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There is a 9 player no gimmicks or bullshit game. The Creator starts off with this:
2 Scum {1 Roleblocker, 1 Framer} with 1 KP
vs
2 Masons
1 Detective
1 Medic
3 Vanilla Town
After realizing that the 2 Masons read the book of Ace and will therefore roleclaim on Day 1 and screw the Scum over he changes his game to this:
2 Scum {1 Roleblocker, 1 Framer} with 1 KP
vs
2 Masons
1 Parity Cop (no self investigation)
1 CPR Doctor
3 Vanilla Town
The game starts and both Masons claim immediately. As Scum this is the only concrete information you know, but you suspect a doctor and DT are in the game. As Town, you also suspect this but do know there are definitely 2 Scum in the game. Whether a Roleblock hits a Power Role or not the player will always be informed he/she has been blocked.
1.) The game mod took into account that the Masons could still role claim on Day 1. Why did he do this?
2.) If you are the Scum what is your plan of action for Night 1? Assume Day 1 ended with a No Lynch.
3.) Likewise for the PC.
4.) Likewise for the CPR Doctor
5.) Is it fair for game balance to switch the Parity Cop with a Detective that is Naive or Paranoid?
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Nevermind. Over-reliance on mafiascum wiki.
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Parity Cop -
You are an Alignment Cop with the ability to compare Investigations. Instead of receiving "Innocent" or "Guilty" your targets will be compared for Alignment. On Night 1 you will receive no result. Every night after, the new person you investigate will be compared with the person you investigated the prior night. If they are all of the same alignment you will receive "Same" otherwise you will receive "Different". All mafia are considered same, even if they are from different families.
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1. The masons can claim but it doesn't make them more likely to live or contribute. CPR doc doesn't know which one to protect and the scum don't necessarily know that one is safe to hit, since the setup is closed.
2. If I were scum I'd shoot one of the mason claimers immediately. Worth the risk that the player is protted; if the protection saves the hit then town has gained a bit, but not much. Lynch the next day will still come down to purely behavioral analysis. Frame either one.
If there is a clear preference among the two masons then shoot/frame the more experienced/pro-town one and hope the PC decides to check him n1. No point in roleblocking anyone unless there is someone who is clearly giving off the air of a power role. The alternative is to shoot the less experienced one and frame the more experienced one; this might even be better.
3. As parity cop I'd check one of the masons n1. By d3 the parity cop should have enough information from the checks and behaviour to determine what's going on.
4. As CPR I'd either not take a shot n1 or shoot for scum. Not taking a shot might be better in the case when you don't have enough info by n1 to make a good decision. Any shot that has 50% or greater chance of hitting scum in my eyes I would take.
5. I think it would be fair, since the game ultimately won't revolve around the checks anyway. If the town relies on the checks then they'll miss a lot of behavioural clues that will point them to scum. With a framer in play even the PC will be unreliable.
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1) Masons claiming together basically confirms two townies. Scum has no reason to fakeclaim mason cause they'd have to say their scum partner is in the mason circle with them. As soon as one of them dies the other will be outted and they'll lose the game.
3) Parity cop should check one of the masons -> He now has a townie to compare future checks to
He should claim by end of night 2. Mafia are not going to fake claim/counter claim this since it's only end of night 2.
Or he should check whomever he thinks is scummy night one from the other nonconfirmed players and then keep doing that until one of the masons dies and check then the second mason to get a baseline for all his checks.
By day 3 you've got like three/four confirmed townies, especially if one of the masons die, 100% confirming the other as townie.
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Masons claiming would force the CPR doc to be tied up for a bit until they died.
As scum I would probably shoot into the town, trying to figure out cop or medic
Parity cop should check one of the masons first
CPR doc should prot the better mason
Iftar cop has an easier time as a parity than a parinoid/insane one. A parity cop returns a viable check on the second try, whereas an insane, paranoid cop would need to first check both masons to determin sanity.
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@wherebugsgo: The Masons claim because it gives the Town a highest chance of winning. They've thought this through and know the only sensible way for the Mafia to win is by shooting them.
+ Show Spoiler [partial solution] +
Here is the new state of the game and it look at like this:
2 confirmed Town
7 Unknowns <---All Night Actions should act here
If you are the Parity Cop you know the Masons are Innocent - why even bother looking at them?
Same thing if you are a Framer: even if the PC checks the player you picked he won't know until Night 2. Better off to frame someone in the 7 unknowns and hope they mislynch right?
If you are the PC this gives you a considerable advantage: If the Masons are not lying and the Scum are smart they will shoot the Masons. Shooting into the pool of 7 unknowns just hastens their demise. Hence, you check the unknowns, knowing that if it turns out the Masons are both Scum lying you can check them on Night 2 instead.
