this isn't "the lives of others" or "pan's labyrinth" (either of which I would accept as movie of the decade btw). And those took a fraction of the cost to produce.
It was fun, I'd watch it again (in the cinema not on DVD... blu-ray maybe).
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I really enjoyed this movie. I can't wait for the sequel
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On January 19 2010 09:07 Physician wrote:
- 4/6 is pretty harsh given the 3xperience u get for the $ u pay
This.
Given it's a film for all ages it's pretty sensational. I've never seen a film so immersive and stunning. In 3 hours we are introduced to an entirely new world and the whole environment is believable. The plot suffices with just enough suspense to keep you immersed.
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On January 19 2010 09:14 zergpower123 wrote:
I really enjoyed this movie. I can't wait for the sequel
Oh dear God no.
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i can deconstruct every point youve made up until now in less then 30 minutes. But it makes no sense whatsoever
1. Everything you "came up" with( half the stuff ripped out of official avatar thread but for some reason posted here) was already crushed and proven wrong or irrelevant at that
2. Deconstructing a pile of steaming shit is senseless
On January 19 2010 09:20 Hans-Titan wrote:
Oh dear God no.
This kind of sums it up for me. Arguing with you is like pissing against the wind.
Whats also hilarious is that 90% of attention whores that called avatar boring( or made separate blogs for just that) come from either scandinavia, germany or canada. You can sit outside all day watching paint dry( snow melt) and it would still be an exhilarating experience for your imagination. Learn to appreciate.
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You forgot one of the major aspects of the movie. Music!
The music in this movie is just plain beautiful. I could watch this movie a thousand times just for the environment and music.
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Well, i thought it was a good movie overall. Why do people say a movies acting/plot is bad just because it had special effects and all of that, like its some intellectual position. The only problem i had with the main character was at first he acted like some 19 year old douche bag, but towards the end he started to change his attitude a bit.
Every story in the history of the world from avatar to the fucking bible has some kid of "plagiarism", and come on of course you know how the movie is going to end ITS A MOVIE. Do we really need to go over the movies that have had any form of "plagiarism"? just seems like a lame point to make considering the vast amounts of movies that you would probably like that have "plagiarized" and considering the other content that had nothing to do with Pocahontas.
If anyone else directed this film I don't think they would have pulled it off like James Cameron has. This is because he had the time and the money to do everything he could to make sure this movie didn't go unnoticed. If Michael Bay would have directed this film instead of James Cameron, it would be a train wreck.
But hey, everyone is entitled to their opinion and you did a good job of reviewing one of the best movies that i have seen in a LLLLLOOOOOOOOONNNNNGGG time. Good read.
On January 19 2010 09:14 zergpower123 wrote:
I really enjoyed this movie. I can't wait for the sequel
A sequel would probably ruin the series like most other movie franchises.(Matrix)
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I think the 82% rating on Rotten Tomatoes is pretty spot on. It's a decently good movie with mindblowing visuals but issues regarding plot.
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On January 19 2010 10:04 sassy wrote:i can deconstruct every point youve made up until now in less then 30 minutes. But it makes no sense whatsoever 1. Everything you "came up" with( half the stuff ripped out of official avatar thread but for some reason posted here) was already crushed and proven wrong or irrelevant at that 2. Deconstructing a pile of steaming shit is senseless This kind of sums it up for me. Arguing with you is like pissing against the wind. Whats also hilarious is that 90% of attention whores that called avatar boring( or made separate blogs for just that) come from either scandinavia, germany or canada. You can sit outside all day watching paint dry( snow melt) and it would still be an exhilarating experience for your imagination. Learn to appreciate.
And this speaks to the essence of fanboyism. Rather than engage in an educated discussion about the merits of the film, all you did was dismiss his points as wrong, irrelevant, or whatnot. This is what makes the Avatar thread unbearable. All the people that love the movie are so defensive when anybody speaks out of its flaws. I hate to break it to you; it's not perfect. I wish I had the experience that all the Avatar fanboys had and wish I got swept away with the movie, but there are glaring flaws in the movie that make the experience not as great as I had expected.
I have no idea where you get off with this conjecture about Scandinavians, Germans, and Canadians being attention whores for voicing their opinion of the movie, but so many of you can't see the forest for the trees that you don't notice some of the flaws if it hit you in the face.
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I fucking loved this movie SOOOOOOOOO much.
