EPTOn April 24 2009 23:41 Zato-1 wrote:
Already asked in March, and they didn't answer.
Already asked in March, and they didn't answer.
well, i hope they answer this time.
it's something that's pretty important, atleast to me.
Submit your questions - April - Page 4
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jeppew
Sweden471 Posts
well, i hope they answer this time. it's something that's pretty important, atleast to me. | ||
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uglymoose89
United States671 Posts
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spkim1
Canada286 Posts
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Tyrant
Korea (South)234 Posts
Starcraft is an amazing RTS that is known for a delicate balance of soft counters that allow for a player skill to be a larger part of deciding a victory rather than unit choice as seen in many other RTS. While watching the first battle report the terran marauder stood out to me as a very strong "hard counter" unit where you cannot effectively micro against them due to their slowing attack and in the demo they appeared to beat literally everything except zealots. While watching the second battle report the replacement for the science vessel seems to be a nightmare for zerg as there are no scourge to counter them. Hydralisks are too slow to deal with them effectively and even if they were faster they would still be shredded by simply moving the nighthawks behind the ball of death on the ground. It seems that the nighthawks are also a hardcounter to zerg. I realize and am considering that each player only used a small set of possible units during the match so perhaps this was merely a result of the protoss and zerg respectively being limited by unit choice, but my question is: Will the design of SC2 follow SC1's model of numerous soft counters or will SC2 be moving toward the path of other RTS where a certain unit is designed to simply outplay another unit or perhaps some middleground? --- Examples of what i mean by soft counter that helped make sc dynamic: -Irradiate > Muta, but if you micro well Muta can pull it off. -Lurker > M&M, but if T micro well they can win equal $$ fight. -Using zealot bombs to weaken Terran tank wall. -Archon > Muta stack, but with proper micro archon can be dealt with. | ||
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Krikkitone
United States1451 Posts
On April 25 2009 02:22 spkim1 wrote: Question: if warp rays (or whatever they are called now) shoot beams, aerial micro manoeuvers previously used in SC1 with units using projectiles like mutalisks/corsairs (shooting while still moving) seems to be no longer available for beam using units. Will the warp ray still be able to do the aerial micro manoeuver practiced in SC1? Am i making sense here? lol Its been reported that Warp rays will be able to shoot and move at the same time (although probably not as a micromaneuver, since they need to Keep the beam on target, so their movement will be part of their attack) | ||
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spkim1
Canada286 Posts
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spkim1
Canada286 Posts
On April 25 2009 03:09 Krikkitone wrote: Its been reported that Warp rays will be able to shoot and move at the same time (although probably not as a micromaneuver, since they need to Keep the beam on target, so their movement will be part of their attack) that's nice, makes it an easier job catching fleeing units  | ||
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Rob Air Guitar
United Kingdom32 Posts
RAG | ||
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spkim1
Canada286 Posts
hope as hell the requirements are less than DOW2 Edit: it's Geforce 9800 GX2 | ||
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Zato-1
Chile4253 Posts
On April 25 2009 02:22 spkim1 wrote: Question: if warp rays (or whatever they are called now) shoot beams, aerial micro manoeuvers previously used in SC1 with units using projectiles like mutalisks/corsairs (shooting while still moving) seems to be no longer available for beam using units. Will the warp ray still be able to do the aerial micro manoeuver practiced in SC1? Am i making sense here? lol I think this question loses significance when you consider what the Void Ray is as a unit. It's almost as expensive as a SC1 Scout. It's bad at fighting against groups of small units (like Marines) by design. It deals half the damage of a SC1 Scout unless you let it focus on its target for several seconds. It's supposed to be strong against big, expensive units but when you consider them case by case, it's not good against BCs, probably not good vs. Carriers, and maybe good against Thor. So what IS the Void Ray good at fighting against? Theorycrafting tells me it's good vs. units that can't fight back, mostly. Ever try killing Ultralisks with Wraiths? It takes an eternity. Not for the Void Ray, though. Or consider a Marauder with 125 HP and base armor 1; it'll take a muta 16 hits to kill one, so either you get a bunch of mutas or it'll take an eternity to kill them- the Void Ray will be much more efficient at that. Basically, if your opponent has units that can't fight back vs. air, make 'em pay with the Void Ray, kind of like how Wraiths can be used to punish an opponent who only makes tanks and vultures in TvT. With the notable difference that the Void Ray's attack is actually pretty strong, even if you only have a few of them. Hit and run micro maneuvers won't be something you want to do with this unit. | ||
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Zato-1
Chile4253 Posts