+ Show Spoiler [PC vs Cop] +
As a hint assume the Mafia are really cunning. A PC has outs. In this setup the Mafia are trying to get rid of both Masons and cause a mislynch in order to win. If a Naive/Paranoid Cop checks Scum/Town and mislynches the Town the Mafia gain another out. The new state of the game would have a Detective who claimed he got off the correct check, and would have to explain his sanity (that he isn't sure about). Imagine what would go down if this scenario played out during LYLO.
carry on...
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That completely ignores the framer, chaoser. If the scum shoot one Mason and frame the PC's check then town is basically dead.
Scum needs a hit, a mislynch, another hit, and another mislynch to win. (with no losses) A day 2 mislynch is really easy, n2 hit would not be so hard either. If the frame works and the PC thinks his n2 check is scum then town will lose on n3 unless the CPR gets a prot or shoots scum.
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Yeah, scum could potentially frame into the five nonclaimers as well, or frame the roleblocker so he's not suspected.
The best would be to have the roleblocker claim to be roleblocked the next day. Then, have the framer frame the roleblocker so he appears innocent. Bam "confirmed" town.
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That completely ignores the framer, chaoser. If the scum shoot one Mason and frame the PC's check then town is basically dead.
Yeah, scum could potentially frame into the five nonclaimers as well, or frame the roleblocker so he's not suspected.
This depends on what variant of framer is being used. If it's the vanilla version then it's only allowed to make people look guilty. This means innocent checks can be trusted which would still lead to at least 3 confirmed townies by the end of night 2.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
1. A sucessful medic save extends the game a cycle. With 2 confirmed town, the medic has to be targeted first
4. With an odd number of players going into the night, CPR doc can shoot for scum night one without shortening the game
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It is very likely that CPR Doc will not protect anyone on N1.
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Oh wait nvm, i forgot about the RB
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?? lol
as Kita said, CPR should aim for scum as long as there is an odd number of players left .
1 in 3 chance of hitting scum, better chances than that in fact by simply using behavioral clues. The chances will be even better n2, particularly if scum shoot into the pool of unknowns.
Once the scum find out there's another KP out there they absolutely need to shoot the masons. This is why it might be advantageous for the CPR to hold shot until n2.
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It's much more interesting when your masons are 1 town and 1 scum.
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1.) The game mod took into account that the Masons could still role claim on Day 1. Why did he do this?
2.) If you are the Scum what is your plan of action for Night 1? Assume Day 1 ended with a No Lynch.
3.) Likewise for the PC.
4.) Likewise for the CPR Doctor
5.) Is it fair for game balance to switch the Parity Cop with a Detective that is Naive or Paranoid?
1) Masons self claim as town, two townies
2) Try to kill one of the masons, frame someone in the unconfirmed, RB someone in the unconfirmed, you got 2 out of 5 chance to roleblock the doc or PC.
3) PC checks person he finds to be most townie
4) Dunno about the CPR doc
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+ Show Spoiler +
The Scum Roleblocker claiming a Role block is a waste of time.
Kurumi has a good idea.
The reason I wouldn't touch anyone as CPR Doctor is that we already start the game ahead of Scum. As the CPR Doctor all I know is I have 2 people who claimed Mason and 2 Scum.
I won't ever protect either Mason Night 1, because if I'm correct with my pick the game goes right back to Day 1 with all parties knowing a Medic is in the game for sure.
However if I'm wrong, BOTH confirmed Townies die On Night 1. The game would be 7 Town vs 2 Scum which is really bad.
If I allow one of the Masons to die on Night 1, then on Night 2 I have a good shot of saving the other Mason since it's an almost guarantee the Scum will hit that Mason (they dont know there is a CPR Doc in the game). Only way this fails is if I get roleblocked.
If I was feeling ballsy I'd aim into the pool of 7 players(6 not counting myself). However, if I kill a Townie and a Mason dies we could have an issue. With 2 dead Town in 1 night we'd be at 7 players but 1 confirmed instead of 8 with 1 confirmed. Doesn't seem like a big deal at first until you realize with this new information the Mafia know there is an extra KP role out there - now they might risk not shooting the Mason on Night 2 and instead aim somewhere else. But the idea of hitting into the pool of 7 isn't going to lose the game outright.
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It's a pool of 6, not 7, since the CPR doesn't count himself.
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1) It confirms townies as soon as one of them dies, and scum would give each other away.
2) Attack a random townie. Do not confirm the masons for as long as it's viable. Role-block random townies or anybody who claims DT. Frame a mason, see if the DT falls for it.
3) Start with a mason, they are very likely to be town.
4) Consider healing a mason, the more likely one to die, or do nothing. In the worst case scenario, you confirm both.
5) The presence of a framer throws parity cops checks into trouble very easily. A naive/paranoid detective will have the same power since all checks are inaccurate anyway.
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2) Attack a random townie. Do not confirm the masons for as long as it's viable. Role-block random townies or anybody who claims DT.
4) Consider healing a mason, the more likely one to die, or do nothing. In the worst case scenario, you confirm both.
Wut....so mafia shouldn't shoot masons but the CPR doctor should "save the one most likely to die"? Masons claiming already pretty much confirmed them.
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EPT
