• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 10:46
CEST 16:46
KST 23:46
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
BGE Stara Zagora 2025: Info & Preview27Code S RO12 Preview: GuMiho, Bunny, SHIN, ByuN3The Memories We Share - Facing the Final(?) GSL47Code S RO12 Preview: Cure, Zoun, Solar, Creator4[ASL19] Finals Preview: Daunting Task30
Community News
Weekly Cups (June 2-8): herO doubles down1[BSL20] ProLeague: Bracket Stage & Dates9GSL Ro4 and Finals moved to Sunday June 15th13Weekly Cups (May 27-June 1): ByuN goes back-to-back0EWC 2025 Regional Qualifier Results26
StarCraft 2
General
Firefly do had match fixing CN community: Firefly accused of suspicious activities The SCII GOAT: A statistical Evaluation How does the number of casters affect your enjoyment of esports? Serious Question: Mech
Tourneys
$3,500 WardiTV European League 2025 Bellum Gens Elite: Stara Zagora 2025 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament SOOPer7s Showmatches 2025 Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2)
Strategy
[G] Darkgrid Layout Simple Questions Simple Answers [G] PvT Cheese: 13 Gate Proxy Robo
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 477 Slow and Steady Mutation # 476 Charnel House Mutation # 475 Hard Target Mutation # 474 Futile Resistance
Brood War
General
BGH auto balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Mihu vs Korea Players Statistics BW General Discussion Will foreigners ever be able to challenge Koreans? [BSL20] ProLeague: Bracket Stage & Dates
Tourneys
[ASL19] Grand Finals NA Team League 6/8/2025 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL20] ProLeague Bracket Stage - Day 2
Strategy
I am doing this better than progamers do. [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread What do you want from future RTS games? Armies of Exigo - YesYes? Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
LiquidLegends to reintegrate into TL.net
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Vape Nation Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
Maru Fan Club Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Korean Music Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Cognitive styles x game perf…
TrAiDoS
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
I was completely wrong ab…
jameswatts
Need Your Help/Advice
Glider
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Poker
Nebuchad
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 22178 users

[M] (2v2) Fields of Strife

Forum Index > SC2 Maps & Custom Games
Post a Reply
1 2 Next All
Apom
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
France655 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-11-10 19:49:47
October 18 2011 17:48 GMT
#1
[image loading]


Fields of Strife - 144x174 - available on NA, EU and SEA

He who sowed strife shall reap strife.


Made by : Apom


+ Show Spoiler [current overview (v0.15)] +

[image loading]


+ Show Spoiler [angled overview] +

[image loading]


+ Show Spoiler [v0.6 overview] +

[image loading]


+ Show Spoiler [v0.4 overview] +

[image loading]


+ Show Spoiler [major changes from v0.1 to v0.4] +

[image loading]


+ Show Spoiler [v0.1 overview] +

[image loading]


+ Show Spoiler [initial sketchy overview] +

Numbers in orange indicate cliff level (3 = high ground, 1 = low ground).
Brown blocks are destructible rocks.
Pink represents starting locations, and Xel'Naga watchtowers.
Blue and yellow dashes are mineral deposits.

[image loading]


Introduction

Following the anouncement of the TL mapping contest, I decided to participate and give some love to team maps, and in particular 2v2 maps. This is also my first attempt at using the editor, so this is a learning experience and all feedback is welcome !

Rush distance

It takes 36 seconds for a SCV to travel between the main ramps.
For reference :
- Current 2v2 ladder pool is 32.5 seconds on average (from 19s on Boneyard close positions to 43 seconds on Tyrador Keep open ramp).
- All-time 2v2 Blizzard maps are 32.7 seconds on average (min/max unchanged, but Gutterhulk is also 43 seconds).

Aesthetics

The map is entirely built with the Agria tileset. There has to be hospitable planets out there ^_^

There are currently 1474 doodads, two thirds of which are some fort of vegetation.

Some real-life pictures that may relate to this map :
- low ground : Sabarmati River floodlands (India)
- middle ground : Val Terbi (Switzerland)
- high ground : South Dakota high plains (USA)

Pretty pictures

+ Show Spoiler [in-base naturals] +
In-base natural expansions are on the low ground and vulnerable to air attacks. A mid-height ridge on the extremity of the cliff allows reapers to avoid the ramp if they desire so.

[image loading]

[image loading]


+ Show Spoiler [side expansions] +

Each side has an high ground expansion that is reasonably easy to defend, and a much more open one on the other side which is high yield.

