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On September 10 2009 20:21 Railxp wrote:
when you join a dota team game, you join with an agreement that you will try your best to beat the other team and win the game, at least that is what is expected of you from your team mates. Thus you have an obligation to your teammates. When you quit mid game, you place your own enjoyment factor before theirs. Although you might not enjoy the game as much anymore, you quitting would likely decrease their enjoyment because now they stand an even lesser chance to win. I think as long as two people within the 5 player team want to continue playing, the game should go on, hence i would agree with the 4/5 vote concede.
I propose the following:
- 4/5 vote to concede
- an option to opt-out, or kick yourself/feeders without penalty. Say if you are feeding in a game, you or the team should be able to do a quick vote and if the team agrees that you are a burden, you can quit the game without tarnishing your reputation.
- A reputation system that displays the percentage of games where you voluntarily disconnect. If you hold your mouse over that percentage, it will display the number of games you stuck through with over the number of total games. Although you should be free to quit the game at anytime, your teammates should also have that information before they let you into the game. This reputation should encourage people to not ragequit. Whether your reputation is good enough to be allowed in a game would be up to the host's discretion.
HoN has some of those. Right now:
1. You need 5/5 to concede
2. There is an option to kick out a player without penalty. The thing is the vote is for everyone in the game not just your teammates. So if your opponents enjoys getting fed they will rarely accept the kick.
3. There is something like that. You have a leaving % (a bit like disconnects in SC). The system has a minimum disconnect % depending on your level. The host can decide to make the game with the no leaver option, meaning that players exceeding a certain disc% can't join
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1v1 gg'ing and leaving is obviously fine, it's your decision alone. However, in a team game, you should play on unless everyone calls it out of politeness. I've often felt like we'd 100% lost dota games only for my teammates to pull through. You can get a pretty skewed negative perspective of the state of a game like dota after a string of deaths.
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The ability to reconnect to a game you've DCed from is League of Legends' greatest addition to DotA-like games imo. If HoN employs something like this, then this situation probably wouldn't have happened (unless the guy's teammates were dicks and sold all his shit).
A lot of people will play a game to the very end because that is what they consider a fun game, and their opinion matters just as much as yours. Also, if you're good you can improve your K/D ratio at the very least (don't know if HoN keeps track of it).
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On September 10 2009 22:51 Eti307 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 10 2009 20:21 Railxp wrote:
when you join a dota team game, you join with an agreement that you will try your best to beat the other team and win the game, at least that is what is expected of you from your team mates. Thus you have an obligation to your teammates. When you quit mid game, you place your own enjoyment factor before theirs. Although you might not enjoy the game as much anymore, you quitting would likely decrease their enjoyment because now they stand an even lesser chance to win. I think as long as two people within the 5 player team want to continue playing, the game should go on, hence i would agree with the 4/5 vote concede.
I propose the following:
- 4/5 vote to concede
- an option to opt-out, or kick yourself/feeders without penalty. Say if you are feeding in a game, you or the team should be able to do a quick vote and if the team agrees that you are a burden, you can quit the game without tarnishing your reputation.
- A reputation system that displays the percentage of games where you voluntarily disconnect. If you hold your mouse over that percentage, it will display the number of games you stuck through with over the number of total games. Although you should be free to quit the game at anytime, your teammates should also have that information before they let you into the game. This reputation should encourage people to not ragequit. Whether your reputation is good enough to be allowed in a game would be up to the host's discretion. HoN has some of those. Right now: 1. You need 5/5 to concede 2. There is an option to kick out a player without penalty. The thing is the vote is for everyone in the game not just your teammates. So if your opponents enjoys getting fed they will rarely accept the kick. 3. There is something like that. You have a leaving % (a bit like disconnects in SC). The system has a minimum disconnect % depending on your level. The host can decide to make the game with the no leaver option, meaning that players exceeding a certain disc% can't join
ooo cool didnt know that XP maybe i should start considering HoN
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Calgary26004 Posts
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Most people want to see the final battle, even if it's like 10 marines vs 4 battle cruisers. Maybe the battle cruisers are all really badly damaged, maybe they're hallucination whatever.
In progaming it really sucks (but at least is incredibly rare) when one of them just gets starved and leaves before they've lost all their units. People want to see the game end on the note that all their fighting units had their last hurrah. It kind of sucks in normal games you're playing in too. Obviously don't turtle when you're dead, but go in for some last really risky operation that might swing the game, even though no one is expected to live.
That's my thought anyway. Plus come back games are always the best games. Just hope your opponent slips up a lot while you play perfectly there on.
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From a DotA perspective I'm more-or-less in your boat, actually. If the other team has a Void that's been farming all game, and you know he doesn't suck ass, and he's not even had to enter battles for your team to get crushed all game, then I don't really ever see hope in winning. For god's sakes you're losing battles 5v4... without their uber invinci char. Usually in DotA I just gg and leave; if I'm playing with friends I usually ask them first before I "ragequit." I mean I know there's the moral of being in a team game but in a casual game I don't see any reason to killjoy myself for people I don't know and probably will never run into again. I play games to have fun; the moment it becomes not-fun for me it's time to stop.
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On September 10 2009 23:25 Flakes wrote:
The ability to reconnect to a game you've DCed from is League of Legends' greatest addition to DotA-like games imo. If HoN employs something like this, then this situation probably wouldn't have happened (unless the guy's teammates were dicks and sold all his shit).
A lot of people will play a game to the very end because that is what they consider a fun game, and their opinion matters just as much as yours. Also, if you're good you can improve your K/D ratio at the very least (don't know if HoN keeps track of it).
You can reconnect to a game in HoN. If you disconnect, you have 5 minutes to reconnect. Should further disconnects happen, your timer doesn't restart, it simply continues where you left off. So if you disconnect for 1 minute and 12 seconds, reconnect, and later disconnect again, you now have 3 minutes and 48 seconds to reconnect a second time. Once the 5 minutes is up, you are permanently disconnect and it counts against your leave %.
HoN keeps track of your all-time K:D ratio. I didn't want to risk ruining my ratio further in that game that it already is by being on the offensive. I didn't see any hope in sight, so I farmed. Given how that game played out, farming away from the battle and defending at home were probably the smartest things I could have done. I wasn't doing them hoping for a turnaround, though, I was simply doing it to avoid being killed myself. Jungling, the term used in HoN to kill neutral creeps, is kinda hard to find a player doing that, and then fighting in my base, well, I had the defender's advantage.
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Even if you don't come back, at least you get training in coming back from a behind position.
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It's interesting that in most sports, you can't concede because you think you're in an un-winnable position, but RTS people expect it. Image the 2004 Yankees, World Series Champions.
The difference is that people mass game in RTS's, there's no time limit, and advantages tend to snowball worse than linear point differences. And in dota, I would be less likely to quit if I knew my teammates and believed they could raise their level of play for a comeback.
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EPT
