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On November 03 2013 05:56 JonnyLaw wrote:
I'm just asking a question. I'm not angry. Why should anybody be taken at face value in this game? You should understand that as well as anyone. There's a lot of time until we need to decide on our lynch.
My point is if there is no mafia roleblocker then claiming to be role blocked as mafia makes a lot of sense.
Why did you tell us you were roleblocked? What information does that add to help the town? From what I see it doesn't help us but that could just be a mistake. This is a serious question and I don't know why you're getting so defensive about it.
Claiming immediately helps paint a picture for what occurred in the night. It certainly helps, especially if there is a town RB trying to block a kill as well.
Think about a situation where there is a town RB and a mafia RB (similar to our game together jonny), town RB's goal is to try to block any scum KP. Mafia RB's someone, and town RB's someone he thinks is mafia. Both people claim to get RB'ed. Now at least 1 person (town RB) knows that the person he didn't RB is confirmed town since mafia roleblocked him, he can choose to either disclose the information on who he blocked or not.
it was very silly of me to expect town RB to come out if he blocked me... this was a retarded assumption i had in my head for some reason and the only reason a town RB should come out is if he is 1-shot RB..
If you are blocked though, why hold back your claim? It can only help town to claim it. Holding back information that you have only hurts town (unless you being secret is important to town, in the case of not claiming your blue role)
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odin, that was kinda my point with my post. so you actually do agree with me...
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What are you referencing?
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RB stuff about you that odin said.
he said he "didn't agree with me" but he actually does since we are on the same page.
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What I meant by that Storr, short of you being able to convince me of believing that Balla is a SK why would town RB him?
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Oh and I remember you asking me about my voting, so while I'm working on an analysis I will answer you since you are here right now.
I came back to the thread just before the deadline. I wasn't sold entirely on Cake anymore so I didn't believe my vote on him would reflect what my thoughts where. I had bad vibes from Jonny so I moved onto him. Balla said this was stupid since July was obv. going through at this point. I agreed with this and changed over to July.
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Truth of the matter is it wouldn't have mattered at all where you put anyways and didn't.
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Which is why it jumped around. I knew unless I was going to lynch myself over July I could put my vote on whoever I wanted to pressure. But I can't actually generate pressure this close to the deadline, which you pointed out. I agreed with your point and moved it again.
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I actually see that as pro-town, coming back to a thread and be willing to change your useless vote.
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On November 03 2013 11:08 Balla24 wrote:
Jonny/Obzy, I have an interesting question for you guys:
If you were mafia who would you be pushing for right now?
For me:
I would be pushing OWB lightly and then pushing E00 and Storr... (assuming everybody but yourself is town). Why? Because OWB is completely inactive when he said he would be, and E00 and Storr are playing weak towns which I would try to take advantage of.
What do you think?
Not sure how much I like this question, since it assumes we don't have any teammates/we are the last mafia alive. Who I pushed would be very dependent on things like that, although it's not like I have any idea what I'd do if I was mafia lol. I haven't really thought about things like that before, so...
Anyways, I was really expecting more from OWB today. My not paying much attention to him/giving him a small free pass has largely been contingent on proper activity this weekend, and it just didn't happen today. He posted a few times, saying "later, probably" - not good enough.
##Unvote
##Vote: Onlywonderboy
Frankly, the fact that he's easy to push doesn't really say a lot to me. I mean, if we wanted to target only people that were sort of #yoloing around, or people that were really difficult to push - aren't big contributors really difficult to push? -_- I just really dislike the question.
Sort of similarly, I'd rather not consider nyxnyxnyx as a vote contender today, since he sorta showed up, said his bit, and peaced out. Pretty sure this is a 100% reversal of my previous methodology, but whatever. I never claimed to be good. (Also, I sort of doubt his ridiculous QT mention was a tactic. It looked like such a townslip that yesterday as I was heading to bed, I was worried he was going to be modkilled by this morning.)
Secondary individuals I would be okay with lynching are... numerous, now that I've rewritten this a few times. Rather, I'm not interested in lynching Balla, Odin, nyxnyxnyx... not really up for lynching cake or Vonthin either. *Shrugs*
E00e, Poofter sorta disappeared I think, :l
I've talked about Jonny plenty already, I'd be fine with lynching him, but it'd be good if more objective individuals were to bring a case on him. I've written a lot about him already, you can just use my filter to find some of it - -;
I hated the way Storr was playing d1, I'm a little more okay with it so far today, although I haven't invested anywhere near the same amount of time and energy as I did on d1.
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Alright fair enough. I've played scum enough times to be able to answer a question like that fairly easily.
Reason I ask though is because I'd like to see if any of our hypothetical targets line up with people in this thread. It's not about whether or not what our hypothetical targets are doing at all.
For example, Vonthin lines up significantly with what I wrote.
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EBWOP: "It's not about what our hypothetical targets are doing at all, but more about who is ACTUALLY targetting them"
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I actually think it's a fair question, I honestly already included a sort of raesoning pretty close to it regarding you night night view post Balla. I'll just quote that for now though since I'm not done with it yet.