[image loading]


+ Show Spoiler [central expansions] +

There are high yield expansions on each side of the main path, which overlooks them. Rocks block the ramp from one side, while the ramp from the opposing side is open.

[image loading]
Callynn
Profile Joined December 2010
Netherlands917 Posts
October 18 2011 18:51 GMT
#2
Unless if they are intended, you should get rid of those straight lines in your cliffs. They make the map appear unnatural. I will not comment on the textures, because they simply don't seem to be finished, but getting those cliffs to appear natural is important before going into the balancing and copying the symmetry.

I like it that you chose such a pristine, untouched terraformed human colony as a tileset because although it looks very pretty, it's not very commonly used (people prefer alien jungles and barren wastelands appearantly).

Good luck with your project, it seems that you still have a lot of work ahead of you.
Comparing BW with SCII is like comparing a beautiful three-master sailing ship with a modern battlecruiser. Both are beautiful in their own way, both perform the same task, but they are worlds apart in how they are built and how they are steered.
Apom
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
France655 Posts
October 19 2011 05:01 GMT
#3
Thanks for your input, I am hunting down straight cliffs and only have one left now (annoying to get rid of though). Textures are unfinished indeed, the only signifcant effort I have made in that regard is on the outer gold bases. They are probably the next step.

In the meantime, I added an actual overview to the OP : overview.
a176
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Canada6688 Posts
October 19 2011 05:17 GMT
#4
did you just draw an angry guy throwing something and make it into a map?
starleague forever
Proko
Profile Joined February 2011
United States1022 Posts
October 19 2011 05:40 GMT
#5
I think the map is too expansion light, also why such a long walk to the second back nat?
Caster duos should compliment each others' strengths. "You look very handsome today, Tasteless."
EatThePath
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
United States3943 Posts
October 19 2011 09:11 GMT
#6
The center is way too choky, let alone for a 2v2 map. I would fill in most or all of the 4 void spaces there to create enough room for maxed out armies for 4 players.

Also, terran drops will be outrageous cause they can shoot either main mineral line from below the cliff, meaning they are in zero danger. Not sure how to fix this without using up way too much space.
Comprehensive strategic intention: DNE
Hassybaby
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom10823 Posts
October 19 2011 09:19 GMT
#7
Can you build on the crops?
"These guys are mindfucking me into a sex coma" | "Mayonnaise is a must-have lubricant when performing necrophilia"
Apom
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
France655 Posts
October 19 2011 13:30 GMT
#8
Hey guys, thanks for the input !

On October 19 2011 14:17 a176 wrote:
did you just draw an angry guy throwing something and make it into a map?

Uh, no ?

On October 19 2011 14:40 Proko wrote:
I think the map is too expansion light, also why such a long walk to the second back nat?

I'm not sure about expansions. There is a total of 7 bases per team, it is exactly the same as every 4 player 2v2 map, except Monlyth Ridge / Arid Wastes (which only have 6) and Twilight Fortress (9, and Blizzard stated it was too much when they retired the map from the ladder pool).

I agree on the long walk, I will be reworking that part so there is a ramp to provide faster access to the player who is far from the other back expansion.

On October 19 2011 18:11 EatThePath wrote:
The center is way too choky, let alone for a 2v2 map. I would fill in most or all of the 4 void spaces there to create enough room for maxed out armies for 4 players.

Also, terran drops will be outrageous cause they can shoot either main mineral line from below the cliff, meaning they are in zero danger. Not sure how to fix this without using up way too much space.

You are right on the chokyness. I will make some room there.

Regarding Terran drops, I think the shorter walk distance (see above) will help defending. However, I rarely see drop play in 2v2, much less so than in 1v1. Maybe it's because you only need half of your team to go for some air tech to counter them, while in 1v1 you obviously need all of your team to do so.

On October 19 2011 18:19 Hassybaby wrote:
Can you build on the crops?

Crops that are inside the area of play, such as in the bottom right expansion, are buildable. The yellow-ish crops that surround the island are here for aesthetic purposes, and are unreachable.
Apom
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
France655 Posts
October 19 2011 20:36 GMT
#9
Update !

I went ahead and added a ramp in the back of the base. The blocked expansion has been reworked as part of this modification, you can see the result in this picture. I also cut the part of the ridge than linked the two natural bases, and flipped the main mineral line to reduce exposure to drops.

