• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 15:45
CET 20:45
KST 04:45
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy7ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT30Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book19Clem wins HomeStory Cup 289
Community News
Weekly Cups (March 16-22): herO doubles, Cure surprises3Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool48Weekly Cups (March 9-15): herO, Clem, ByuN win42026 KungFu Cup Announcement6BGE Stara Zagora 2026 cancelled12
StarCraft 2
General
Potential Updates Coming to the SC2 CN Server What mix of new & old maps do you want in the next ladder pool? (SC2) Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool Weekly Cups (March 16-22): herO doubles, Cure surprises Weekly Cups (August 25-31): Clem's Last Straw?
Tourneys
WardiTV Mondays Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament World University TeamLeague (500$+) | Signups Open RSL Season 4 announced for March-April WardiTV Team League Season 10
Strategy
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Frigid Storage Publishing has been re-enabled! [Feb 24th 2026]
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 518 Radiation Zone Mutation # 517 Distant Threat Mutation # 516 Specter of Death
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Gypsy to Korea Soulkey's decision to leave C9 How much money terran looses from gas steal? mca64Launcher - New Version with StarCraft: Remast
Tourneys
[ASL21] Ro24 Group C [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Ro24 Group B 2026 Changsha Offline Cup
Strategy
What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2
Other Games
General Games
Darkest Dungeon Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread General RTS Discussion Thread Path of Exile
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece
Sports
Cricket [SPORT] 2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion Tokyo Olympics 2021 Thread General nutrition recommendations
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Laptop capable of using Photoshop Lightroom?
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Money Laundering In Video Ga…
TrAiDoS
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
FS++
Kraekkling
Shocked by a laser…
Spydermine0240
Unintentional protectionism…
Uldridge
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1578 users

[G] How to stop 4-5pools with every race

Forum Index > Brood War Strategy
Post a Reply
1 2 3 4 Next All
CharlieMurphy
Profile Blog Joined March 2006
United States22895 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-02-24 02:07:22
November 27 2008 10:27 GMT
#1
My Youtube account was deleted, But I reuploaded them
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=84861



I made a bunch of videos about stopping 4 and 5 pools on BB with every race. So if it works here, it'll work (or a variation of it will work on a larger map).

I've had these videos sitting on my HD for almost a year now. Just now adding captions and uploading to youtube:

I tested each BO v BO 2 or 3 times (not counting the 1000s of other game's experiences)
PvZ 5pool vs 9gate:

+ Show Spoiler +


PvZ 4pool vs 10gate:

+ Show Spoiler +


TvZ 8rax vs 4pool:

+ Show Spoiler +


ZvZ 9pool vs 5pool:
(this is probably the most notable video)

+ Show Spoiler +


I never actually finished testing/making all the BOs v BOs (even though I'm sure what works already):
5pool vs 8rax (obvious though)
5pool vs 9rax
4pool vs 9pool
4-5pool vs Forge builds.
4pool vs 9gate
5pool vs 10gate
overpool vs 4pool
overpool vs 5pool

If anyone wants to test with me give me a PM or whatever. Does 1.16 work for hamachi?


I used shitty music in these videos because its funny to me.
I am aware my micro and decision making is sub par for some of these but that just puts an emphasis on the fact that these defenses work.

PS- I have some blooper videos if you guys wanna see those too. Failed 9raxes (failed 4pool vs 9rax, lol) and failed 10gate.

Builds that don't work 95% of the time are:
9rax vs 4pool,
10/12 2gate vs 4pool
10/12 2gate vs 5pool
10pool vs 4pool
10pool vs 5pool


Thanks to Smaq aka NightToad for being my Zerg guinea pig please don't flame him.
..and then I would, ya know, check em'. (Aka SpoR)
Shikyo
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Finland33997 Posts
November 27 2008 10:46 GMT
#2
Forge expand would be pretty useful, as would 11rax .-.
League of Legends EU West, Platinum III | Yousei Teikoku is the best thing that has ever happened to music.
wo0py
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
Netherlands922 Posts
November 27 2008 10:47 GMT
#3
You made very nice vids. bloopers are always fun
We shouldnt recreate anger of the non-virtual world
InfeSteD
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States4658 Posts
November 27 2008 10:48 GMT
#4
really fun videos, good background music too LOL ^_^
w/e
StylishVODs
Profile Joined December 2005
Sweden5331 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-11-27 10:53:52
November 27 2008 10:50 GMT
#5
fun but i dont see how this would work, terrans seldom does 8rax wallin with suply to prevent a 4pool if he doesnt know its coming lol;)