Probably my favourite movie of all time now ^_^
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I completely agree with all the points OP made, except I didn't even care about the Na'vi princess (don't even care enough to remember the name). I really hope the 3D technology gets less expensive in the future. Imagine movies like the Titanic in 3D 
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I was very favorably impressed by the movie, but I came in with low expectations.
The imagination that went into the flora and fauna of Pandora, and the vividness of their representation, was mostly what impressed me.
The plot kept me going, although I wasn't really thrilled except when Sully decided to ride the Mercedes-Benz dragon. That moment was awesome.
Overall I was impressed, but I wouldn't go out of my way --- or pay! --- to watch it again.
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omg you only gave it a 4 you suck your opinion doesn't matter you're so stupid you don't even know what you're talking about this is the best movie of all time and you just can't understand it omg you suck
+ Show Spoiler +I forgot that Giovanni Ribisi was Phoebe's brother LOL looking back now he wasn't quite the perfect actor for the part
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i regret watching it in 3D
ruined the entire fucking experience for me
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Personally, I thought Lord of the Rings Trilogy was better
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On January 19 2010 13:05 WindCalibur wrote:
Personally, I thought Lord of the Rings Trilogy was better
Well duh!
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On January 19 2010 08:35 Snet wrote:
Thanks for actually putting some effort into your thread compared to other Avatar threads floating around this site. I agree, the story and characters were pretty bad, but the visuals were excellent (and good enough to be worth the watch).
My conclusion is about the same as yours. It is worth the money to see it in imax, but I would definitely not watch it a second time, or buy the dvd.
Took the words right out my mouth
I hated the plot, it was so freaking obvious that the Avatar-people were going to win the war and Jack was going to help them out instead.
And I also agree that I didn't give a shit that his fellow human friends died, even Grace
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Will have to make a distinction between 'good' plot or 'inconsistency/holes'.
What is a good plot is highly subjective, something that supports the visuals, in Avatar's case can be considered good enough or lacking by others. I'm not going to go there, as I said all in the eye of the beholder.
The other aspect is specific critiques of the narrative/script, something that almost anyone can pick up. This is the part where characters are a tad confused, behaves differently for no apparent reason or random events that seems to add no value. These are what I believe Avatar stumbled on.
In addition to those mentioned by the OP,
Doc goes 'this is amazing Navi's are connected to the planet! The anticipation builds. Then the 'grand revelation' fizzles and comes to nothing: 'they can hear voices' LOL..I thought the response from the corporate was perfectly justified.
It was established how sacred the bond with animals via the universal plug is, then Jack went for the Mercedez anyway, hah! Sure supposedly it's his "only choice" but the connection is very loose.
Jack establishes himself as the war leader of the natives atop a legendary mount. After going through the formalities, out of the blue goes: "oh btw please help my friend!" Very random and 0 emotional impact.
The Na'vi, they Are a bunch of savages. With the human equalivent emotional maturity of 15 year olds. Father died, but cometh legendary creature all is forgotten. Betrothed was stolen, will only stare and make angry face. Bandwagoners of the highest order (easily stirred with corny football moviesque fist pumping) and yet goes about face just as easily - we must not leave -> bomb -> we leave.
All these aside, there are moments in the movie that made me smile unconsciously. So a few pluses and many minuses execution wise, still mostly enjoyable.
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Good graphics, bad story. I wouldn't rank Avatar as one of my favorite movies. It's one of those movies that I just need to watch once, reflect on it for a while and then forget about it.
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First of all, thanks for all the posts everyone. It's always nice to see a good discussion going on, and there are some points I'd like to adress.
On January 19 2010 10:04 sassy wrote:
i can deconstruct every point youve made up until now in less then 30 minutes. But it makes no sense whatsoever
You didn't bother making a proper post, because 'it makes no sense whatsoever'? Good I guess, but then why post at all?
1. Everything you "came up" with( half the stuff ripped out of official avatar thread but for some reason posted here) was already crushed and proven wrong or irrelevant at that
Firstly, I haven't red the Avatar thread for fear of spoilers: I doubt I'm going to, since it's 70+ pages and people haven't exactly advertised it well in this thread. All these thoughts were my own, so you can back off on that account. Secondly, if they're so easy to 'crush', go right ahead, I'm waiting.
2. Deconstructing a pile of steaming shit is senseless
I'm not going to add anything here, since I agree. I don't think my post is 'steaming shit' - actually quite a few moments went into making it - ,though, and most people seem to share that view.