I also slightly enlarged the central path. I may enlarge it further later on, but I don't think I'll act before some testing has been conducted. I also did some detailing here and there, and will do some more before I publish a beta version. In the meantime, there is an updated overview. I have not started on essential texturing yet, so please give me all the feedback you may have on the layout !
Apom
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
France655 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-22 20:11:25
October 21 2011 23:41 GMT
#10
Hello guys,

I did some work on out-of-play areas, trying to find a suitable atmosphere without entirely replicating the same things on both sides on the map. More visibly, I also did some detailing the in-base expansions and the ridges above them. I will probably leave it at that for that part of the map.

+ Show Spoiler [pictures] +
[image loading]

[image loading]


In a more structural issue, I am not entirely happy with the middle of the map. Once all rocks are destroyed, it's not entirely clear what is the main path and what is a side path. I now think that flipping the entire central section of the map would make for a better layout. I came up with a Paint-powered overlay, you are welcome to share your thoughts about it.

+ Show Spoiler [<3 Paint] +

[image loading]


// edit : spoilered because the picture is pretty big.
Apom
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
France655 Posts
October 23 2011 13:09 GMT
#11
Update ! I implemented the changes described in the previous post.

+ Show Spoiler [overview] +

[image loading]


Following these changes, I published the map on EU (current version is 0.4). Texturing is not done on the majority of the map yet, but the layout should be close to its final state. All testing and feedback on this topic will be appreciated while I work on making the map more pleasing to the eye.
Apom
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
France655 Posts
October 27 2011 01:15 GMT
#12
Another update - it's the final stretch ^_^

I measured the rush distance, it's quite good with the new layout : 36 seconds, exactly the same as Scorched Haven. I updated the OP with more detailed information, which I repeat here for convenience.

+ Show Spoiler [rush distances] +
It takes 36 seconds for a SCV to travel between the main ramps.
For reference :
- Current 2v2 ladder pool is 32.5 seconds on average (from 19s on Boneyard close positions to 43 seconds on Tyrador Keep open ramp).
- All-time 2v2 Blizzard maps are 32.7 seconds on average (min/max unchanged, but Gutterhulk is also 43 seconds).


I received some feedback that the four symetrical side expansions were both aesthetically unfitting, and boring gameplay-wise. I also wanted to put a gold base there (as explained in the vision statement), but it was kinda OP with the high ground (which is why it was made a regular base in v0.4). So, I reworked that area, there is now a gold base, but it's on middle ground, and fairly open.

+ Show Spoiler [updated overview] +

[image loading]


In other news, as can be seen on the overview, I have made significant progress on the detailing front. Only the starting bases (yellow grass on overview) are still to be done. Here is a couple of beauty shots.

+ Show Spoiler [pictures] +

Man-made expansion, with gold base in the back :
[image loading]

One of the central expansions :
[image loading]
DoubleReed
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States4130 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-27 02:11:12
October 27 2011 02:09 GMT
#13
I really don't like backdoor rocks that are really far from the main entrance. There's too much gimmicky stuff you can with cannons, warp in, etc.

Also the cliff is too close to the mineral lines. Someone could put a cannon on the lowground and bring his probe back up or something and just deny mining from the base. And with it being so far from the main entrance there's basically no way to stop the cannon from getting up.

Looks like a really cool map though. Better than the blizzard maps by the looks of it :D 2v2 maps ftw!!
Apom
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
France655 Posts
October 27 2011 08:23 GMT
#14
On October 27 2011 11:09 DoubleReed wrote:
I really don't like backdoor rocks that are really far from the main entrance. There's too much gimmicky stuff you can with cannons, warp in, etc.

Also the cliff is too close to the mineral lines. Someone could put a cannon on the lowground and bring his probe back up or something and just deny mining from the base. And with it being so far from the main entrance there's basically no way to stop the cannon from getting up.

Looks like a really cool map though. Better than the blizzard maps by the looks of it :D 2v2 maps ftw!!

Ah, yes, I see how canon rushing from there is indeed subject to abuse. I'm fine with the warp-in possibility, and made some modifications to limit drop abuse, but the canon thing is a problem. Thanks for pointing that out.

