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Active: 1450 users

Pope compares secularism to Nazism

Forum Index > General Forum
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matjlav
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Germany2435 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-19 06:47:16
September 19 2010 06:40 GMT
#1
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/speeches/2010/september/documents/hf_ben-xvi_spe_20100916_incontro-autorita_en.html

Even in our own lifetime, we can recall how Britain and her leaders stood against a Nazi tyranny that wished to eradicate God from society and denied our common humanity to many, especially the Jews, who were thought unfit to live. I also recall the regime’s attitude to Christian pastors and religious who spoke the truth in love, opposed the Nazis and paid for that opposition with their lives. As we reflect on the sobering lessons of the atheist extremism of the twentieth century, let us never forget how the exclusion of God, religion and virtue from public life leads ultimately to a truncated vision of man and of society and thus to a “reductive vision of the person and his destiny” (Caritas in Veritate, 29).


This is a statement from a speech given by the Pope in Great Britain recently.

I find this pretty infuriating... the fact that a world leader can get away with making a statement that is not only irrelevant, but also blatantly unhistorical is ridiculous to me. Especially when there are recorded quotes from Hitler that directly prove it false, such as:

We are convinced that the people need and require faith. We have therefore undertaken to fight against the atheistic movement.


Reductio ad Hitlerium arguments are annoying enough, but when the premise upon which you're making your argument is completely false in the first place, it's just inexcusable.

The rest of the speech is typical "without Christianity, society would crumble" BS.
Ciryandor
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States3735 Posts
September 19 2010 06:46 GMT
#2
He was PART of a Nazi-related group; and that is different from being a Party member.
에일리 and 아이유 <3 - O Captain 박재혁 ・゚✧*:・*゚+..。✧・゚:*・..。 ✧・゚ :・゚* ゜・*:・ ✧・゚:・゚:.。 ✧・゚ SPARKULING ・゜・:・゚✧*:・゚✧。*゚+..。 ✧・゚: ✧・゚:*・゜・:・゚✧*::
genotyrant
Profile Joined April 2010
Cambodia46 Posts
September 19 2010 06:46 GMT
#3
religion is always has some agenda, I don't see why they can't keep to themselves and just have religion by itself.


athiestism all the way
I dont use quotes
matjlav
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Germany2435 Posts
September 19 2010 06:47 GMT
#4
On September 19 2010 15:46 Ciryandor wrote:
He was PART of a Nazi-related group; and that is different from being a Party member.


meh, on second thought, i'll take that part out. I wouldn't want to stoop down to his level with half-truths.
YoureFired
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States822 Posts
September 19 2010 06:47 GMT
#5
Hitler's entire movement definitely did not oppose the Pope, in fact the Catholic leader ended up being an ally of the Nazis (too lazy to get source but there is evidence of the Pope helping out Mussolini and the Nazis).

Damn you, religious leaders. Keep religion pure and un-corrupted :[
ted cruz is the zodiac killer
konadora *
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Singapore66363 Posts
September 19 2010 06:52 GMT
#6
i always felt the pope was some cranky dude
POGGERS
FragKrag
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
United States11563 Posts
September 19 2010 06:56 GMT
#7
great to know that even the high ups are so well educated
*TL CJ Entusman #40* "like scissors does anything to paper except MAKE IT MORE NUMEROUS" -paper
illumination
Profile Joined August 2010
Korea (South)248 Posts
September 19 2010 07:00 GMT
#8
yes because my atheist scientist parents work for pharmaceutical companies to resurrect the devil and not fight AIDs in 3rd world countries. Although the pills they are giving them do cause a burning sensation...
Welcome to TL - Where Terran have been teaching the Zerg / Toss pros how to play since Patch 11
Zlasher
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States9129 Posts
September 19 2010 07:01 GMT
#9
Funny since if I said what I actually thought here I'd probably get warned or banned for flaming.

