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Computer Build Resource Thread - Page 1300

Forum Index > Tech Support
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When using this resource, please read FragKrag's opening post. The Tech Support forum regulars have helped create countless of desktop systems without any compensation. The least you can do is provide all of the information required for them to help you properly.
skyR
Profile Joined July 2009
Canada13817 Posts
December 11 2012 01:57 GMT
#25981
Most Intel boards don't offer much features and aren't intended for overclocking.
Alryk
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
United States2718 Posts
December 11 2012 02:11 GMT
#25982
On December 11 2012 10:57 skyR wrote:
Most Intel boards don't offer much features and aren't intended for overclocking.


What's the difference between Q and the other options?
Team Liquid, IM, ViOlet!
skyR
Profile Joined July 2009
Canada13817 Posts
December 11 2012 02:17 GMT
#25983
Q77 is a business chipset that supports VT-d, vPro, and some other stuff.
Belial88
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5217 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-11 05:51:41
December 11 2012 05:33 GMT
#25984
On December 11 2012 10:24 MisterFred wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 11 2012 10:16 Belial88 wrote:
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cpus/2012/05/01/intel-core-i5-3570k-cpu-review/7

\Seems like sites say the i5 3570k reaches above 150tdp easily


First of all, kudos for actually posting something short. That is good.

Second, to quote the article you linked:

Show nested quote +
However, for the power consumption tests we re-enable everything in order to get a real-world power draw. The power draw is measured via a power meter at the wall, so the numbers below are of total system power draw from the mains, not the power consumption of a CPU itself. Measuring the power draw of any individual component in a PC is tricky to impossible to acheive.


Meaning, of course, that such a measurement is not very useful for determining the power use, or heat output, of a CPU. You read the article wrong. It is not saying an i5-3570k reaches above 150w total power draw easily. It is saying an i5-3570k + mobo + RAM + case fans + HDD + GTX 590 + Power Supply inefficiency easily surpasses 150w total power draw.


You are correct, but the total system draw is going to be under 100w. These chips are pushing 250w overclocked, and system load when only the CPU is being used is going to be very, very low outside the CPU itself, less than 100w for sure.

I do agree we should be looking at a better bench though, but I think these results are the best I've seen so far on this topic.

So, anecdotes, forum posts, and dismissing a valid comment about methodology, wrapped up in a nice wall of text. I'm done with this discussion, until and unless you bring something both new and relevant to the table.


I'm here to offer practical advice to people, and to help people who don't have much money, like I was when I first joined TL. I almost didn't build a computer because the $400-500+ people were telling me to spend was way too much, and looking back on it, I could have spent even less and done fine.

The core of this argument we're having, is you having a problem with my recommendation that for $39, the Logisys Assassin is the best heatsink to buy, bar none, for new. If you have a better suggestion, please let me know, but there are quite a few people around here asking for what heatsink to buy, and have terrible ideas on what to get (h70, zalman, ughghgh). My advice on the Logisys Assassin for $39 I think is very solid, and I think your being very counter-productive here.

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=33412

The Logisys Assassin is a top tier performing air cooler, and benchmarks regularly show that:
+ Show Spoiler +

http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Gamer-Storm-Assassin-CPU-Cooler-Review/1540/6

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/LGA-2011-i7-3960X-Air-Overclocking,3130-17.html
(yes, i know th is crap, simply just posting as many as i can until you realize your wrong, and it even shows evo far behind)

http://www.pureoverclock.com/Review-detail/deepcool-gamer-storm-assassin-cpu-cooler/7/
"The Assassin performed very closely to our custom waco set-up." maybe not the best site, just another of the, granted, relatively few, reviews out there on this cooler

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/coolers/display/deepcool-assassin_5.html#sect1
This bench shows the Phanteks > Assassin, but not by much, showing that it's still a top tier class cooler, and even the bottom graph shows the assassin holding it's own vs dual towers with 140mm fans instead of 120+140

http://www.overclock.net/t/1289884/finished-assassin-vs-nh-d14-vs-phanteks-vs-cm-v8-vs-hyper-612-vs-hyper-212/60

You also gotta recall most reviews test the stock fans, or 120+140mm fans instead of 2x140mm like many dual towers come with by default (SA, Phanteks) and that the Assassin really shines with 3x140mm fans, and that the stock fans of the Assassin are actually pretty bad and placed on ass backwards.


