Whose Line Is It Anyway? Mafia! - Page 29

On November 05 2012 03:18 Blazinghand wrote:
I don't get how there was every any doubt that Mementoss = scum and Hopeless = town

On November 02 2012 08:58 Blazinghand wrote:
Know I am here, Mementoss! Lo, I consolidate onto ##vote: BKEXE. My vote will prevent your horrible mislynch. No way is Mementoss Lynch a good idea today.

On November 05 2012 03:39 Hopeless1der wrote:

Sometimes people just want to see a 'good performance'

@SnB - I was actually attacking Crossfire because I thought he was BKE's scumbuddy at that point.
When you say MMT has claimed scum, you mean the way he's given up and is just spamming in-your-endo's?


I almost 100% agree with Chezinu's painting, its very lifelike.

We presumably know the number of scum = 3

3 Scum (1 confirmed)
4 Performers (1 confirmed)
3 Audience
1 Host
=11 Players Total
Potential for 4 Audience/No Host based on setup speculation
That means its currently 7v2 or 6v2v1.

Chezinu thinks he's got all the audience. I'm not convinced on Crossfire in that list but I am confident that MMT is either Black or Red. gonzaw's shenanigans makes him being red far more likely.

On November 05 2012 04:53 strongandbig wrote:


umm, hopefully you had some doubt yesterday, seeing as



i just wanted to give him a careful read-through before we lynch him, so i did.



Yeah so what do you think of Crossfire right now? Think I might have a point? Or is there someone else you have a better read on for the (second/third) scum?

and yes that is what I meant about mementoss claiming scum

On November 03 2012 09:38 Mementoss wrote:
buffalo soilder

On November 05 2012 05:05 Blazinghand wrote:
Mementoss sex may have been a bad idea D1 but it's the best of all possible ideas D2. I never said I was perfect-- just that I'm right now, like I always am.

On November 05 2012 05:06 Mementoss wrote:


Thanks dude.

On November 05 2012 01:46 strongandbig wrote:
Now, some of my own thoughts:

- I was reading through Crossfire's filter to think about asking him a question, but I found some stuff in there that I very much don't like.

For one thing, there's the overall fluffiness or what people have been calling his "poetry" - I think it was perfectly possible to play within the minigame restriction while still making total sense and expressing ideas in a clear and concise manner.


I don't like this comment. Why should you be worried about staying in your "meta" - for one thing, you have like 200 posts, so how much meta can there be? For another thing I would expect anyone doing a meta read to take into account the unique circumstances of this game. It's weird that you call attention to and excuse a difference from an imagined "meta".

Then from earlier in his filter there's

- more being all like "guys i'ma post so much!" - but his filter is really not very long. (You know what else of his isn't very long?) Like, there was no need to draw everyone's attention to the fact that he was posting a lot unless he's worried that people would accuse him of not posting enough.

then later on there's this:

This is a really weird thing to do. In the exact same breath, tell someone their plan is bad, and also go along with it.
That said, this may well have been an optimal scum response to Chezinu's plan - we all agreed that scum would have to claim VT, but by doing it early he fits in and his claim gets cred if people follow Chezinu's plan, while simultaneously he comes out against it so he's on the right side of popular opinion if everyone else says "wtf chezinu your plan is scummy and terrible". (scummy and terrible - just like "the game" right?) (+ Show Spoiler +)

Finally, there's one less significant thing that I still want to call attention to. (well, less significant than the rest of my case. Still more significant than crossfire's success with the opposite gender.)




The interesting thing here is that in the first post, he "proposed" the idea that in the future he might play without reading his role PM (which, by the way, is a really weird thing to write a post about in the first place - more fluff, I guess?) but then after I yell at him about it, he claims that he just checked his role PM for the first time. I don't believe for a second that he actually played that far into the game without checking his role PM, but why would he phrase his response to me like that? I think it's because he was trying to be super-conciliatory after I yelled at him; he probably guessed that saying "okay I checked it" was the most direct way to get me off his back, when he should have said "I didn't try that this game, in the future I will not play like that."

Again, this last point is less significant, but it is a discrepancy and I think there is a scum motivation for it.

The main counterpoint to this case, that I can see, is (if Mementoss flips scum) the fact that crossfire voted for Mementoss yesterday. However, I'm not convinced that means very much. Don't forget, Gonzaw made sure that Mementoss wouldn't be lynched yesterday with his weird voting behavior. I could totally see a scum team tripping itself up like that if two of the players voted early (or committed early to voting, in Gonzaw's case) for their teammate, and then had to backpedal furiously when it turned out that he might actually get lynched. Anyway, this is only relevant if Mementoss flips scum.