its like "this is how to prevent dt rush" suply rax ebay academy scan bunker turret bunker turret
......na nanana.. nana.. nana can't touch this
According to Reach, he is the fastest learner he has ever seen. He start bw only like 2/3 years ago. Infact, his bw history knowledge is so limited, he didn't even know what the map Guillotine was.
village_idiot
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
2436 Posts
November 27 2008 10:54 GMT
#6
Python versions please
TJcan
Profile Joined November 2008
14 Posts
November 27 2008 10:54 GMT
#7
The problem is not 4pool or 5pool, the problem is 9 pool into up'ed hydras from 2 hatches. If you mass zealots, he'll micro you to death. If you gas and core, your tech won't kick in before he rushes and all you have is a few zlots and a silly goon or two. Only chance is to rush w/ mass zlots before hydras are speed up'ed, but he has that ovie in your base and can just add a few sunks X_X
stanley_
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States816 Posts
November 27 2008 11:06 GMT
#8
In PvZ 4pool vs 10gate, the lings should have went for the gateway. That way the gateway has a chance to go down and the toss is left with maybe a zealot. It also forces the toss to pull probes then you just run away from, this is better because it will make the toss lose more minerals then the other method.

It takes about 14 seconds to kill a gateway with 6 lings. I counted with the video. If he were to go for the gateway, He would have taken it down before the zealot came out.
hoorah
Ganfei
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
Taiwan1439 Posts
November 27 2008 11:07 GMT
#9
In your 8 rax video, a good zerg will kill your scvs that are not protected. That zerg also pulled back when he coulda probably killed your bunker.

When you are opening without knowing a 4 pool is coming BBS all at 9 is probably the best option
You are crushing me like a cheese sandwich
eX-Corgh
Profile Joined October 2007
Russian Federation386 Posts
November 27 2008 11:19 GMT
#10
lol why make 8 rax vs 5 pool? Its pretty obvious. What about standard rax timing @ 11?
Never give cheese to the Gorilla ^^
ShloobeR
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Korea (South)3820 Posts
November 27 2008 11:25 GMT
#11
in your zvz one, your opponent starting build a colony in range of yours, which is obviously going to be stopped with your build.

usually the opponent will build a colony somewhere it can hit pool/hatch but is not in range of your own.

seeing as you only stopped his sunk because you had yours out I dunno how useful this really is.
: o )
stanley_
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States816 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-11-27 11:27:43
November 27 2008 11:25 GMT
#12
These can be easier to retest. There are too many variables. Try using the playrep tool.

edit: Nvm playrep isn't updated.
hoorah
CharlieMurphy
Profile Blog Joined March 2006
United States22895 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-11-27 11:31:43
November 27 2008 11:30 GMT
#13
On November 27 2008 20:25 ShloobeR wrote:
in your zvz one, your opponent starting build a colony in range of yours, which is obviously going to be stopped with your build.

usually the opponent will build a colony somewhere it can hit pool/hatch but is not in range of your own.

seeing as you only stopped his sunk because you had yours out I dunno how useful this really is.

Yea, that was a pretty big mistake on his part but I think I still win because I got free hits with drones and some of his lings died, I would have maybe lost a few more lings or drones to it. That's all.
My sunken hits his 4 times.
..and then I would, ya know, check em'. (Aka SpoR)
CharlieMurphy
Profile Blog Joined March 2006
United States22895 Posts
November 27 2008 11:33 GMT
#14
On November 27 2008 20:25 stanley_ wrote:
These can be easier to retest. There are too many variables. Try using the playrep tool.

edit: Nvm playrep isn't updated.

holy fuck, didn't even know about this http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=67365
..and then I would, ya know, check em'. (Aka SpoR)
stanley_
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States816 Posts
November 27 2008 11:54 GMT
#15
On November 27 2008 20:19 eX-Corgh wrote:
lol why make 8 rax vs 5 pool? Its pretty obvious. What about standard rax timing @ 11?


With the 8 rax build you can be offensive early game in tvz. it allows you do a bunker rush if they 12hatch, helps defend from a 9 pool and 5 pool because of earlier marines. So even if you haven't scouted them yet 8 rax can be very viable.

Don't think you couldn't still lose from 8 rax aganist 5 pool.

