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On April 23 2012 06:29 Risen wrote:
I haven't even placed my vote on marv yet >.> It is my intention to do so, though. Everyone on VE should be shot/lynched. I'll vote for anyone on him. Only an idiot would vote for VE and we're better off with all of them dead.
That includes VE
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United Kingdom36156 Posts
On April 23 2012 06:29 Risen wrote:
I haven't even placed my vote on marv yet >.> It is my intention to do so, though. Everyone on VE should be shot/lynched. I'll vote for anyone on him. Only an idiot would vote for VE and we're better off with all of them dead.
Sadly this sounds like Risen's town meta.
"Anyone who disagrees with me is scum". It's a recurring theme, he did it in LI too.
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On April 23 2012 06:32 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2012 06:29 Risen wrote:
I haven't even placed my vote on marv yet >.> It is my intention to do so, though. Everyone on VE should be shot/lynched. I'll vote for anyone on him. Only an idiot would vote for VE and we're better off with all of them dead. Sadly this sounds like Risen's town meta. "Anyone who disagrees with me is scum". It's a recurring theme, he did it in LI too.
exactly why we should vote for BM
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On April 23 2012 01:16 gonzaw wrote:Risen:I'd like to lynch Risen and I'll tell you why Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 02:22 Risen wrote:On April 22 2012 01:42 layabout wrote:How are you feeling VE? Any thoughts on marvellosity paqman or mattchew? we need Risen to rise and get posting we need ghost 403 to de-cloak we need St.Daniel to grace us with his presence we need Janaan to get out of bed we need slOosh to stop fapping to Beethoven *we need BroodkingEXE to execute som scum for us we need Bill Murray to get his head in the game we need Zephirrd to tell you guys to stop posting shit we need layabout to stop with the puns lead us to victory Yeah I'm sorry. Just woke up. I'll get posting. Posting lots is pro-town and from what I've read I don't find anyone really all that scummy. I'd rather we put pressure on someone who isn't posting. I messed up last game with my pressure on ET so I'm not sure how to get everyone posting. From the last page I do have a problem with mementoss' idea. It seems solid but as you said on this page, all vigs would have to get on board. I don't like directing blues in the first place (i realize this game has special stuff going on, though, so I don't think forwarding the idea is scummy. I just don't think we should do it). Another problem with your plan mt is your directing of jailkeepers. By directing jk away from targets and the vigis you give scum a potential three kill night. They can kill the vig, another person, and then if the vigi target is town they get to laugh at us. To sum, don't direct blues. I think there's been enough discussion about it and with no clearly best plan there's no way to get everyone behind one plan. This post is wishy washy as hell. First he starts by being unnecessary apologetic when laya called him out. He posts a very wishy washy statement like "from what I've read I don't find anyone really all that scummy". Really? That's not the town Risen I know of. The town Risen I know of would instantly find people scummy and try to create discussion. Town Risen wouldn't stay neutral and spout wishy washy shit like "I'm not sure who's scummy". Then he keeps trying to appear more "innocent" and neutral by saying things like "I messed up last game with my pressure on ET so I'm not sure how to get everyone posting". Then the rest of the post is fluff about Mementos' plan. He doesn't seem to have a solid stance on the matter (says things like "I don't like directing blues, though I realize this game has special stuff going on") yet he just keeps talking about it. Also, please note the tone of his post. It seems neutral, but most of all it's not aggressive at all. It seems submisive. Layabout called him out and he seems afraid and posts only because he was called out. Also take notice of the bolded "Posting lots is pro-town" bit, I'll use it later. Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 02:28 Risen wrote:
I don't get your reasoning mt or anyone else's voting for marvel. He's posting and it's very early day 1. There isn't that much to go off of so I don't think he's scummy. I hate lurkers, they always fuck us and it isn't pro-town at all. I'd rather not lynch someone who's here day 1. Posting is pro-town and I don't think we should be scaring people away from posting day 1 bc it just gives people an excuse to be worthless He just barely comments on the marvel issue, but doesn't really take any stances. He keeps up with his "I still don't think anybody is scummy" excuse to avoid taking stances on people. He also doesn't comment on other things happening in the thread, like VE's "case" on me, or my case against VE, or the Paqman/Mattchew issue, nothing. Again, note the bolded bit too. Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 03:04 Risen wrote:On April 22 2012 02:54 layabout wrote:
Anybody feel like Risen is hustlin' us? I think you're making up bullshit to try and push an easy wagon on me. ##vote layabout I'm done for now. I'll change my vote if someone does something scummy but I don't see anything and I think someone trying to push a wagon at this point is our best bet. I'll vote for the hydra too. Now here's the kicker. Here he goes against layabout and votes him, and his reason is "I think you're making up bullshit to try and push an easy wagon on me"... ...really? I already said how this seems like Toad's play from LI. He ignores current discussion, he avoids taking a stance on the current events, and instead decides to FoS someone completely irrelevant for shitty reasons, and keeps his vote there. This vote only disrupts town because he fails to justify it and derails current discussions. Not only that, but it makes it so he can "justify" his vote and just leave it there, so he can fake trying to contribute. But there's another important thing to take into account: Notice how aggressive he's become against layabout.Why did the tone of his post and his behaviour change so much? In that first post he sounded afraid. Laya called him out and he sounded submissive against him, he was the opposite of aggressive. He posted trying to please laya, had a very neutral tone, was wishy-washy and didn't take any stances. Yet now that layabout points out Risen being suspicious, he flips and goes all crazy against him? Really? I don't buy that change of behaviour, it's inconsisent, it's way too sudden and doesn't make sense with the way he was posting before. Hey, remember that bolded bits I was mentioning before? Here: He says that posting a lot is pro-town, yet he's not following his own advice and is barely posting!So really people, Risen is scum because: - He barely posts at all even though he said posting a lot is pro-town and people should be encouraged to do it
- Starts off wishy washy as hell, sounds very submissive and afraid of being called out, ignores current discussions and doesn't take stances on them, posts uninteresting fluff about directing blues while not even taking a solid stance on the matter
- Makes a very flimsy vote on layabout and doesn't justify it at all
- Has a very sudden change of behaviour. He becomes aggressive very quickly while his previous behaviour was the opposite of that
- He doesn't play like when he does as town at all. As town he posts without fear or hesitation, he actively calls people out and tries whatever he can to get some discussion going. As town he posts more and pushes people more, as town he doesn't park a vote on someone irrelevant for irrelevant reasons and remains hidden for the rest of the day
So people, let's lynch Risen
##Unvote: VisceraEyes
##Vote: Risen
What kind of stupid shit is this? By request of jubjub Pac I'll respond. Wishy washy? What the hell do you want from me not even a day into the game? How the hell could ANYONE have true feelings of someone being scum that early on. You can have policies that guide you, such as kill every idiot you see, like anyone on VE or lynch lurkers like BM, but you can't possibly have feelings of people being scummy that early on. Only people who are atrocious at this game would take that point seriously. Oh look, we have pac taking it seriously. I'm so shocked.
You say this posting looks like Toad from LI? Awesome. I'm not Toad. Also, where do you get me being SUBMISSIVE to layabout. The guy was playing like an idiot and I called him out on it. If you count me apologizing for cursing as being "submissive" then you need to get your head checked. How can you go from me voting layabout to trying to get approval from him. Stupidity at it's finest. BUT Pac wants me to address this piece of shit case so lets keep going.
On to your little bullets.
1) I've been busy as all hell, but I've been trying to come in and read and post instead of lurk. Screw it, I should have just lurked. You're right, posting in the thread is anti-town. My bad, I was wrong. I'll stop posting.
2) Not taking a solid stance? I SAID DONT DIRECT BLUES. IT IS BAD. How much more solid does it get? What do I have to do to make it more solid?
3) A flimsy vote on layabout? You right... because votes before a day has passed in the game are going to be super solid. Oh wait. They're not. Only an idiot or scum would try and say something like this. I'm leaning idiot because at least your vote isn't with the derps on VE.
4) I like how you call me passive and then point number 4 is saying I'm being too aggressive. This case is air tight guys, let's all get on the Risen choo choo. Right Janaan?
5) People don't have lives my b I always forget about that. I wasn't supposed to head back to Vegas until next weekend and when I signed up for this game it didn't matter anyways. It took two years to start, though, and I've only been able to read the thread from my phone. Now I'm able to type on a keyboard and tear this horrid case to shreds.
I'll sum this case for all you dolts voting on me. Risen isn't playing like his town play usually is (but lets not link any of Risen's filters and quote anything from previous games, lets just SAY that's how it is and pray people don't actually check his filters.)
Wow. Slam dunk case Paq, glad I took the time to respond to it. Why are you on me again?
I don't have much time, I'm driving back to Flagstaff very shortly. I'm going to cut all this nonsense short and post cases against every person on VE. They're all idiots and/or scum who should be killed.
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On April 23 2012 06:06 PaqMan wrote:
Shit's about to go down. I'm going to write up something so I'll be back in a few hours
How convenient? When does the day end again? Hmm...
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I would like to note the reasoning behind the people voting VE here:
Ottoxol:
+ Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 16:36 Ottoxlol wrote:
He has 5 votes right now against marv's 6.
Is he a good player?
He argued we shouldn't give any info to the scum then claim he's a JK.
If he did not claim and we lynch marv or anyone, then scum wouldnt kill him because he had votes.
This contradiction is enough for me to vote VE, everyone saying he is a good player, if he is indeed town JK he shouldn't have played this way. So I trust you guys on that he is good also that means he is a scum.