I really don't think any heatsink comes close to value or performance for under $70, unless maybe the hyper 212+ but only in pure degress lowered vs stock per dollar and every marginal increase in higher delta temps is harder to come by, but the hyper 212+/evo simply isn't enough cooling for certain chips and overclocks (i5s, phenom x4s, i7s, FX), and if you got $39, the assassin is just a huge step up.

If you want, we can move this to PM, but I'm not going to stop recommending the Assassin until another cooler comes as a better deal (it'd have to be a dual tower for cheaper...) or this deal expires or a lower performing cooler sells for like $25 in the class of megahalems or h50 (h50 is $25 used though... great deal).
How to build a $500 i7-3770K Ultimate Computer:http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=392709 ******** 100% Safe Razorless Delid Method! http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade/0_100
Nightops
Profile Joined November 2011
United States66 Posts
December 11 2012 06:39 GMT
#25985
Okay guys, here's the revised build that my friend and I put together for him. He's trying to build his first computer that can play new gen games for around 500-600 dollars. Can you guys look through this all and recommend any changes, or point out anything that I am missing. Thanks!

Motherboard: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128540
CPU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116775
GPU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150605
Case: http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=77540&promoid=1306
RAM: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147096
PSU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817182066
Fan: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065
Optical drive: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827106276
Hard drive: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136769
SlayerS | oGs | NaDa | Mvp | fOrGG | MKP
skyR
Profile Joined July 2009
Canada13817 Posts
December 11 2012 06:59 GMT
#25986
On December 11 2012 15:39 Nightops wrote:+ Show Spoiler +
Okay guys, here's the revised build that my friend and I put together for him. He's trying to build his first computer that can play new gen games for around 500-600 dollars. Can you guys look through this all and recommend any changes, or point out anything that I am missing. Thanks!

Motherboard: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128540
CPU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116775
GPU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150605
Case: http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=77540&promoid=1306
RAM: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147096
PSU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817182066
Fan: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065
Optical drive: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827106276
Hard drive: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136769


You need an order over $50 on NCIX to qualify for free shipping so best to get some other stuff from there as well like the HDD which is $10 less expensive: http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=58402&promoid=1306 and the burner which is $3 less: http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=49597&promoid=1306

You don't need a Hyper 212+ for a core i3.

The Gigabyte 7870 is better at $230 so why get a XFX model that is worse for more? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125418
Rollin
Profile Joined March 2011
Australia1552 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-11 07:12:05
December 11 2012 07:08 GMT
#25987
On December 11 2012 14:33 Belial88 wrote:
You are correct, but the total system draw is going to be under 100w.

Okay...
On December 11 2012 14:33 Belial88 wrote:
These chips are pushing 250w overclocked, and system load when only the CPU is being used is going to be very, very low outside the CPU itself, less than 100w for sure.


The chart does not even go up to 200w for total system draw. 250w as claimed is far above this.

[image loading]

Where are you getting your 250w figure from. Please explain, nobody else is having this trouble. (this is the 3570k btw)

EDIT: Oh I see you were using the terrible bit-tech one, where they didn't even specify what voltage they overclocked with.
Throw off those chains of reason, and your prison disappears. | Check your posting frequency timeline: http://www.teamliquid.net/mytlnet/post_activity_img.php
Alryk
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
United States2718 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-11 07:25:33
December 11 2012 07:09 GMT
#25988
My post sucks, look at Skyr ^.^

On December 11 2012 16:08 Rollin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 11 2012 14:33 Belial88 wrote:
You are correct, but the total system draw is going to be under 100w.