This kind of sums it up for me. Arguing with you is like pissing against the wind.
You haven't tried have you? I dislike the thought of an Avatar sequel because:
A) The story is not good enough to warrant it
B) The story, with all its flaws, still managed to reach and ending that tied up all the untied knots (A sequel will most likely just be the humans returning for more unobtanium (The Core anyone?), and thus we have a remake of the first movie, with slightly different characters: not worth the 200 million sorry)
C) Sequels very rarely match the quality of the first one
Whats also hilarious is that 90% of attention whores that called avatar boring( or made separate blogs for just that) come from either scandinavia, germany or canada. You can sit outside all day watching paint dry( snow melt) and it would still be an exhilarating experience for your imagination.
I'm assuming you've done research and aren't just pulling those numbers out your ass: oh, wait, you are, meaning that discussing this is going to be entirely pointless, so let's move right along. Also you seem to think I think Avatar is a bad movie; it's not, but it's not amazing either. I gave it 4/6 because that's what it is: above average. (and yes I weighed the special effects quite heavily in that score)
Learn to appreciate.
What bullshit. Should I appreciate it even when it's not perfect? I think TealLurker put it best:
"All the people that love the movie are so defensive when anybody speaks out of its flaws. I hate to break it to you; it's not perfect. I wish I had the experience that all the Avatar fanboys had and wish I got swept away with the movie, but there are glaring flaws in the movie that make the experience not as great as I had expected."
Someone mentioned Pans Labyrinth. Go watch that, that's a good movie. Not as much eye-candy, granted, but the story and the characters are so well constructed it's hard not go get emotionally attached, something I never was with Avatar.
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On January 19 2010 10:19 Khaymus wrote:
You forgot one of the major aspects of the movie. Music!
The music in this movie is just plain beautiful. I could watch this movie a thousand times just for the environment and music.
I must respectfully disagree on the music. It wasn't particularly outstanding or memorable, though it might be pleasant to listen to.
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Goliath on- I mean uh...cool original machines.
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avatar was a really nice movie and u dont know shit about movies/acting, why? because u said the cast was shit and sorry mate but the guy that played Jake Sully played a really well crippled soldier.oh and the bad ass sergeant was like a marine from starcraft riding a goliath. lolz.
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about the pocahantas thing: it's called the hero's journey
also did anyone else notice that the story is almost exactly the same as district 9 lol
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Zurich15365 Posts
On January 19 2010 08:12 Hans-Titan wrote:
[...]because he gets to date the tribe leader’s daughter as an Avatar (which, by the way, includes a love scene this movie could’ve been without).
Wasn't this cut from the theatrical release? I saw the movie 2 times and the scene cut off pretty quickly. See here under the Spoiler category:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0499549/trivia
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On January 19 2010 10:24 Saturnize wrote:Show nested quote +On January 19 2010 09:14 zergpower123 wrote:
I really enjoyed this movie. I can't wait for the sequel A sequel would probably ruin the series like most other movie franchises.(Matrix)
Terminator 2 was better than 1.
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On January 19 2010 21:56 zatic wrote:Show nested quote +On January 19 2010 08:12 Hans-Titan wrote:
[...]because he gets to date the tribe leader’s daughter as an Avatar (which, by the way, includes a love scene this movie could’ve been without).
Wasn't this cut from the theatrical release? I saw the movie 2 times and the scene cut off pretty quickly. See here under the Spoiler category: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0499549/trivia
There are a few shots, and I guess labelling them a love scene is stretching it, but it was enough to made me feel icky inside.
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On January 19 2010 10:19 Khaymus wrote:
You forgot one of the major aspects of the movie. Music!
The music in this movie is just plain beautiful. I could watch this movie a thousand times just for the environment and music.
While I agree for most of the movie, the music in the climax (last battle) was very bad and wasn't fitting at all imo
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posting in a troll thread
User was unlucky enough that I followed this thread and noticed him and his atrocious history on this site.
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I thought Avatar was seriously amazing in my opinion. But then again, originality factor didn't matter for me because I don't even remember the story of Pontificates or even Dances with Wolves. For characters, everybody were shells except Jake and Neytiri, which I don't really care too much about. Graphics were amazing but what I found most compelling about this movie was the Avatar universe...it has fair depth than you would expect. I guess the reason why I loved this movie isn't because of the story itself but because of how amazing Pandora looks and why I sit in front of computer instead of riding on a banshee.
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