##Vote: VisceraEyes
Sloosh:
+ Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 07:13 slOosh wrote:slOosh's "VisceraEyes is scum" case.First item: VE's rebuttal of Gonzaw's plan.. Notice how VE does not actually discuss the pros and cons of the plan itself, but instead chooses to only talk about how unfeasible it is based solely on the idea of a non-cooperative JK (which might not even exist). His point by point breakdown ,which he says is for "ease of comprehension", is actually an excuse to set up strawmen, as he avoids talking about the plan itself but rather nitpicks at each point on inconsequential points. Go read the post. If you can honestly see any of the points being valid discussion of gonzaw's plan, then let's discuss that. But all I see is "analysis" used as an excuse to paint gonzaw in a bad light. No actual valid points.
Second item: VE's "scumslip" catchIf you look at gonzaw's post in question, you will see that he consistently uses plural pronouns "we", and so it would be totally natural to use "our" to describe the plan. Yet VE chooses to vote after catching this "scumslip", rather than demonstrating to town how gonzaw is proposing an anti-town agenda in the giant "analysis" of his rebuttal.
Third item: VE's evasion when asked for clarificationThe post linked is the start of the evasion. Watch how Ottoxlol brings up how VE's rebuttal doesn't make much sense, and multiple times VE evades it without really wanting to flesh out his reasoning and discuss his stance. Townies aren't scared to discuss their stances - only mafia are scared of scrutiny as they fear their scum agenda being revealed. More prodding and VE gives this "explanation" Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 11:40 VisceraEyes wrote:
Because the whole plan hinges on JKs following the plan and I wouldn't in my LIFE follow a mass claim plan D1 giving scum information if I were a JK. To which Ottoxlol points out how illogical that is Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 11:49 Ottoxlol wrote:
I still find it amazing that VE missed the point about JKs and still not responding directly why wouldn't the JKs not follow the plan.
So we'll know who are the vigs, and later scum wont be able to fakeclaim. We already discussed why wouldn't scum fake-claim. Scum doesn't want to kill real vigs first, so the information we are giving up is negligible
Final item: VE's apathy, misrepresentation and fearmongering (no link as there are 2 quotes) Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 15:50 VisceraEyes wrote:
I'm done talking about claiming plans. Anyone who has a role is free to speculate however they choose. You're giving scum all the information they need.
I've made my opinion known. I feel like it town wants to adopt this ridiculous claim plan, then JKs and Trackers are going to be forced to participate. I wouldn't advocate participating in the plan in the first place.
Anyway, my vote on gonzaw stands - especially now that he thinks I'm scum because I disagree with a mass-claim plan. Unbelievable. Note how VE clearly has a stance (thinks gonzaw's plan is ridiculous and terrible) but doesn't actually move to help explain and convince town why it is bad. Instead, it is like "you guys do what you want, I don't advise it, it is clearly pro scum, but you guys decide if you want to do it or not". Why wouldn't a townie be more vocal and start convincing people why it is bad if they truly believed it was pro scum agenda? Why would they be so apathetic? Fearmongering comes in the first line - it is true that this plan outs our vigs, but really - to say that it "gives scum all the information they need" is quite the exaggeration, and as discussed by others, the information isn't that valuable (cf. Ottoxlol's post in my third point). Misrepresentation is in the last line - gonzaw thinks that VE is scum because of his apathy and focus on irrelevant points and lack of proper scumhunting. ( here and here) Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 00:46 VisceraEyes wrote:
gonzaw's response to my vote was terribad. Everyone should be voting for him or explaining why he's town plz.
For anyone who's all like "Hey I don't think scum would stick their neck out with some plan", I say only "OH REALLY FOOL? You don't think scum would be willing to trade a modicum of suspicion on them for the identities of all of our vigs?"
He's pushing a scum agenda in trying to fish for claims, and I for one will NOT ALLOW IT! Again, he hasn't bothered to explain why this information is detrimental to town, and is instead misinterpreting it to make it seem like scum agenda. His whole beef is centered on how this plan outs our vigs, but he has never bothered explaining why that is bad, and intentionally does not acknowledge how it is different from other mass claims because it is actually 1) only making vigs claim, and 2) vigs have the death miller mechanic, which is the crux of gonzaw's plan.
Conclusion: VisceraEyes has displayed a lack of scumhunting, misrepresentation of facts, fearmongering, evasion, apathy to town agenda and illogical arguments. Therefore, he must be scum. ##Vote VisceraEyes
Bill Murray:
No reason
Marveoullosity:
+ Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 09:31 marvellosity wrote:
Alright.
Two things: I find VE's faux objection to gonzaw's case really scummy. It was never backed up by any convincing analysis and it was brushed over by "I don't like the plan"
Second: BH's tunnelling of me makes me despair. This is Day 1. I would really really really love to have super strong scummy cases to make on someone, but I don't. At the moment, I think sloosh's case on VE is as strong as it gets, and echos my own sentiments on how the game has played out.
There have been many more lurkers, but the only inconsistency I have found has been VE's nonsense.
##Vote: VisceraEyes
layabout(couldnt find in thread vote hopefully this is right post reflecting):
+ Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 21:15 layabout wrote:
First off.
##unvote marvellosity
BH's case was good when you consider how early on it was posted. The case was centred around the idea that marvellosity was actively lurking (at the beginning of the game. Marvellosity is no longer actively lurking
I think that marvellosity has tried to be more open and has reacted to BH's increasingly ridiculous pressure in a very town like way.
This BM wagon doesn't appear to have any grounding. It is a mindless vote on a lurker, the sort that usually hits town and is easy for scum to hop onto. If you are on that wagon please consider that there are definitely town lurkers and if you pick one at random you are likely to pick town. If somebody else picks a lurker and you support them then there is not only the chance that they will pick town by chance but the chance that they are scum and they are deliberately picking tow.
Thirdly,
The only reason to not vote for VisceraEyes is the following:
You believe that he is telling the truth about his claim.
If you believe that then you also have to believe that VisceraEyes would make that appalling move as the real town Jailkeeper.
[UON]Sentinel:
+ Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 22:01 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
Ok. What the hell is a "non-cooperative Jailkeeper"?
Coupled with trying to sway townies so much over the course of this thread, I feel no shame in voting VE.
##Unvote: ghost_403
##Vote: VisceraEyes
St. Dan is next on my list. As for Brood, his last post was fluff but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.
VE(for completeness):
+ Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 23:48 VisceraEyes wrote:
K this game is no longer interesting to me. I'm not interested in defending myself.
##Unvote: Bill Murray
##Vote: VisceraEyes
For anyone concerned about me "playing to my win-condition", D1 discussion is ruined and I can accept my part in that. Lynch me, flip me, and do what you will with the information. You'll win with it. And therefor, I'll win. I'm playing to my win-condition.
gg
As you read more and more, the only person voting VE with an actual case seems to be sloosh and layabout. Most people are voting him NOT because they think he is scum, but because his claim was bad. Or they think he is bad. We vote for people for SCUMMY actions! Bad town =/= scum.
Is this really worth the risk of eliminating 1/3 of our blue roles on day 1? Can VE technically prove his claim? Yes. But its very difficult. He needs to have a successful protect. Or he needs to be tracked and confirmed. I personally do not think he is the scummiest player atm. If you do, for all means leave your vote on him. Do not keep your vote on him because he is bad or bad claim. All people that voted for him for that reason, explain in detail why he is more scummy than Marveoulosity or Riven?
Layabout mentioned the high risk of the lynch but is still heavily supporting it:
On April 23 2012 02:22 layabout wrote:
The problem with VE is that lynching him is high risk, but since his reaction to questionng has been to martyr himself i think that right now we should take that risk.
I really oppose it because I do not want us to lose 1/3 our blues on day 1, from sheeping and stupidity.
It seems like this has gained the most sheeping. And people are taking the easy reasoning to vote VE. It seems suspicious to me, also most people are just ignoring and not commenting on the Riven case. Or they are not justifiying why VE is more suspicious than the other popular suspects. If you haven't done this, do it.
Currently waiting on Rivens reply towards Gonzaws case on him. All this being said I will not be voting VE tonight, it seems like it will be between Riven or Marv.
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On April 23 2012 06:12 layabout wrote:
Guys, if you believe that VE is being honest then you believe that he wants us to lynch him because he thinks its in town's best interests.
If you believe that he is lying then there is next to no chance that he is town and lynching him is in town's best interests.
VE is being an emo idiot. This isn't a good enough reason to vote for him. I'm playing what I call the wbg strategy. It entials dragging derpderp townies kicking and screaming so they stop being fools. GET OFF VE.
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United Kingdom36156 Posts
+ Show Spoiler +On April 23 2012 06:47 Mementoss wrote:I would like to note the reasoning behind the people voting VE here: Ottoxol: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 16:36 Ottoxlol wrote:
He has 5 votes right now against marv's 6.
Is he a good player?
He argued we shouldn't give any info to the scum then claim he's a JK.
If he did not claim and we lynch marv or anyone, then scum wouldnt kill him because he had votes.
This contradiction is enough for me to vote VE, everyone saying he is a good player, if he is indeed town JK he shouldn't have played this way. So I trust you guys on that he is good also that means he is a scum.
##Vote: VisceraEyes
: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 07:13 slOosh wrote:slOosh's "VisceraEyes is scum" case.First item: VE's rebuttal of Gonzaw's plan.. Notice how VE does not actually discuss the pros and cons of the plan itself, but instead chooses to only talk about how unfeasible it is based solely on the idea of a non-cooperative JK (which might not even exist). His point by point breakdown ,which he says is for "ease of comprehension", is actually an excuse to set up strawmen, as he avoids talking about the plan itself but rather nitpicks at each point on inconsequential points. Go read the post. If you can honestly see any of the points being valid discussion of gonzaw's plan, then let's discuss that. But all I see is "analysis" used as an excuse to paint gonzaw in a bad light. No actual valid points.