Okay...
Show nested quote +
On December 11 2012 14:33 Belial88 wrote:
These chips are pushing 250w overclocked, and system load when only the CPU is being used is going to be very, very low outside the CPU itself, less than 100w for sure.


The chart does not even go up to 200w for total system draw. 250w as claimed is far above this.

[image loading]

Where are you getting your 250w figure from. Please explain, nobody else is having this trouble. (this is the 3570k btw)

EDIT: Oh I see you were using the terrible bit-tech one, where they didn't even specify what voltage they overclocked with.


The bit-tech review gets a 4.7 (or 4.8ghz?) ivy bridge at 261 watts. So the system draws only 11 watts, duh.

Anyways, even with that number... considering the power supply alone is 10-15% inefficiency (their PSU is an 85+, and since its a 1kw psu at 25% load, it's probably on the lower end.) Which at 260 watts would be approximately 40 watts (I'm slightly highballing it). A GTX 590 draws 50W at idle according to tech powerup power consumption. Meaning the rest of the system gets 20W to fulfill his claim. And that's assuming the GPU is 100% idle, etc. etc.
Team Liquid, IM, ViOlet!
iTzSnypah
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States1738 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-11 07:23:23
December 11 2012 07:17 GMT
#25989
On December 11 2012 15:39 Nightops wrote:
Okay guys, here's the revised build that my friend and I put together for him. He's trying to build his first computer that can play new gen games for around 500-600 dollars. Can you guys look through this all and recommend any changes, or point out anything that I am missing. Thanks!

Motherboard: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128540
CPU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116775
GPU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150605
Case: http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=77540&promoid=1306
RAM: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147096
PSU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817182066
Fan: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065
Optical drive: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827106276
Hard drive: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136769

You don't need an aftermarket HSF when your not overclocking. XFX HD7000 series are trash, they only thing vendors have to do is cool the GPU and XFX failed miserably this time around. The ram you picked is 1.35v C11 which is kind of pointless when you can get 1.5v C9 for cheaper. I would suggest going with these instead:

i3-3220 & DVD Burner $128.98
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.1163383

Gigabyte HD7870 3fan & Mushkin 8GB (2x4GB) DDR3-1600 $259.98 2 free games
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.1156003

Also if you still want an aftermarket HSF I would go with something cheaper like the TX3.

EDIT: Am I the only one who actually looks for combo deals on newegg?
Team Liquid needs more Terrans.
skyR
Profile Joined July 2009
Canada13817 Posts
December 11 2012 07:33 GMT
#25990
The i3 3220 & burner bundle is actually inferior to purchasing the CPU and burner from NCIX.
Nightops
Profile Joined November 2011
United States66 Posts
December 11 2012 07:50 GMT
#25991
Okay so I'm doing everything that you recommended skyR, is there anything that my friend and I are missing to put this PC together from scratch?
SlayerS | oGs | NaDa | Mvp | fOrGG | MKP
Ercster
Profile Joined August 2011
United States603 Posts
December 11 2012 08:21 GMT
#25992
My disc drive took a shit on me the other day. Are there any good BluRay drives, or should I just stick to a DVD drive?
“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.” -Neil deGrasse Tyson
Molinder
Profile Joined December 2012
France4 Posts
December 11 2012 10:39 GMT
#25993
Hello,

I want to upgrade my CPU in order to play AND stream SC2 with decent stream quality (480p or a bit higher would be enough). If possible I'd like to play on medium settings, if not then low settings to stream would be okay. Right now I have an Athlon X2 2.51GHz CPU which makes my PC lag a lot at late game situations, with an ATI Radeon 3870 which I will upgrade when i can save more money.

I'm not very confident about choosing by myself, so could you could recommend me a CPU + motherboard for approximately 170-180 euros? Should I go for an i3 3220 or would a similar AMD Quad core perform better? Maybe the Phenom ll 965 x4?

