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Poll: Would you sell your principles?
(Vote): Never!
(Vote): Yes.
(Vote): How much will you pay?
I mean, let us say, you have to do something as innocuous as filling out a questionnaire for work. For example, let's say it has something disagreeable that you personally disagree with. I think, based on the high thread, that many have liberal attitudes about drugs. Many questionnaires of course expect you to take a stance against drugs. I know how I'm voting after the many I've done. It seems most 'intelligent' people in real life claim they'd never give up on their principles, but maybe a different truth is found in teh intrawebz?
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You must be the change you wish to see in the world. Ghandi would be very disappointed in all of you
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so you mean lie?
i lie in some situations
drugs is a good example
and I see nothing wrong with the lying
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It depends on what the principles are. Many ones I'm not very passionate about, then sure, no problem. But the ones I abide my life through, my beliefs, major morals, then I probably wouldn't. Living a life you disagree with can't be paid for...
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United States44205 Posts
I think you can't choose to act against your principles. If you do then your principles are simply not what you thought they were. In cases where you sell them often you're acting for the greater good in doing it and therefore your principles are redefined but the spirit behind them are preserved.
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Only 5-10% of all people act on universal principles, the rest is lying.
I honestly don't know if I belong to that 5% because I've never been in one of these situations as far as I know. I'd like to think I do but every human underestimates positional factors, so I'm probably no exception.
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Well I don't really have any principles, my opinion on things change all the time.
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On November 11 2008 08:41 Kwark wrote:
I think you can't choose to act against your principles. If you do then your principles are simply not what you thought they were. In cases where you sell them often you're acting for the greater good in doing it and therefore your principles are redefined but the spirit behind them are preserved.
There's truth to this, but I don't think it's always true. I think that usually "selling out your principles" means either you hurt yourself in the long term to get a short term gain, or hurt other people in order to help yourself (or both). For example, suppose someone offered to pay you a large sum of money in order to humiliate yourself. The money would help in the short term, but then it would run out, and you'd be left with the shame forever.
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OP, you example doesn't really have anything to do with principals.... I really think to need to define what a principal is. I guess maybe, if your principal is to be constantly honest and never lie, you're going to have a tough time if you also break the law. But most people don't really care about lying to people they don't know, especially when they're not being asked face to face, and in a personal setting.
My principals are to pursue pleasure, and evade pain. I will always follow those goals, no matter what. Being honest all the time with people I care about is something I do, but it's not because I'm such a moral upright guy. It's because it keeps me out of trouble, and I don't like living in a world where I can't be sure the people I care about like me, or like what I tell them.
If I had principals, they would be sold as soon as they became detrimental to my goals.
You might think that's a very dangerous way to think, because it almost sounds like the instant I can, I will screw over anyone I know if it will benefit me. You'd be right, except that screwing people over is not beneficial very often. People need to be able to trust you. I need to be able to live in a society where people like me. Screwing them over won't help that.
So in a sense... I'd say the whole idea is meaningless. Even if people say I'm the type of guy who sticks to his principals, I think these people are wrong. When I take an activist stance against something, it's purely for my own benefit, not some ludicrous arbitrary divine idea from the heavens.
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There is such a thing as being practical. If not selling out your principles means you are breaking the law and will be caught, then clearly you have to sell out your principles.
Here is an example. I am opposed to dishonesty, in all forms. And yet I lie about doing drugs sometimes. Why? I don't want to go to jail. It is selfish but practical.
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Only 5-10% of all people act on universal principles, the rest is lying.
I love made up numbers.
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On November 11 2008 08:41 Kwark wrote:
I think you can't choose to act against your principles. If you do then your principles are simply not what you thought they were. In cases where you sell them often you're acting for the greater good in doing it and therefore your principles are redefined but the spirit behind them are preserved.
Ofcourse you can do things against your principles, we just use cognitive dissonance to justify breaking them. Everyone has principles and they are exactly what you think they are, thing is that only a very small percentage of people stay true to these principles and the rest doesn't give a fuck, they just stay true to principles because of the law, or a general idea that if everyone would break the universal principles society would fall apart.
Redefining your principles is still breaking them.
Also what is 'the spirit behind them are preserved' supposed to mean, you're saying you can do something that goes against a principle and the spirit behind it still stands? lol
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nothing is never for sale
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On November 11 2008 08:54 Chef wrote:I love made up numbers.
I might not have done the research myself but I'm pretty sure that my professor who has published numerous credible articles has more credibility than a random smartass on the internet.
What the hell makes you think I'm talking out of my ass.
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how do you know your professor isnt a fraud? ^^
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United States22883 Posts
Because you didn't cite anything.
This question is kind of silly. Using the general understanding of what principles are, no one follows them or doesn't follow them completely. You have to give us a hypothetical situation. For a blowjob? Probably not. The chance to give Reach a blowjob? Mmhmmmmm
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On November 11 2008 09:02 Racenilatr wrote:
how do you know your professor isnt a fraud? ^^
lol I know you're joking but anyway:
Academic articles are reviewed by other professors before they can be published in credible scientific magazines.
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lol.....giving reach a blowjob is probably crossing the line...unless you get to do it for alot of money
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On November 11 2008 09:01 Frits wrote:Show nested quote +On November 11 2008 08:54 Chef wrote:Only 5-10% of all people act on universal principles, the rest is lying. I love made up numbers. I might not have done the research myself but I'm pretty sure that my professor who has published numerous credible articles has more credibility than a random smartass on the internet. What the hell makes you think I'm talking out of my ass.
I don't know who was sampled, how many of these people were sampled, or how often they were sampled, or at what time of the year, and a host of other factors. The stat you gave is basically the same as me saying "Oh well, 99% of Canadians brush their teeth daily." I don't know that. I'd hope so, but even if I took a sample of 99 students at my university, the study is already botched because university students are not really representative of all Canadians.
Basically, you gave so little information, that the stat sounded completely made up and bullshit. The fact that you haven't done the research yourself (by that I mean, looking into it to see how credible it is) means you basically don't know what the fuck you're talking about. Statistics are meaningless if you don't know where they came from. The law of natural distribution, the law of large numbers, and the law of regularity. If you can't confirm all three of these in a statistic, do not use it. Even academically obtained statistics need to be scrutinized. Studies often contradict each other. Until you have 99 quality, thoughtful studies saying one thing, and only 1 saying the opposite, you can't really draw any reliable conclusions, and so therefore you shouldn't try to.
You can call me a smart ass if you want. That's not why I rant about it. I rant about it because it really fucking pisses me off when people use stats improperly, because they're so powerful in warping the minds of lazy people.
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whay if he just doestn know any better?
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EPT