Second item: VE's "scumslip" catchIf you look at gonzaw's post in question, you will see that he consistently uses plural pronouns "we", and so it would be totally natural to use "our" to describe the plan. Yet VE chooses to vote after catching this "scumslip", rather than demonstrating to town how gonzaw is proposing an anti-town agenda in the giant "analysis" of his rebuttal.
Third item: VE's evasion when asked for clarificationThe post linked is the start of the evasion. Watch how Ottoxlol brings up how VE's rebuttal doesn't make much sense, and multiple times VE evades it without really wanting to flesh out his reasoning and discuss his stance. Townies aren't scared to discuss their stances - only mafia are scared of scrutiny as they fear their scum agenda being revealed. More prodding and VE gives this "explanation" Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 11:40 VisceraEyes wrote:
Because the whole plan hinges on JKs following the plan and I wouldn't in my LIFE follow a mass claim plan D1 giving scum information if I were a JK. To which Ottoxlol points out how illogical that is Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 11:49 Ottoxlol wrote:
I still find it amazing that VE missed the point about JKs and still not responding directly why wouldn't the JKs not follow the plan.
So we'll know who are the vigs, and later scum wont be able to fakeclaim. We already discussed why wouldn't scum fake-claim. Scum doesn't want to kill real vigs first, so the information we are giving up is negligible
Final item: VE's apathy, misrepresentation and fearmongering (no link as there are 2 quotes) Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 15:50 VisceraEyes wrote:
I'm done talking about claiming plans. Anyone who has a role is free to speculate however they choose. You're giving scum all the information they need.
I've made my opinion known. I feel like it town wants to adopt this ridiculous claim plan, then JKs and Trackers are going to be forced to participate. I wouldn't advocate participating in the plan in the first place.
Anyway, my vote on gonzaw stands - especially now that he thinks I'm scum because I disagree with a mass-claim plan. Unbelievable. Note how VE clearly has a stance (thinks gonzaw's plan is ridiculous and terrible) but doesn't actually move to help explain and convince town why it is bad. Instead, it is like "you guys do what you want, I don't advise it, it is clearly pro scum, but you guys decide if you want to do it or not". Why wouldn't a townie be more vocal and start convincing people why it is bad if they truly believed it was pro scum agenda? Why would they be so apathetic? Fearmongering comes in the first line - it is true that this plan outs our vigs, but really - to say that it "gives scum all the information they need" is quite the exaggeration, and as discussed by others, the information isn't that valuable (cf. Ottoxlol's post in my third point). Misrepresentation is in the last line - gonzaw thinks that VE is scum because of his apathy and focus on irrelevant points and lack of proper scumhunting. ( here and here) Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 00:46 VisceraEyes wrote:
gonzaw's response to my vote was terribad. Everyone should be voting for him or explaining why he's town plz.
For anyone who's all like "Hey I don't think scum would stick their neck out with some plan", I say only "OH REALLY FOOL? You don't think scum would be willing to trade a modicum of suspicion on them for the identities of all of our vigs?"
He's pushing a scum agenda in trying to fish for claims, and I for one will NOT ALLOW IT! Again, he hasn't bothered to explain why this information is detrimental to town, and is instead misinterpreting it to make it seem like scum agenda. His whole beef is centered on how this plan outs our vigs, but he has never bothered explaining why that is bad, and intentionally does not acknowledge how it is different from other mass claims because it is actually 1) only making vigs claim, and 2) vigs have the death miller mechanic, which is the crux of gonzaw's plan.
Conclusion: VisceraEyes has displayed a lack of scumhunting, misrepresentation of facts, fearmongering, evasion, apathy to town agenda and illogical arguments. Therefore, he must be scum. ##Vote VisceraEyes : No reason Marveoullosity: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 09:31 marvellosity wrote:
Alright.
Two things: I find VE's faux objection to gonzaw's case really scummy. It was never backed up by any convincing analysis and it was brushed over by "I don't like the plan"
Second: BH's tunnelling of me makes me despair. This is Day 1. I would really really really love to have super strong scummy cases to make on someone, but I don't. At the moment, I think sloosh's case on VE is as strong as it gets, and echos my own sentiments on how the game has played out.
There have been many more lurkers, but the only inconsistency I have found has been VE's nonsense.
##Vote: VisceraEyes (couldnt find in thread vote hopefully this is right post reflecting): + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 21:15 layabout wrote:
First off.
##unvote marvellosity
BH's case was good when you consider how early on it was posted. The case was centred around the idea that marvellosity was actively lurking (at the beginning of the game. Marvellosity is no longer actively lurking
I think that marvellosity has tried to be more open and has reacted to BH's increasingly ridiculous pressure in a very town like way.
This BM wagon doesn't appear to have any grounding. It is a mindless vote on a lurker, the sort that usually hits town and is easy for scum to hop onto. If you are on that wagon please consider that there are definitely town lurkers and if you pick one at random you are likely to pick town. If somebody else picks a lurker and you support them then there is not only the chance that they will pick town by chance but the chance that they are scum and they are deliberately picking tow.
Thirdly,
The only reason to not vote for VisceraEyes is the following:
You believe that he is telling the truth about his claim.
If you believe that then you also have to believe that VisceraEyes would make that appalling move as the real town Jailkeeper. [ UON]Sentinel: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 22:01 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
Ok. What the hell is a "non-cooperative Jailkeeper"?
Coupled with trying to sway townies so much over the course of this thread, I feel no shame in voting VE.
##Unvote: ghost_403
##Vote: VisceraEyes
St. Dan is next on my list. As for Brood, his last post was fluff but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. : + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 23:48 VisceraEyes wrote:
K this game is no longer interesting to me. I'm not interested in defending myself.
##Unvote: Bill Murray
##Vote: VisceraEyes
For anyone concerned about me "playing to my win-condition", D1 discussion is ruined and I can accept my part in that. Lynch me, flip me, and do what you will with the information. You'll win with it. And therefor, I'll win. I'm playing to my win-condition.
gg As you read more and more, the only person voting VE with an actual case seems to be sloosh and layabout. Most people are voting him NOT because they think he is scum, but because his claim was bad. Or they think he is bad. We vote for people for SCUMMY actions! Bad town =/= scum. Is this really worth the risk of eliminating 1/3 of our blue roles on day 1? Can VE technically prove his claim? Yes. But its very difficult. He needs to have a successful protect. Or he needs to be tracked and confirmed. I personally do not think he is the scummiest player atm. If you do, for all means leave your vote on him. Do not keep your vote on him because he is bad or bad claim. All people that voted for him for that reason, explain in detail why he is more scummy than Marveoulosity or Riven? Layabout mentioned the high risk of the lynch but is still heavily supporting it: Show nested quote +On April 23 2012 02:22 layabout wrote:
The problem with VE is that lynching him is high risk, but since his reaction to questionng has been to martyr himself i think that right now we should take that risk.
I really oppose it because I do not want us to lose 1/3 our blues on day 1, from sheeping and stupidity. It seems like this has gained the most sheeping. And people are taking the easy reasoning to vote VE. It seems suspicious to me, also most people are just ignoring and not commenting on the Riven case. Or they are not justifiying why VE is more suspicious than the other popular suspects. If you haven't done this, do it. Currently waiting on Rivens reply towards Gonzaws case on him. All this being said I will not be voting VE tonight, it seems like it will be between Riven or Marv.
Clearly you haven't bothered to read my posts if you maintain that what you spoilered under me is the main reason I'm voting VE.
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Risen is scum.
+ Show Spoiler +On April 21 2012 14:14 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 14:05 gonzaw wrote:I'm sure VE will point this out and create more shitstorm, so just in case I'll address this:No, I didn't mean "our plan" as in "the plan my scumbuddies and me hatched". I meant "the plan town would have imposed once people agreed with me". Now, I dunno why but I think I'm posting WAY too much >_> I'll try to tone it down a little bit  He already pointed it out in his post voting for you. You're a little late. Posting from my phone I'll be home in a couple hours but it's a little late. Just read everything on my phone, though. Alright, cool, nothing really wrong with it. No real content and nothing that circulates discussion, but hey it's his first post. I'll give that to him. One thing to note is the bolded though.
On April 22 2012 02:22 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 01:42 layabout wrote:How are you feeling VE? Any thoughts on marvellosity paqman or mattchew? we need Risen to rise and get posting we need ghost 403 to de-cloak we need St.Daniel to grace us with his presence we need Janaan to get out of bed we need slOosh to stop fapping to Beethoven *we need BroodkingEXE to execute som scum for us we need Bill Murray to get his head in the game we need Zephirrd to tell you guys to stop posting shit we need layabout to stop with the puns lead us to victory Yeah I'm sorry. Just woke up. I'll get posting. Posting lots is pro-town and from what I've read I don't find anyone really all that scummy. I'd rather we put pressure on someone who isn't posting. I messed up last game with my pressure on ET so I'm not sure how to get everyone posting. From the last page I do have a problem with mementoss' idea. It seems solid but as you said on this page, all vigs would have to get on board. I don't like directing blues in the first place (i realize this game has special stuff going on, though, so I don't think forwarding the idea is scummy. I just don't think we should do it). Another problem with your plan mt is your directing of jailkeepers. By directing jk away from targets and the vigis you give scum a potential three kill night. They can kill the vig, another person, and then if the vigi target is town they get to laugh at us. To sum, don't direct blues. I think there's been enough discussion about it and with no clearly best plan there's no way to get everyone behind one plan. #1 - He posts this roughly 30 minutes after layabout's post. He coincidentally woke up when he name gets mentioned. I'll give him benefit of the doubt on this one #2 - posting lots is pro-town. But, you don't even have a full page of posts in your filter, even though D1 is a few hours from ending. #3 - posting lots is pro-town and from what I've read I don't find anyone really all that scummy. So what does that mean? Well he's doing what I was previously accusing Mattchew of, not taking a definite side. He's not making a solid opinion on anything. The rest of his post is fluffy. He gives his input on MT's plan and that's it. He doesn't establish any solid ground on any of the issues at hand. His only mention of scum is that "nobody looks scummy".
