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Braavos36375 Posts
A recent debate about Pro's and their achievements has led to me making this thread about the implications of greatness and how achievement is measured:
By "which would you rather have" i mean "which would you think is a bigger accomplishment" rather than which would you personally rather have.
Poll: Which would you rather have?
(Vote): 1 OSL win, 2 OSL group stage losses
(Vote): 3 OSL third places
Which career would you rather have?
This is simplified, I didn't have time to compile a list of achievements, so for the purpose of these polls go with whats stated:
Poll: Which Zerg career?
(Vote): Like July: 2 OSL win, lots of OSLs
(Vote): Like Yellow: MANY OSL 2nd place, lots of OSLs
Poll: Which Terran Career?
(Vote): Like Casy: 1 OSL win, a few of OSLs
(Vote): Like Midas: Many OSL semis, lots of OSLs
Poll: Trade 1 OSL Win For...
(Vote): 2 Second Places
(Vote): 3 Second Places
(Vote): 5 Second Places
(Vote): 10 Second Places
(Vote): 50 Second Places
(Vote): Every Second Place Imaginable
(Vote): Never
Thanks for your replies and hopefully this will create some good discussion.
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1 win over 1000 participations
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I agree. People remember champions, not runner-ups.
So one title > 10 second places, imo.
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None for toss eh?
well fuck you.
Anytime's journey to win his osl championship and his 2nd place finish is probably the most memorable line of series to me.
Boxer's set of games in which he rose to get his first 2 osl titles, not as memorable, just the finals he participated in were.
Casy is equivalent to sync in terms of recognition.(so many similiarites, shitty tvp ftw??) That final was hardly memorable, except the first game in which chojja won, now that was craazy.
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Germany / USA16648 Posts
You simplify too much, Midas for example was in semis ONCE, how can you make many out of once?
I might as well base my argument on the non-simplified facts. YellOw didn't have many OSL 2nd places, he only got two, plus a couple of third places. YellOw ain't shit compared to July, even if you take account that he personally was maybe the best current Zerg at a certain time he wasn't as good compared to others as July in his prime. July also won a KT KTF Premiere League, so that's 3 Major titles against a bunch of 2nd and 3rd places, not contest at all in my books.
Picking between YellOw's and July's career is easy, July 100%. Between Midas and Casy not as easy, hrm
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I would rather be first once in osl, that three times third place. Winning it all is what it matters to me, and I guess you gain more respect. However I do respect players who are consistent, and they will someday win something (Midas, GF).
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No one wants to be known as "consistent". Consistently a winner, yes. But not in the way you are describing.
No one remembers the consistent people, only the champions.
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Germany / USA16648 Posts
On January 22 2007 14:07 Red_Dragon wrote:
I would rather be first once in osl, that three times third place. Winning it all is what it matters to me, and I guess you gain more respect. However I do respect players who are consistent, and they will someday win something (Midas, GF). GF won't win anything. Ever.
Midas will however 
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Midas didn't got his fame due to "wining" -_-;
He is also known for not having the guts to win a full major tournament, although he is consistent.
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Hong Kong20321 Posts
yeah, wins count more i would say. like goodfriend. participations 91241024 times...and nobody on TL seems to like him either, and now that hes sorta shitty tvt ppl here hate him even more- _- you guys are so mean to him ahha.
but as for midas vs casy...i'd go for midas cuz hes liek so fucking good now at all matchupO_O
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Braavos36375 Posts
sorry for the misunderstanding but the careers are "LIKE MIDAS"
so similar but not exact, so please don't turn this into MIDAS VS CASY or JULY VS YELLOW etc
sorry i didn't know exactly how many semis midas has been in, i thought he was in at least 2
so yeah, please treat the questions that way rather than take them as player X vs player Y
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Braavos36375 Posts
another question i should put up is... how many 2nds would equal one win?
ill do that now
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On January 22 2007 14:10 Carnac wrote:Show nested quote +On January 22 2007 14:07 Red_Dragon wrote:
I would rather be first once in osl, that three times third place. Winning it all is what it matters to me, and I guess you gain more respect. However I do respect players who are consistent, and they will someday win something (Midas, GF). GF won't win anything. Ever. Midas will however
Oh come on even ChoJJa won something, GF can do it IF he pulls his shit together :D
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On January 22 2007 14:05 Carnac wrote:
You simplify too much, Midas for example was in semis ONCE, how can you make many out of once?
Twice actually, but your point still stands. I think he was just using him as a random example though.
As for my own opinion, of course I'd rather be champion than consistent, yet I have more respect for someone staying on top for years without actually winning anything than for a player who gets lucky once, wins a big tourney and then disappears completely (hint: Sync -- even though he totally deserved his one OSL).
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On January 22 2007 14:14 Hot_Bid wrote:
another question i should put up is... how many 2nds would equal one win?
ill do that now
It might be stupid, but I would say none for me. There is really something special to be the best, to reach the top and the first place. Being second, you always know some was better than you ONE MORE TIME.
+ You get a trophy, and your name is written on champions list. Your picture is added in hall of fame (MSL). I wouldn`t trade that for nothing. Even if I was first only once. Being second 10x would still be great achievement.
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Braavos36375 Posts
ohhh shit sync.. i shouldve used him instead of casy
edit: and red_dragon, i voted none too =)
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United States10501 Posts
The victory is most important. There are so many athletes with great careers that sorrow over never winning a ring. Karl Malone, Dan Marino, Dominique Wilkins,, Charles Barkley, John Stockton, Patrick Ewing, Chris Carter, Gary Payton, etc.
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Hong Kong20321 Posts
yeah midas was in one OSL Semi and one MSL semi right? oh ok hotbid i get what you mean now...
hopefully casy will not become another sync lol
and as for yellow hes died out too much and a player like july with 2 big osl achievements and more consistency would be 'more achieving' imho
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Germany / USA16648 Posts
On January 22 2007 14:20 PoP wrote:Show nested quote +On January 22 2007 14:05 Carnac wrote:
You simplify too much, Midas for example was in semis ONCE, how can you make many out of once?
Twice actually, but your point still stands. I think he was just using him as a random example though. As for my own opinion, of course I'd rather be champion than consistent, yet I have more respect for someone staying on top for years without actually winning anything than for a player who gets lucky once, wins a big tourney and then disappears completely (hint: Sync -- even though he totally deserved his one OSL). Oh, my bad: I was looking at Benny's list in the article section and didn't realize it missed the last OSL and since I was inactive towards BW at the time I missed that one.
Anyway, being a champion is what it's mostly about
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EPT