Thanks in advance
Nuttyguy
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United Kingdom1526 Posts
December 11 2012 12:39 GMT
#25994
quick question
http://uk.gigabyte.com/products/product-page.aspx?pid=4144#sp

does this have 6 or 8 sata ports?
looks kind of misleading to me.
Shauni
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
4077 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-11 12:54:30
December 11 2012 12:53 GMT
#25995
On December 11 2012 21:39 Nuttyguy wrote:
quick question
http://uk.gigabyte.com/products/product-page.aspx?pid=4144#sp

does this have 6 or 8 sata ports?
looks kind of misleading to me.


2 intel 6gbps
4 intel 3gbps
2 marvell 6gbps

so 8 in total. companies usually have to add their own 6gbps ports cause intel is retarded.
I'm taking whatever coverage I can get, because frankly, I'm busy working on this million dollar deal at my job. Early retirement is a good thing brotha man. - MessengerASL
Nuttyguy
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United Kingdom1526 Posts
December 11 2012 13:01 GMT
#25996
On December 11 2012 21:53 Shauni wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 11 2012 21:39 Nuttyguy wrote:
quick question
http://uk.gigabyte.com/products/product-page.aspx?pid=4144#sp

does this have 6 or 8 sata ports?
looks kind of misleading to me.


2 intel 6gbps
4 intel 3gbps
2 marvell 6gbps

so 8 in total. companies usually have to add their own 6gbps ports cause intel is retarded.

Thanks
Rachnar
Profile Joined October 2010
France1526 Posts
December 11 2012 13:38 GMT
#25997
On December 11 2012 19:39 Molinder wrote:
Hello,

I want to upgrade my CPU in order to play AND stream SC2 with decent stream quality (480p or a bit higher would be enough). If possible I'd like to play on medium settings, if not then low settings to stream would be okay. Right now I have an Athlon X2 2.51GHz CPU which makes my PC lag a lot at late game situations, with an ATI Radeon 3870 which I will upgrade when i can save more money.

I'm not very confident about choosing by myself, so could you could recommend me a CPU + motherboard for approximately 170-180 euros? Should I go for an i3 3220 or would a similar AMD Quad core perform better? Maybe the Phenom ll 965 x4?

Thanks in advance


recommended : You can either switch to intel, which will cost you about 250€ for an i5-3450, MSI b75ma-p45 and 4gb RAM (yours wouldn't be compatible)

But you can also stick to AMD since your on a low budget and get a phenom II x4 955 (which should be compatible with your motherboard) for around 85€
depending on your motherboard, you could get a heatsink and OC it a bit too for better performance (~25€)
This isn't that recommended because it is not as good an upgrade as switchong to intel would be, but it would definitly still be one, and you'll be able to stream 720p

The i3 is dualcore with HT, so not good for streaming and gaming at the same time
"What if it's a triple DK ?" "Then we cry" "Prepare your handkerchief then ..."
Molinder
Profile Joined December 2012
France4 Posts
December 11 2012 14:08 GMT
#25998
On December 11 2012 22:38 Rachnar wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 11 2012 19:39 Molinder wrote:
Hello,

I want to upgrade my CPU in order to play AND stream SC2 with decent stream quality (480p or a bit higher would be enough). If possible I'd like to play on medium settings, if not then low settings to stream would be okay. Right now I have an Athlon X2 2.51GHz CPU which makes my PC lag a lot at late game situations, with an ATI Radeon 3870 which I will upgrade when i can save more money.

I'm not very confident about choosing by myself, so could you could recommend me a CPU + motherboard for approximately 170-180 euros? Should I go for an i3 3220 or would a similar AMD Quad core perform better? Maybe the Phenom ll 965 x4?