On April 22 2012 02:28 Risen wrote:
I don't get your reasoning mt or anyone else's voting for marvel. He's posting and it's very early day 1. There isn't that much to go off of so I don't think he's scummy. This part's important as he does end up voting marv with a very stupid reason. On April 22 2012 02:28 Risen wrote:
I hatelurkers, they always fuck us and it isn't pro-town at all. I'd rather not lynch someone who's here day 1. And who does Risen end up voting for? Marv! Risen is full of shit. His only reason for voting marv is because marv voted for VE. But what about Bill Murray? Dude's lurking the entire D1 and votes for VE. Based on just this quote you would think that Risen votes BM but he jumps right in the wagon that BJ made and votes marv. On April 22 2012 02:28 Risen wrote:
Posting is pro-town and I don't think we should be scaring people away from posting day 1 bc it just gives people an excuse to be worthless dafuq are you talking about?
His next post is basically useless but the next 3 posts are is gold. On April 22 2012 02:58 Risen wrote:
Oh, alright. I had read the vigi shot being refunded, but didn't apply that to them not shooting if they were killed.
And wtf? Where the fuck do you get me targeting ANYONE right now? Do you see me voting any "lurkers"? Did I point any out? No. I didn't. Why didn't I? Because I know how early it is in the game. Take your useless shit somewhere else layabout. What's with the sudden freak out? All layabout does is make a little comment on you and you blow up. On April 22 2012 03:04 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 02:54 layabout wrote:
Anybody feel like Risen is hustlin' us? I think you're making up bullshit to try and push an easy wagon on me. ##vote layabout I'm done for now. I'll change my vote if someone does something scummy but I don't see anything and I think someone trying to push a wagon at this point is our best bet. I'll vote for the hydra too. He immediately votes layabout all because of this little comment: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 02:54 layabout wrote:
Anybody feel like Risen is hustlin' us? Also take note of the bold. That's his only mention of BJ&BH.
The next couple of posts are useless. So far he still hasn't contributed jack to Town and his posts are weak. UNTIL we get to this one: On April 22 2012 03:39 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 03:31 slOosh wrote:
Hey layabout I think Risen is acting really off. Agree / disagree? Oh hey look, easy wagon member #1 Why is he so defensive all of a sudden? He definitely is acting off. He's acting like he's guilty of something. He immediately proclaims himself as an easy wagon. But look where he ends up putting his most recent vote!On April 22 2012 03:56 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 03:44 slOosh wrote:On April 22 2012 03:39 Risen wrote:On April 22 2012 03:31 slOosh wrote:
Hey layabout I think Risen is acting really off. Agree / disagree? Oh hey look, easy wagon member #1 So ... you calling me scum or what? No. Why even bring that up? I'd call you scum if I thought you were scum. Scum aren't the only ones who jump on a stupid wagon. Lazy townies who don't feel like posting or playing jump on them and screw town too. Again he's acting way too overly-defensive. Chill out bro.
On April 23 2012 04:27 Risen wrote:
Hey folks. I'm not actually voting layabout. Just woke up, was out drinking last night. I'm going to be going through everyone's filters and I'll make a giant post containing my analysis. It has been two hours since and he still hasn't made his giant post. So far he's keeping up with the thread so I highly doubt he's even working on one. On April 23 2012 04:27 Risen wrote:
Let me catch up on the thread, though. Why are there two votes on me? I assumed when layabout wasn't able to start the choo choo that train died. He's "surprised" he has votes on him and is still convinced that layabout's little comment was an attempt to start a wagon on him. It's been two hours since he woke up and that's plenty of time to read through the thread. Despite this, he still has not said a single thing on Gonzaw's case against him. He hasn't brought it up nor has he made a single mention of it. As of that^^ post he still has not given any solid opinions on who is scummy and who's not.
Spoilered because I don't want to clutter my case >.> + Show Spoiler +On April 23 2012 05:33 Risen wrote:
Honestly johnnywup is my biggest scumread atm Pac. I have no idea why he thinks forwarding another lynch candidate at the last second is a good idea, and it just shits up the thread. Do we take the case against him seriously? Do we try and organize everyone to swap their votes over to zeph even though no one else has mentioned zeph as a serious candidate thus far? We can't do that, we don't have the time. Okay, finally have an opinion. johnnyboy is your biggest scumread. On April 23 2012 05:33 Risen wrote:
I know I was against it before, but I don't see how marvel could be pushing a lynch on VE right now. We can't lynch our claimed JK. It's been stated in the thread but I'll state it again. You don't lynch a claimed doctor, and we shouldn't lynch the closest thing we have to a doctor. Is it possible VE is lying? Yup. He might be lying and be a vigi, or a tracker, or scum, or vanilla. Doesn't matter. The only shitty thing is that the person who is jailed doesn't know they were jailed, so I don't know how to confirm his claim.
Regardless, a vote on VE is stupid. It's just like everyone who voted for me when I claimed a guaranteed sane detective with a red check. Only an idiot would vote for said blue unless it was LYLO. It's applicable here. We can't lynch someone who claims such a powerful blue role right now. Is it a shitty claim? Yeah. I don't think it was smart, but we have to roll with it now that it's in the open. Any trackers watch him, I guess.
I'm voting marvel. Pre-EBWOP I just looked at the voting thread prior to hitting post. What the hell is going on? How can you lynch a claimed blue? This is so stupid. If need be I'll vote BM b/c I'm all for lynching someone who's being useless, but for now my vote is resting on marvel.
##vote marvellosity He shits up the rest of this post with useless crap. But wait!!Despite johnnyboy having Risen's biggest scumread, Risen votes for marv?!?!?! Whyyyy??? Here's why: On April 23 2012 05:33 Risen wrote:
I'm voting marvel. Pre-EBWOP I just looked at the voting thread prior to hitting post. What the hell is going on? How can you lynch a claimed blue? This is so stupid. If need be I'll vote BM b/c I'm all for lynching someone who's being useless, but for now my vote is resting on marvel.
##vote marvellosity He's voting marv because marv placed his vote on VE. I call complete bullshit on Risen. He put his vote on marv because marv is easy wagon #1. Sound familiar?
We got you cornered mofo. If Town has enough sense to realize this then you're getting lynched today.
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On April 23 2012 06:46 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2012 06:06 PaqMan wrote:
Shit's about to go down. I'm going to write up something so I'll be back in a few hours How convenient? When does the day end again? Hmm...
Sarcasm bro. It's been 3 hours and you still have not posted your big analysis. Your time is running out scum.
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On April 23 2012 06:53 marvellosity wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 23 2012 06:47 Mementoss wrote:I would like to note the reasoning behind the people voting VE here: Ottoxol: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 16:36 Ottoxlol wrote:
He has 5 votes right now against marv's 6.
Is he a good player?
He argued we shouldn't give any info to the scum then claim he's a JK.
If he did not claim and we lynch marv or anyone, then scum wouldnt kill him because he had votes.
This contradiction is enough for me to vote VE, everyone saying he is a good player, if he is indeed town JK he shouldn't have played this way. So I trust you guys on that he is good also that means he is a scum.
##Vote: VisceraEyes
: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 07:13 slOosh wrote:slOosh's "VisceraEyes is scum" case.First item: VE's rebuttal of Gonzaw's plan.. Notice how VE does not actually discuss the pros and cons of the plan itself, but instead chooses to only talk about how unfeasible it is based solely on the idea of a non-cooperative JK (which might not even exist). His point by point breakdown ,which he says is for "ease of comprehension", is actually an excuse to set up strawmen, as he avoids talking about the plan itself but rather nitpicks at each point on inconsequential points. Go read the post. If you can honestly see any of the points being valid discussion of gonzaw's plan, then let's discuss that. But all I see is "analysis" used as an excuse to paint gonzaw in a bad light. No actual valid points.
Second item: VE's "scumslip" catchIf you look at gonzaw's post in question, you will see that he consistently uses plural pronouns "we", and so it would be totally natural to use "our" to describe the plan. Yet VE chooses to vote after catching this "scumslip", rather than demonstrating to town how gonzaw is proposing an anti-town agenda in the giant "analysis" of his rebuttal.
Third item: VE's evasion when asked for clarificationThe post linked is the start of the evasion. Watch how Ottoxlol brings up how VE's rebuttal doesn't make much sense, and multiple times VE evades it without really wanting to flesh out his reasoning and discuss his stance. Townies aren't scared to discuss their stances - only mafia are scared of scrutiny as they fear their scum agenda being revealed. More prodding and VE gives this "explanation" Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 11:40 VisceraEyes wrote:
Because the whole plan hinges on JKs following the plan and I wouldn't in my LIFE follow a mass claim plan D1 giving scum information if I were a JK. To which Ottoxlol points out how illogical that is Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 11:49 Ottoxlol wrote:
I still find it amazing that VE missed the point about JKs and still not responding directly why wouldn't the JKs not follow the plan.
So we'll know who are the vigs, and later scum wont be able to fakeclaim. We already discussed why wouldn't scum fake-claim. Scum doesn't want to kill real vigs first, so the information we are giving up is negligible
Final item: VE's apathy, misrepresentation and fearmongering (no link as there are 2 quotes) Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 15:50 VisceraEyes wrote:
I'm done talking about claiming plans. Anyone who has a role is free to speculate however they choose. You're giving scum all the information they need.