Regarding the views on the night kill from your post on pg 40.
I mainly agree with this. It does seem a little confusing as to why they would chose to kill Vane over you. I was honestly expecting Obzy,myself, or you to die. I could see myself or Obzy getting past this night because Obzy is confirmed. If he wasn't on the right track though why kill him right now? I'm intermitten in my availability to such a degree that maby I just got lucky to not get a bullet tonight. But I can't think of any reason why to chose Vane over you.
I think Storr doesn't look fantastic though. So he could be just playing bad town but it's things like this I'm rolling around in my head and will include them when I get my reads and analysis up later tonight.
OWB has been missing for a long time, but considering my own personal availability issues, I'm not really in a position to say that.
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Also, and i'm sorry if this undermines your vote BUT I feel I have to share my opinion on this:
I'm not really ok with lynching OWB at this point... now I do think he's off and quite scummy but he's also not here. Until his return to the thread (he said his internet is down) I don't feel like he can adequately defend himself and I believe we'd be severely risking a mislynch if we did this. I'm waiting on a return to thread for some people before I vote though.
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Ok damnit, this is why I type out my stuff in word first.
All those grammar errors. I could never be a receptionist.
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@Odin: I can think of an easy reason to not kill you. A lot of people think you're suspicious... why kill a suspicious player when they might just get themselves lynched the next day.
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I wouldn't actually apply similar logic to the night kills actually Odin. For me, as scum, choosing the night kill is VERY dependent on who is suspicious of me and/or my teammates, not necessarily dependent on what other players in the thread are doing.
Choosing who to push for however, for me, is mostly completely independent of my teammates and completely dependent on how well players are playing, how well they defend themselves, what kind of mistakes they are making etc...
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Oh, I can see your point. I can agree with that 100% at the end of D1. But I feel like after I had a chance to calm down, collect my thoughts, and try to actually play this game I've been fairly open trying to push a townie agenda and scum-hunt.
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Is there anybody else around besides Odin?
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Today I'd like to lynch Vonthin:
He was already looking scummy to me after Day1, but everything after that too isn't improving my judgment on him.
First, let's look at the beginning of day2, he says he will read up on jonny/cake at day opening and then posts this:
+ Show Spoiler +On November 02 2013 10:39 Vonthin wrote:I def think Jonny is scum after reading his filter after the Vanesco murder Everything Van said in this post about him is spot on imo http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=433102¤tpage=36#708While sounds sheepish of me, I honestly can't add much to that argument since Van made such a good case against him. Since that post that Van made Jonny only made one post Show nested quote +On November 02 2013 06:33 JonnyLaw wrote:
Hey guys, I don't have a lot of time right now but I'll be off work soon. I read through the posts briefly since last night.
Whoever said I was frustrated last night by the July lynch was correct. July's play was transparent and just plain bad. He said whatever he wanted when pressured and his best defense was "fuck off I'm town." Ehh...he didn't come off as stupid so that defense wasn't in line with him being scum. Oh well, what's done is done.
When I get home I'll check the filters again. Particularly intrigued to see when and how people placed their votes. No one has addressed this issue and it's really the best reads we can get from that lynch.
We need look at who joined the July lynch party and when. Examine these facts in relationship to their other posts and we can start to form a picture of the web that got July lynched and we can come up with a better lynch target for day2. If it happens to be me that you decide on after actual fact analysis, so be it. I'll look for myself soon and see what I can come up with here.
In regards to cakeman. I don't know if he's scum or town but since the day 1 pressure that came from a couple shitty posts he's been improving his play and acts as though he's genuinely trying to catch scum. I'll check that filter along with the rest. In this post he says he was frustrated with the July lynch, if he was frustrated why vote for him? When he started on Julys defense it was when July had 6 votes and it looked like he was going to get the 7th we needed to lynch him any second, I think it would be a good mafia strat to say some guy is innocent when he knows that guy is gonna die then he gets cred later saying he tried to say he was town, if he really thought July was town wouldn't he try to make a good case against someone else and then vote for that person instead of making a half assed case against Odin and then voting for July anyways? Then like Van pointed out he defends and talks about Cakeman again.
Nothing about cake the rest of the day... all about Jonny. I think it's convenient that the first thing he does, instead of generally analyzing what the night kill means, why mafia would kill Vanesco he just goes straight for the "look at who vanesco suspected" route... maybe he purposefully killed Vanesco at night to push Jonny during the day. Particularly convenient since Jonny had such an emotional night 1 and was being called suspicious. Easy pickings. I dont' like how he goes after Jonny for voting July... especially since Jonny's vote ultimately didn't matter at all. He was pretty against it and reluctant to do it (which you could say is information bias but you could also just say is careful town), but he didn't have a choice.
He's been pressuring easy targets (particularly: my hypothetical mafia targets). Calling out people for basic fallacies when they occur and ignoring poofter completely even though he's called him scum 3 (?) times now...
I'd like to lynch him.
##Vote: Vonthin
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EPT