On April 25 2009 02:29 Tyrant wrote: Starcraft is an amazing RTS that is known for a delicate balance of soft counters that allow for a player skill to be a larger part of deciding a victory rather than unit choice as seen in many other RTS. While watching the first battle report the terran marauder stood out to me as a very strong "hard counter" unit where you cannot effectively micro against them due to their slowing attack and in the demo they appeared to beat literally everything except zealots. I wouldn't say marauders are a hard counter to anything the Protoss has. Sure, they beat Stalkers in an even fight, but you could say the same of hydras vs vultures; the vultures can just run away. The marauders do have a slowing attack, but you can research blink for the Stalkers with which they can run away anyway. Marauders were also able to beat a colossus, but that's only because the Protoss kept sending them piecemeal rather than getting two or three together; three colossi will instantly kill a group of Marauders. Finally, the Protoss didn't make Void Rays, which are a hard counter to Marauders because Marauders can't attack air units. On April 25 2009 02:29 Tyrant wrote: While watching the second battle report the replacement for the science vessel seems to be a nightmare for zerg as there are no scourge to counter them. Hydralisks are too slow to deal with them effectively and even if they were faster they would still be shredded by simply moving the nighthawks behind the ball of death on the ground. It seems that the nighthawks are also a hardcounter to zerg. I agree with you on this point, and I attribute this to balance considerations. Having a unit that is very mobile and is strong vs. everything is not an issue of hard counters vs. soft counters, it's a balance issue of the unit in question being too good. On April 25 2009 02:29 Tyrant wrote: Will the design of SC2 follow SC1's model of numerous soft counters or will SC2 be moving toward the path of other RTS where a certain unit is designed to simply outplay another unit or perhaps some middleground? I'd wager they're shooting for the former. What wins in Marines vs. Banelings? Well, it depends. Did the marines walk over a group of burrowed banelings? Did the Zerg engage the Terran with Roaches to soak up damage while the Banelings snuck up from behind? Do the Banelings have their speed upgrade researched? It depends on the circumstances and the unit control. SC1 also had plenty of hard counters. Ever use BCs against a Protoss? Dragoons + Stasis / Mindcontrol (depending on the number of BCs) was a pretty hard counter. Firebats get hard countered in TvT by Goliaths and Vultures. Vultures are also a pretty hard counter to Archons. The Guardian has so many hard counters in ZvT it's not even funny. The fact that players almost never choose to build those units in those matchups doesn't mean that the hard counters don't exist. | ||
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Zato-1
Chile4253 Posts
On April 28 2009 19:19 Rob Air Guitar wrote: Will Zealots still be speed upgraded or has charged replaced that buff?? Blue quote: "There are two upgrades possible at Twilight Council, one is researching 'Charge' for Zealots and the other is researching 'Blink' for Stalkers. Charge upgrade for Zealots includes movement speed increase of Zealots as well. So to speak, Charge increases the movement speed of Zealots AND allows them to intercept nearby enemies." http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=14132918952&postId=141215390768&sid=3000#1 | ||
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jtype
England2167 Posts
I realize that this game is going to be different in more ways than just being newer; with newer units, buildings, etc. but seeing as how Starcraft is now so competitive; being played in ways that the devs never imagined, I wonder if they will bear this potential for metagame evolution in mind, even in the single-player modes. It could be a nice feature to be able to select, for example, a new or popular build order for your computer opponent to use, so you can practice countering it and spotting the early warning signs for it. As new builds and strategies are being used/developed, imagine if they could be downloaded/'learned' from replays. Also, if you could set the APM for your computer opponent, so you could train with someone who is technically the same 'speed' as you, that could make for some pretty good training. That, combined with choosing a build order for your AI opponent, could really make the single player 'custom' mode very valuable for practice. I don't know, maybe this is stupid; maybe impossible. Just throwing it out there. | ||
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Zato-1
Chile4253 Posts
On April 29 2009 05:04 jtype wrote: It could be a nice feature to be able to select, for example, a new or popular build order for your computer opponent to use, so you can practice countering it and spotting the early warning signs for it. As new builds and strategies are being used/developed, imagine if they could be downloaded/'learned' from replays. Also, if you could set the APM for your computer opponent, so you could train with someone who is technically the same 'speed' as you, that could make for some pretty good training. That, combined with choosing a build order for your AI opponent, could really make the single player 'custom' mode very valuable for practice. I don't think that's what the skirmish vs. the AI is meant for. The computer AI will certainly be superior to the one SC1 has (which isn't saying much), but I don't think stuff like setting APM will be helpful. The computer AI will always have perfect multitasking for instance; if you drop a base from two locations at once while pushing with your army and sneaking DTs into an expansion, the AI will respond to each threat with the same amount of micro it would have handling each one of these threats separately. It would be nice if Blizzard incorporated popular BOs into the AI with patches as the game matures, though. I'm sure you'll be able to play skirmishes against the AI to get a feel as to what units each race has and what each unit is good for, but I doubt it can be a decent substitute for human opponents if you're interested in competitive play. | ||