I've made my opinion known. I feel like it town wants to adopt this ridiculous claim plan, then JKs and Trackers are going to be forced to participate. I wouldn't advocate participating in the plan in the first place.
Anyway, my vote on gonzaw stands - especially now that he thinks I'm scum because I disagree with a mass-claim plan. Unbelievable. Note how VE clearly has a stance (thinks gonzaw's plan is ridiculous and terrible) but doesn't actually move to help explain and convince town why it is bad. Instead, it is like "you guys do what you want, I don't advise it, it is clearly pro scum, but you guys decide if you want to do it or not". Why wouldn't a townie be more vocal and start convincing people why it is bad if they truly believed it was pro scum agenda? Why would they be so apathetic? Fearmongering comes in the first line - it is true that this plan outs our vigs, but really - to say that it "gives scum all the information they need" is quite the exaggeration, and as discussed by others, the information isn't that valuable (cf. Ottoxlol's post in my third point). Misrepresentation is in the last line - gonzaw thinks that VE is scum because of his apathy and focus on irrelevant points and lack of proper scumhunting. ( here and here) Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 00:46 VisceraEyes wrote:
gonzaw's response to my vote was terribad. Everyone should be voting for him or explaining why he's town plz.
For anyone who's all like "Hey I don't think scum would stick their neck out with some plan", I say only "OH REALLY FOOL? You don't think scum would be willing to trade a modicum of suspicion on them for the identities of all of our vigs?"
He's pushing a scum agenda in trying to fish for claims, and I for one will NOT ALLOW IT! Again, he hasn't bothered to explain why this information is detrimental to town, and is instead misinterpreting it to make it seem like scum agenda. His whole beef is centered on how this plan outs our vigs, but he has never bothered explaining why that is bad, and intentionally does not acknowledge how it is different from other mass claims because it is actually 1) only making vigs claim, and 2) vigs have the death miller mechanic, which is the crux of gonzaw's plan.
Conclusion: VisceraEyes has displayed a lack of scumhunting, misrepresentation of facts, fearmongering, evasion, apathy to town agenda and illogical arguments. Therefore, he must be scum. ##Vote VisceraEyes : No reason Marveoullosity: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 09:31 marvellosity wrote:
Alright.
Two things: I find VE's faux objection to gonzaw's case really scummy. It was never backed up by any convincing analysis and it was brushed over by "I don't like the plan"
Second: BH's tunnelling of me makes me despair. This is Day 1. I would really really really love to have super strong scummy cases to make on someone, but I don't. At the moment, I think sloosh's case on VE is as strong as it gets, and echos my own sentiments on how the game has played out.
There have been many more lurkers, but the only inconsistency I have found has been VE's nonsense.
##Vote: VisceraEyes (couldnt find in thread vote hopefully this is right post reflecting): + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 21:15 layabout wrote:
First off.
##unvote marvellosity
BH's case was good when you consider how early on it was posted. The case was centred around the idea that marvellosity was actively lurking (at the beginning of the game. Marvellosity is no longer actively lurking
I think that marvellosity has tried to be more open and has reacted to BH's increasingly ridiculous pressure in a very town like way.
This BM wagon doesn't appear to have any grounding. It is a mindless vote on a lurker, the sort that usually hits town and is easy for scum to hop onto. If you are on that wagon please consider that there are definitely town lurkers and if you pick one at random you are likely to pick town. If somebody else picks a lurker and you support them then there is not only the chance that they will pick town by chance but the chance that they are scum and they are deliberately picking tow.
Thirdly,
The only reason to not vote for VisceraEyes is the following:
You believe that he is telling the truth about his claim.
If you believe that then you also have to believe that VisceraEyes would make that appalling move as the real town Jailkeeper. [ UON]Sentinel: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 22:01 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
Ok. What the hell is a "non-cooperative Jailkeeper"?
Coupled with trying to sway townies so much over the course of this thread, I feel no shame in voting VE.
##Unvote: ghost_403
##Vote: VisceraEyes
St. Dan is next on my list. As for Brood, his last post was fluff but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. : + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 23:48 VisceraEyes wrote:
K this game is no longer interesting to me. I'm not interested in defending myself.
##Unvote: Bill Murray
##Vote: VisceraEyes
For anyone concerned about me "playing to my win-condition", D1 discussion is ruined and I can accept my part in that. Lynch me, flip me, and do what you will with the information. You'll win with it. And therefor, I'll win. I'm playing to my win-condition.
gg As you read more and more, the only person voting VE with an actual case seems to be sloosh and layabout. Most people are voting him NOT because they think he is scum, but because his claim was bad. Or they think he is bad. We vote for people for SCUMMY actions! Bad town =/= scum. Is this really worth the risk of eliminating 1/3 of our blue roles on day 1? Can VE technically prove his claim? Yes. But its very difficult. He needs to have a successful protect. Or he needs to be tracked and confirmed. I personally do not think he is the scummiest player atm. If you do, for all means leave your vote on him. Do not keep your vote on him because he is bad or bad claim. All people that voted for him for that reason, explain in detail why he is more scummy than Marveoulosity or Riven? Layabout mentioned the high risk of the lynch but is still heavily supporting it: Show nested quote +On April 23 2012 02:22 layabout wrote:
The problem with VE is that lynching him is high risk, but since his reaction to questionng has been to martyr himself i think that right now we should take that risk.
I really oppose it because I do not want us to lose 1/3 our blues on day 1, from sheeping and stupidity. It seems like this has gained the most sheeping. And people are taking the easy reasoning to vote VE. It seems suspicious to me, also most people are just ignoring and not commenting on the Riven case. Or they are not justifiying why VE is more suspicious than the other popular suspects. If you haven't done this, do it. Currently waiting on Rivens reply towards Gonzaws case on him. All this being said I will not be voting VE tonight, it seems like it will be between Riven or Marv. Clearly you haven't bothered to read my posts if you maintain that what you spoilered under me is the main reason I'm voting VE.
Just read your filter, and it seems that what I spoilered was the TLDR version of why you voted him wasn't it? His case against gonzaws plan was bad and hes inconsistent. Why is he a better vote than Risen in you opinion since you never commented on that case (aka why is he scummier)? Also, do you personally think its worth risking a day 1 lynch of 1/3 of our blues? If so, why?
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VOET COUNT:
marvellosity - 2 Votes
BlazingJitsu
BroodKingEXE
VisceraEyes - 7 Votes
slOosh
marvellosity
Bill Murray
Ottoxlol
VisceraEyes
layabout
[uon]sentinel
Mattchew - 1 Vote
PaqMan
layabout - 1 Vote
Risen
[UoN]Sentinel - 1 Vote
ghost_403
ghost_403 - 0 Vote
Bill Murray - 2 Votes
Mattchew
St. Daniel
risen - 3 votes
gonzaw
paqman
janaan
johnnywup - 2 votes
midnightGladius
mementoss
zephridd - 1 votes
johnnywup
At least, according to my calculations.
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United Kingdom36156 Posts
On April 23 2012 06:56 Mementoss wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2012 06:53 marvellosity wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 23 2012 06:47 Mementoss wrote:I would like to note the reasoning behind the people voting VE here: Ottoxol: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 16:36 Ottoxlol wrote:
He has 5 votes right now against marv's 6.
Is he a good player?
He argued we shouldn't give any info to the scum then claim he's a JK.
If he did not claim and we lynch marv or anyone, then scum wouldnt kill him because he had votes.
This contradiction is enough for me to vote VE, everyone saying he is a good player, if he is indeed town JK he shouldn't have played this way. So I trust you guys on that he is good also that means he is a scum.
##Vote: VisceraEyes
: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 07:13 slOosh wrote:slOosh's "VisceraEyes is scum" case.First item: VE's rebuttal of Gonzaw's plan.. Notice how VE does not actually discuss the pros and cons of the plan itself, but instead chooses to only talk about how unfeasible it is based solely on the idea of a non-cooperative JK (which might not even exist). His point by point breakdown ,which he says is for "ease of comprehension", is actually an excuse to set up strawmen, as he avoids talking about the plan itself but rather nitpicks at each point on inconsequential points. Go read the post. If you can honestly see any of the points being valid discussion of gonzaw's plan, then let's discuss that. But all I see is "analysis" used as an excuse to paint gonzaw in a bad light. No actual valid points.
Second item: VE's "scumslip" catchIf you look at gonzaw's post in question, you will see that he consistently uses plural pronouns "we", and so it would be totally natural to use "our" to describe the plan. Yet VE chooses to vote after catching this "scumslip", rather than demonstrating to town how gonzaw is proposing an anti-town agenda in the giant "analysis" of his rebuttal.
Third item: VE's evasion when asked for clarificationThe post linked is the start of the evasion. Watch how Ottoxlol brings up how VE's rebuttal doesn't make much sense, and multiple times VE evades it without really wanting to flesh out his reasoning and discuss his stance. Townies aren't scared to discuss their stances - only mafia are scared of scrutiny as they fear their scum agenda being revealed. More prodding and VE gives this "explanation" Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 11:40 VisceraEyes wrote:
Because the whole plan hinges on JKs following the plan and I wouldn't in my LIFE follow a mass claim plan D1 giving scum information if I were a JK. To which Ottoxlol points out how illogical that is Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 11:49 Ottoxlol wrote:
I still find it amazing that VE missed the point about JKs and still not responding directly why wouldn't the JKs not follow the plan.