On November 05 2012 06:16 Crossfire99 wrote:


You're right that I got carried away with alphabet game. I think if you look at my posts later in the day, I tried to word stuff better once blazing pointed out that I was being retarded about it.

I made the meta point because adam jumped on brood early in the game because of meta and it seemed to be a focus early on. Also, if you would believe it, someone in my 3rd newbie game made a meta analysis on me based on my 2 previous newbie games lol. I pointed that out myself because I feel meta was going to be less useful as a tool this game due to the games that would occur each day and I used myself as example of how I am playing completely differently than I ever did previously. Also, if you would believe it, this is the most I've posted day 1 in any of my games. And I've been blue, green, red, and black before.

Also about all those posts dealing with claiming. I never "proposed" that I play without checking my role PM for future games. I "proposed" that I had played without checking my role pm up until that point this game. The reason why I apologized to you strong was because when you told me Drazerk tried that once and you really hated that because you have a good possibility of playing against your win condition, I realized I never ever want any part of my game to resemble anything that Drazerk does. That scared me.

Also, I'll answer your last point now because I'm pretty confident that Mementoss is scum. So you're not going to give me any credit for my case on Mementoss? I'm pretty sure I was the first one to bring up Mementoss's scummy behavior. Adam then elaborated on it. That's why I voted for him.

On November 05 2012 06:45 Crossfire99 wrote:

Mementoss, there's no need to be a wanker. I know what you are: + Show Spoiler [If you know what I mean] +

On November 05 2012 01:46 strongandbig wrote:
So it appears that Mementoss has decided to claim scum, and it looks like we're falling into the trap of letting a pretty-much-decided lynch keep us away from actually doing any scumhunting. That's not a good thing for town - just look at Liquid City, where town got handed two scum lynches by good blue play, but let its momentum die out and still lost the game. So let's try and get this thread moving a bit.

---

- Stutters: I get that plowing through day1 is hard because of the rhyme game, but you've had some time so I would really like something from you other than the mementoss-Adam connection stuff and complaining about Chezinu. Believe me, we all feel the same way about Chezinu, but since he won't actually provide his reasoning for stuff like his claim plan or his D1 ninja vote on Mementoss I don't really know what to do about him. Chezinu actually plays like this all the time, regardless of alignment. So do you have any other potential scum reads? Or do you want to build up a case on Adam based on his posting or his actions, rather than the connection theory with Mementoss?

On November 05 2012 06:58 Stutters695 wrote:

I'm becoming more suspicious of Crossfire for a few reasons you didn't mention as well as some of your own. I agree with your analysis of his fluff and the strangeness of the meta comment but I don't think the thing about the role PM is really indicative at all. In the newbie games I've played a few people have done that or at least said they were going to do that resulted in it being a null tell. I can't see anything that we could use to figure out his role.

One more speculative addition to the meta comment though is that he has no scum games to begin with.so it would make sense to me that he would try to preemptively point out the deviation from his town meta since he can't fall back on "this isn't my scum meta either." I don't really consider that strong at all.

Now my additional points (since you covered the major concrete stuff) are mostly speculation based off of the assumption that there is no way in hell Mementoss will flip town with his d2 play. On the very small offchance he doesn't my focus would immediately shift to Adam.

This + Show Spoiler + interaction between Mementoss and Crossfire really didn't sit well with me. When I was going through his recent posts he kept referring back to his "case" and the fact that Mementoss ignored Adam's criticism of Mem's Keirathi case. His case however is based off of what could be a scumslip but could just as easily be explained by Mem feeling that even though he might be town the posting style and potential for scum is worth it (BH actually defends Mem from this case
the post after Cross calls him out initially).

In addition to a case being based off of a debatable interpretation the whole thing feels somewhat orchestrated to me. He throws some big posts around that accuse Mementoss without really challenging him. It makes him still appear confrontational but in those two giant posts he doesn't accuse him of being scum outside of an offhanded comment when he first calls him out. Finally, he doesn't even vote him until a day later when the deadline is approaching and he hasn't given any analysis on someone else to avoid voting Mementoss. If that line was so scummy why wouldn't he have voted him at the time and tried to get an answer instead of waiting?

The only thing that really gives me pause to this idea is both that his vote actually put Mementoss ahead 4-3 and this feels somewhat elaborate and unnecessary at the time. The delayed vote and the weakness of why he is voting him while claiming that BKExe's "brain farts" make him a null tell feels off.

Moving past this post however his only comments since then have all revolved around either his "case" or how he thinks Adam is right calling BS on the Keirathi case. Feels to me like he is trying to ride that "case" as long as he can for town cred without actually contributing.

All of these things together just feels too off to me for him to be town. Townies obviously make mistakes but I'm struggling to find town motivation for all of these topics.