To resolve it, I could move the rocks to the entrance of the back path instead, but I'm not sure I like four bases behind one ramp very much (Twilight Fortress does it, but it's a huge map, very macro by 2v2 standards). I'll think about it and come up with something.
Plexa
Profile Blog Joined October 2005
Aotearoa39261 Posts
October 27 2011 11:17 GMT
#15
That back door is such a huge burden map would be a lot better without it - or at the very least with the rocks positioned further away. I think moving it to the front is a good idea. There is also a lot of gold expos on this map, I think more regular bases would be nice.
Administrator~ Spirit will set you free ~
jeeeeohn
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States1343 Posts
October 27 2011 12:21 GMT
#16
I really like the aesthetic; looks really pretty. ^.^

That said, I'm not an expert in balance, but I think the cannon rush comment is valid. I'd also like to point out that with cliffs you get elevator abuse--not sure if you wanted that or not. Anyway, great work!
If you can't jam with the best, then you have to slam with the rest.
Apom
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
France655 Posts
October 27 2011 15:19 GMT
#17
Hello guys, thanks for the feedback, it's appreciated ! I'm glad to see that aesthetics are pleasant to mroe than just me

I eventually decided to remove the back route entirely. The back expo has been relocated in an outside position where it is easy to expand. I added a small ramp at the front, right next to the main ramp : this one is blocked by rocks which should be destroyed to facilitate defending the expansion, although players are not forced to do so.

+ Show Spoiler [updated overview] +

[image loading]


Regarding gold bases : I think that providing an incentive to agressive expanding (towards the enemy) is a worthy cause. This is not the first 2v2 map with 4 gold bases, Khaydarin Depths and War Zone already have that feature (Tyrador Keep has 3). However, should play testing prove that the side expansions are too easy to acquire/defend, I am very willing to turn them into regular yield ones.

Thanks again guys, keep the comments flowing
Macpo
Profile Joined September 2010
453 Posts
October 27 2011 16:08 GMT
#18
Map is really beautfiul, it makes me want to quit starcraft and go have a walk on the countryside it looks a bit like a cossacks 2 map

"Courage consists, however, in agreeing to flee rather than live tranquilly and hypocritically in false refuges." G. Deleuze
hipsterHobbit
Profile Joined September 2011
United States218 Posts
October 27 2011 16:43 GMT
#19
It's pretty, but way too big and complicated.
Apom
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
France655 Posts
October 27 2011 18:25 GMT
#20
Hey guys, thanks again for the feedback

Now that the back expand is removed, I'm going to move stuff around and make the in-base expand less complicated (will not be two levels below main base anymore). This will also save space and allow me to make the playable area smaller, by cutting some of the top and bottom edges.

I don't think it will make the map way simpler or way smaller, but hopefully it adresses at least part of your concerns.
1 2 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 9h 14m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Hui .214
mcanning 203
Rex 146
ProTech88
StarCraft: Brood War
Rain 12281
Sea 3875
EffOrt 1376
Horang2 923
Stork 579
Snow 384
Mini 346
firebathero 278
Sea.KH 94
Pusan 82
[ Show more ]
sorry 79
sSak 74
Sharp 69
Hyun 45
Barracks 44
Movie 41
Sacsri 36
Terrorterran 24
Backho 23
Rock 20
Shine 10
yabsab 8
Bale 8
Dota 2
Gorgc7108
qojqva2734
syndereN318
XcaliburYe240
League of Legends
Dendi1904
Counter-Strike
byalli371
FunKaTv 203
markeloff185
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King93
Other Games
singsing2055
B2W.Neo1629
hiko731
Lowko586
crisheroes458
Beastyqt426
XaKoH 198
ArmadaUGS196
Liquid`VortiX95
QueenE58
KnowMe25
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 8
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Adnapsc2 34
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 4255
League of Legends
• Nemesis7068
• TFBlade1010
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
9h 14m
Replay Cast
19h 14m
WardiTV Invitational
20h 14m
WardiTV Invitational
20h 14m
PiGosaur Monday
1d 9h
GSL Code S
1d 18h
Rogue vs GuMiho
Maru vs Solar
Online Event
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
GSL Code S
2 days
herO vs Zoun
Classic vs Bunny
The PondCast
2 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
3 days
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
OSC
3 days
Korean StarCraft League
4 days
CranKy Ducklings
4 days
WardiTV Invitational
4 days
Cheesadelphia
5 days
GSL Code S
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Season 17: Qualifier 2
BGE Stara Zagora 2025
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
NPSL S3
Rose Open S1
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
2025 GSL S2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
ECL Season 49: Europe
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025
PGL Bucharest 2025
BLAST Open Spring 2025

Upcoming

Copa Latinoamericana 4
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
SEL Season 2 Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
HSC XXVII
Championship of Russia 2025
Murky Cup #2
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.