So I'll just say that It's awesome that the Pope can say whatever he wants and still have hundreds of millions of followers.
Follow me: www.twitter.com/zlasher
The_Pacifist
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States540 Posts
September 19 2010 07:03 GMT
#10
Meh. Plenty of world leaders have said stupider and more embrassing things. Why is this any different?
Slow Motion
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States6960 Posts
September 19 2010 07:05 GMT
#11
On September 19 2010 15:47 YoureFired wrote:
Hitler's entire movement definitely did not oppose the Pope, in fact the Catholic leader ended up being an ally of the Nazis (too lazy to get source but there is evidence of the Pope helping out Mussolini and the Nazis).

Damn you, religious leaders. Keep religion pure and un-corrupted :[

I don't believe organized religion can be pure. They have the same problems that many organizations have: corruption, greed, lack of transparency, bureaucracy, etc.
On_Slaught
Profile Joined August 2008
United States12190 Posts
September 19 2010 07:05 GMT
#12
Reading that quote is both disappointing and frightening.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-19 07:08:36
September 19 2010 07:06 GMT
#13
The rest of the speech is typical "without Christianity, society would crumble" BS.


Interesting point given the fact that the Church, I'm sure, could make an enormous difference in say building/digging wells, schools, and teaching safe sex in Africa.
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Yttrasil
Profile Joined April 2010
Sweden651 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-19 07:08:38
September 19 2010 07:07 GMT
#14
Atheist terrorists here we come again to conquer the World!

Or not...

Funny how in most the cases which are relevant there has always been something to replace God, Stalin-Communism, Hitler, Mao...

SOOO! What can we do in the name of our almighty God science? I say nuke the Vatican!! That is the power of a real god, I wish you all the luck with your prayer for survival =)
Meh
RandomAccount#49059
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States2140 Posts
September 19 2010 07:10 GMT
#15
--- Nuked ---
gogogadgetflow
Profile Joined March 2010
United States2583 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-19 07:13:24
September 19 2010 07:12 GMT
#16
On September 19 2010 16:06 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Show nested quote +
The rest of the speech is typical "without Christianity, society would crumble" BS.


Interesting point given the fact that the Church, I'm sure, could make an enormous difference in say building/digging wells, schools, and teaching safe sex in Africa.


you're right, non-religious folk clearly don't know how to use condoms or shovels.
Ojahh
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Ireland728 Posts
September 19 2010 07:16 GMT
#17
let me give you my standart comment on that issue



===== Barcraft Münster ===== www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=282905! ////// ♥ Nyovne is the new Manifesto
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
September 19 2010 07:19 GMT
#18
On September 19 2010 16:12 gogogadgetflow wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 19 2010 16:06 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
The rest of the speech is typical "without Christianity, society would crumble" BS.


Interesting point given the fact that the Church, I'm sure, could make an enormous difference in say building/digging wells, schools, and teaching safe sex in Africa.


you're right, non-religious folk clearly don't know how to use condoms or shovels.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/mar/17/pope-africa-condoms-aids

http://www.catholic.org/international/international_story.php?id=19561
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
hypercube
Profile Joined April 2010
Hungary2735 Posts
September 19 2010 07:32 GMT
#19
It's funny how public personas can get away with statements that would get you banned on any respectable message board. Not for inflamatory language, just plain old trolling;
"Sending people in rockets to other planets is a waste of money better spent on sending rockets into people on this planet."
snpnx
Profile Joined February 2010
Germany454 Posts
September 19 2010 07:33 GMT
#20
On September 19 2010 16:03 The_Pacifist wrote:
Meh. Plenty of world leaders have said stupider and more embrassing things. Why is this any different?

It might be not that much different, but given the million followers of christianity, there are surely enough that will take these words just as truth.

Also, for me personally, it's embarrassing that a German pope, who should know better about the history, decides to put something like that into the world.
"Language is Freeware, in that it's free to use, but it's not Open Source, so you can't just change things how you like."
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