On November 05 2012 06:58 Stutters695 wrote:

I'm becoming more suspicious of Crossfire for a few reasons you didn't mention as well as some of your own. I agree with your analysis of his fluff and the strangeness of the meta comment but I don't think the thing about the role PM is really indicative at all. In the newbie games I've played a few people have done that or at least said they were going to do that resulted in it being a null tell. I can't see anything that we could use to figure out his role.

One more speculative addition to the meta comment though is that he has no scum games to begin with.so it would make sense to me that he would try to preemptively point out the deviation from his town meta since he can't fall back on "this isn't my scum meta either." I don't really consider that strong at all.

Now my additional points (since you covered the major concrete stuff) are mostly speculation based off of the assumption that there is no way in hell Mementoss will flip town with his d2 play. On the very small offchance he doesn't my focus would immediately shift to Adam.

This + Show Spoiler + interaction between Mementoss and Crossfire really didn't sit well with me. When I was going through his recent posts he kept referring back to his "case" and the fact that Mementoss ignored Adam's criticism of Mem's Keirathi case. His case however is based off of what could be a scumslip but could just as easily be explained by Mem feeling that even though he might be town the posting style and potential for scum is worth it (BH actually defends Mem from this case
the post after Cross calls him out initially).

In addition to a case being based off of a debatable interpretation the whole thing feels somewhat orchestrated to me. He throws some big posts around that accuse Mementoss without really challenging him. It makes him still appear confrontational but in those two giant posts he doesn't accuse him of being scum outside of an offhanded comment when he first calls him out. Finally, he doesn't even vote him until a day later when the deadline is approaching and he hasn't given any analysis on someone else to avoid voting Mementoss. If that line was so scummy why wouldn't he have voted him at the time and tried to get an answer instead of waiting?

The only thing that really gives me pause to this idea is both that his vote actually put Mementoss ahead 4-3 and this feels somewhat elaborate and unnecessary at the time. The delayed vote and the weakness of why he is voting him while claiming that BKExe's "brain farts" make him a null tell feels off.

Moving past this post however his only comments since then have all revolved around either his "case" or how he thinks Adam is right calling BS on the Keirathi case. Feels to me like he is trying to ride that "case" as long as he can for town cred without actually contributing.

All of these things together just feels too off to me for him to be town. Townies obviously make mistakes but I'm struggling to find town motivation for all of these topics.

On November 05 2012 06:58 Stutters695 wrote:

I'm becoming more suspicious of Crossfire for a few reasons you didn't mention as well as some of your own. I agree with your analysis of his fluff and the strangeness of the meta comment but I don't think the thing about the role PM is really indicative at all. In the newbie games I've played a few people have done that or at least said they were going to do that resulted in it being a null tell. I can't see anything that we could use to figure out his role.

One more speculative addition to the meta comment though is that he has no scum games to begin with.so it would make sense to me that he would try to preemptively point out the deviation from his town meta since he can't fall back on "this isn't my scum meta either." I don't really consider that strong at all.

Now my additional points (since you covered the major concrete stuff) are mostly speculation based off of the assumption that there is no way in hell Mementoss will flip town with his d2 play. On the very small offchance he doesn't my focus would immediately shift to Adam.

This + Show Spoiler + interaction between Mementoss and Crossfire really didn't sit well with me. When I was going through his recent posts he kept referring back to his "case" and the fact that Mementoss ignored Adam's criticism of Mem's Keirathi case. His case however is based off of what could be a scumslip but could just as easily be explained by Mem feeling that even though he might be town the posting style and potential for scum is worth it (BH actually defends Mem from this case
the post after Cross calls him out initially).

In addition to a case being based off of a debatable interpretation the whole thing feels somewhat orchestrated to me. He throws some big posts around that accuse Mementoss without really challenging him. It makes him still appear confrontational but in those two giant posts he doesn't accuse him of being scum outside of an offhanded comment when he first calls him out. Finally, he doesn't even vote him until a day later when the deadline is approaching and he hasn't given any analysis on someone else to avoid voting Mementoss. If that line was so scummy why wouldn't he have voted him at the time and tried to get an answer instead of waiting?

The only thing that really gives me pause to this idea is both that his vote actually put Mementoss ahead 4-3 and this feels somewhat elaborate and unnecessary at the time. The delayed vote and the weakness of why he is voting him while claiming that BKExe's "brain farts" make him a null tell feels off.

Moving past this post however his only comments since then have all revolved around either his "case" or how he thinks Adam is right calling BS on the Keirathi case. Feels to me like he is trying to ride that "case" as long as he can for town cred without actually contributing.

All of these things together just feels too off to me for him to be town. Townies obviously make mistakes but I'm struggling to find town motivation for all of these topics.