With standard rax timing you just get a later marine and later bunker and those seconds REALLY matter. It will be just based on micro before and after the marine pops out (stacking the scvs then hitting stop and surrounding the marines with the scvs then pushing the lings untill you get a bunker up)

Charlie is just trying to show how the best way to defend and the BO comes first.
hoorah
Biff The Understudy
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
France8010 Posts
November 27 2008 11:56 GMT
#16
The terran one is retarded: everybody can stop a 4 pool with 8 rax. The problem is: you don't know that 4 pool is coming and you go 11 rax.

And you die.
The fellow who is out to burn things up is the counterpart of the fool who thinks he can save the world. The world needs neither to be burned up nor to be saved. The world is, we are. Transients, if we buck it; here to stay if we accept it. ~H.Miller
CharlieMurphy
Profile Blog Joined March 2006
United States22895 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-11-27 12:13:36
November 27 2008 12:08 GMT
#17
On November 27 2008 20:56 Biff The Understudy wrote:
The terran one is retarded: everybody can stop a 4 pool with 8 rax. The problem is: you don't know that 4 pool is coming and you go 11 rax.

And you die.

On bb I always open with 9rax/10depot vs zerg or random sometimes even vs protoss. Its perfectly viable and will stop a 5pool (i'm pretty sure) but 8rax is guaranteed to stop the 4pool.
If they don't rush when I 9 rax I just make 1 marine and a 2nd barracks/depot sooner.

It's pretty hard to fit all the 'what ifs' into the video, it would just be an endless stream of tangents (sorta like a combat-X vid, but actually correct).
Basically all these builds are pretty safe to open with vs anything. That was the point of all the videos.

btw, I've never opened 11rax on BB.
..and then I would, ya know, check em'. (Aka SpoR)
Naib
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Hungary4861 Posts
November 27 2008 14:25 GMT
#18
Your micro blows CM, especially with Protoss
Complete the cycle!
koreasilver
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
9109 Posts
November 27 2008 14:33 GMT
#19
I think a lot of people ignored the fact that all these were done on Blood Bath. 11rax'ing against a zerg in BB is suicide.
Trozz
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Canada3456 Posts
November 27 2008 17:35 GMT
#20
Depends on the map.
Not everyone scouts early.
I don't blood bath often.
A build is not a guess, an estimation or a hunch, a feeling, or a foolish intuition. A build is a dependable, unwavering, unarguably accurate, portrayer of your ambition.
1 2 3 4 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
OSC
18:00
OSC Elite Rising Star #18
SteadfastSC165
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
elazer 192
SteadfastSC 165
mouzHeroMarine 160
SpeCial 121
UpATreeSC 113
JuggernautJason64
MindelVK 35
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 13782
Calm 2745
EffOrt 551
Horang2 415
Shuttle 300
ggaemo 72
Backho 54
HiyA 40
soO 21
ivOry 5
Dota 2
Gorgc8695
Counter-Strike
fl0m1554
Other Games
summit1g5208
tarik_tv3092
Grubby2310
B2W.Neo952
Beastyqt673
ArmadaUGS134
C9.Mang0118
mouzStarbuck85
QueenE62
Mew2King52
Trikslyr51
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1879
BasetradeTV28
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 19 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• IndyKCrew
• sooper7s
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• intothetv
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• RayReign 16
• 80smullet 8
• ZZZeroYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 1538
• WagamamaTV550
League of Legends
• Nemesis4377
• TFBlade814
Other Games
• Scarra1344
• imaqtpie984
• Shiphtur140
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
4h 15m
WardiTV Team League
16h 15m
Big Brain Bouts
21h 15m
Fjant vs SortOf
YoungYakov vs Krystianer
Reynor vs HeRoMaRinE
RSL Revival
1d 14h
Cure vs Zoun
herO vs Rogue
WardiTV Team League
1d 16h
Platinum Heroes Events
1d 19h
BSL
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
ByuN vs Maru
MaxPax vs TriGGeR
WardiTV Team League
2 days
BSL
2 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Afreeca Starleague
3 days
Light vs Calm
Royal vs Mind
Wardi Open
3 days
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
OSC
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
Afreeca Starleague
4 days
Rush vs PianO
Flash vs Speed
Replay Cast
5 days
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
BeSt vs Leta
Queen vs Jaedong
Replay Cast
6 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-03-25
WardiTV Winter 2026
Underdog Cup #3

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
BSL Season 22
CSL Elite League 2026
CSL Season 20: Qualifier 1
ASL Season 21
Acropolis #4 - TS6
RSL Revival: Season 4
Nations Cup 2026
NationLESS Cup
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual

Upcoming

2026 Changsha Offline CUP
CSL Season 20: Qualifier 2
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.