So we'll know who are the vigs, and later scum wont be able to fakeclaim. We already discussed why wouldn't scum fake-claim. Scum doesn't want to kill real vigs first, so the information we are giving up is negligible
Final item: VE's apathy, misrepresentation and fearmongering (no link as there are 2 quotes) Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 15:50 VisceraEyes wrote:
I'm done talking about claiming plans. Anyone who has a role is free to speculate however they choose. You're giving scum all the information they need.
I've made my opinion known. I feel like it town wants to adopt this ridiculous claim plan, then JKs and Trackers are going to be forced to participate. I wouldn't advocate participating in the plan in the first place.
Anyway, my vote on gonzaw stands - especially now that he thinks I'm scum because I disagree with a mass-claim plan. Unbelievable. Note how VE clearly has a stance (thinks gonzaw's plan is ridiculous and terrible) but doesn't actually move to help explain and convince town why it is bad. Instead, it is like "you guys do what you want, I don't advise it, it is clearly pro scum, but you guys decide if you want to do it or not". Why wouldn't a townie be more vocal and start convincing people why it is bad if they truly believed it was pro scum agenda? Why would they be so apathetic? Fearmongering comes in the first line - it is true that this plan outs our vigs, but really - to say that it "gives scum all the information they need" is quite the exaggeration, and as discussed by others, the information isn't that valuable (cf. Ottoxlol's post in my third point). Misrepresentation is in the last line - gonzaw thinks that VE is scum because of his apathy and focus on irrelevant points and lack of proper scumhunting. ( here and here) Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 00:46 VisceraEyes wrote:
gonzaw's response to my vote was terribad. Everyone should be voting for him or explaining why he's town plz.
For anyone who's all like "Hey I don't think scum would stick their neck out with some plan", I say only "OH REALLY FOOL? You don't think scum would be willing to trade a modicum of suspicion on them for the identities of all of our vigs?"
He's pushing a scum agenda in trying to fish for claims, and I for one will NOT ALLOW IT! Again, he hasn't bothered to explain why this information is detrimental to town, and is instead misinterpreting it to make it seem like scum agenda. His whole beef is centered on how this plan outs our vigs, but he has never bothered explaining why that is bad, and intentionally does not acknowledge how it is different from other mass claims because it is actually 1) only making vigs claim, and 2) vigs have the death miller mechanic, which is the crux of gonzaw's plan.
Conclusion: VisceraEyes has displayed a lack of scumhunting, misrepresentation of facts, fearmongering, evasion, apathy to town agenda and illogical arguments. Therefore, he must be scum. ##Vote VisceraEyes : No reason Marveoullosity: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 09:31 marvellosity wrote:
Alright.
Two things: I find VE's faux objection to gonzaw's case really scummy. It was never backed up by any convincing analysis and it was brushed over by "I don't like the plan"
Second: BH's tunnelling of me makes me despair. This is Day 1. I would really really really love to have super strong scummy cases to make on someone, but I don't. At the moment, I think sloosh's case on VE is as strong as it gets, and echos my own sentiments on how the game has played out.
There have been many more lurkers, but the only inconsistency I have found has been VE's nonsense.
##Vote: VisceraEyes (couldnt find in thread vote hopefully this is right post reflecting): + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 21:15 layabout wrote:
First off.
##unvote marvellosity
BH's case was good when you consider how early on it was posted. The case was centred around the idea that marvellosity was actively lurking (at the beginning of the game. Marvellosity is no longer actively lurking
I think that marvellosity has tried to be more open and has reacted to BH's increasingly ridiculous pressure in a very town like way.
This BM wagon doesn't appear to have any grounding. It is a mindless vote on a lurker, the sort that usually hits town and is easy for scum to hop onto. If you are on that wagon please consider that there are definitely town lurkers and if you pick one at random you are likely to pick town. If somebody else picks a lurker and you support them then there is not only the chance that they will pick town by chance but the chance that they are scum and they are deliberately picking tow.
Thirdly,
The only reason to not vote for VisceraEyes is the following:
You believe that he is telling the truth about his claim.
If you believe that then you also have to believe that VisceraEyes would make that appalling move as the real town Jailkeeper. [ UON]Sentinel: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 22:01 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
Ok. What the hell is a "non-cooperative Jailkeeper"?
Coupled with trying to sway townies so much over the course of this thread, I feel no shame in voting VE.
##Unvote: ghost_403
##Vote: VisceraEyes
St. Dan is next on my list. As for Brood, his last post was fluff but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. : + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 23:48 VisceraEyes wrote:
K this game is no longer interesting to me. I'm not interested in defending myself.
##Unvote: Bill Murray
##Vote: VisceraEyes
For anyone concerned about me "playing to my win-condition", D1 discussion is ruined and I can accept my part in that. Lynch me, flip me, and do what you will with the information. You'll win with it. And therefor, I'll win. I'm playing to my win-condition.
gg As you read more and more, the only person voting VE with an actual case seems to be sloosh and layabout. Most people are voting him NOT because they think he is scum, but because his claim was bad. Or they think he is bad. We vote for people for SCUMMY actions! Bad town =/= scum. Is this really worth the risk of eliminating 1/3 of our blue roles on day 1? Can VE technically prove his claim? Yes. But its very difficult. He needs to have a successful protect. Or he needs to be tracked and confirmed. I personally do not think he is the scummiest player atm. If you do, for all means leave your vote on him. Do not keep your vote on him because he is bad or bad claim. All people that voted for him for that reason, explain in detail why he is more scummy than Marveoulosity or Riven? Layabout mentioned the high risk of the lynch but is still heavily supporting it: Show nested quote +On April 23 2012 02:22 layabout wrote:
The problem with VE is that lynching him is high risk, but since his reaction to questionng has been to martyr himself i think that right now we should take that risk.
I really oppose it because I do not want us to lose 1/3 our blues on day 1, from sheeping and stupidity. It seems like this has gained the most sheeping. And people are taking the easy reasoning to vote VE. It seems suspicious to me, also most people are just ignoring and not commenting on the Riven case. Or they are not justifiying why VE is more suspicious than the other popular suspects. If you haven't done this, do it. Currently waiting on Rivens reply towards Gonzaws case on him. All this being said I will not be voting VE tonight, it seems like it will be between Riven or Marv. Clearly you haven't bothered to read my posts if you maintain that what you spoilered under me is the main reason I'm voting VE. Just read your filter, and it seems that what I spoilered was the TLDR version of why you voted him wasn't it? His case against gonzaws plan was bad and hes inconsistent. Why is he a better vote than Risen in you opinion since you never commented on that case (aka why is he scummier)? Also, do you personally think its worth risking a day 1 lynch of 1/3 of our blues? If so, why?
The thing that gives me the biggest scumvibe on VE (and I have said this at least 3 times, but I will say it again just for you, sweetie) was the timing of the claim - when gonzaw's plan wasn't going to be implemented. Mafia LI taught me that timing is an important thing - wbg caught VE out because VE fingered Toad as scum but didn't post a case until much later. In this case, taking the merits of the claim aside (my obvious stance was that it's bad), it's the timing of the claim that gives me such a bad feeling. Of course it's a risk, but if he's scum then he should die, simple as that.
Having said that, I just read Paqman's full case on Risen just there. The flipflopping and inconsistencies Paqman points out are very strong - talking about easy wagons then wagoning, vote on me instead of Bill Murray, vote on me when he just pronounced jdub as his main scum read... he's basically saying one thing then doing the other.
At the moment I would be happy with either a Risen or VE lynch.
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@johnnywup: I have no idea why you thought a few hours before the lynch was a good time to bring forward another lynch candidate. Seriously?
I'm not really seeing why Risen is scum. Sure, he's loud, obnoxious and belligerent, but that doesn't say anything about his alignment.
I'm still pretty happy with a VE lynch. I thought he was scum before he claimed, and I don't buy his claim. Even if his claim is true, he's functioning in an anti-town manner. Also, I'm surprised that no one has brought up the point that he's pretty much ragequit.
Marvellosity is still posting nothing of content. I'd be down with that lynch.
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+ Show Spoiler +slOosh seems like someone who had his case fall apart and is too stubborn to take his vote off VE now that he has done a JK claim because he put in some effort. He needs to realize lynching VE is stupid and get off him. I don't think he's scum, but I think he's being an idiot. Sentinel is willing to give Brood "benefit of the doubt" but he's going to vote VE based on VEs trying to make discussion in the thread? Why are you so willing to lynch someone who, while I don't agree with the route, is generating discussion in the thread. Discussion is PRO-TOWN. But yeah, go ahead and keep your derpderp vote on VE. I don't think layabout is seriously voting for VE. I think he's going to switch his vote, because like I said earlier just because VE is being emoking right now does not mean we should be voting him. Layabout knows this. Stop being stuck on stupid. How shocking that marvel picks the only other person with enough votes to rival him as the person he finds most scummy. Yeah, I get it, claiming JK was bad. Bad != scum. I wish I could be ok with lynching VE because he's an idiot, but he's an idiot we can't afford to lynch right now. His claim seals it. And no, layabout is wrong. Scum can't use this as a defense because JK is a very unique roll and other blues would know how to test the claim. On April 23 2012 06:53 marvellosity wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 23 2012 06:47 Mementoss wrote:I would like to note the reasoning behind the people voting VE here: Ottoxol: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 16:36 Ottoxlol wrote:
He has 5 votes right now against marv's 6.
Is he a good player?
He argued we shouldn't give any info to the scum then claim he's a JK.
If he did not claim and we lynch marv or anyone, then scum wouldnt kill him because he had votes.
This contradiction is enough for me to vote VE, everyone saying he is a good player, if he is indeed town JK he shouldn't have played this way. So I trust you guys on that he is good also that means he is a scum.