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jtype
England2167 Posts
On April 29 2009 05:15 Zato-1 wrote: I don't think that's what the skirmish vs. the AI is meant for. The computer AI will certainly be superior to the one SC1 has (which isn't saying much), but I don't think stuff like setting APM will be helpful. The computer AI will always have perfect multitasking for instance; if you drop a base from two locations at once while pushing with your army and sneaking DTs into an expansion, the AI will respond to each threat with the same amount of micro it would have handling each one of these threats separately. It would be nice if Blizzard incorporated popular BOs into the AI with patches as the game matures, though. I'm sure you'll be able to play skirmishes against the AI to get a feel as to what units each race has and what each unit is good for, but I doubt it can be a decent substitute for human opponents if you're interested in competitive play. But that's my point exactly - the skirmish vs the AI wasn't meant for that, because the game wasn't designed for such competitive, high-level play. The computer does multi-task perfectly and very efficiently, but if you could control the APM/build, then you would at least know that, if you were playing at 200 APM and the computer at 100 max, for example, and you had a build that perfectly countered the AI build, then there is little-to-no reason for you to lose. I think that single player games vs the computer could be an excellent training tool, particularly at times when there are no human players available, or you want to perfect a certain build counter, if such features were implemented. | ||
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spkim1
Canada286 Posts
On April 29 2009 03:38 Zato-1 wrote: I think this question loses significance when you consider what the Void Ray is as a unit. It's almost as expensive as a SC1 Scout. It's bad at fighting against groups of small units (like Marines) by design. It deals half the damage of a SC1 Scout unless you let it focus on its target for several seconds. It's supposed to be strong against big, expensive units but when you consider them case by case, it's not good against BCs, probably not good vs. Carriers, and maybe good against Thor. So what IS the Void Ray good at fighting against? Theorycrafting tells me it's good vs. units that can't fight back, mostly. Ever try killing Ultralisks with Wraiths? It takes an eternity. Not for the Void Ray, though. Or consider a Marauder with 125 HP and base armor 1; it'll take a muta 16 hits to kill one, so either you get a bunch of mutas or it'll take an eternity to kill them- the Void Ray will be much more efficient at that. Basically, if your opponent has units that can't fight back vs. air, make 'em pay with the Void Ray, kind of like how Wraiths can be used to punish an opponent who only makes tanks and vultures in TvT. With the notable difference that the Void Ray's attack is actually pretty strong, even if you only have a few of them. Hit and run micro maneuvers won't be something you want to do with this unit. It's true that microing hit-and-run style like you would with mutas is not going to be effective with a void ray. But then again the ultralisks have quick mobility, so if what you say is true about the void ray being only useful for stationary targets, it will not be effective agains the ultralisk either. More than hit-and-run, I was referring to Corsair or Mutalisk movement when chasing, say, speed overlords: with good micro sairs/mutas will barely slow down while shooting down groups of fleeing Overlords. I'm just hoping the warp ray could do that so they would be more advantageous when chasing down, say, weakenned BCs, or indeed speed overlords (really, i'mm just hoping the void ray fills up the hollow gap left by the absence of the Corsair) | ||
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stroggos
New Zealand1543 Posts
How will the ladder system work in sc2 | ||
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jtype
England2167 Posts
On April 29 2009 23:07 stroggos wrote: are mutas stackable?. How will the ladder system work in sc2 The muta stacking query has been posed and answered a couple of times already actually. Yes, they are stackable. However, they apparently unstack when moving or attacking. | ||
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Ideas
United States8167 Posts
In the latest Q&A it was revealed that only the medivac currently has an unload animation of all the transport units in the game. Do the transports still have the ability to unload and move at the same time as was possible in SC1 (by pressing U and clicking on the transport unit as it was moving)? In the latest Q&A, Dustin Browder said that the new macro mechanics are currently working out very well. Will these be replacing the gas mechanic? Or are they both going to be in use? | ||
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Tintti
Finland46 Posts
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