Thanks in advance


recommended : You can either switch to intel, which will cost you about 250€ for an i5-3450, MSI b75ma-p45 and 4gb RAM (yours wouldn't be compatible)

But you can also stick to AMD since your on a low budget and get a phenom II x4 955 (which should be compatible with your motherboard) for around 85€
depending on your motherboard, you could get a heatsink and OC it a bit too for better performance (~25€)
This isn't that recommended because it is not as good an upgrade as switchong to intel would be, but it would definitly still be one, and you'll be able to stream 720p

The i3 is dualcore with HT, so not good for streaming and gaming at the same time


Thanks for your response. My current motherboard isn't compatible with that CPU, it's quite old. I heard i3 3220 can easily move SC2 but I'm not sure how would it perform while streaming.
Alryk
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
United States2718 Posts
December 11 2012 14:11 GMT
#25999
On December 11 2012 23:08 Molinder wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 11 2012 22:38 Rachnar wrote:
On December 11 2012 19:39 Molinder wrote:
Hello,

I want to upgrade my CPU in order to play AND stream SC2 with decent stream quality (480p or a bit higher would be enough). If possible I'd like to play on medium settings, if not then low settings to stream would be okay. Right now I have an Athlon X2 2.51GHz CPU which makes my PC lag a lot at late game situations, with an ATI Radeon 3870 which I will upgrade when i can save more money.

I'm not very confident about choosing by myself, so could you could recommend me a CPU + motherboard for approximately 170-180 euros? Should I go for an i3 3220 or would a similar AMD Quad core perform better? Maybe the Phenom ll 965 x4?

Thanks in advance


recommended : You can either switch to intel, which will cost you about 250€ for an i5-3450, MSI b75ma-p45 and 4gb RAM (yours wouldn't be compatible)

But you can also stick to AMD since your on a low budget and get a phenom II x4 955 (which should be compatible with your motherboard) for around 85€
depending on your motherboard, you could get a heatsink and OC it a bit too for better performance (~25€)
This isn't that recommended because it is not as good an upgrade as switchong to intel would be, but it would definitly still be one, and you'll be able to stream 720p

The i3 is dualcore with HT, so not good for streaming and gaming at the same time


Thanks for your response. My current motherboard isn't compatible with that CPU, it's quite old. I heard i3 3220 can easily move SC2 but I'm not sure how would it perform while streaming.


It can do Starcraft pretty decently, but as he said it's a dual core with hyperthreading, so it won't be that great for streaming (i.e. don't stream with it).
Team Liquid, IM, ViOlet!
Molinder
Profile Joined December 2012
France4 Posts
December 11 2012 14:21 GMT
#26000
On December 11 2012 23:11 Alryk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 11 2012 23:08 Molinder wrote:
On December 11 2012 22:38 Rachnar wrote:
On December 11 2012 19:39 Molinder wrote:
Hello,

I want to upgrade my CPU in order to play AND stream SC2 with decent stream quality (480p or a bit higher would be enough). If possible I'd like to play on medium settings, if not then low settings to stream would be okay. Right now I have an Athlon X2 2.51GHz CPU which makes my PC lag a lot at late game situations, with an ATI Radeon 3870 which I will upgrade when i can save more money.

I'm not very confident about choosing by myself, so could you could recommend me a CPU + motherboard for approximately 170-180 euros? Should I go for an i3 3220 or would a similar AMD Quad core perform better? Maybe the Phenom ll 965 x4?

Thanks in advance


recommended : You can either switch to intel, which will cost you about 250€ for an i5-3450, MSI b75ma-p45 and 4gb RAM (yours wouldn't be compatible)

But you can also stick to AMD since your on a low budget and get a phenom II x4 955 (which should be compatible with your motherboard) for around 85€
depending on your motherboard, you could get a heatsink and OC it a bit too for better performance (~25€)
This isn't that recommended because it is not as good an upgrade as switchong to intel would be, but it would definitly still be one, and you'll be able to stream 720p

The i3 is dualcore with HT, so not good for streaming and gaming at the same time


Thanks for your response. My current motherboard isn't compatible with that CPU, it's quite old. I heard i3 3220 can easily move SC2 but I'm not sure how would it perform while streaming.


It can do Starcraft pretty decently, but as he said it's a dual core with hyperthreading, so it won't be that great for streaming (i.e. don't stream with it).


Ok, so with that budget should I go for the 965? Or is there a better option?
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