##Vote: VisceraEyes
: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 07:13 slOosh wrote:slOosh's "VisceraEyes is scum" case.First item: VE's rebuttal of Gonzaw's plan.. Notice how VE does not actually discuss the pros and cons of the plan itself, but instead chooses to only talk about how unfeasible it is based solely on the idea of a non-cooperative JK (which might not even exist). His point by point breakdown ,which he says is for "ease of comprehension", is actually an excuse to set up strawmen, as he avoids talking about the plan itself but rather nitpicks at each point on inconsequential points. Go read the post. If you can honestly see any of the points being valid discussion of gonzaw's plan, then let's discuss that. But all I see is "analysis" used as an excuse to paint gonzaw in a bad light. No actual valid points.
Second item: VE's "scumslip" catchIf you look at gonzaw's post in question, you will see that he consistently uses plural pronouns "we", and so it would be totally natural to use "our" to describe the plan. Yet VE chooses to vote after catching this "scumslip", rather than demonstrating to town how gonzaw is proposing an anti-town agenda in the giant "analysis" of his rebuttal.
Third item: VE's evasion when asked for clarificationThe post linked is the start of the evasion. Watch how Ottoxlol brings up how VE's rebuttal doesn't make much sense, and multiple times VE evades it without really wanting to flesh out his reasoning and discuss his stance. Townies aren't scared to discuss their stances - only mafia are scared of scrutiny as they fear their scum agenda being revealed. More prodding and VE gives this "explanation" Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 11:40 VisceraEyes wrote:
Because the whole plan hinges on JKs following the plan and I wouldn't in my LIFE follow a mass claim plan D1 giving scum information if I were a JK. To which Ottoxlol points out how illogical that is Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 11:49 Ottoxlol wrote:
I still find it amazing that VE missed the point about JKs and still not responding directly why wouldn't the JKs not follow the plan.
So we'll know who are the vigs, and later scum wont be able to fakeclaim. We already discussed why wouldn't scum fake-claim. Scum doesn't want to kill real vigs first, so the information we are giving up is negligible
Final item: VE's apathy, misrepresentation and fearmongering (no link as there are 2 quotes) Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 15:50 VisceraEyes wrote:
I'm done talking about claiming plans. Anyone who has a role is free to speculate however they choose. You're giving scum all the information they need.
I've made my opinion known. I feel like it town wants to adopt this ridiculous claim plan, then JKs and Trackers are going to be forced to participate. I wouldn't advocate participating in the plan in the first place.
Anyway, my vote on gonzaw stands - especially now that he thinks I'm scum because I disagree with a mass-claim plan. Unbelievable. Note how VE clearly has a stance (thinks gonzaw's plan is ridiculous and terrible) but doesn't actually move to help explain and convince town why it is bad. Instead, it is like "you guys do what you want, I don't advise it, it is clearly pro scum, but you guys decide if you want to do it or not". Why wouldn't a townie be more vocal and start convincing people why it is bad if they truly believed it was pro scum agenda? Why would they be so apathetic? Fearmongering comes in the first line - it is true that this plan outs our vigs, but really - to say that it "gives scum all the information they need" is quite the exaggeration, and as discussed by others, the information isn't that valuable (cf. Ottoxlol's post in my third point). Misrepresentation is in the last line - gonzaw thinks that VE is scum because of his apathy and focus on irrelevant points and lack of proper scumhunting. ( here and here) Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 00:46 VisceraEyes wrote:
gonzaw's response to my vote was terribad. Everyone should be voting for him or explaining why he's town plz.
For anyone who's all like "Hey I don't think scum would stick their neck out with some plan", I say only "OH REALLY FOOL? You don't think scum would be willing to trade a modicum of suspicion on them for the identities of all of our vigs?"
He's pushing a scum agenda in trying to fish for claims, and I for one will NOT ALLOW IT! Again, he hasn't bothered to explain why this information is detrimental to town, and is instead misinterpreting it to make it seem like scum agenda. His whole beef is centered on how this plan outs our vigs, but he has never bothered explaining why that is bad, and intentionally does not acknowledge how it is different from other mass claims because it is actually 1) only making vigs claim, and 2) vigs have the death miller mechanic, which is the crux of gonzaw's plan.
Conclusion: VisceraEyes has displayed a lack of scumhunting, misrepresentation of facts, fearmongering, evasion, apathy to town agenda and illogical arguments. Therefore, he must be scum. ##Vote VisceraEyes : No reason Marveoullosity: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 09:31 marvellosity wrote:
Alright.
Two things: I find VE's faux objection to gonzaw's case really scummy. It was never backed up by any convincing analysis and it was brushed over by "I don't like the plan"
Second: BH's tunnelling of me makes me despair. This is Day 1. I would really really really love to have super strong scummy cases to make on someone, but I don't. At the moment, I think sloosh's case on VE is as strong as it gets, and echos my own sentiments on how the game has played out.
There have been many more lurkers, but the only inconsistency I have found has been VE's nonsense.
##Vote: VisceraEyes (couldnt find in thread vote hopefully this is right post reflecting): + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 21:15 layabout wrote:
First off.
##unvote marvellosity
BH's case was good when you consider how early on it was posted. The case was centred around the idea that marvellosity was actively lurking (at the beginning of the game. Marvellosity is no longer actively lurking
I think that marvellosity has tried to be more open and has reacted to BH's increasingly ridiculous pressure in a very town like way.
This BM wagon doesn't appear to have any grounding. It is a mindless vote on a lurker, the sort that usually hits town and is easy for scum to hop onto. If you are on that wagon please consider that there are definitely town lurkers and if you pick one at random you are likely to pick town. If somebody else picks a lurker and you support them then there is not only the chance that they will pick town by chance but the chance that they are scum and they are deliberately picking tow.
Thirdly,
The only reason to not vote for VisceraEyes is the following:
You believe that he is telling the truth about his claim.
If you believe that then you also have to believe that VisceraEyes would make that appalling move as the real town Jailkeeper. [ UON]Sentinel: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 22:01 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
Ok. What the hell is a "non-cooperative Jailkeeper"?
Coupled with trying to sway townies so much over the course of this thread, I feel no shame in voting VE.
##Unvote: ghost_403
##Vote: VisceraEyes
St. Dan is next on my list. As for Brood, his last post was fluff but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. : + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 23:48 VisceraEyes wrote:
K this game is no longer interesting to me. I'm not interested in defending myself.
##Unvote: Bill Murray
##Vote: VisceraEyes
For anyone concerned about me "playing to my win-condition", D1 discussion is ruined and I can accept my part in that. Lynch me, flip me, and do what you will with the information. You'll win with it. And therefor, I'll win. I'm playing to my win-condition.
gg As you read more and more, the only person voting VE with an actual case seems to be sloosh and layabout. Most people are voting him NOT because they think he is scum, but because his claim was bad. Or they think he is bad. We vote for people for SCUMMY actions! Bad town =/= scum. Is this really worth the risk of eliminating 1/3 of our blue roles on day 1? Can VE technically prove his claim? Yes. But its very difficult. He needs to have a successful protect. Or he needs to be tracked and confirmed. I personally do not think he is the scummiest player atm. If you do, for all means leave your vote on him. Do not keep your vote on him because he is bad or bad claim. All people that voted for him for that reason, explain in detail why he is more scummy than Marveoulosity or Riven? Layabout mentioned the high risk of the lynch but is still heavily supporting it: Show nested quote +On April 23 2012 02:22 layabout wrote:
The problem with VE is that lynching him is high risk, but since his reaction to questionng has been to martyr himself i think that right now we should take that risk.
I really oppose it because I do not want us to lose 1/3 our blues on day 1, from sheeping and stupidity. It seems like this has gained the most sheeping. And people are taking the easy reasoning to vote VE. It seems suspicious to me, also most people are just ignoring and not commenting on the Riven case. Or they are not justifiying why VE is more suspicious than the other popular suspects. If you haven't done this, do it. Currently waiting on Rivens reply towards Gonzaws case on him. All this being said I will not be voting VE tonight, it seems like it will be between Riven or Marv. Clearly you haven't bothered to read my posts if you maintain that what you spoilered under me is the main reason I'm voting VE. What IS your exact reason for voting VE? All I see is VE wouldn't be this bad as a town JK. Lynch him. That's not a case. Bill Murray. I had no idea we had someone like this in the game. It's lyter v2! Ottox makes the case that VE wouldn't be bad like that, ergo scum. Derpderpderpderp.
Don't think I missed anyone. I think it's clear that given the options, and my general disposition towards people who are absolutely useless I think this is an easy vote.
##vote Bill Murray
I see absolutely NO REASON other than "VE is bad hurrdurr" to be voting VE over BM. I managed to find a way to get to a computer and I'm not even home. He could have done the same. Should just change the policy from lynch all lurkers to lynch idiots who sign up for mafia games and then don't do anything.
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On April 23 2012 07:03 ghost_403 wrote:
@johnnywup: I have no idea why you thought a few hours before the lynch was a good time to bring forward another lynch candidate. Seriously?
Honestly? I think he's scum. And because I forgot when day ends.
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Risen your defense is full of shit and fails to explain your:
- wishy-washyness,
- overreacting, overly-defensive attitude,
- sudden jump on the marv wagon, even though johnny is your biggest scumread
He is scum. Take note of the actions he's made so far and read through his entire filter, and you'll see how scummy this guy is.
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Johnny's lurking like a bawse.
@Johnnywup: Your lynch isn't going to happen today. Who's your next choice?
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On April 23 2012 06:53 PaqMan wrote:Risen is scum. + Show Spoiler +On April 21 2012 14:14 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 14:05 gonzaw wrote:I'm sure VE will point this out and create more shitstorm, so just in case I'll address this:No, I didn't mean "our plan" as in "the plan my scumbuddies and me hatched". I meant "the plan town would have imposed once people agreed with me". Now, I dunno why but I think I'm posting WAY too much >_> I'll try to tone it down a little bit He already pointed it out in his post voting for you. You're a little late. Posting from my phone I'll be home in a couple hours but it's a little late. Just read everything on my phone, though. Alright, cool, nothing really wrong with it. No real content and nothing that circulates discussion, but hey it's his first post. I'll give that to him. One thing to note is the bolded though.
On April 22 2012 02:22 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 01:42 layabout wrote:How are you feeling VE? Any thoughts on marvellosity paqman or mattchew? we need Risen to rise and get posting we need ghost 403 to de-cloak we need St.Daniel to grace us with his presence we need Janaan to get out of bed we need slOosh to stop fapping to Beethoven *we need BroodkingEXE to execute som scum for us we need Bill Murray to get his head in the game we need Zephirrd to tell you guys to stop posting shit we need layabout to stop with the puns lead us to victory Yeah I'm sorry. Just woke up. I'll get posting. Posting lots is pro-town and from what I've read I don't find anyone really all that scummy. I'd rather we put pressure on someone who isn't posting. I messed up last game with my pressure on ET so I'm not sure how to get everyone posting. From the last page I do have a problem with mementoss' idea. It seems solid but as you said on this page, all vigs would have to get on board. I don't like directing blues in the first place (i realize this game has special stuff going on, though, so I don't think forwarding the idea is scummy. I just don't think we should do it). Another problem with your plan mt is your directing of jailkeepers. By directing jk away from targets and the vigis you give scum a potential three kill night. They can kill the vig, another person, and then if the vigi target is town they get to laugh at us. To sum, don't direct blues. I think there's been enough discussion about it and with no clearly best plan there's no way to get everyone behind one plan. #1 - He posts this roughly 30 minutes after layabout's post. He coincidentally woke up when he name gets mentioned. I'll give him benefit of the doubt on this one #2 - posting lots is pro-town. But, you don't even have a full page of posts in your filter, even though D1 is a few hours from ending. #3 - posting lots is pro-town and from what I've read I don't find anyone really all that scummy. So what does that mean? Well he's doing what I was previously accusing Mattchew of, not taking a definite side. He's not making a solid opinion on anything. The rest of his post is fluffy. He gives his input on MT's plan and that's it. He doesn't establish any solid ground on any of the issues at hand. His only mention of scum is that "nobody looks scummy".
On April 22 2012 02:28 Risen wrote:
I don't get your reasoning mt or anyone else's voting for marvel. He's posting and it's very early day 1. There isn't that much to go off of so I don't think he's scummy. This part's important as he does end up voting marv with a very stupid reason. On April 22 2012 02:28 Risen wrote:
I hatelurkers, they always fuck us and it isn't pro-town at all. I'd rather not lynch someone who's here day 1. And who does Risen end up voting for? Marv! Risen is full of shit. His only reason for voting marv is because marv voted for VE. But what about Bill Murray? Dude's lurking the entire D1 and votes for VE. Based on just this quote you would think that Risen votes BM but he jumps right in the wagon that BJ made and votes marv. On April 22 2012 02:28 Risen wrote:
Posting is pro-town and I don't think we should be scaring people away from posting day 1 bc it just gives people an excuse to be worthless dafuq are you talking about?
His next post is basically useless but the next 3 posts are is gold. On April 22 2012 02:58 Risen wrote:
Oh, alright. I had read the vigi shot being refunded, but didn't apply that to them not shooting if they were killed.
And wtf? Where the fuck do you get me targeting ANYONE right now? Do you see me voting any "lurkers"? Did I point any out? No. I didn't. Why didn't I? Because I know how early it is in the game. Take your useless shit somewhere else layabout. What's with the sudden freak out? All layabout does is make a little comment on you and you blow up. On April 22 2012 03:04 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 02:54 layabout wrote:
Anybody feel like Risen is hustlin' us? I think you're making up bullshit to try and push an easy wagon on me. ##vote layabout I'm done for now. I'll change my vote if someone does something scummy but I don't see anything and I think someone trying to push a wagon at this point is our best bet. I'll vote for the hydra too. He immediately votes layabout all because of this little comment: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 02:54 layabout wrote:
Anybody feel like Risen is hustlin' us? Also take note of the bold. That's his only mention of BJ&BH.
The next couple of posts are useless. So far he still hasn't contributed jack to Town and his posts are weak. UNTIL we get to this one: On April 22 2012 03:39 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 03:31 slOosh wrote:
Hey layabout I think Risen is acting really off. Agree / disagree? Oh hey look, easy wagon member #1 Why is he so defensive all of a sudden? He definitely is acting off. He's acting like he's guilty of something. He immediately proclaims himself as an easy wagon. But look where he ends up putting his most recent vote!On April 22 2012 03:56 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 03:44 slOosh wrote:On April 22 2012 03:39 Risen wrote:On April 22 2012 03:31 slOosh wrote:
Hey layabout I think Risen is acting really off. Agree / disagree? Oh hey look, easy wagon member #1 So ... you calling me scum or what? No. Why even bring that up? I'd call you scum if I thought you were scum. Scum aren't the only ones who jump on a stupid wagon. Lazy townies who don't feel like posting or playing jump on them and screw town too. Again he's acting way too overly-defensive. Chill out bro.
On April 23 2012 04:27 Risen wrote:
Hey folks. I'm not actually voting layabout. Just woke up, was out drinking last night. I'm going to be going through everyone's filters and I'll make a giant post containing my analysis. It has been two hours since and he still hasn't made his giant post. So far he's keeping up with the thread so I highly doubt he's even working on one. On April 23 2012 04:27 Risen wrote:
Let me catch up on the thread, though. Why are there two votes on me? I assumed when layabout wasn't able to start the choo choo that train died. He's "surprised" he has votes on him and is still convinced that layabout's little comment was an attempt to start a wagon on him. It's been two hours since he woke up and that's plenty of time to read through the thread. Despite this, he still has not said a single thing on Gonzaw's case against him. He hasn't brought it up nor has he made a single mention of it. As of that^^ post he still has not given any solid opinions on who is scummy and who's not.
Spoilered because I don't want to clutter my case >.> + Show Spoiler +On April 23 2012 05:33 Risen wrote:
Honestly johnnywup is my biggest scumread atm Pac. I have no idea why he thinks forwarding another lynch candidate at the last second is a good idea, and it just shits up the thread. Do we take the case against him seriously? Do we try and organize everyone to swap their votes over to zeph even though no one else has mentioned zeph as a serious candidate thus far? We can't do that, we don't have the time. Okay, finally have an opinion. johnnyboy is your biggest scumread. On April 23 2012 05:33 Risen wrote:
I know I was against it before, but I don't see how marvel could be pushing a lynch on VE right now. We can't lynch our claimed JK. It's been stated in the thread but I'll state it again. You don't lynch a claimed doctor, and we shouldn't lynch the closest thing we have to a doctor. Is it possible VE is lying? Yup. He might be lying and be a vigi, or a tracker, or scum, or vanilla. Doesn't matter. The only shitty thing is that the person who is jailed doesn't know they were jailed, so I don't know how to confirm his claim.
Regardless, a vote on VE is stupid. It's just like everyone who voted for me when I claimed a guaranteed sane detective with a red check. Only an idiot would vote for said blue unless it was LYLO. It's applicable here. We can't lynch someone who claims such a powerful blue role right now. Is it a shitty claim? Yeah. I don't think it was smart, but we have to roll with it now that it's in the open. Any trackers watch him, I guess.
I'm voting marvel. Pre-EBWOP I just looked at the voting thread prior to hitting post. What the hell is going on? How can you lynch a claimed blue? This is so stupid. If need be I'll vote BM b/c I'm all for lynching someone who's being useless, but for now my vote is resting on marvel.
##vote marvellosity He shits up the rest of this post with useless crap. But wait!!Despite johnnyboy having Risen's biggest scumread, Risen votes for marv?!?!?! Whyyyy??? Here's why: On April 23 2012 05:33 Risen wrote:
I'm voting marvel. Pre-EBWOP I just looked at the voting thread prior to hitting post. What the hell is going on? How can you lynch a claimed blue? This is so stupid. If need be I'll vote BM b/c I'm all for lynching someone who's being useless, but for now my vote is resting on marvel.
##vote marvellosity He's voting marv because marv placed his vote on VE. I call complete bullshit on Risen. He put his vote on marv because marv is easy wagon #1. Sound familiar? We got you cornered mofo. If Town has enough sense to realize this then you're getting lynched today.
No you twat. I'm not voting johnnywup because I'm not an idiot who thinks we can organize idiot townies like you onto him with so little time left. I'm forced to pick from a small pool of people who we can get votes on.
I'm very intense, god... Don't know why I even came back to this. I'm just getting heated again and I'm going to get banned.
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On April 23 2012 07:07 PaqMan wrote:Risen your defense is full of shit and fails to explain your: - wishy-washyness,
- overreacting, overly-defensive attitude,
- sudden jump on the marv wagon, even though johnny is your biggest scumread
He is scum. Take note of the actions he's made so far and read through his entire filter, and you'll see how scummy this guy is.
No one is going to pay attention to you. You're an idiot. WHAT WAGON DID I JUMP ON. I never even placed my vote on marv. Go look at the voting thread. derpderpderp, I'm hurrdurrPaq, I don't actually read anything, I just jump on Gonzaw's case, say I'm going to be away, but actually never leave when Risen comes to defend himself.
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EPT
